St Louis Browns Farm Clubs in the 40's

[tdworak]

Was wondering if anyone on this site had any information about the St. Louis Browns Farm Teams in the 40's. I am trying to piece together my Father's Baseball Career after WWII. According to my Mother (who does'nt remember much) and some Photographs she has, she said that my Father was in the St. Louis Browns Farm System in the Forties. She remembers him playing in New York (There is a Picture of his Team with the name "Glovers?) on their Uniform). She also remembers him playing and/or training in Pine Bluff Arkansas and Louisiana and other Places (need to go back to my Mom's House and study the photo's better). There is also a Photo of him (by himeself) with a St. Louis Cap and "Browns" across his Uniform. Looking for any Information on where the Browns Triple A, Double A, Single A and others played.

Thanks,
Tom

[bobw357]

The Gloversville Glovers (NY) were a Browns' farm team from1942-49. They played in the Canadien-American League.

What is your father's name?

[tdworak]

My Father's Name was Joe Dworak. He was a left handed Pitcher out of South Omaha, Nebraska. After High School, He enlisted in the Armed Forces. After the War, he went back to playing baseball but am not sure how far he got before being injured. Thanks for the Information.

Tom

[The Commissioner]

Hi Tom,
I'm sorry it took me so long to reply. I was able to find your father's record as having played professionally between the years 1947-50. He appears to have been a pretty darn good pitcher. In his first year of professional ball (1947) he pitched for Mayfield in the Kentucky, Illinois, Tennesee ("Kitty") League. This was a class D League. That season his record was 11-11, which is a bit misleading. While his won/loss record may have only been .500, his 2.69 ERA was the best in the entire league!!!! He also led the league in ERA by a good margain. He was the only pitcher to post a mark below 3 runs per game. The man that finished second in the ERA race that year was Bob Buhl (3.00) who later went onto win 166 games in 15 ML seasons!!! The next season (1948) your father moved up to Springfield in the Illinois-Iowa Indiana League at Class B level. He posted a 1-4 record with a 4.76 record that season. The next year he moved on to play for Gloversville-Johnston at class C in the Canadian-American League. There he posted a .650 winning percentage (6th best by players with 8 or more wins) by going 13-7 with a 4.48 ERA. For his final season he moved on to Anderson in the Tri-State League at class B level. Unfortunately, this was not his best season. He posted a 5-17 record (second most losses in the league) with a 6.02 ERA. That appears to have been his last season of playing pro ball. Overall, he seems to have had a nice little career for himself there. Along the way he played with and against many former and future Major Leaguers. His most notable teammate was probably Roy Sievers on the 1948 Springfield squad. Sievers went on to win the Rookie of the Year his next season and later became a four time All-Star.

[tdworak]

Thank you for the reply. You have filled in many blanks in my Fathers Baseball Career. I think (according to my mom) that my Dad got injured during his last Year in Baseball and never recovered. I appreciate the Time you spent researching My Dad's Minor League Career.

[NittanyRyan]

Hello,
First time poster here. I'm trying to find out some similar information on my grandfather who also played in the St. Louis Browns farm system. His name was James (Jim) Roberts, played 2B and I believe he played on some clubs in the Carolinas or possibly Tennessee. He was from Tennessee. Is there any way I can find out some information on his career? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated my my father and myself. He died in '86 so we have no record. Thanks

Ryan

[The Mick]

If you want, I could help either of you contact the St. Louis Browns Historical Society. I've done some stuff for their newsletter "Pop Flies" and know the publisher well. Email me and I can put you in touch with him (off the board).

(BTW: the Commish came up huge!!! Great job!)

[The Commissioner]

Originally posted by NittanyRyan
Hello,
First time poster here. I'm trying to find out some similar information on my grandfather who also played in the St. Louis Browns farm system. His name was James (Jim) Roberts, played 2B and I believe he played on some clubs in the Carolinas or possibly Tennessee. He was from Tennessee. Is there any way I can find out some information on his career? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated my my father and myself. He died in '86 so we have no record. Thanks

Ryan

Would it be possible for you to provide any more details, such as what decade we should be looking for here? Jim Roberts has been the name of several professional ballplayers.

[NittanyRyan]

Thanks for the quick reply. He was born Aug 25th 1917 or 1918. Played primarily 2B but some SS as well. Played during the late 1930s and into 1940-1941 I believe.

[The Commissioner]

I'm sorry, but I haven't been able to locate any records on him. The closest that I have found is that there was a Jim Roberts who played for Albany in the Florida-Georgia League in 1946. I have also found various incomplete records of several players who's first names are not even listed, but who's last name was "Roberts" that played in the 1930s. Could it be possible that he played under a different name other than "Jim" or "James"?

