best year of Babe Ruths career poll

[Blackout]

I figure I'd try something new. everything in bold is a career high, everything in italics lead the league. I've narrowed this down to 5 options.

*I put AB's to compare with his BA


1920: .376 BA, 457 AB, 54 HR, 137 RBI, 150 BB, 14 stolen bases, .533 on-base, .849 slugging %, and 1.382 OPS, 388 Total bases
1921: .378 BA, 540 AB, 44 doubles, 16 triples, 59 HR, 171 RBI, 177 Runs, 145 BB, 17 SB, 1.358 OPS and 457 Total bases
1923: .393 BA, 522 AB, 205 hits, 45 doubles, 13 triples, 41 HR, 131 RBI, 151 runs, 170 BB, 17 SB, .545 OBP, 1.309 OPS, 393 Total bases
1927: .356 BA, 540 AB, 60 HR, 164 RBI, 158 runs, 137 BB, .772 slugging %, 1.258 OPS, 417 Total bases
1930: .359 BA, 518 AB, 186 hits, 9 triples, 49 HR, 153 RBI, 150 Runs, 136 BB, 10 SB, .732 slugging %, 1.225 OPS, 379 Total bases

I was going to make his 1916 and 1917 seasons on this poll too (as a pitcher), but I figured anyone who voted for them would be wasting their vote. I did put in an "other" option for the hell of it

[torez77]

I choose 1921, although 1920 is very close. His OPS+ is actually higher in 1920, but in '21 he set the record for runs scored, RBI's and total bases in '21 - playing for an average offensive team before Gehrig, Combs or Lazzeri! '20 and '21 are tight, but I'll take '21!

[Blackout]

i voted for 1921, which i think could possibly be the best season anyones ever had, but looking at 1923, Ruths stats seemed to be so distributed that '23 is hard not to vote for

career high BA, career high hits, career high doubles, a good amount of triples, a decent 41 homeruns, career high BB, and a damn good OPS

but alot of people will probably sleep on that year because he only had 41 homeruns, and it'd be hard to say his best year was a season he was behind his usual pace on homers

[SHOELESSJOE3]

I chose 1921 by a slim, slim margin over 1923. To me this was his most well rounded season. He did have some stats in other seasons that bettered his 1921 stats but all around he was at his best in 1921
In 1921 Ruth had his SECOND highest totals and SECOND highest percentage stats for one season in the following.

Home runs--------------------59------60 IN 1927
Doubles----------------------44------45 in 1923
Batting Average-------------.378-----.393 in 1923--- also had a .378- 1924
Slugging--------------------.846-----.847 in 1920
OPS------------------------1.359---1.379 in 1920
Run/CG---------------------17.90---18.41 in 1920

So he did do better in some stats in 1920 and 1923 but was second by a slim margin in a number in 1921.

His best for one season all in 1921.
Triples----------------------------------16
Total bases----------------------------457
RBI's-----------------------------------171
Runs-----------------------------------177
EBHs-----------------------------------119
Runs created above average (RCAA)----166
Runs Created--------------------------243

Looks (1921) to be the best all around, the way I see it. Strong argument could be made for 1923 and 1920.

A shame although his own fault that he had that short season in 1922. That really hurt what could have been, still may be one of the best 5 year peaks 1920-1924.

[POLO GROUNDS 1957]

Hello i voted for 1921. i have read that the babe loved playing in the polo grounds Donald :waving

[NationalPastime1980]

1921 was an amazing season for The Sultan of Swat

[Blackout]

still no votes for 1920?

[Honus Wagner Rules]

OK, I voted for 1920. In 1920 Ruth showed the baseball world what is possible. Ruth's 1920 season was "historic" in the sense that he did something different. It's like Chuck Yeager breaking the sound barrier in the Bell X-1. The X-1 was the first supersonic aircraft. Other aircraft flew much faster in later years but the X-1 was the first.

[Dudeman]

1921 the year Babe became a Legend.

[csh19792001]

1921 the year Babe became a Legend.

1923- look at his splits in 20' and 21'- the Polo Grounds MADE HIM those years.

[plask_stirlac]

1. 1921
2. 1923 - More times on base
3. 1920 - Best OPS+
4. 1927

[wrgptfan]

It must be 1923. He had stats that were comparable to those in 1920 and 1921 but he led his team to the World Series championship hitting 386/556/1000 in the 6 game series win.

[Appling]

I picked 1921 because he set records that year that still stand: 457 Total Bases and 177 runs scored. His combination of 177 runs and 171 runs scored also stands unchallanged, and his .846 slugging average was certainly "respectable".

I am surprised there are not more votes for his 1927, which prior to the Maris season of 1961 was probably the most famous and most romanticised season of the Babe's career.

In the 1940'S and 1950's a number of players were threats to break Ruth's record of 60 homeruns: Kiner and Mize 1947; Kiner 1949; Kiner 1950; Mathews 1953; Kluszewski 1954; Mays 1955; Mantle 1956. By July of each year the daily newspaper would print a box score comparing the homerun total for the current threat with Ruth's total for the same number of games. The new threat would always be ahead of the Ruth pace until the middle of August, when Ruth's torrid August numbers would push him back in front.

