The official Giant/Dodger rivalry thread

[Jake83]

Lets keep the snide comments about each other's team in here.

Wannabe rivals of the Dodgers or Giants can post in here( That is you Padre, Angel and A's fans)

But it is mainly about the greatest rivarly in Professional Sports
http://www.ticketsconcertssports.com/sf-giants-logo.gif

http://usbank.com/espanol/images/personal/products_and_services/checking/dodgers_logo.jpg

[Astro]

Alright, rivalries are all well and good but this is the current events board, why not just post this topic in the Dodgers and/or Giants board...

Also no need to bash other teams' fans

[Yankee Legend]

But it is mainly about the greatest rivarly in Professional Sports

Hey I thought you said this was about the giants/dodgers rivalry!!!!

[Jake83]

Hey I thought you said this was about the giants/dodgers rivalry!!!!



:laugh :laugh What else would be the greatest rivarly in professional sports

[Mattingly]

Alright, rivalries are all well and good but this is the current events board, why not just post this topic in the Dodgers and/or Giants board...

Also no need to bash other teams' fans
Current Events is considered "neutral grounds" when discussing various teams. It's like if we're talking about two cities, but you go to one, the others' at a disadvantage. If posting in the SFG forum, then LAD fans are guests; vice versa is also true.

It's not about dissing. Please see the main Bitter Rivalry thread here, as it's about cute humor, at least in its original incarnation.

Please feel free to discuss the history of both teams, going back to when they both played in Manhattan and Brooklyn, respectively, and how that rivalry continued over the years, now in San Francisco and Los Angeles, respectively.

I'm surprised that there aren't more rivalries between the NL Central fans like yourself. There are Cubs and Cards fans here.

[Mattingly]

:laugh :laugh What else would be the greatest rivarly in professional sports
Hmmmmmmmmm ... Ali-Frazier? No, that's long gone.

Magic-Bird? Nahhhhhhhh, nobody's ever heard of them.

King-Evert? Bahh, humbug.

Nope, that's it. Giants-Dodgers must be the greatest rivalry in all of pro sports. :p

[Ontarioguy]

I hope this thread takes off and remains a staple of the current events board much like the Bitter Rivals thread.

[Mattingly]

I hope this thread takes off and remains a staple of the current events board much like the Bitter Rivals thread.
Same here. I'm wondering if fans of teams outside of two certain AL East teams feel more comfortable here, since they won't be outnumbered by chatter between said fans.

NL fans (including those of teams no longer amongst us), where are you? Come on by! :D

[Gagne#3 8]

Alright, rivalries are all well and good but this is the current events board, why not just post this topic in the Dodgers and/or Giants board...

Also no need to bash other teams' fans


Because rivarlies in baseball are just as important as what goes on the field. Rivarlies is what puts people in the stands are what drives organizations to win. Any fan of the Orioles, Blue Jays or Devil Rays would love nothing more than see their team sweep the yankees or red Sox. Ask a fan of the D-Backs, Padres or Rockies if they would love nothing more than seeing the Dodgers or Gnats being swept. Fans of Boston, New York, LA, and San Francisco these rivaerlies are what makes baseball.

[Ontarioguy]

I think this thread has potential. I think of a guy like mojorisin71 and he's always taking humeruous pot-shots at the Giants. He seems like the type of poster who could turn this into a fun thread. He just needs someone to poke some fun at his Dogers. Both these teams have their quality posters, such as WCOB and KH (I know I'm missing other people, sorry)

Just a possible sugestion, if this thread doesnt take off, perhaps we should try an NL-wide thread, with fans from across the league. For example we could have both the LAD/SFG rivals and the CHC/STL rivals going at it in one thread. The extra rivals would provide a 'bump', but it would be a productive bump rather than just one trying to keep the thread on life support. Just a thought...I leave this thread and this idea in the hands of our capable mods.

[Yankee Legend]

:laugh :laugh What else would be the greatest rivarly in professional sports

you know the rivalry im talking about. its the only one that means anything.

[Jake83]

you know the rivalry im talking about. its the only one that means anything.


The one-sided rivarly. Beating up on Boston shouldn;t consitute as the best rivarly.

[UnderPressure]

This has turned into a Dodgers-Giants rivalry vs. Red Sox-Yankees rivalry rivalry.

[Jake83]

It should be interesting we have Finley joining the Hated Gnats
and Mueller joining the Blue this off season

[Gagne#3 8]

The fog and cold weather up in the Bay Area has finally gone to Gnat fans who think they have a chance in the NL West this year

[Gagne#3 8]

This is the reason why this forum should be apart of baseball discussion because it is as much to baseball as the fans, Hall of Fame, statistics and records



The idea for this article came to me a few weeks ago when I was watching the Giants-Dodgers series with my kids. My four-year old daughter asked, “Why do we hate the Dodgers so much?” My son informed her, “Because they are the bad guys.” (Okay, so I am training them well…but that will be another article). My son’s answer was good enough for her but it made me stop to think. Here I am, a life-long Giants fan and I don’t really know why we hate the Dodgers or what started the rivalry to begin with. Then I began to wonder, how many other fans out there have one team in particular that they love to hate but don’t know what is behind the rivalry? So, I posed the question to a group of die-hard fans and guess what I discovered? I am not alone; almost everyone has a team that they love to hate but very few people know all of the reasons why. This article will attempt to examine and explain one of baseball’s fiercest rivalries.

The Dodgers and the Giants rivalry can be traced back to their New York days when the Giants played in Manhattan and the Dodgers played in Brooklyn, which at the time were separate cities. Brooklyn was the fifth largest city in the USA but was in the shadow of Manhattan and Broadway. Even though the Polo Grounds were not in an upscale section of town, the Manhattan socialites that followed the Giants were said to have looked down upon the Dodgers and their fans. The Giants’ fans rode to the games at the Polo Grounds in their expensive clothes and carriages, while the players paraded through town wearing their uniforms. Dodger fans felt as if they were taunting them. In truth, there was no visitor clubhouse so the Giants were forced to arrive in uniform.

The Dodgers’ fans from Brooklyn consisted mostly of hard-working immigrants who seemed to feel that the Giants’ fans were flaunting their wealth and position. As a matter of fact the Dodgers name is actually a derogatory term given to Brooklynites who were called Trolley Dodgers by Manhattanites.

And then there is baseball. In the early years the Giants were very successful having five World Series victories out of fourteen attempts, while the Dodgers were merely one and eight in series play. In the very first meeting between the two teams (1889 Championship), the Giants defeated the Bridegrooms (as they were called in those days) six games to three. In game four there was a dispute over a bad call and as they say, the rest is history.

For players and fans alike, the Giant-Dodger rivalry was war. There were fewer teams in the early days of baseball so the Giants and the Dodgers, who played against each other twenty-two times per season had quite a few meaningful games – that is, games that meant the NL championship for one or the other of them. Then when Leo Durocher, who managed the Dodgers from 1938-1945, made his move to the Giants’ organization in 1948 it certainly only added fuel to the fire.