[UConnDrTom]

My Dad played for the Yonkers Norsemen in 1939 - he used to say that they were part of the St. Louis Browns Farm Team organization and that he got paid $75.00/ month. I only have one photo and am very curious to find out more information. Any ideas on where we could find out more?

[The Commissioner]

Originally posted by UConnDrTom
My Dad played for the Yonkers Norsemen in 1939 - he used to say that they were part of the St. Louis Browns Farm Team organization and that he got paid $75.00/ month. I only have one photo and am very curious to find out more information. Any ideas on where we could find out more?

Yonkers did not have a minor league ballclub at that time. The only two season in which Yonkers was home to one were in 1905 and 1907. Could it be possible that your father actually played on a semi-pro team instead? If you would let me know your father's name I could run a search on him to see if there is any record of him having played professionally.

[UConnDrTom]

My father's name was James J. Connors Jr. He d.o.b. was Nov. 27, 1914. Thanks for all your help.

[The Commissioner]

The only record of anyone going by that name, who played during that era, that I could locate is of a player named Jim Conners. Het played one season in the PONY League in 1940 for the London Pirates. However, that team was an affiliate of the Pittsburgh Pirates and not the Browns.

[starkbucks]

Hi,
My Dad was on the St. Louis Browns farm club in the '40s. If you have any information you can share. Please email me.
He was a right handed pitcher, Michael Rolla.
Thanks,
Lu

[starkbucks]

Originally posted by tdworak
Was wondering if anyone on this site had any information about the St. Louis Browns Farm Teams in the 40's. I am trying to piece together my Father's Baseball Career after WWII. According to my Mother (who does'nt remember much) and some Photographs she has, she said that my Father was in the St. Louis Browns Farm System in the Forties. She remembers him playing in New York (There is a Picture of his Team with the name "Glovers?) on their Uniform). She also remembers him playing and/or training in Pine Bluff Arkansas and Louisiana and other Places (need to go back to my Mom's House and study the photo's better). There is also a Photo of him (by himeself) with a St. Louis Cap and "Browns" across his Uniform. Looking for any Information on where the Browns Triple A, Double A, Single A and others played.

Thanks,
Tom

I also posted about my Father who played on the St. Louis Browns farm teams-- Triple A. He was a right handed pitcher.
If you have any information about Michael Rolla. Please email me. I have pictures I can email.
Thanks,
Lu

[The Commissioner]

Wow, Lu!!! Your father played a long time. He pitched, with time off in between, from 1937-54 He made his professional debut in 1937 with Paducha in the Kitty League (Class D). There he posted a respectable 3.56 ERA, yet his record was only 10-16. Still, he can't be blamed for his record. Ten wins placed him tied for 17th in the league in that category, but first on his team. He single handedly accounted for over 32% of their victories!!! No other Paducha pitcher had more than 6 wins. The next year he made the jump to Meridian in the Southeastern League (class B) where he posted a 1-4 mark with a 4.80 ERA. In 1939 he split time between Springfield of the Three I League (class B), San Antonio in the Texas League (Class A1) and Youngstown in the Mid-Atlantic League (Class C). I don't have a playing record for him at Springfield or San Antonio, but with Youngstown he posted a 3-4 mark with an ERA of 5.00. In 1940 he pitched for Meridian in Southeastern League (B). I'm afraid I can't find his stats for that season either. Once again, though, he seems to have had the misfortune of being saddled with a poor team as they went 64-80 finishing 24 1/2 games out of first place that year. I can't find a playing record for him in 1941. I'm curious, whether you happen to know if was he drafted that year,injured, or missed for some other reason? Anyway, in 1942, he returned to split time between Springfield again and Muskogee of the Western Association (Class C) At Springfield he was 5-4 with a 5.23 ERA and with Muskogee he went 4-11. He was out of baseball from '43-45, but in 1946 came back to pitch for Elmira of the Eastern League ( Class A). There he went 8-12 with a 3.02 ERA. Once again, though, his record seems to a bit deceptive considering that his team finished 30 games out of first that season. He, apparently, returned to play for Elmira again in 1947 but I can't find a record of his stats. Then there is no record of him pitching again until 1952 when he suddenly reappered with Centralia in the Mississippi-Ohio Valley League (Class D). There had what could be argued was his best season up to that point. He went 11-8 with a 2.30 ERA!!! Once again he seems to have carried much of his team's burden earning almost 27% of their wins. What's more, he placed sixth in the league in ERA. The next season in '53 he once again pitched in The Mississippi-Ohio Valley League, but this time for Mt. Vernon. There he posted his finest won-lost record ever going 14-3 with a 3.81 ERA. He placed seventh overall in wins (just 4 behind the leader) and had the highest winning percentage in the league for anyone with over 8 wins and placed The next seaon he returned to Mt. Vernon and picthed but was not involved in any decisions. That was his final pro season. Overall, I'm extremely impressed with his record. He seems like quite a ballplayer.