This was excitement not matched anywhere else -- perhaps because we knew our hero would win out again when the season ended. We were reminded almost every year of the Ruth 1927 season -- and the famous Yankee Murderer's Row. I knew that Foxx and Greenberg had each hit 58 in a season, but only several years later did I realize that Ruth himself hit 59 in a year (1921 season). Even today, I suspect most casual fans know only of the Ruth 1927 season.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

I picked 1921 because he set records that year that still stand: 171 runs scored also stands unchallanged


Uhhhhmm...Last time I checked I thought Billy Hamilton has the runs scored record with 192 runs for the 1894 Phillies.

[Blackout]

Uhhhhmm...Last time I checked I thought Billy Hamilton has the runs scored record with 192 runs for the 1894 Phillies.

ruth has the modern day record, pre-1900 stats get overlooked due to the way the rules have evolved over the years

[Honus Wagner Rules]

ruth has the modern day record, pre-1900 stats get overlooked due to the way the rules have evolved over the years

Ok...But nothing happened in 1900 to make the game "modern". If anything the game became modern in 1893 when the mound was set at 60'6". If you look at Baseball-Reference.com they list Hamilton as the runs record holder.

Baseball-Reference link (http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/R_season.shtml)

[Blackout]

Ok...But nothing happened in 1900 to make the game "modern". If anything the game became modern in 1893 when the mound was set at 60'6". If you look at Baseball-Reference.com they list Hamilton as the runs record holder.

Baseball-Reference link (http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/R_season.shtml)

i dont want to get off-topic in here, so I made my response in your new thread

[Appling]

Uhhhhmm...Last time I checked I thought Billy Hamilton has the runs scored record with 192 runs for the 1894 Phillies.
It may not be fair, but (like many others) I choose to ignore "MLB records" that were set before 1900.

And 1894 is my favorite year to ignore -- hitting .400 was no special achievement in that season.

[Imapotato]

1927 without a doubt

OPS+ BLAH!

He was the only one hitting HRs in 1920 and 1921, in 1923 I think 2 players in the AL and 3 in the NL started playing Ruth's game wherein 1927, he had alot more HR competition and blasted all of them away, truly his most magnificent season

and the biggest rule in regards to offense took place around 1903, the foul strike rule...before then you could just strike at pitches and hit them foul w/o a strike being called until you got a pitch you liked...and thus began the deadball era...look at Lajoie's, Wagner's and Keeler's stats stats after the rule change (I forgot who adopted it 1st I think ut was the NL in 1902, Al in 1903)

[SHOELESSJOE3]

1927 without a doubt

And the biggest rule in regards to offense took place around 1903, the foul strike rule...before then you could just strike at pitches and hit them foul w/o a strike being called until you got a pitch you liked...and thus began the deadball era...look at Lajoie's, Wagner's and Keeler's stats stats after the rule change (I forgot who adopted it 1st I think ut was the NL in 1902, Al in 1903)

Your right on with that one. That foul strike was a big change.

The NL made the change in 1901 and the league offense dropped.
---------Batting Ave.---------BB-----------ERA
1900-------.279-------------3034----------3.69
1901-------.267-------------2619-----------3.32


The AL made the change in 1903
----------Batting Ave--------BB-----------ERA
1902----------.275--------2815----------3.57
1903----------.255--------2266---------2.95.

[CoasttoCoast]

1921 and what a year it was!

[Sultan_1895-1948]

1923- look at his splits in 20' and 21'- the Polo Grounds MADE HIM those years.

How different do you think his numbers would have been, had he started out in Yankee Stadium in '20? Just curious.

Hard not to pick '20. There are the numbers. Then there's the 26 game hitting streak, and doing what nobody thought could ever be possible, in ways that were never imagined. All this through an injury plagued season.

I gotta go with '21 though. Not that he was ever bothered by pressure, but for him to top '20 the very next year was amazing. 457 total bases, and setting the all time HR record that year is nice too.

blackout, u should update his OBP and SA for '20. (.533 and .849)

[Wee Willie]

I voted 1923 because Ruth also had arguably a gold glove year in RF. It likely was his best defensive year, and of course he won his first WS ring.

[csh19792001]

How different do you think his numbers would have been, had he started out in Yankee Stadium in '20? Just curious.


Probably quite different, if you look at his splits at The Polo Grounds.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

Probably quite different, if you look at his splits at The Polo Grounds.

Do you have those off hand? Do you mean just homeruns or everything.

We know what his splits were in '19.

We know the huge dimensions of other AL parks.

We know that the majority of his Polo Grounds homers left little doubt.

Speaking of the thread topic, one could make a case that '19 was his best year. Making emergency starts, and setting the HR record in huge parks before rule changes were implemented.