These two teams have definitely had their share of controversies. One of the most renowned being the dramatic ending of the 1951 pennant race and the playoff finale with Bobby Thomson’s ninth inning home run now referred to as “the shot heard ‘round the world”. Allegations arose that Thomson had stolen signs and to this day most Dodger fans cringe when they hear re-plays of Russ Hodge’s famous home run call.

Emotions between the Giants and the Dodgers ran so high that Jackie Robinson, when traded from Brooklyn to New York after the 1956 season, chose to retire instead of reporting to the Giants.

Then in 1957 Dodger owner Walter O’Malley convinced the Giants to join them in the move west in order to continue the rivalry. In the 1958 season opener, the Giants beat the Dodgers, 8-0 but perhaps even more significantly, they beat the Dodgers 16 out of 22 times that year, keeping the rivalry alive.

So, what perpetuates the rivalry now? Part of it is still due to being in rival cities; there is a natural rivalry between San Francisco and Los Angeles (Northern and Southern California). San Francisco is filled with business people, and entrepreneurial types that perceive themselves to be above the blue-collar, surfer types in Los Angeles. Los Angeles, in the past, has wanted to secede from the state of California to become its own state. Northern Californians are bitter because their water is piped south. It is a battle of geography, economics, culture, as well as politics.

And then there is baseball. Since moving west in 1958 the Giants have had limited post-season success, they have not won a World Series while the Dodgers have won five.

The media also may have done a lot to keep the rivalry going because in the 1960’s the only baseball games that were televised in the Los Angeles area were as expected, Dodgers-Giants games. So, nine times a year the Dodgers’ fans watched these teams battle it out on the field. And I do mean battle.

In 1962 The Giants narrowly defeated the Dodgers in a three game playoff to win the NL pennant and reach the World Series for the first time since they moved west. Of course, there is also more controversy; the Dodgers accused the Giants of wetting down the field at Candlestick Park in order to prevent Maury Wills from stealing bases.

Again in the midst of a pennant race in 1965, Giants’ pitcher, Juan Marichal knocked down Maury Wills and Ron Fairly with brush back pitches. When Marichal came to the plate in the third inning the Dodgers pitcher, Sandy Koufax didn’t try to retaliate, but catcher, John Roseboro, did. When returning the ball to the pitcher’s mound Roseboro threw it extremely close to Marichal’s face. After the second of Roseboro's throws came too close to Marichal he struck Roseboro on the head with his bat, opening up a wound that required 14 stitches and in the process started a brawl that lasted 14 minutes.

In 1993, at the end of September with only four games left in the season, the Giants were tied with Atlanta for the division title. Who else would the Giants have to face in those last four games but the Dodgers, who had nothing to lose? (The Braves had it easier as they were playing the Rockies) Naturally, both the Giants and the Braves won the first three games. And on the last day of the season the Dodgers beat the Giants, knocking them out of the playoffs and finally extracting revenge for 1982 when the Giants knocked them out of the playoffs.

In 2001 when Barry Bonds hit home run number 500 against the Dodgers they were displeased that the game was halted for a lengthy on field celebration. Later the same year when the Dodgers visited Pacific Bell Park the Giants wanted to celebrate the 50-year anniversary of “the shot heard ‘round the world.” Of course, the Dodgers wanted no part in it (and who could blame them?) but it was more fodder for the media thus fueling the rivalry even more.

Over one hundred years later, fans still take this rivalry seriously. Chants of “Beat LA” can be heard around San Francisco – even when the Giants are playing another team. Some fans travel from as far as New York to watch these teams battle it out on the field. There is an inexplicable spirit and intensity at these games that you can actually feel; everyone finds themselves becoming a part of it. To the fans it doesn’t even seem to matter if their team is having a bad season, as long as they beat the other – at all costs. That is what this rivalry is all about.

[KHenry14]

OK, I'll jump in....

As I've written before on this board, my Grandfather grew up a fan of Mathewson, so being a Giants fan was in my blood. And when I started coming of age in the 60's, the rivalry was white hot, which meant the distaste for the Bums came easily. Part of this was due, and I'll admit this, the Dodgers had a lot more success than the Giants, and I wanted that success for my team. But over the years things kept happening to keep the rivalry going in my heart. Reggie Smith going into the stands at the "Stick, Joe Morgan beating the Bums in '82, the last game of '93 and many more examples.

And while it's not IMO the greatest rivalry in sports, much less baseball, it is one of the longest lasting, and still has relevance today. But the Giants success over the last decade has given us Giants fans a modicum of bragging rights, it wont be finished till the teams wins a WS. And if both Sox teams can win one, it's gotta be the Giants turn now.

And yes, it's personal! :laugh

KH14<--who's betting a pack of Topps cards the Giants win the division.:gt

[Jake83]

And while it's not IMO the greatest rivalry in sports, much less baseball, it is one of the longest lasting, and still has relevance today. But the Giants success over the last decade has given us Giants fans a modicum of bragging rights, it wont be finished till the teams wins a WS. And if both Sox teams can win one, it's gotta be the Giants turn now.

And yes, it's personal! :laugh

KH14<--who's betting a pack of Topps cards the Giants win the division.:gt



Your few NL West Titles and NL pennets do not compare to our let me see 1....2.....3.....4.....Let me see......5 World Championshp since the move out West :laugh :laugh :laugh

[Gagne#3 8]

After years of rooting for the Giants this is how your life will end up
http://www.ringoffireradio.com/video/straight%20jacket.jpg
http://www.magicmakers.com/internet%20jpg%20S/straight%20jacket%20front.jpg

Being a Gnat fan is a psychological disorder

[UnderPressure]

Come on, man. It's ok to bash on the team, but no need for that.

[Mattingly]

Come on, man. It's ok to bash on the team, but no need for that.
It's borderline to have a fan in a straight jacket, but if it's taken in humor (like zinging someone), I guess that'll go.

See the very long bitter rivalry thread and see all the cheesy potshots we've all taken at one another. Not as direct as the straight jacket, but zings nonetheless.

An off-key sense of humor helps, is all I'll say. :)

[Elvis]

I object to the title of this thread. It should be Dodger/Giant rivalry, not the other way 'round. Shame on you Jake.

[POLO GROUNDS 1957]

The giants have not won anything since 1954 when they were still in new york. they should have never left new york. i hope i never see them win anything on the west coast. the curse of the POLO GROUNDS.

[Jake83]

I object to the title of this thread. It should be Dodger/Giant rivalry, not the other way 'round. Shame on you Jake.


Like the saying ladies first

[iPod]

It's borderline to have a fan in a straight jacket, but if it's taken in humor (like zinging someone), I guess that'll go.

See the very long bitter rivalry thread and see all the cheesy potshots we've all taken at one another. Not as direct as the straight jacket, but zings nonetheless.