[starkbucks]

Hi THE COMMISSIONER,
I have pictures of my Dad wearing the St. Louis Browns uniform where he played; I think Triple A??? Where in your reply was that farm team located for the St. Louis Browns?? I remember as a little girl, the stories that Dad told me. One I believe that he played with John Berardino. Berardino was called a "one-man infielder" during his 11 years with the St. Louis Browns, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh from 1939 through 1952. Is there any record that my Dad played with Berardino during these years and if so I would like to know when and where. He also mentioned he played against or with Chuck Conners somewhere in his baseball career. My Mother is still living and has a lot of the newspaper clippings. She also has a ball uniform that Dad wore advertising ZERO CANDY BARS. Most of his other uniforms have been distroyed. I also have a bit of information that he played for the HOUSE OF DAVID in 1940-- but again when I went to their website there isn't any information. Dad was drafted into the service before my sister was born in 1942???? He was in the Navy and stationed in the Philippines. I have searched website for more information. He started playing at a very young age. After the war he continued and then later after I was born he managed American Legion??? Baseball leagues in Southern Illinois area. I believe at one time he also done some scouting. He was a great man and a great pitcher! If you have any more information please feel free to post or email me! THANKS so much for all the information.

[The Commissioner]

Most of those teams that he played for were affiliated with the Browns. However, San Antonio was the highest level team that he played for. Back then it wasn't Triple A, but rather AA which was the highest minor league. San Antonio was just a step below that at A1. I believe that all of those clubs besides Springfield were associated with the Browns' organization. Then the two teams he played for in '52 and '53 were independent teams in the Mississippi-Ohio Valley League.

In regards to Beradino, this is odd because I can't find any evidence that they actually played together. However, it appears that Beradino played at San Antonio in 1938, the year before your father pitched there.

While your father and Chuck Connors seem to have been active for many of the same years, I can't find any evidence that they ever played in the same league with or against one another at the same time.

[starkbucks]

Thank you very much for all the information. My Dad was born in 1918. He left home to play ball before 1937. I will have to talk to my Mother and find out what year he actually left. One of his pictures when he was in Elmira, New York- hangs in a restaurant in Southern Illinois. The owner of the restaurant would shag balls for my Father. I just returned from Las Vegas and met a woman whose husband pitched Triple A for New York Giants in the early 1950's -and had to stop with the same reason as my Dad- calcium deposits etc. His name was Frank Geroski (I may have mispelled his last name). He later went on to be a figure skater and model. He died of Lou Gerhigs disease. Again thank you for the added information. My Mother has a signed ball of Dad's and 10 or 11 out of the 13 names on the ball- went on to play professional baseball.

[quiltinupastorm]

:hp My father played ball during the 30's and 40's. Remember him talking about the House of David, the St Louis Browns and others. The scrapbooks of newspaper clippings we have stop at 1940. There is a telegram offering him a job with the House of David,dated April 2,1939 and an envelope dated Oct 1939 also from the House of David. I also remember seeing a uniform with the name of the Browns in the closet His name was James B Summers...aka "Little Jimmie Summers "(also Jimmy) in a lot of the articles,most when playing with the Mount Pleasant Texas Cubs during the 30's . Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Melody

[The Commissioner]

I found a record of there being a Jim Summers who played from 1931-33 and then in 1936. Could that be your father?

This Jim Summers played for Oklahoma City from 1931-33 , Joplin in 1933, and then Muskogee in 1936.

In 1931 he made his professional debut with the Oklahoma City Indians in the Western League (Class A) where he batted .271 with one homerun and 11 runs batted in. The next year he became a regular in the lineup and was fourth on the team in both runs batted in with 73, and homeruns with 6. He also had a respectable .268 batting average that season. While Oklahoma City did place 17 games out that season, they had a lot of excellent players including Roy Schalk and Al Benton. They also had the misfortune of being in the same league with the great Tulsa Oilers who's .671 winning percentage was the best in league history. In 1933, Mr. Summers made the jump with the Oklahoma City team into the Western League where he batted .240, before returning to the Western League with the Joplin Miners, an A level affiliate of the Browns. He proceeded to bat .319 for that ballclub with one homerun. The next record of him appearing in pro ball was in 1936 with Muskogee of the Western Association (Class C) where he batted .153 with six runs batted in.

Does that sound like it could be your father?

[quiltinupastorm]

This may be him! One of the newspaper headings says "Miners capture fifth in a row,to witchita today" another says "joplin victor at hutchinson while cards grab lead "Another heading says"950 fans shiver in R.I.park" and talks about the House of Davids "Red Summers,the only unbearded man" during the 1939 autumn season . Melody

[twinheart]

I am trying to find information about my Uncle. He was signed with the Yankees in 1947. I believe he played on the farm team. He used to joke that Whitey Ford still owed him 50 bucks!!