[Edgartohof]

1921 straight up. Just can't compare.

The other seasons may have individual numbers that were better (not by much though), but overall, this was clearly his best year.

His top three years, he had:

.370+ BA
.510+ OBP
1.300+ OPS

Of them, he had his greatest power in '21, where his 59 HR's beats out the other two seasons (54 in '20, and 41 in '23). But it's not just his HR's where he leads in power, he also had 44 doubles (one less than in '23), and a career high of 16 triples (3 more than in '23). In short, he beats out the other 2 seasons in XBH by 20 (119 to 99)!
Edge: 1921

His best OBP year of these three was in 1923, where he hit .393/.545. These were career numbers for both OBP and BA for him that year, and he was 2nd in BA that year. He also posted an OBP of .533in 1920, which also beats his OBP from '21, which was still an astounding .512.
Edge: 1923

Stolen Bases - actually has very little to do with this, but I just wanted to mention it. 1921 was Ruths best year on the bases of the three (although still horrible by todays standards). He stole 17 of 30, good for a 57% success rate (okay, so not so good). But it is still clearly better than the other two seasons (14/28 in '20, and 17/38 in '23).
Edge: none - all of them were crappy, so this was pointless

Runs/RBI - team dependant? who cares. 1921 was also Ruths biggest year, putting up career highs of 177 Runs, and 171 RBI. The 177 runs is a 20th century record, and the 171 RBI were a record then. These beat the other two seasons by at least 19 Runs, and 34 RBI!
Edge: 1921

Pitching: Ruth won 2 games in '21 (in spite of giving up 9 ER in 9 innings over those 2 games).
Edge: none - again. He had a 9.00 ERA - he probably homered in both of those games to win (hey, could somebody check that out for me?)

RC - runs created - '21 wins here as well. According to BB-ref, he had 233 RC in '21, 206 in '20, and 216 in '23.
Edge: 1921

There are probably other areas to consider, but these are the big ones (some more so than others). For me, it's clear that 1921 was the best, but not by much, and as it's been said before, I'd be able to live with any of them.

[csh19792001]

Do you have those off hand? Do you mean just homeruns or everything.


Ruth's splits
1920
Home: .397/.539/.985
Ruth slugged nearly 1.000 at home for an entire season.
He had 201 total bases in 204 at bats!!!

1921
Home: .404/.545/.929

The Grounds:
258 to right, 249 to left.

The left-field second-deck overhang meant that a homer to left was actually easier than a homer to right, even though the wall in left was 19 feet further away - the overhang was 21 feet, effectively shortening the distance required for a pop-fly homer to the second deck in left to 249 feet because of the angle involved.

In his two ostensibly greatest seasons, you gotta believe Ruth benefitted a ton from his park. Light years more so than after the move to The Stadium.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

He had a 9.00 ERA - he probably homered in both of those games to win (hey, could somebody check that out for me?)



He started a game on June 13 of 1921. Went 5 innings and got roughed up a bit, but still got the win. Yanks won that day over Detroit 13-8. Not sure what Ruth did at the plate. Knowing how he normally did against Detroit pitchers, chances are good he contributed. Maybe Joe can check the boxscore for info.

The other game in '21 came after the Yanks had clinched the pennant in the first game of a doubleheader. Babe gnagged Huggins into letting him pitch a few innings of the second game. He entered the game in the 8th inning with the Yanks ahead 6-0. He gave up six runs to tie the score. Huggins let Ruth stay in and he pitched shutout ball through the 9th, 10th, and 11th innings, before the Yanks scored in the bottom of the 11th. 7-6 win. Looking at retrosheet here, looks like that game was an Oct 1st home game against PHI and Hoyt started.


[U]The Grounds:
258 to right, 249 to left.


Yeah, in '21 Polo Grounds

Left - 286 (250 overhang)

Left Center, Left of Bullpen - 447

Left Center, Right of Bullpen - 455

Center - 480

Right Center - 450

Right - 256

[SHOELESSJOE3]

He started a game on June 13 of 1921. Went 5 innings and got roughed up a bit, but still got the win. Yanks won that day over Detroit 13-8. Not sure what Ruth did at the plate. Knowing how he normally did against Detroit pitchers, chances are good he contributed. Maybe Joe can check the boxscore for info.
.

Ruth pitched 5 innings, gave up 5 hits- 7 walks-4 earned runs. He left the mound after the 5th inning after he struck out Ty Cobb. The day before Cobb and Ruth had to be separated after nearly coming to blows.

At the plate Ruth was 2 for 3. Two home runs, one into the center field bleachers at the Polo Grounds. At that time CF was 433 feet away. The only time the CF bleachers was reached was yesterday, by Ruth in another two home run day. Todays was further than yesterdays, described as "several rows back around 460 to 470 feet. Ruth has homered 4 times in his last 5 official at bats and had 7 home runs in the last 5 days.

Glad to hear this. Before the series with the Tigers was over Cobb patted Ruth on the back near the games end, both smiled, happy ending.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

At the plate Ruth was 2 for 3. Two home runs

Figures. Nice work Joe.