An off-key sense of humor helps, is all I'll say. :)

It obviously couldn't have been meant to be hurtful, because Southern Californians have no feelings in the first place.

[Jake83]

It obviously couldn't have been meant to be hurtful, because Southern Californians have no feelings in the first place.


We sure have a better baseball team

[BayBaseballFan]

It obviously couldn't have been meant to be hurtful, because Southern Californians have no feelings in the first place.
It must be the smog and plastic in LA

Great thread

Very refresing

[Where is Chone Figgins]

The Dogger/Giant rivarly is a pissing match that no one cares about anyone

It is about the Angels now:clapping :clapping :clapping

[Mattingly]

The Dogger/Giant rivarly is a pissing match that no one cares about anyone

It is about the Angels now:clapping :clapping :clapping
Uh-ohhhhh. Now how'd the Halos (who can't even figure out where they play) get involved?

In 10,000 words or less (preferably 500 or less), why is it now about Anaheim? Or would that be Les Angels de Los Angeles? :D ;) :p

[Jake83]

It must be the smog and plastic in LA

Great thread

Very refresing


No it is the 5 championships in LA

[Jake83]

The Dogger/Giant rivarly is a pissing match that no one cares about anyone

It is about the Angels now:clapping :clapping :clapping


It will be an very unlikely day when I worry about the joke of a franchise down in Orange County

[Where is Chone Figgins]

Uh-ohhhhh. Now how'd the Halos (who can't even figure out where they play) get involved?

In 10,000 words or less (preferably 500 or less), why is it now about Anaheim? Or would that be Les Angels de Los Angeles? :D ;) :p


Can you still not get over us knocking you out of the playoffs last year.
Molina....Molina for another....How about Magic Santana


We know where we play same place for the last 35+ years

[Where is Chone Figgins]

It will be an very unlikely day when I worry about the joke of a franchise down in Orange County


Did the San Franscico Dodgers of Boston fan say something.................. Stop living off other teams.

[UnderPressure]

The Dogger/Giant rivarly is a pissing match that no one cares about anyone

It is about the Angels now:clapping :clapping :clapping

Now that's comedy.

[Jake83]

Did the San Franscico Dodgers of Boston fan say something.................. Stop living off other teams.

Living off other teams is what the joke of a franchise does. They adopted our name. Have an entire coaching staff of former Dodgers. A owner who bought the Angels because he couldn;t affored the Dodgers. Now who is living off other teams.

[Jake83]

Now that's comedy.


I call it not being in reality

[dabum1]

the giants are good for comedy

[Gagne#3 8]

Gnat fans are comedy. Angels fans are trying to sort to their level.

[Dravecky43]

We sure have a better baseball team

You've GOT to be kidding me. You STILL seriously believe this? Even after your team signed the amazing BRETT TOMKO? Now THAT'S comedy. And it's going to be even funnier during the season when you are complaining about the signing.

[BayBaseballFan]

Gnat fans are comedy. Angels fans are trying to sort to their level.



What is comedy is watching the dysfunctional baseball team know as the LA Dodgers operate.

[BayBaseballFan]

No it is the 5 championships in LA


Did you have to count them on your fingers. We all know what the public school system is like in LA

[UnderPressure]

You've GOT to be kidding me. You STILL seriously believe this? Even after your team signed the amazing BRETT TOMKO? Now THAT'S comedy. And it's going to be even funnier during the season when you are complaining about the signing.

He was signed to be a number 4 starter (although a bit overpaid for that role). Don't act like he was signed to be our ace.

[UnderPressure]

What is comedy is watching the dysfunctional baseball team know as the LA Dodgers operate.

A team that's never won a World Series for its current city; a team that trails their bitter rivals in almost every single category since moving to CA (WS, pennants, playoff appearances, head-to-head matchups, etc.)... they also trail their neighbors, the Oakland A's; a team that has attempted to leave its current city twice; a team that never drew more than 3 million fans until its 42nd year in the current city; fans that only care about doing better than the Dodgers, no matter how bad the season would be.

How's that for comedy?

[Mattingly]

Can you still not get over us knocking you out of the playoffs last year.
Molina....Molina for another....How about Magic Santana

We know where we play same place for the last 35+ years
Replied to on post 5,076 (pg 204) of the Bitter Rivalry thread (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=6638&page=204). Please reply there.

[Mattingly]

Now that we've had enough tongues being stuck out and "nyah-nyah-nyah" kind of posts, let's see people talk about the baseball aspect, like the players, the team accomplishments. Let's see some discussion on what the teams have discussed, and not just in a "my team can beat your team" thing, but about the players, the history, the strengths, the weaknesses of both.

The managers, the GMs, the trades, etc. In short, intelligent baseball discussion about the two teams. Thanks. :)

[UnderPressure]

Which accomplishment is something be more proud of (for your team), your 5 straight ROY awards or your 5 straight MVP awards.

[Elvis]

Now that we've had enough tongues being stuck out and "nyah-nyah-nyah" kind of posts, let's see people talk about the baseball aspect, like the players, the team accomplishments. Let's see some discussion on what the teams have discussed, and not just in a "my team can beat your team" thing, but about the players, the history, the strengths, the weaknesses of both.

The managers, the GMs, the trades, etc. In short, intelligent baseball discussion about the two teams. Thanks. :)

Yeah, good luck with that request. :hp That's like asking a bunch of 14-year old guys to stop thinking about sex.

I wish they would though. This thread is quickly degenerating into sophmoric poo poo.

[Mattingly]

Yeah, good luck with that request. :hp That's like asking a bunch of 14-year old guys to stop thinking about sex.

I wish they would though. This thread is quickly degenerating into sophmoric poo poo.
Don't worry, I have ways of changing the course of a thread. If people want to keep the teenaged style of "fratboy humor" alive, I can only suggest the mlb.com forums.

At least when we talk the smack in the main Bitter Rivalry thread, we talk about real events, such as the Yanks snaring Damon away from the Red Sox, or we talk about questionable moves by the others' front office. This "my team can beat yours" neither requires insight, studying the topic at hand, nor much common sense, to put it bluntly.

Let's get this thread back on track, folks, and hopefully, instead of just braggadocio, we can at least see some kind of baseball intelligence. If not, another one bites the dust, if they can figure that one out (should take 1/2 second, at most).

The strangest thing is that as often as people have wanted fans outside of the AL East to have their own "rivalry" thread, now when they have it, it's like nobody knows what to do with it. Discuss baseball here. Is that too difficult? Discuss matchups by position, discuss stats, discuss how intelligent the moves by the managers are, discuss which GM is giving their team a chance to win, discuss whose teams' holes are being filled, discuss attendance.

If they can do that, I'll tolerate a few cheesy "nyah-nyah-nyah" things, but that shouldn't be the main focus of everything. It shouldn't be impossible to discuss baseball in a respectable baseball forum, given that said forumers are quality baseball fans. In fact, it should be like drinking water or breathing air. Something naturally done, not a chore one wants to avoid.