Watching the old timers game this Saturday was especially touching this year, as my Uncle passed away last week -

Any information you could provide me with would be much appreciated -

thank you so much - twinheart

[twinheart]

ackkk!!!!!!!!


....can't believe I did that - it's Robert Scott - Bobby Scott -

sorry!!!

[sultanofswat3]

Hi there...Although none of my relatives were professional players,I do have a friend who was in the Browns system near the end of the franchise's history. His name is Bill Brockett,he is over 70 years old,and I BELIEVE he was an infielder in his day..unfortunately he got drafted, was eventually sent over to Korea,and suffered major battle injuries to his legs there,ending his professional baseball career.** He has since umpired baseball and [eventually]softball in our area [the mid-Hudson Valley in NY State] for almost 50 years![You know..I dont have a CLUE what he did before he retired..and I have known him 13 years as a fellow softball umpire!]


** Before he was sent to Korea, he DID get to play on an Army team with Willie Mays! So he mustve been in the Browns system around 50-51...

[The Commissioner]

Hi there...Although none of my relatives were professional players,I do have a friend who was in the Browns system near the end of the franchise's history. His name is Bill Brockett,he is over 70 years old,and I BELIEVE he was an infielder in his day..unfortunately he got drafted, was eventually sent over to Korea,and suffered major battle injuries to his legs there,ending his professional baseball career.** He has since umpired baseball and [eventually]softball in our area [the mid-Hudson Valley in NY State] for almost 50 years![You know..I dont have a CLUE what he did before he retired..and I have known him 13 years as a fellow softball umpire!]


** Before he was sent to Korea, he DID get to play on an Army team with Willie Mays! So he mustve been in the Browns system around 50-51...

I'm sorry, but I can't find any record of him as having played professionally.

[Bob Lampi]

My father-in-law played for a minor league team in Nebraska before WWII, it was a farm team for the St. Louis Browns. One of his brothers clamied Dan held the record for strike outs in a single game of 18. I can't find out any additional informaton.
His name is Daniel Fenwick born 1916 in Mount Olive Illinois.I would appreciate any help.

[perljm8]

Hello. I'm trying to find out information about my uncle's baseball career and was wondering if anyone could help. I believe he may have only played one year or maybe less. His name is Stacey "Bill" Wills. He graduated High School in 1950 and signed a contract with Class D Baxley, Ga., farm club of the St. Louis Browns. That's about all I have to go on. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

[darusty1]

I am doing a family search on Jeremiah J. O'Leary who played for the Brown's farm club sometime in the mid to late 1930's. He sometimes went by the nicknames of "JJ" or "Jerry". Jerry was from St. Louis, MO.

Birth/death: September 1915 - 1994

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

thank you

[Bill_McCurdy]

Someone posed a similar question a while back and I researched and posted the following information. Even if the horse is out of the barn as far as interest in this topic is concerned, I felt the repetition of this data here might help.

Let's face. We spend a lot of time thinking, researching, and talking about a baseball franchise that has done nothing new in 54 years. There's hardly avoiding all these frequent rest stops at Redundancyville.

Then, when new people drop in to post a "new" topic, it often turns out to be some cabbage that has already been chewed and floated over time to one of the back pages of this thread board.

That's OK. We still love the Browns and all the re-hash their history invites. By the way, has anyone heard the story yet of the time that Browns owner Bill Veeck actually sent a midget up to pinch hit in a regulation game??? :rolleyes:

Nuf sed. Here's the Post WWII farm system data. I think the information displayed below is accurate. I culled it from the wonderful 2nd edition of "The Encyclopedia of Minor League Baseball."

Hope this helps too. The data is dsiplayed here by Minor League Class Level, Team Name, and League.

St. Louis Browns Farm Teams: 1945 to 1953:

1945

AAA Toledo Mud Hens American Association
A Elmira Pioneers Eastern League
D Newark Moundsmen Ohio State League

1946

AAA Toledo Mud Hens American Association
AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
A Elmira Pioneers Eastern League
B Springfield Browns Three I League
B Spartanburg Spartans Tri-State League
C Gloversville-Johnstown Glovers Canadian-American League
C Paris Red Peppers East Texas League
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
D Pittsburg Browns Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League
D Mayfield Clothiers Kitty League
D Newark Moundsmen Ohio State League

1947

AAA Toledo Mud Hens American Association
AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
A Elmira Pioneers Eastern League
B Springfield Browns Three I League
C Globe-Miami Browns Arizona-Texas League
C Hannibal Pilots Central Association
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
C Muskogee Reds Western Association
D Baton Rouge Red Sticks Evangeline League
D Belleville Stags Illinois State League
D Pittsburg Browns Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League
D Mayfield Clothiers Kitty League
D Newark Moundsmen Ohio State League
D Ada Herefords Sooner State League
D Wausau Lumberjacks Wisconsin State League