[SHOELESSJOE3]

Ruth's splits
1920
Home: .397/.539/.985
Ruth slugged nearly 1.000 at home for an entire season.
He had 201 total bases in 204 at bats!!!

1921
Home: .404/.545/.929

The Grounds:
258 to right, 249 to left.

The left-field second-deck overhang meant that a homer to left was actually easier than a homer to right, even though the wall in left was 19 feet further away - the overhang was 21 feet, effectively shortening the distance required for a pop-fly homer to the second deck in left to 249 feet because of the angle involved.

In his two ostensibly greatest seasons, you gotta believe Ruth benefitted a ton from his park. Light years more so than after the move to The Stadium.

Regarding the home runs, more than a few times I gave some numbers on Ruth's 32 home runs hit at the Polo Grounds that season. If I can recall, only 6 went into the lower deck in right and some were described a "deep" into the bleachers. All the rest were into the upper deck. One off the roof facade in RF, some to the power alleys, more than a few over the roof, one to the back row in left center field and two to dead center. So he did poke a few down that line but overall, he earned the rest.

Until Ruth poked a number over the roof in RF and RCF before 1920 no parks had foul lines painted any further than on the ground itself, there was no need. It was Ruth's high drives that brought on the painting of the foul stripe up to the roof, the precursor to what we call today, the foul pole or as some choose to call it, the fair pole.

[four tool]

I picked 1921 because he basically did his 1920 numbers with a lot more ABS, so 1921 over 1920 for me.

1923 is a close second. Definitely more balanced, but it just doesn't have the appeal of the spectacular 1920-1921 seasons.

[SHOELESSJOE3]

I chose 1921 by a slim, slim margin over 1923. To me this was his most well rounded season. He did have some stats in other seasons that bettered his 1921 stats but all around he was at his best in 1921
In 1921 Ruth had his SECOND highest totals and SECOND highest percentage stats for one season in the following.
Home runs--------------------59------60 IN 1927
Doubles----------------------44------45 in 1923
Batting Average-------------.378-----.393 in 1923--- also had a .378- 1924
Slugging--------------------.846-----.847 in 1920
OPS------------------------1.359---1.379 in 1920
Run/CG---------------------17.90---18.41 in 1920

So he did do better in some stats in 1920 and 1923 but was second by a slim margin in a number in 1921.

His best for one season all in 1921. Triples----------------------------------16
Total bases----------------------------457
RBI's-----------------------------------171
Runs-----------------------------------177
EBHs-----------------------------------119
Runs created above average (RCAA)----166
Runs Created--------------------------243

Looks (1921) to be the best all around, the way I see it. Strong argument could be made for 1923 and 1920.

.

Ruth could have had 60 home runs in 1921 and that would have tied his best which was 60 in 1927. On July 5, 1921 he hit a ball into the bleachers but a fan in attempting to catch the ball knocked it back onto the playing field. At that time the runner was given a ground rule double, that was the ground rule then, has been changed since then. A few inniings later he did hit a home run, striking a flag staff on the roof.

[csh19792001]

Regarding the home runs, more than a few times I gave some numbers on Ruth's 32 home runs hit at the Polo Grounds that season. If I can recall, only 6 went into the lower deck in right and some were described a "deep" into the bleachers. All the rest were into the upper deck. One off the roof facade in RF, some to the power alleys, more than a few over the roof, one to the back row in left center field and two to dead center. So he did poke a few down that line but overall, he earned the rest.


Have you looked at 1921 also? I'd be really interested too hear how many cheapies he had that year, which was probably his best on paper.

With Ruth, MOST of his years were freakishly good, and you can't go wrong with any of them. Ruth in his prime was very much like Bonds the last 5 years, but with far more runs and RBI's, taking the ball to all fields, and hitting for a higher average. Less of his value coming from walks and homeruns, and more from sheer hitting ability.

[csh19792001]

Ruth could have had 60 home runs in 1921 and that would have tied his best which was 60 in 1927. On July 4,1921 he hit a ball into the bleachers but a fan in attempting to catch the ball knocked it back onto the playing field. At that time the runner was given a ground rule double, that was the ground rule then, has been changed since then. A few inniings later he did hit a home run, striking a flag staff on the roof.

Nice work here as always, Joe. This anecdote I hadn't ever heard before.

[Jidge708]

Have you looked at 1921 also? I'd be really interested too hear how many cheapies he had that year, which was probably his best on paper.

With Ruth, MOST of his years were freakishly good, and you can't go wrong with any of them. Ruth in his prime was very much like Bonds the last 5 years, but with far more runs and RBI's, taking the ball to all fields, and hitting for a higher average. Less of his value coming from walks and homeruns, and more from sheer hitting ability.

I believe, I thought that the year Sholessjoe3 was speaking of was his 1921 season.

