Bill Carrigan - Any thoughts?

[runningshoes]

Bill Carrigan is the only manager to win back to back World Series (1915 & 1916) and not be elected to the Hall of Fame.

Babe Ruth credited him for much of his development on and off the field.

Does he belong in Cooperstown?

[oscargamblesfro]

I'D say no, he was indeed a good manager , but he kind of ruined his legacy by handling some putrid late 20's sox clubs, though the results weren't his fault NO one could have got good results from that crew. as a player, he was merely decent, perhaps amongst the best catchers in the A.L. for a while, though never the best, and didn't have a particularly long career, even by catcher's standards. decent player, very good manager, but not Hall material.

[runningshoes]

I'D say no, he was indeed a good manager , but he kind of ruined his legacy by handling some putrid late 20's sox clubs, though the results weren't his fault NO one could have got good results from that crew. as a player, he was merely decent, perhaps amongst the best catchers in the A.L. for a while, though never the best, and didn't have a particularly long career, even by catcher's standards. decent player, very good manager, but not Hall material.

I'm only thinking of his managerial record, not his playing days. If Sparky Anderson, who I'm by no means comparing to Carrigan, had his playing days thrown into the fray, he'd be in big trouble.

[jalbright]

Carrigan only managed seven seasons and has a fourth place and three eighth place finishes in an eight team league. He may have been a good manager, but even with two consecutive World Series wins, that resume is a bit thin when the standard is greatness. For his managing record, see here:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/managers/carribi02.shtml

Jim Albright

[abacab]

Bill Carrigan is the only manager to win back to back World Series (1915 & 1916) and not be elected to the Hall of Fame.


Cito Gaston?

[runningshoes]

Is Cito out of baseball? I didn't think these guys got the nod until the've been out for awhile.

I think Cito belongs there.

[runningshoes]

Carrigan only managed seven seasons and has a fourth place and three eighth place finishes in an eight team league.

I'm not one of those who believes a manager has to have the greatest winning record to be a great manager. There's so much more to thier job description than winning games.

[jalbright]

I'm not one of those who believes a manager has to have the greatest winning record to be a great manager. There's so much more to thier job description than winning games.

Maybe--but you won't get anybody into the HOF with that approach. If you want a great manager with a lesser record, how about Gene Mauch? I'd say he'd deserve to go in before Carrigan. Carrigan's career is so short that if he wasn't a big winner (and he wasn't, at least not consistently during those seven seasons), there's simply no way to persuade enough people he was a great one to give him even a prayer of getting into the HOF.

Jim Albright

[Fuzzy Bear]

There are too many guys that rank ahead of Carrigan.

Billy Southworth, Cito Gaston, Dick Williams, Billy Martin, Ralph Houk, and Gil Hodges all rank ahead of Carrigan.

[Fuzzy Bear]

I saw this thread and rethought my assessment of Carrigan. He's probably not a HOFer, but he definitely had HOF potential as a manager.

Carrigan was an alumnus of Holy Cross College; he served as the President of a Savings and Loan when he died. He was a native New Englander and a Catholic. He was educated and a leader, and he had a life (apparently a pretty good life, too) outside of baseball. He went back to Lewiston, ME, his hometown, after the Red Sox were sold. He wasn't the kind of guy who wanted a career in baseball; he wanted a good life in New England, where he was from. Perhaps this post is more for the History of the Game section, but the little I looked into Carrigan, the more I found a well-rounded, quality inividual, whom baseball has always needed. I beieve that Carrigan could have been one of the most successful managers in MLB history if he managed in an era where huge salaries were paid. But he didn't manage in a big money era, and he had good things going for him outside of baseball. It's nice to read how a guy lived a positive life. I'm sure Carrigan never once thought that he could have been a HOFer.