1948

AAA Toledo Mud Hens American Association
AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
A Elmira Pioneers Eastern League
B Wichita Falls Spudders Big State League
B Port Chester Clippers Colonial League
B Springfield Browns Three I League
C Globe-Miami Browns Arizona-Texas League
C Modesto Reds California League
C Gloversville-Johnstown Glovers Canadian-American League
C Hannibal Pilots Central Association
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
C Muskogee Reds Western Association
D Redding Browns Far West League
D Griffin Pimientos Georgia-Alabama League
D Belleville Stags Illinois State League
D Pittsburg Browns Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League
D Mayfield Clothiers Kitty League
D Peekskill Highlanders North Atlantic League
D Ada Herefords Sooner State League
D Wausau Lumberjacks Wisconsin State League

1949

AAA Baltimore Orioles International League
AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
A Elmira Pioneers Eastern League
B Wichita Falls Spudders Big State League
C Globe-Miami Browns Arizona-Texas League
C Gloversville-Johnstown Glovers Canadian-American League
C Pine Bluff Cardinals Cotton States League
C Marshall Browns East Texas League
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
C Salina/Tijuana Colts Sunset League
C Muskogee Reds Western Association
D Redding Browns Far West League
D Pittsburg Browns Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League
D Mayfield Clothiers Kitty League
D Olean Oilers PONY League
D Ada Herefords Sooner State League
D Wausau Lumberjacks Wisconsin State League

1950

AAA Baltimore Orioles International League
AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
B Wichita Falls Spudders Big State League
C Pine Bluff Judges Cotton States League
C Marshall Browns East Texas League
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
D Redding Browns Far West League
D Pittsburg Browns Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League
D Ada Herefords Sooner State League
D Appleton Papermakers Wisconsin State League

1951

AAA Toronto Maple Leafs International League
AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
A Dayton Indians Central League
B Anderson Rebels Tri-State League
C Pine Bluff Judges Cotton States League
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
D Redding Browns Far West League
D Pittsburg Brownies Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League
D Ada Herefords Sooner State League
D Appleton Papermakers Wisconsin State League

1952

AAA Toronto Maple Leafs International League
AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
A Scranton Miners Eastern League
B York White Roses Interstate League
B Anderson Rebels Tri-State League
C Pine Bluff Judges Cotton States League
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
D Independence Browns Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League
D Ada Herefords Sooner State League

1953

AA San Antonio Missions Texas League
A Wichita Indians Western League
A Lewiston Broncs Western International League
B York White Roses Interstate League
B Anderson Rebels Tri-State League
C Pine Bluff Judges Cotton States League
C Aberdeen Pheasants Northern League
C Pocatello Bannocks Pioneer League
C Thetford Mines Mineurs Provincial League
D Wytheville Statesmen Appalachian League
D Valdosta Browns Georgia-Florida League
D Ada Herefords Sooner State League

[ladybug65793]

Hi...I'm new to this posting thing and not really sure how to use it...but here goes...I'm looking for some information about my grandfather, who I am told, played for a St. Louis Browns farm team. My grandmother once had a book about baseball that had my grandfather's name in it, however, over the years the book disappeared. His name was Ray Isham and my mother says it would have been the late 1930's or 1940's when he played. I would appreciate any information anyone has. I can be emailed at ladybug65793@hotmail.com

[Bill_McCurdy]

Hi...I'm new to this posting thing and not really sure how to use it...but here goes...I'm looking for some information about my grandfather, who I am told, played for a St. Louis Browns farm team. My grandmother once had a book about baseball that had my grandfather's name in it, however, over the years the book disappeared. His name was Ray Isham and my mother says it would have been the late 1930's or 1940's when he played. I would appreciate any information anyone has. I can be emailed at ladybug65793@hotmail.com

Dear Ladybugs,

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but there is no evidence in our most reliable data sources that your grandfather, Ray Isham, ever played for any baseball club at the professional level. The only Isham listed in the Old Time data bank was Martin Isham, who played minor league baseball briefly in 1952.

Ray Isham may have played semi-professional baseball, but we have no way of checking on that possibility for you. Your best bet for tracking down data on his possible semi-pro past is through photos or still-living peers who may have known something about his life in the old days. Pictures are important as clues to the names of teams and companies that once sponsored semi-pro ball.

Try not to be too disappointed in the news about your grandfather. It seems to happen fairly often around here. People like you write us about their ancestor's time with the Browns and, most of the time, we have to report back that that their ancient family member had lived out a family legend that never was true.

Again, my regrets.

- Bill McCurdy

[disgrig]

I have one minor update to make to the list of Browns' Farm Clubs. In 1947, Gloversville-Johnstown (Class C-Canadian American League) was a farm club of the Browns because that is where the Browns sent Chuck Harmon (the second African-American to play in the Canadian-American League; Sammy Gee of Three-Rivers, a Brooklyn Dodgers affiliate, was the first). Chuck was the fourth African-American signed to a contract by the Browns in July of 1947 (the others were Willard Brown and Henry Thompson who played for the Browns for about six weeks and Lorenzo "Piper" Davis was signed to a 30 day option but never played for the Browns).