[Jidge708]

Nice work here as always, Joe. This anecdote I hadn't ever heard before.
I believe that the ruling on balls hit into the spectator section changed in the 1930s. It's a judgement call by the ump, deciding did the fan reach onto the playing area or not when deflecting a ball. It was clear in Ruth's lost home run in 1921 at the Polo Grounds, the ball hit a few rows back but a fan knocked it back on to the field.

I recall seeing somewhere that Ruth also lost two home runs at Shibe Park in the 1930s because of a ground rule in effect. I think he hit 49 that season and that cost him what would have been his 5th season with 50 or more.

[csh19792001]

I believe, I thought that the year Sholessjoe3 was speaking of was his 1921 season.

Ok, how about 1920? :)

[SHOELESSJOE3]

Ok, how about 1920? :)

I have not looked at his home/away home runs, distance in 1920. It was 29 home and 25 away but I have not checked game recaps of that season, where those 29 were hit, what area of the Polo Grounds.

[SHOELESSJOE3]

I recall seeing somewhere that Ruth also lost two home runs at Shibe Park in the 1930s because of a ground rule in effect. I think he hit 49 that season and that cost him what would have been his 5th season with 50 or more.

That was the 1930 season and he did hit 49. Twice in that season, I think once in April and then late in the season September Ruth hit balls that cleared the wall in right center but struck speaker supports and bounded back on the playing field. There was no ground rule covering that, both times the Yanks protested, both times they lost and Ruth was given a double.

Don't recall the one pitcher but one was hit off of Lefty Grove.

[538280]

I voted for 1923 for two reasons:

1.As Wee Willie said, Ruth was very good in the field in 1923. Although he was a decent fielder in his younger years, 1923 was his only year when he was really of Gold Glove quality out there.

2.Ruth's power numbers in 1920 and 1921 were greatly inflated by the Polo Grounds. In 1923 he played in Yankee Stadium which was a pitchers' park, even for left handers.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

Ok, how about 1920? :)

Season Homers

Babe had 12 home runs by the end of May (far more than anyone had ever hit in one month before), 12 home runs in June, and 37 home runs by the end of July.

-- He only hit seven in the next five weeks, but came alive again in September and had 10 homers in his last 24 games.

-- His first 16 Polo Grounds homers in '20 all went into the upper deck, or over the roof.

Batting Averages

On June 20, it was .345

On June 28, it was .359

On July 1, it was .372

On July 11, it was .385

On August 4, it was .391

He cooled off a bit after that and finished with a .376 average, good for fourth in the league behind Sisler (.407), Speaker (.388), and Jackson (.382).


-- During 1920 Babe began to be walked more and more. Huggins finally switched Babe from fourth to third in the order, and put Meusel, a good cleanup hitter, in the fourth spot. It didn’t help much.

-- Typical was a game on July 11, when Ruth went to bat four times against Howard Ehmke of Detroit, and took the bat off his shoulder only twice. In the first inning with men on 2nd and 3rd and nobody out, he was walked on four straight pitches. In the third inning with nobody on, he swung and missed at the first pitch, and hit a home run on the next pitch. In the fifth and seventh innings, both times with the bases empty, he was walked on four straight pitches.

-- It became apparent that there was no way to pitch to him. In a June game, the Yanks were losing 5-3 in the eighth inning to the Red Sox. The Yanks had runners on first and third, and Babe was coming up to bat. The Sox wanted to walk him, but that meant putting the winning run on first base, and the tying run into scoring position. They decided to take their chances. Babe hit a triple off the right-center exit gate in the Polo Grounds to score both runners. Meusel followed with a double to score Ruth, and then Pratt singled in Meusel. Yankees win 7-5.

Hitting Streak

Babe’e 26 game hitting streak came in 1920. It lasted from June 26 and ended in the second game of a double header on July 13. In the final game he walked twice and struck out twice. After the last strikeout, he slammed his bat against the ground in frustration and cracked it.

Here’s some info on that streak courtesy of SHOELESSJOE3:

"Here is what I have, remember there are 5 games with no accounting for. With the total of probable at bats being around 90+ ( thats low) assuming an average of 3 or 4 in those 5 missing games a few more hits could make a big difference in that batting average for those 26 games"

AB-----------78
Hits----------36
Ba.----------.461
BB-----------16
Doubles------5
Triples-------4
Home runs---10

[Blackout]

surpseied 27 has all those votes

[SHOELESSJOE3]

surpseied 27 has all those votes

Probably because of hitting 60 in 1927, more print for that season.
I stay with 1921, it was his best all around.

One note here, only a fluke cost Babe a 60 home run season in 1921. Fan intererference, a fan attempting to catch a ball knocked the ball back on to the field, today fan interference in 1921 not so, Babe sent back to second base, a double.

Not only that, in January of 1921 he predicts hitting 60 and but for that lost home run his prediction would have been correct. Finished with 59 home runs in 1921.