[mojorisin71]

Isn't there already a Bitter Rivals Thread here on BBF?

I second Mattingly's statements. I do not want this to become MLB.com redux. I'll keep an eye on this thread, as will KHenry and WCOAB. If it gets out of hand, I would not mind it being closed. Let's just stick to talking about the organizations and the moves they make, with an occasional "1954" reminder here and there. :laugh :evil

[Jake83]

Head to Head matchup
Lets start with the lineup
Starting Pitching next

C Navarro Matheny SF
1BNomar Nikero LA
2BKent Durham LA
SSFurcal Vizquel LA
3BMueller Felix TIE
RFDrew Alou LA
CFLofton Winn SF
LFCruz Bonds SF


Any disagreements- If asked I will explain my head to head matchup

[Mattingly]

Isn't there already a Bitter Rivals Thread here on BBF?
Mostly created by Jake83, since the fans of the other teams, including NL teams, weren't really included. The main Bitter Rivalry thread was primarily a shootout amongst the AL East teams.

Head to Head matchup
Lets strt with the lineup

* * *

Any disagreements- If asked I will explain my head to head matchup
If you could put the positions each player players, that would be great.

If people can mention the bench, the pen, that would be fine.

Don't forget, a few cheesy shots at the other teams, I won't mind (see the main Bitter Rivalry thread for exagerrated examples), so long as people actually do refer to recent events that have come along, including how they may affect the relevant teams. :)

[Gagne#3 8]

Mueller and Felix should be a toss up because 1. Felix's defense at 3rd base is questionable 2. He has never started a full season

[Jake83]

Alou is a question mark of the Gnats. He plays an awful RF and his bat may go any year. If Bonds comes back it will make up for it. I still do not see a player on the Gnats to protect Bonds. Felix may break out or even Nikero but those are question marks. The Gnats situation in the minors at the highest levels does not predict a bright future unlike the Dodgers who may have the best farm system in the majors

[UnderPressure]

Do you guys mean Feliz?

[Jake83]

Do you guys mean Feliz?


The sorry Gnat 3rd basemen is better :laugh :laugh

Anyway I give him the nod over Mueller at 3rd

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Your few NL West Titles and NL pennets do not compare to our let me see 1....2.....3.....4.....Let me see......5 World Championshp since the move out West :laugh :laugh :laugh

So? Dodger fans still suck. And I doubt you were a Dodger fan in 1959.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Alou is a question mark of the Gnats. He plays an awful RF and his bat may go any year. If Bonds comes back it will make up for it. I still do not see a player on the Gnats to protect Bonds. Felix may break out or even Nikero but those are question marks. The Gnats situation in the minors at the highest levels does not predict a bright future unlike the Dodgers who may have the best farm system in the majors
Can you name some highly touted Doder's prospects? And where is Edwin Jackson?

[Jake83]

Can you name some highly touted Doder's prospects? And where is Edwin Jackson?


Matt Kemp

Joel Guzman

Andy laroche

James Loney

Chad Bilingsley

Do you want me to contiune:laugh :laugh :laugh

Who do the Gnats have

[Honus Wagner Rules]

No it is the 5 championships in LA
Jake,

You keep bragging abut the Dodgers World Series titles. It's been a while since most of them happened. :rolleyes:

1988-16 years ago
1981-24 Years ago
1965-40 years ago
1963-42 years ago
1959-46 years ago

[Jake83]

Jake,

You keep bragging abut the Dodgers World Series titles. it's been a while since most of them happened. :rolleyes:

1988-16 years ago
1981-24 Years ago
1965-40 years ago
1963-42 years ago
1959-46 years ago


SF Gnats-----------------NEVER NEVER

Who will protect Bonds in the lineup

[mojorisin71]

Giants top prospects:

- Matt Cain (we should see plenty of him over the years)
- Merkin Valdez (had a long chat about him this weekend with some A's fans/Giant observers, and he's somewhat lost his touch)
- Lance Niekro (saw some games with him and he needs more playing time)

and then there's the occasional call-ups like Linden, Torcato, Correia, etc.

As for the Dodgers' prospects, I feel that only LaRoche, Billingsley, and Broxton will pan out. The Dodger farm has had a lot of highly touted prospects (Thurston, Ashley, Miller, Gutierrez, etc.) that failed to meet expectations. It's one thing to tear the cover off the ball in AA. It's another thing to pan out in the bigs. Hence the term "prospects."

If we could stay away from the name-calling, we could make this thread bigger than the hijacked-by-East-Coasters Bitter Rivals Thread :crazy

[Jake83]

Giants top prospects:

- Matt Cain (we should see plenty of him over the years)
- Merkin Valdez (had a long chat about him this weekend with some A's fans/Giant observers, and he's somewhat lost his touch)
- Lance Niekro (saw some games with him and he needs more playing time)

and then there's the occasional call-ups like Linden, Torcato, Correia, etc.

As for the Dodgers' prospects, I feel that only LaRoche, Billingsley, and Broxton will pan out. The Dodger farm has had a lot of highly touted prospects (Thurston, Ashley, Miller, Gutierrez, etc.) that failed to meet expectations. It's one thing to tear the cover off the ball in AA. It's another thing to pan out in the bigs. Hence the term "prospects."

If we could stay away from the name-calling, we could make this thread bigger than the hijacked-by-East-Coasters Bitter Rivals Thread :crazy


You see Guzman's numbers in the DR winter league .

Kemp's numbers in the AFL

[eddiejc1]

Hmmmmmmmmm ... Ali-Frazier? No, that's long gone.

Magic-Bird? Nahhhhhhhh, nobody's ever heard of them.

King-Evert? Bahh, humbug.

Nope, that's it. Giants-Dodgers must be the greatest rivalry in all of pro sports. :p

England-Argentina?

Manchester United-Arsenal?

Celtics-Rangers?

Eddie Cunningham

[eddiejc1]

SF Gnats-----------------NEVER

*sigh* It's nice to see ANOTHER team called the Gnats, for once!

Eddie Cunningham

[Jake83]

Your team has to be around for more than 5 years before you can put your two cents in :laugh :laugh



The Giants have been known as the Gnats for a long time

[mojorisin71]

If by a long time, you mean the last 8-9 years, then yes, they have been known as the Gnats.

Growing up, I've always heard "Jints" when referring to that team that plays in SoMa.

[Jake83]

Lets have a postion by positon break down of each team in the divison


Catchers

Dodgers---- Navarro-Starter 273 3 14 50 Games
Alomar- Backup w/Texas 273 0 14 46 Games

Others Russell Martin- One of the top catching prospects in baseball will play AAA this year May be the starting catcher bt August if Navarro fails


Giants---------Matheny Starter 242 13 59 134 Games
Backup?????????