[tschulz88]

I am looking for information on my grandfather who played for the Browns organization at one time. His name is Delmar Williams. He died before I got a chance to meet him but I was told he played for the Major League club but we can't find any records of it. So I guess I assume he played in the farm system. The only information I have is his professional contract....Thanks in advance for everyone's help.

Travis

[dave_heller]

No Delmar Williams played in the majors - sorry. You might want to give approximate years he might have played in the minors. That would be a help to any "investigation."

[Brownieand45sfan]

(snip) She also remembers him playing and/or training in Pine Bluff Arkansas and Louisiana and other Places (snip)
Thanks,
Tom
The Comish's record might be incomplete because teh Browns definitely did have a minor league club at Pine Bluff, at least as of 1950. It was Class C in the Cotton States league.

[Brownieand45sfan]

Where Ryne Duren got his start. Had the Browns not moved, he would have joined the illustrious list of great Brownie "handicapped" players... and "characters."

Duren was not the first player to wear glasses, but perhaps the first to wear glasses as thick as Coke bottle bottoms. His last warmup pitch ALWAYS went up on the screen over the backstop. Since he had a great fastball, and was wild to begin with, not too many batters had the 'juevos' (Spanish for eggs) to dig in.

By the way, Hall of Famer Ryne Sandberg was named after him. That's ironic, because Sandberg's parents were Mormons, and Duren (unknown to them) was an alcoholic (now sober and on the lecture circuit).


D Wausau Lumberjacks Wisconsin State League

[Brownieand45sfan]

I wonder if he could have gone on to pitch for C Pine Bluff Judges - Cotton States League in '51 and it just didnt show up in your records? As bad as his 1950 Class B record was, that's still a lot of decisions to compltely give up on baseball. Back in thiose days, guys hung on, stepping down the minor league ladder as long as they were still getting paid to play a child's game. (I know Rollie Stiles stayed in the minors for seven years after he was sent down by the Browns the final time. Had some good experienceds too, including being a teammate with KiKi Cuyler at Chattanooga, one of the only fan-owned franchises in the nation.)


Hi Tom,
I'm sorry it took me so long to reply. I was able to find your father's record as having played professionally between the years 1947-50. He appears to have been a pretty darn good pitcher. In his first year of professional ball (1947) he pitched for Mayfield in the Kentucky, Illinois, Tennesee ("Kitty") League. This was a class D League. That season his record was 11-11, which is a bit misleading. While his won/loss record may have only been .500, his 2.69 ERA was the best in the entire league!!!! He also led the league in ERA by a good margain. He was the only pitcher to post a mark below 3 runs per game. The man that finished second in the ERA race that year was Bob Buhl (3.00) who later went onto win 166 games in 15 ML seasons!!! The next season (1948) your father moved up to Springfield in the Illinois-Iowa Indiana League at Class B level. He posted a 1-4 record with a 4.76 record that season. The next year he moved on to play for Gloversville-Johnston at class C in the Canadian-American League. There he posted a .650 winning percentage (6th best by players with 8 or more wins) by going 13-7 with a 4.48 ERA. For his final season he moved on to Anderson in the Tri-State League at class B level. Unfortunately, this was not his best season. He posted a 5-17 record (second most losses in the league) with a 6.02 ERA. That appears to have been his last season of playing pro ball. Overall, he seems to have had a nice little career for himself there. Along the way he played with and against many former and future Major Leaguers. His most notable teammate was probably Roy Sievers on the 1948 Springfield squad. Sievers went on to win the Rookie of the Year his next season and later became a four time All-Star.

[kokosforever]

I live in Hannibal and the old ballpark the Pilots used in 47-48 is still used by the local legion team.
Roy Sievers hit one up on the hill in leftfield in 1947 and was one of the longest hit here.
When Auggie Busch bought the Cardinals in 1953 and remodeled Sportsmans Park they put a bunch of the old seats removed from Sportsmans in the grand stand here and they were used up into the 70's but the wood started to rot on them so they tore them out and threw them in a pile and anyone that wanted them could have them. Luckely I grabbed a set of 3 connected together and have them in my house. had to replace the slats though but kept the old roted ones.

[Historian]

Hi, looking for information for a friend of mine's father. His name is Michael Veres (or Verne). I believe he played for the St. Louis Browns during 1950-1953, however, I can not find his name on any of the major league rosters during this period or earlier. Therefore, I assume he must have played in the St. Louis Browns farm system.

Could someone either provide information about his minor leaguer career or point me to where I might be able to find information on his minor leaguer career?