[brett]

i voted for 1921, which i think could possibly be the best season anyones ever had, but looking at 1923, Ruths stats seemed to be so distributed that '23 is hard not to vote for

career high BA, career high hits, career high doubles, a good amount of triples, a decent 41 homeruns, career high BB, and a damn good OPS

but alot of people will probably sleep on that year because he only had 41 homeruns, and it'd be hard to say his best year was a season he was behind his usual pace on homers

Are we to include defense as well? I like '23 because a lot of defensive systems rate it as one of the top 5 defensive years ever by a right fielder. All-around I think that '20, '21, '23 and '24 are his 4 best, BUT I think that '27 sometimes gets UNDER appreciated because after the 50+ years in '20-'21, Ruth hung around in the 40 range. Those years would have seemed a little anomalous in terms of HRs if he hadn't put up the 60 in '27. Interestingly, the league had still not really starting hitting home runs by 27. Ruth actually hit almost 1 out of every 7 home runs in the AL that year. '29 was the first year in which the league really started to move toward the "home run hitter".

'21 however was actually a bigger offensive year in the AL than even '30 in OB and Slugging and maybe the best in history for the AL in those terms.

I think that some people think that '19 was one of his top 5 as well.

Also, in '20-'24 pitchers could save their best for Ruth. By '27 that would have been dangerous.

[Blackout]

i was a fool for not adding 1919

[stuarthouse]

You have made the most cogent argument! Frankly, the Polo Grounds giveth and the Polo Grounds taketh away. Most of Ruth's homers in 1921 would have been home runs in any park including Yellowstone. The centerfield dimensions left a huge amount of real estate in which to collect a lot of additional extra-base hits. The Yankee offense that year was dependent upon Ruth more so than in later years. If he had had such teammates as he did in later years, undoubtedly his numbers would have been even more gaudy!
I choose 1921, although 1920 is very close. His OPS+ is actually higher in 1920, but in '21 he set the record for runs scored, RBI's and total bases in '21 - playing for an average offensive team before Gehrig, Combs or Lazzeri! '20 and '21 are tight, but I'll take '21!

[pheasant]

Ruth's 1918 season is the most impressive season to me. He posted a 194 OPS+ during the Dead Ball era over 380 PA. He also led the league in HRs. However, he also went 13-7 on the mound with 2.22 ERA. In addition, he went 2-0 in the World Series with a 1.06 ERA in 17 innings. This type of versatility wins my vote. Granted, it may not have been as valuable as a handful of other seasons. But this season impresses me the most about Ruth. Talk about a workhorse that year.

[csh19792001]

Ruth's 1918 season is the most impressive season to me. He posted a 194 OPS+ during the Dead Ball era over 380 PA. He also led the league in HRs. However, he also went 13-7 on the mound with 2.22 ERA. In addition, he went 2-0 in the World Series with a 1.06 ERA in 17 innings. This type of versatility wins my vote. Granted, it may not have been as valuable as a handful of other seasons. But this season impresses me the most about Ruth. Talk about a workhorse that year.

Fantastic point. Never considered this...I think you're right! Led the league in EBH (in 95 games)...pitched 20 games, finished 18 (!) of them. Hit .300, led the league in HR, and was one of the top 10 pitchers in the game.

This is awesome...stumbled on this...strictly in games where he appeared as pitcher, against the very dead WWI baseballs, his line was .344/.444/.656. He was also pinch hitting regularly, then pitching, then playing LF, and CF when needed.

[stuarthouse]

I do not believe that the Polo Grounds aided in anyway in his home runs, as he probably lost more to deep center than he gained from the short right field corner. It undoubtedly helped with extra base hits to the huge open center field area. He was younger, lighter and more daredevil in his base running during those years than in later years. Center field was a lot of ground for any fielder to cover.
1923- look at his splits in 20' and 21'- the Polo Grounds MADE HIM those years.

[pheasant]

Fantastic point. Never considered this...I think you're right! Led the league in EBH (in 95 games)...pitched 20 games, finished 18 (!) of them. Hit .300, led the league in HR, and was one of the top 10 pitchers in the game.

This is awesome...stumbled on this...strictly in games where he appeared as pitcher, against the very dead WWI baseballs, his line was .344/.444/.656. He was also pinch hitting regularly, then pitching, then playing LF, and CF when needed.

Nice breakdown of his stats while pitching. That is amazing. When you think about it, he had a big advantage while pitching back in the day. Ruth had a Hall of Fame type DH hitter in the lineup while he pitched. I.e, you may as well leave him in during the late innings since a pinch hitter would be lowering your chances of getting a clutch hit.

[csh19792001]

Nice breakdown of his stats while pitching. That is amazing. When you think about it, he had a big advantage while pitching back in the day. Ruth had a Hall of Fame type DH hitter in the lineup while he pitched. I.e, you may as well leave him in during the late innings since a pinch hitter would be lowering your chances of getting a clutch hit.

Which makes me wonder...who was the closest thing to Ruth in history? In any professional league? (I.e., a guy who could have been the best hitter and pitcher in the game, at the same time....were it possible)?