Others Knoedler- 100 0 0 8 games Coverted pitcher only has been catching for 4 seasons
Alfonzo No major league History- If any Giant fans can add a profile for him

Padres Starter Mirabelli- w/Boston .228 6 18 50 games
Backups Ross .240 3 15 51 games

Others Laforest .172 1 4 25 games Came from Devil Rays has international experience with 2004 Olympics with Canada
Kottaras No major league history Will do futher research on him

Diamonbacks- Estrada- w/ Atlanta .261 4 39 105 games dropped from 2004 still young tons of potential
Synder .202 6 28 115 games

Others Koyle Hill .218 0 6 34 games


Colorado- Starter Torreabla w/ Giants and Mariners 234 3 15 78 Games

Closser Backup .219 7 27 92 games

Others Arodin .229 6 22 80 games



Molina may sign with the Padres still in question

1. Diamondbacks
2. Colorado
3. Dodgers
4. Giants
5. Padres If sign Molina will jump to #1

[UnderPressure]

Celtics-Rangers?

Eddie Cunningham

You mean Lakers, don't you?

[iPod]

Now that we've had enough tongues being stuck out and "nyah-nyah-nyah" kind of posts, let's see people talk about the baseball aspect, like the players, the team accomplishments. Let's see some discussion on what the teams have discussed, and not just in a "my team can beat your team" thing, but about the players, the history, the strengths, the weaknesses of both.

The managers, the GMs, the trades, etc. In short, intelligent baseball discussion about the two teams. Thanks. :)

There's no such thing as a "Rivalry thread" that stays civil and doesn't quickly become a worthless pissing match. You might as well pour cream into coffee and then get mad because the two mixed together. There's nothing intelligent about a Dodger fan pointing out to a Giants fan that the Dodgers have more championships, for example. It's bait, and everyone knows it. Everything anyone could discuss on this thread is meant to be bait; anything, any point at all that would be relevant to this thread would be meant to indicate that his team actually has the upper hand in the rivalry. You could go and stick a "SO THERE" on the bottom of virtually every post and it would still look appropriate. Why beat around the bush? I personally hate trash talking, but I think it's really silly to make a thread devoted to intellectual exploration of a bitter rivalry and order that it stay calm. That's like serving ribs for dinner and then saying "Guys, try not to make too much of a mess."

[Jake83]

There's no such thing as a "Rivalry thread" that stays civil and doesn't quickly become a worthless pissing match. You might as well pour cream into coffee and then get mad because the two mixed together. There's nothing intelligent about a Dodger fan pointing out to a Giants fan that the Dodgers have more championships, for example. It's bait, and everyone knows it. Everything anyone could discuss on this thread is meant to be bait; anything, any point at all that would be relevant to this thread would be meant to indicate that his team actually has the upper hand in the rivalry. You could go and stick a "SO THERE" on the bottom of virtually every post and it would still look appropriate. Why beat around the bush? I personally hate trash talking, but I think it's really silly to make a thread devoted to intellectual exploration of a bitter rivalry and order that it stay calm. That's like serving ribs for dinner and then saying "Guys, try not to make too much of a mess."


I believe we are all civilized. We can start with a positon by positon break down of all NL West clubs

[Jake83]

You mean Lakers, don't you?


Celtic v Rangers is a Scottish football(soccer) match with the Rangers being Protestant and English and the Celtics being Catholic and Irish. It embodies everything that goes into a rivarly.

[Gagne#3 8]

Lets have a postion by positon break down of each team in the divison


Catchers

Dodgers---- Navarro-Starter 273 3 14 50 Games
Alomar- Backup w/Texas 273 0 14 46 Games

Others Russell Martin- One of the top catching prospects in baseball will play AAA this year May be the starting catcher bt August if Navarro fails


Giants---------Matheny Starter 242 13 59 134 Games
Backup?????????

Others Knoedler- 100 0 0 8 games Coverted pitcher only has been catching for 4 seasons
Alfonzo No major league History- If any Giant fans can add a profile for him

Padres Starter Mirabelli- w/Boston .228 6 18 50 games
Backups Ross .240 3 15 51 games

Others Laforest .172 1 4 25 games Came from Devil Rays has international experience with 2004 Olympics with Canada
Kottaras No major league history Will do futher research on him

Diamonbacks- Estrada- w/ Atlanta .261 4 39 105 games dropped from 2004 still young tons of potential
Synder .202 6 28 115 games

Others Koyle Hill .218 0 6 34 games


Colorado- Starter Torreabla w/ Giants and Mariners 234 3 15 78 Games

Closser Backup .219 7 27 92 games

Others Arodin .229 6 22 80 games



Molina may sign with the Padres still in question

1. Diamondbacks
2. Colorado
3. Dodgers
4. Giants
5. Padres If sign Molina will jump to #1



Your over rating Arizona's catchers Synder and Hill in my opinion are not capable backups. I think Ross could be a capacble backup with the Padres and you forget Fick you even though he may be a liablity behind the plate he produces in offense


1. Colorado
2. Dodgers
3. Giants
4. Diamondbacks
5. Padres

[Mattingly]

There's no such thing as a "Rivalry thread" that stays civil and doesn't quickly become a worthless pissing match. You might as well pour cream into coffee and then get mad because the two mixed together. There's nothing intelligent about a Dodger fan pointing out to a Giants fan that the Dodgers have more championships, for example. It's bait, and everyone knows it. Everything anyone could discuss on this thread is meant to be bait; anything, any point at all that would be relevant to this thread would be meant to indicate that his team actually has the upper hand in the rivalry. You could go and stick a "SO THERE" on the bottom of virtually every post and it would still look appropriate. Why beat around the bush? I personally hate trash talking, but I think it's really silly to make a thread devoted to intellectual exploration of a bitter rivalry and order that it stay calm. That's like serving ribs for dinner and then saying "Guys, try not to make too much of a mess."
I strongly suggest that you look very closely at the posts directly above and below yours, then see for yourself if people can conduct themselves in a proper manner. if you do see this, then what's the point? If you don't see this, then I suggest you look a little bit closer.

People *CAN* conduct themselves in a civilized manner. If not, then I can only suggest the mlb.com boards to those who absolutely refuse to see any other way around this. No exceptions!