Thanks

[Bill_McCurdy]

Hi, looking for information for a friend of mine's father. His name is Michael Veres. I believe he played for the St. Louis Browns during 1950-1953, however, I can not find his name on any of the major league rosters during this period or earlier. Therefore, I assume he must have played in the St. Louis Browns farm system.

Could someone either provide information about his minor leaguer career or point me to where I might be able to find information on his minor leaguer career?

Thanks

Historian -

No one named Michael Veres ever played a single inning of major or minor league organized professional baseball. I don't know what else to tell you. The only alternatives are that he played independent, semi-pro, or amateur ball and then enlarged upon his history in his stories to family. Or else - or else he's just the latest member of the St. Louis Browns Fibbers Club. Back in the murky pre-Internet days, a lot of guys seemed fond of telling family about their time with the Browns, probably never realizing how easily these tales would unravel in the information-wired digital future. Bottom Line: I don't really know how the Michael Veres story started. I only know with 100% certainty that no one by that name ever played organized professional baseball.

As per usual, my regrets go out to the family with this information.

- Bill McCurdy

[cdog6198]

Hi! I was wondering if someone could help me. My grandpa told me that he used to play for the St. Louis Browns, but i have not been able to find any record of it. I thought he said it was 1941. He was born in 1916 so that would have made him about 25 at the time. I think maybe it was one of the "farm teams" or something. not sure. i am definitely not a baseball buff. His name is Okie Burgess Young, but he may have gone by Burge. Also, I have heard that many of his fellow teammates called him "Blackie" so not really sure what he would be listed as. He said he was a pitcher. I have not had any luck so any help would be greatly appreciated. His family is from KY and he raised his family in MI, so not sure what he was doing in St. Louis, but it would be cool to find something about it. Thanks for your help!!!

Also, kinda off subject, but he also said he played softball for the windsor jets---have not had any luck with that either....ugh!

-Charisma

[Bill_McCurdy]

Charisma -

There's a reason you are having trouble finding out about your grandpa's life in baseball. As I always ending up saying at moments like this one, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but your grandpa, Okie Burgess or Burge Young, never played for the St. Louis Browns or any other professional baseball team.

For whatever reason, a lot of fathers, grandpas, and great-grandpas back in the day engaged in the practice of legend-building by telling their kids, granndkids, and great-grandkids that they once played baseball for the old St. Louis Browns.

What seemed most likely back then as a harmless little white lie that made everybody feel good about an undiscoverable falsification of the truth just floated out there pretty freely as an OK choice. Then along came the 21st century and digital data over the Internet. The old stories about a Browns career burn immediately with a few simple clicks onto the records we now have on everybody whoever played the game. I'm afraid your grandpa was one of the storytellers.

Regrets,

Bill McCurdy

[philliesfiend55]

To Tdworak:

Your topic triggered me to dig out an old 1962 Who's Who In Baseball and look up the record of Bob Turley. He made stops at four levels of the
St. Louis Browns farm system, from 1948 to 1951, and I would guess that his progress through the system would be typical of a farmhand who was major league-bound, during the franchise's final years in St. Louis.

1948 - Belleville - Illinois State League
1949 - Aberdeen - Northern League
1950 - Wichita - Western League
1950 - San Antonio - Texas League
1951 - San Antonio - Texas League

Turley was recalled to pitch one game for the Browns in Sept. 1951 before being drafted into the army. When his military service concluded 23 months later in August 1953, he didn't return to the minors, but went up to the majors for good. He participated in approximately the last seven weeks of Browns' games of that season, and of their franchise history in St, Louis.

Other Browns' farmhands such as Jim Pisoni (the last player to make his MLB debut with the St. Louis Browns in their history) had stops in Wichita and San Antonio in the early '50s as well, so I assume Turley's progression was somewhat typical (except for the fact that he never appeared for a AAA team). Toledo, Baltimore and Toronto were all AAA teams for the Browns/Orioles franchise at various points in the big league club's final years in St. Louis.

-phillies fiend 55-

[philliesfiend55]

Bil McCurdy's research to produce that list of Browns' farm beams between 1945 and 1953 is impressive (Post #31, this thread). Keep in mind however, that the Browns were one of the poorer franchises of that time. While they might have averaged about 15 farm teams per year during that period, with a one-year peak of 20, many teams such as the Dodgers and Phillies had around or over 25 farm teams throughout most of that same period.
That's a clear indication that there has been a decline of popularity of the game among today's youth and that a lot of talent that was once exclusively bound for careers in baseball has been funneled off to other sports.
Today teams have four full season farm teams and two more short season ones in a typical organizational setup.

[Brownieand45sfan]

Good post.

This situation is horrendous. There so much blame to go around, but MLB itself is at least partially to blame. This is (was) the national sport, a great unifying factor between us all. A cultural trust, obliterated. There shouldn't be an American who hasn't played baseball. It can be a sunny Saturday afternoon in Spring with the breeze blowing out and I can drive for miles sometimes without seeing a full diamond. On such a day, every man woman and child under 50 should be playing - or watching - a game.