I know almost nothing about Minor League Ball, Japanese Baseball, or the Negro Leagues.

Is Ruth a total singularity?

[EdTarbusz]

Nice breakdown of his stats while pitching. That is amazing. When you think about it, he had a big advantage while pitching back in the day. Ruth had a Hall of Fame type DH hitter in the lineup while he pitched. I.e, you may as well leave him in during the late innings since a pinch hitter would be lowering your chances of getting a clutch hit.

Ruth may have been the only pitcher to hit clean-up in Major League history.

[csh19792001]

I do not believe that the Polo Grounds aided in anyway in his home runs, as he probably lost more to deep center than he gained from the short right field corner. It undoubtedly helped with extra base hits to the huge open center field area. He was younger, lighter and more daredevil in his base running during those years than in later years. Center field was a lot of ground for any fielder to cover.

I wrote this about 6 years ago, and have done quite a bit of reading since then. Hopefully I'm at least a bit wiser. The Polo Grounds certainly didn't "make" Ruth, but it certainly helped HR hitters and sluggers. Significantly.

In this fantastic book (http://books.google.com/books?id=bmHmeWPhx9UC&pg=PA70&dq=polo+grounds+home+run+effect+schell&hl=en&sa=X&ei=CdZXT7XHBonu0gGtj-mkDw&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false), on page 92, Schell lists the best and worst parks for home runs in modern baseball history, in overlapping 5-10 year periods.

The Polo Grounds is listed for FIVE separate timeframes in that top 20 list. This is proof that it was a great HR park.

Also, consider that Babe's career line at The Polo Grounds (1918 on) was .369/.503/.840 (216 games). Even for Babe, that's out of this world. True, he was young, but there were a couple deadball seasons thrown in there, and his 22' year, where he got sick.

In fact, Babe's slugging and overall production were better at The Polo Grounds than any other park he played in during his entire career.

[csh19792001]

To wit:

Maury Wills hit 20 home runs in a career of almost 2,000 games. 4 of those career home runs were hit (in 18 games) at The Polo Grounds.

The point being, along with Schell's data, this is proof that it gave up more cheapies than it took away in that cavernous CF.

[csh19792001]

Ruth may have been the only pitcher to hit clean-up in Major League history.

Earl Wilson. 7 games in 1964. I read regularly hit cleanup in the minors. In 59' Minneapolis (AAA Sox farm team) he hit .356 with a .622 slugging, going 10-2 on the mound. Bob Lemon hit 4th a few games in 46'.

It's very likely that many guys did so in the 19th Century.

[EdTarbusz]

Earl Wilson. 7 games in 1964. I read regularly hit cleanup in the minors. In 59' Minneapolis (AAA Sox farm team) he hit .356 with a .622 slugging, going 10-2 on the mound. Bob Lemon hit 4th a few games in 46'.

It's very likely that many guys did so in the 19th Century.

I didn't know that about Wilson. Lemon was a good hitting pitcher for the Indians.

[BigRon]

I'm very familiar with Ruth's career, but reviewing some of his stats again just leaves me shaking my head. Imagine what players/managers/owners/fans of that time must have been thinking- there had never been a force like this.

Interestingly, Bill James had a fairly lengthy commnet years ago in his second Historical Abstract about Ruth's 1919 season and, how, in some ways, it was as great as anything else he did.

I've always had a real sense of awe about the overall greatness of his 1923 season. That said, I give the narrowest of edges to 1921. in 1920 he absolutely shattered the HR mark, then whacked that over the head the following season, while collecting an incomprehensible 119 extra base hits. Yeah, he was helped some by the Polo Grounds, but he still hit 27 HR on the road, and had at least 55 EBH on the road. And of course, in all those seasons through at least 1924 or so, he was a quality defensive outfielder. So, 1921 by the narrowest of margins over 1923 and 1920.

[SHOELESSJOE3]

No way to ever know how many home runs Babe hit at the Polo Grounds that may not have been homers in in other parks, but I doubt it would be a significant number. Here is an article describing some of his homers at the Polo Grounds. I realize the upper deck is not that deep. But since he was setting distance records at all the other parks I would assume most of his Polo Ground homers were not aided by the Polo Grounds.

In, June 1921 he hit two on consecutive days the Polo Gounds that reached the centerfield bleachers, at that time 433 feet.

[stuarthouse]

Such statistics are salient as to Wills, but completely irrelevant as to Ruth. Wills was not a home run hitter. Using a banjo hitter's stats to prove a point regarding Ruth is absolute idiocy!
To wit:

Maury Wills hit 20 home runs in a career of almost 2,000 games. 4 of those career home runs were hit (in 18 games) at The Polo Grounds.

The point being, along with Schell's data, this is proof that it gave up more cheapies than it took away in that cavernous CF.