-Matt

[Dravecky43]

Lets have a postion by positon break down of each team in the divison
Catchers

Dodgers---- Navarro-Starter 273 3 14 50 Games
Alomar- Backup w/Texas 273 0 14 46 Games

Others Russell Martin- One of the top catching prospects in baseball will play AAA this year May be the starting catcher bt August if Navarro fails


Giants---------Matheny Starter 242 13 59 134 Games
Backup?????????
Others Knoedler- 100 0 0 8 games Coverted pitcher only has been catching for 4 seasons
Alfonzo No major league History- If any Giant fans can add a profile for him

Padres Starter Mirabelli- w/Boston .228 6 18 50 games
Backups Ross .240 3 15 51 games

Others Laforest .172 1 4 25 games Came from Devil Rays has international experience with 2004 Olympics with Canada
Kottaras No major league history Will do futher research on him

Diamonbacks- Estrada- w/ Atlanta .261 4 39 105 games dropped from 2004 still young tons of potential
Synder .202 6 28 115 games

Others Koyle Hill .218 0 6 34 games


Colorado- Starter Torreabla w/ Giants and Mariners 234 3 15 78 Games

Closser Backup .219 7 27 92 games

Others Arodin .229 6 22 80 games

Molina may sign with the Padres still in question

1. Diamondbacks
2. Colorado
3. Dodgers
4. Giants
5. Padres If sign Molina will jump to #1

WHAT? Do you TOTALLY devalue DEFENSE? Yes, Estrada might well be the best catcher in the west. His offense is pretty good. Well, it is if you think last year was 2004. I guess he wasn't too bad last year. His defense leaves a bit to be desired, but it isn't THAT bad.

Now to Colorado. You rate Torrealba ahead of Matheny? Why do you think Yorvit was Mike's BACKUP for 2/3 of last season? Those backups aren't enough to put the Rockies' catching situation above #3.

Now the dodgers. Navarro is a good defender. Not the best, but he runs the team well. His offensive show last year was adequate, but it really wasn't enough of a show of what he can do. He'll probably be a .265-15-60 offensive player. But I like that Martin guy. I think he'll surpass Navarro in 2006.

The Padres don't look too good behind the dish. Mirabelli ain't the answer. Yeah, if Molina signs the Padres have the best situation in the west. Otherwise...

And the Giants. Mike Matheny had another excellent year on defense. Best defensive catcher in the league. If you don't think so, talk to the people that vote for the Gold Glove. His offense isn't that great, but he have career-high HR and RBI numbers. Knoedler has some talent, although I don't know too much about him, but if I remember correctly he is a very good defender and still getting better. He could be a .260-10-50 player on offense.

So, MY possibly biased NL West catchers' rankings:
1. Arizona
2. SF
3. LA
4. Colorado
5. SD

[Jake83]

WHAT? Do you TOTALLY devalue DEFENSE? Yes, Estrada might well be the best catcher in the west. His offense is pretty good. Well, it is if you think last year was 2004. I guess he wasn't too bad last year. His defense leaves a bit to be desired, but it isn't THAT bad.

Now to Colorado. You rate Torrealba ahead of Matheny? Why do you think Yorvit was Mike's BACKUP for 2/3 of last season? Those backups aren't enough to put the Rockies' catching situation above #3.

Now the dodgers. Navarro is a good defender. Not the best, but he runs the team well. His offensive show last year was adequate, but it really wasn't enough of a show of what he can do. He'll probably be a .265-15-60 offensive player. But I like that Martin guy. I think he'll surpass Navarro in 2006.

The Padres don't look too good behind the dish. Mirabelli ain't the answer. Yeah, if Molina signs the Padres have the best situation in the west. Otherwise...

And the Giants. Mike Matheny had another excellent year on defense. Best defensive catcher in the league. If you don't think so, talk to the people that vote for the Gold Glove. His offense isn't that great, but he have career-high HR and RBI numbers. Knoedler has some talent, although I don't know too much about him, but if I remember correctly he is a very good defender and still getting better. He could be a .260-10-50 player on offense.

So, MY possibly biased NL West catchers' rankings:
1. Arizona
2. SF
3. LA
4. Colorado
5. SD


Like your team and city:laugh :laugh your backups ****

[BayBaseballFan]

Lets have a postion by positon break down of each team in the divison


Catchers

Dodgers---- Navarro-Starter 273 3 14 50 Games
Alomar- Backup w/Texas 273 0 14 46 Games

Others Russell Martin- One of the top catching prospects in baseball will play AAA this year May be the starting catcher bt August if Navarro fails


Giants---------Matheny Starter 242 13 59 134 Games
Backup?????????

Others Knoedler- 100 0 0 8 games Coverted pitcher only has been catching for 4 seasons
Alfonzo No major league History- If any Giant fans can add a profile for him

Padres Starter Mirabelli- w/Boston .228 6 18 50 games
Backups Ross .240 3 15 51 games

Others Laforest .172 1 4 25 games Came from Devil Rays has international experience with 2004 Olympics with Canada
Kottaras No major league history Will do futher research on him

Diamonbacks- Estrada- w/ Atlanta .261 4 39 105 games dropped from 2004 still young tons of potential
Synder .202 6 28 115 games

Others Koyle Hill .218 0 6 34 games


Colorado- Starter Torreabla w/ Giants and Mariners 234 3 15 78 Games

Closser Backup .219 7 27 92 games

Others Arodin .229 6 22 80 games



Molina may sign with the Padres still in question

1. Diamondbacks
2. Colorado
3. Dodgers
4. Giants
5. Padres If sign Molina will jump to #1


Matheny is the best starting catcher in the NL West The Giants should be ahead of Colorado and the Dodgers


1. Arizona
2. Giants
3. Colorado
4. Dodgers
5. Padres

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Matt Kemp

Joel Guzman

Andy laroche

James Loney

Chad Bilingsley

Do you want me to contiune:laugh :laugh :laugh

Who do the Gnats have
Yes, these guys will be the next Greg Brock, Billy Ashley, And Todd Hollinsworth. :laugh :laugh :laugh :laugh

[Mattingly]

Like your team and city:laugh :laugh your backups ****
Can we tone down the language please, and discuss baseball in a more intelligent manner, since you started the thread?

Thanks.

[Dravecky43]

Like your team and city:laugh :laugh your backups ****
I'm sorry, I don't understand what you are talking about. My team, "my" city (I assume you mean SF), and the Giants' backups ... What do they do?

[Ursa Major]

I agree that having to go back a zillion years to compare the # of championships is pretty irrelevant to what the teams are likely to achieve in the future. And players come and go with astonishing frequency... So let's look at the management to guide the team forward . . .

Dodgers ---------------- Giants

The McCourts ---------- Peter McGowan
Nuff said . . . ---------- Not the McCourts
_______________________________

Ned Colletti --------------- Brian Sabean
Brian Sabean wannabe ----- Brian Sabean

________________________________

Grady Little ---------- Felipe Alou
Retread... ------------ Respected baseball man


As we say at our Friday night poker games, I'll play these . . .

[Mattingly]

Dodgers ---------------- Giants

The McCourts ---------- Peter McGowan
Nuff said . . . ---------- Not the McCourts
_______________________________

Ned Colletti --------------- Brian Sabean
Brian Sabean wannabe ----- Brian Sabean

________________________________

Grady Little ---------- Felipe Alou
Retread... ------------ Respected baseball man
I keep hearing that the Dodgers' owners don't have any vested interested in improving the team re salary. What are some of the things they've done or not done that Peter McGowan has done?