Bil McCurdy's research to produce that list of Browns' farm beams between 1945 and 1953 is impressive (Post #31, this thread). Keep in mind however, that the Browns were one of the poorer franchises of that time. While they might have averaged about 15 farm teams per year during that period, with a one-year peak of 20, many teams such as the Dodgers and Phillies had around or over 25 farm teams throughout most of that same period.
That's a clear indication that there has been a decline of popularity of the game among today's youth and that a lot of talent that was once exclusively bound for careers in baseball has been funneled off to other sports.
Today teams have four full season farm teams and two more short season ones in a typical organizational setup.

[philliesfiend55]

To sultan of swat 3:

"Before he was sent to Korea, he DID get to play on an Army team with Willie Mays! So he must've been in the Browns system around 50-51" -Sultan Of Swat 3.

It (his military service) must have been a little later. Mays didn't go into the army until Memorial Day Weekend (late May) of 1952. The war lasted until July 27, 1953, and Mays got an early release from his two year hitch to enable him to go to Spring Training, 1954. Your friend, Bill Brockett may have played on the same army baseball team as Mays before being sent to Korea and wounded there. Probably played ball in '52 and served in Korea '52 and 1953. The youngest Korean War Vets are now at least 74 years old (based on the draft age of 18 in 1952, the last complete year of the war.).
-philliesfiend55-

[armywife]

I'm trying to find some information on my grandpa. I was told he played for a farmer league called the browns in St. Louis before being drafted for the war. His name is Norman Charles Mason. I have tried to find information on the internet myself, but haven't had any luck. So if anyone can help it will be greatly appreciated.

[Bill_McCurdy]

I'm trying to find some information on my grandpa. I was told he played for a farmer league called the browns in St. Louis before being drafted for the war. His name is Norman Charles Mason. I have tried to find information on the internet myself, but haven't had any luck. So if anyone can help it will be greatly appreciated.

Dear Armywife:

If your grandpa's full name was Norman Charles Mason, he did not play professional baseball on any level. Ever.

There was a pitcher named Charles G. Mason who played several seasons of minor league ball between 1938-1947, but his full name does not match the information you have supplied us here.

Sorry. This sort of bad news happens pretty often around here about grandpas and the legends of their own minds. We of the Browns Forum are beginning to feel too much like "The Bad News Bearers" when it comes to news like the information I am forced in the name of truth to bring to you today.

[HarryB923]

Hi--

Love the board! I too am looking for confirmation that my step-dad, Donald Deneen Farris, probably went by Don in the 1940s through 1950s, played in the Browns farm clubs. He was in Korea in the early '50s, but may have played as early as 1947/48. Born in 1930. Grew up near Joplin, MO. Said to have been related by marriage to Ken Boyer (my step-cousins were Greg and Jeff Boyer). May have played after he returned, so 1953-1957 (when my oldest step-brother was born). Spent some time in California, maybe into the 1960s (when my youngest step-brother was born).

Infielder, 2nd base. Said he'd been slid into by Mickey Mantle once, showed a scar on his leg. I seem to remember him mentioning Springfield, but I thought he'd claimed A league status. Went to Pittsburg State College, KS (now KSU Pittsburg), so may have played in the K-O-M League (which would have put him in the right place at the right time to be slid into by Mantle, though what The Commerce Comet was doing sliding with a bum leg I couldn't say ...).

My name's Buerkett, but I don't know that I'm related to Jesse. His "u" probably started out with an umlaut; my side of the family kept the German usage of an "e" in the writing of it. Any family history for Jesse Burkett?

Thanks. I won't be disappointed if this all turns out to be family fables. I don't know how I'll break it to my half sister, though! :(

[HarryB923]

Don Farris clarification. Thanks to those who PM'd me!

From Bill Farris, his brother: Your Dad had a chance to sign with the old St. Louis Browns and would have been assigned to their Fargo, ND farm team. Grandma said Fargo was too far for him to go and therefore he didn't sign. He played semi-pro baseball with a team close to Joplin called the Alba Aces. They had a regular league and they traveled in southwest Missouri and into eastern Kansas. Their main competition was a team called the Baxter Springs Whiz Kids. Either the Aces or the Whiz Kids would win the League Crown every year. One of the Whiz Kids players was Mickey Mantle. Your Dad played second base and led the league in stolen bases every year he played. He batted leadoff and his batting average was always over .300. He played for the Aces for 3 or 4 years.

Thanks again! Another piece of the semi-pro puzzle filled in.

[The Commissioner]

Thanks very much for sharing that information. To what degree the information regarding your father is fact or mythology none of us may ever know, but that's part of what makes baseball history so fascinating.