[SHOELESSJOE3]

Again, no way to ever know what Babe gained in home runs at the Polo Grounds. I did find one homer that he lined into the lower deck in 1921, June 11.
I go back to my earlier post statement. If he is hitting so many at other parks for long distances, it stands to reason that he was also getting good wood on a good many he was hitting at the Polo Grounds and driving them for long distances or that would have traveled far if not obstructed by seats in the upper deck..
It can't be all his long distance drives are on the road, he was hitting the ball hard on the road and at home.

[SHOELESSJOE3]

Quick glance on EBH's 1920-21-22 , home and away, wiil double check the numbers.

----------2b-----3b----Hr
Home----52-----18-----75
Road-----52-----15----73
Not much difference in EBH's home away and only two more home runs at home.

[csh19792001]

Such statistics are salient as to Wills, but completely irrelevant as to Ruth. Wills was not a home run hitter. Using a banjo hitter's stats to prove a point regarding Ruth is absolute idiocy!

That was merely an obscure footnote/addendum. It served only to prove that The Polo Grounds probably gave up the cheapest of cheapies, among the parks of the 20th century. Hell, Babe himself used to hit fungoes out one handed during batting practice for laughs.

As far as your "idiocy" claim, well, the facts about The Polo Grounds being a fantastic HR park are all there, in black and white. I provided the link to Schell's book in the post previous, which proved my point. You either didn't read it, or are dismissing it.

[csh19792001]

Quick glance on EBH's 1920-21-22 , home and away, wiil double check the numbers.

----------2b-----3b----Hr
Home----52-----18-----75
Road-----52-----15----73
Not much difference in EBH's home away and only two more home runs at home.

Being much more astute a hitter than most give him credit for, and the greatest slugging/hitting talent (probably in the history of ALL leagues), I'm sure Ruth tried to pull the ball there much more than he did in, say, Detroit, or Griffith. I would love to know how many were hit where, and your research is a tremendous help, Joe. Thank you for all the time you put in to finding these articles.

Fact is, Babe's line at The Grounds was better than anywhere else he played a lot of games. It was only 216 games, granted, but as I said before, that includes pitching seasons, and the disastrous 22' season.

This is a lot like the Mel Ott dilemma....I used to think Ott was just an "exploitationist" (that's not a word, but I'm making it up anyway). But there is a very good argument to be made that Ott was highly adaptive and intelligent, and knew exactly how to tailor his approach and swing to his home park. Sure, his HR splits are ridiculous, but he actually hit for a much higher average on the road, and had WAY more triples and doubles per AB away from that bathtub shaped park.

Ott's career ROAD OPS is definitely top 50 all time (.918) juxtaposed with road stats for everyone. So, he's probably overrated by in one sense, and underrated in another.

[pheasant]

Quick glance on EBH's 1920-21-22 , home and away, wiil double check the numbers.

----------2b-----3b----Hr
Home----52-----18-----75
Road-----52-----15----73
Not much difference in EBH's home away and only two more home runs at home.

That looks about right. In 1922, Ruth hit far better on the road than at home to balance out the numbers. It's too bad he got suspended in 1922 for all of those games. He never did get back on track that year. Also, that was his only poor performance in the World Series as well. When Ruth was told that he let down all of those kids that year, he allegedly broke down in tears and he promised to play much better in 1923(according to Ken Burns Baseball part 3 that I just watched). He also allegedly said that he'd trade a year of his life in order to hit a HR in the first game of 1923, the year Yankee stadium opened. Ruth did indeed hit a HR and drove in 3 runs in a 4-1 win. Apparently, that game had oved 70000 fans. They said that stadium was rocking with cheers. I can't even imagine.

[willshad]

I'd like to say, that even though they technically do not rank among his best 3 or 4 seasons, 1931 and 1932 have always impressed me for Ruth. At age 36 and 37 he was putting up seasons that would be the best season for just about anybody else, except maybe Ted Williams. I think his 1926-1933 run impresses me more than his early string of seasons, due to the consistency and the fact that he was well into his 30s. Plus the 'deadball' mindset was being done away with, with more offense overall, and more people were swinging for the fences..making those 200 OPS+ scores all that much more impressive.

[pheasant]

I'd like to say, that even though they technically do not rank among his best 3 or 4 seasons, 1931 and 1932 have always impressed me for Ruth. At age 36 and 37 he was putting up seasons that would be the best season for just about anybody else, except maybe Ted Williams. I think his 1926-1933 run impresses me more than his early string of seasons, due to the consistency and the fact that he was well into his 30s. Plus the 'deadball' mindset was being done away with, with more offense overall, and more people were swinging for the fences..making those 200 OPS+ scores all that much more impressive.

That's a great point, Willshad. From 1930-1934(ages 35-39) Ruth of course declined greatly during his last three years during that run, yet posted a 5 year OPS of 195. I.e, a washed up fat Ruth still beat Gehrig and foxx during that span, despited his binge drinking and eating at an advanced age. As a a matter of fact, neither Gehrig nor Foxx EVER had a 5 year run in which his OPS+ was 195 or better, even during their prime. Yet Ruth did this during the twilight of his career.