Same with Colletti vs Sabean, except who have they gotten, and were those player decisions questionable or very good in each case?

As to Grady "Bubba Gump" Little (so-called because of his southern accent, I believe), it's too bad he had such an ill-timed career-defining moment, since he really had that team running and creating lots of runs. I wouldn't compare him to Felipe Alou, but he had better moments than the 8th inning in letting Pedro continue.

[mojorisin71]

Hmmm...both owners are about the same. Magowan is paying off SBC and McCourt is paying off that $25M house he bought in West LA. :grouchy

[Mattingly]

I feel like I've got a hose plugged into the Pacific Ocean, but I'm not pumping up any water at all.

Now then, lemme try this approach: a little green man zooms in from outer space and sees 2 out of several California teams. One is the Dodgers, another is the Giants. He asks, what's the difference between them?

He learns they have a history, and were the two first teams in California, thus inventing west coast baseball. He asks, "So what's the difference between the two current teams?" and then asks, "Why is one better than the next?"

His name: The Great Gazoo (http://bedrock.deadsquid.com/information/profiles/index.php?profile=gazoo)

http://www.topthat.net/webrock/images/gazoo2.gif

[Jake83]

I am just waiting untill the Gnat team just implodes I thouh it would be last year but they were able to hang on with one wheel. This offseason I do not see the Giants making any huge improvements but just getting a year older and losing important players.

[Mattingly]

I am just waiting untill the Gnat team just implodes I thouh it would be last year but they were able to hang on with one wheel. This offseason I do not see the Giants making any huge improvements but just getting a year older and losing important players.
I thought that a lot of their troubles was that Barry Bonds was out most of the year. What were some of their other weaknesses?

I'm curious, how long have they been called "Gnats"?

[mojorisin71]

Growing up, I remember them being referred to as the "Jints," which carried over from their days in New York. The term "Gnats" became popular sometime around the late 1990s when FOX bought the team.

[Mattingly]

Growing up, I remember them being referred to as the "Jints," which carried over from their days in New York. The term "Gnats" became popular sometime around the late 1990s when FOX bought the team.
Jints? The only thing close I know of are the "Gints", which are the NFL's NY Giants; their counterparts in the same stadium--the Jets--are known as "Gang Green", per their uni color.

Fox owned the Giants? The media should never be allowed to own sports teams. Then again, we have the Cubs, the Yanks were bought in '73 by George from CBS, and I think that AOL or TW owns the Braves.

[Elvis]

Jints? The only thing close I know of are the "Gints", which are the NFL's NY Giants; their counterparts in the same stadium--the Jets--are known as "Gang Green", per their uni color.

Fox owned the Giants? The media should never be allowed to own sports teams. Then again, we have the Cubs, the Yanks were bought in '73 by George from CBS, and I think that AOL or TW owns the Braves.

FOX owned the Dodgers and still owns a piece.

Wasn't Ted Turner "The media" when he bought and owned the Braves?

[west coast orange and black]

Jake83: This offseason I do not see the Giants making any huge improvements but just getting a year older and losing important players.

look at where the padres finished last season, and then look at what they have done thus far in the off-season. why do believe that the giants hafta make "huge" improvements? who are the "important" players the giants lost whose positions the giants have not yet covered?

[BayBaseballFan]

The Giants have made improvements by signing Matt Morris and trading for Steve Finley

[Jake83]

There is a few names that the Jints, Gnats or Giants are refered to that I can not reference on this site.

[Jake83]

Dodgers----------------------Giants
LA----------------------------SF
No need for explanation on this

Dodger Staduim-------------Inset Name Here Park
The mecca of West Coast Baseball vs a park with a coke botle and glove in the bleachers

5 Rings---------------------- 0 Rings
3 for us 0 for you

Vin Scully--------------------Jon Miller
A radio legend vs the guy on Sunday Night Baseball 4-0

Nice sunny days----------------Thr brutal wind off the coast
5-0 The wind is unbearable after 20 minutes

Blue------------------------------Black and Orange
It looks like Halloween at Insert Name Park

6-0 Dodgers

[Dravecky43]

Jints? The only thing close I know of are the "Gints", which are the NFL's NY Giants; their counterparts in the same stadium--the Jets--are known as "Gang Green", per their uni color.

Yeah, the baseball Giants were known as "Da Jints" when they were in NY. I've seen old pictures in books about baseball where there are fans from the Giants in one group holding a sign saying, "Go Jints," and dodger fans are in another group holding signs referring to their team as "Dem Bums." And apparently some of their fans still hold the "bums" title. Just look at the posts of Joke83.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Dodgers----------------------Giants
LA----------------------------SF
No need for explanation on this

Dodger Staduim-------------Inset Name Here Park
The mecca of West Coast Baseball vs a park with a coke botle and glove in the bleachers

5 Rings---------------------- 0 Rings
3 for us 0 for you

Vin Scully--------------------Jon Miller
A radio legend vs the guy on Sunday Night Baseball 4-0

Nice sunny days----------------Thr brutal wind off the coast
5-0 The wind is unbearable after 20 minutes

Blue------------------------------Black and Orange
It looks like Halloween at Insert Name Park

6-0 Dodgers
I've been to Dodger Stadium several times. It is vastly overrated. Jake, have you even been to SBC Park? It blows away Dodger Stadium is soooo many ways. I love Vin Scully but he needs to retire. His perfomace has gone down hill significantly over the past 10 years. There is no wind at SBC Park. Have you ever been to a game at SBC? One thing SF doesn't have is smog and a high crime rate. Chavez Ravine is not a nice place. Jake, how old are you? Three of the five LA World titles occured before 1966.

[Gagne#3 8]

I've been to Dodger Stadium several times. It is vastly overrated. Jake, have you even been to SBC Park? It blows away Dodger Stadium is soooo many ways. I love Vin Scully but he needs to retire. His perfomace has gone down hill significantly over the past 10 years. There is no wind at SBC Park. Have you ever been to a game at SBC? One thing SF doesn't have is smog and a high crime rate. Chavez Ravine is not a nice place. Jake, how old are you? Three of the five LA World titles occured before 1966.


No matter when are championships occured we still have more than you. We can not use any before 1985 and we still have more than you. Untill you guys when a championship as the SF ginats yo can not nitpick at our 5 as LA Dodgers. The crime rate in LA is pretty low compared to the rest of the cities it size. SBC is a nice ballpark but like what Jake said Dodger Staduim is the Mecca if West Coast Baseball as it is one of the oldest ballaprks around baseball. Scully is still a star even at his age maybe listening to Jon Miller has damaged your ear drums.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

No matter when are championships occured we still have more than you. We can not use any before 1985 and we still have more than you. Untill you guys when a championship as the SF ginats yo can not nitpick at our 5 as LA Dodgers. The crime rate in LA is pretty low compared to the rest of the cities it size. LA is the second largest city in the U.S. So there are no "cities" the size of LA! So this "argument" makes no sense.


SBC is a nice ballpark but like what Jake said Dodger Staduim is the Mecca if West Coast Baseball as it is one of the oldest ballaprks around baseball. Scully is still a star even at his age maybe listening to Jon Miller has damaged your ear drums.
Are you Jake's lap dog? How is Dodger Stadium the "Mecca"? Yes, it's one of the oldest ballparks in the NL. So? Vin has lost it. I used to listen to him quite often in the 1980s. He was awesome in the 1980s. He's a shell of his former self now.

[Gagne#3 8]

I used to listen to him quite often in the 1980s. He was awesome in the 1980s. He's a shell of his former self now.


Vin only does about a third of the games now that is sorry to say we have Charlie Steiner, Rick Monday and Steve Lyons

[Gagne#3 8]

Detriot and Washinton have higher crime rates than LA. The East Bay is more dangerous than LA in my opinion. I have seen in Berkeley people bust police car windows out with bricks in the middle of the day

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Vin only does about a third of the games now that is sorry to say we have Charlie Steiner, Rick Monday and Steve Lyons
I still remember Vins calling of Gibson's HR against Eckersly in 1988. Awesome call. :clapping

[Gagne#3 8]

I still remember Vins calling of Gibson's HR against Eckersly in 1988. Awesome call. :clapping


He called it like a Dodger 14-1 blowout in the midle of April on a cold windy S.F. day

[Honus Wagner Rules]

He called it like a Dodger 14-1 blowout in the midle of April on a cold windy S.F. day
He called it by not talking too much. Just like his call of Game Six of the 1986 World Series.

[Elvis]

I've been to Dodger Stadium several times. It is vastly overrated. Jake, have you even been to SBC Park? It blows away Dodger Stadium is soooo many ways. I love Vin Scully but he needs to retire. His perfomace has gone down hill significantly over the past 10 years. There is no wind at SBC Park. Have you ever been to a game at SBC? One thing SF doesn't have is smog and a high crime rate. Chavez Ravine is not a nice place. Jake, how old are you? Three of the five LA World titles occured before 1966.
For a person who's team played in an absolute dump for most of their history, I wouldn't talk smack about ballparks. You have a nice ballpark...We have a nice ballpark...with history.

Did the Beatles ever play AT&T Stadium? No.
Did Pope John Paul II ever hold Mass at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did one of the most historic moments in World Series history occur at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did Sandy Koufax ever strike out Mickey Mantle at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did OJ Simpson ever roll off the upper deck in a wheelchair at AT&T Stadium? No.
Were the Olympic Games ever held at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did Cary Grant ever have season tickets at AT&T Stadium? No.
Are there any San Francisco World Championship flags displayed at AT&T Stadium? No.

Oh, and implying that the Bay Area doesn't have a crime, drug and gang problem is very funny.

And saying that Vin needs to retire is like saying Paul Newman should stop acting.

[Gagne#3 8]

For a person who's team played in an absolute dump for most of their history, I wouldn't talk smack about ballparks. You have a nice ballpark...We have a nice ballpark...with history.

Did the Beatles ever play AT&T Stadium? No.
Did Pope John Paul II ever hold Mass at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did one of the most historic moments in World Series history occur at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did Sandy Koufax ever strike out Mickey Mantle at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did OJ Simpson ever roll off the upper deck in a wheelchair at AT&T Stadium? No.
Were the Olympic Games ever held at AT&T Stadium? No.
Did Cary Grant ever have season tickets at AT&T Stadium? No.
Are there any San Francisco World Championship flags displayed at AT&T Stadium? No.

Oh, and implying that the Bay Area doesn't have a crime, drug and gang problem is very funny.

And saying that Vin needs to retire is like saying Paul Newman should stop acting.


They do have a giantic coke bottle, giantic glove, and have had 5 names for their ballpark.

[Elvis]

Vin has lost it...He's a shell of his former self now.

You have lost all credibility with most members here with a statement like that.

[Where is Chone Figgins]

You have lost all credibility with most members here with a statement like that.


It is the truth sorry to say. Dodger fans still living in the past I see

[Where is Chone Figgins]

They do have a giantic coke bottle, giantic glove, and have had 5 names for their ballpark.


Dodger Staduim is old and should be torn down. It smells like piss at deserves the name Chavez Latrine

[BayBaseballFan]

There is no comparsion bewteen the City of San Francisco (we are not talking about the East Bay) to Los Angeles. Our ballaprk is much newer and nicer Dodger Staduim should be bulldozed. We have won in the Last 10 years more than you. Vin Scully is an old man and his voice is not like fine wine.

[Elvis]

It is the truth sorry to say. Dodger fans still living in the past I see
If your version of the truth is that Steve FizzySox is a better broadcaster than Vin Scully, than I'd rather live in delusional land.

[Elvis]

Dodger Staduim is old and should be torn down. It smells like piss at deserves the name Chavez Latrine
You Angel fans are really a class act.

[Elvis]

There is no comparsion bewteen the City of San Francisco (we are not talking about the East Bay) to Los Angeles. Our ballaprk is much newer and nicer Dodger Staduim should be bulldozed. We have won in the Last 10 years more than you. Vin Scully is an old man and his voice is not like fine wine.
Can we please stop bashing HOFer Vin Scully, broadcaster of the century? This is pointless, looks very foolish on your part and just plain not cool.

This thread is supposed to be about the rivalry, not bashing towns, ballparks, or Hall of Fame broadcasters.

Let's start showing a little more class.

[mojorisin71]

Why are we even talking about the crime rate in LA and SF? It's a useless argument anyway. The Bronx is NOT the kind of place I'd like to be in at any time of day, yet the Yankees are one of the most historical franchises in sports history. I like the City of San Francisco, but Hunters Point is easily the worst part of the city to be in when the Giants used to play at the Stick.

There rarely is any wind at SBC/AT&T/Pac Bell Park anyway. It's a much better location than Candlestick/3Com/Monster Park. I'll give you that.

[west coast orange and black]

Elvis9045: Can we please stop bashing HOFer Vin Scully, broadcaster of the century?
Let's start showing a little more class.

with you on this, man.

[west coast orange and black]

the location of pac bell is much better, mojo, but to say that there is rarely any wind tells me that you do not go there often.

by the way: candlestick park averages but 2 degrees less than does the oakland coliseum during a baseball season's six months -- at the stick it is all about the wind and the fog .

[Jake83]

the location of pac bell is much better, mojo, but to say that there is rarely any wind tells me that you do not go there often.

by the way: candlestick park averages but 2 degrees less than does the oakland coliseum during a baseball season's six months -- at the stick it is all about the wind and the fog .


Your fellow Gnat fan was the one said Insert Name Park did not have any wind

[Elvis]

the location of pac bell is much better, mojo, but to say that there is rarely any wind tells me that you do not go there often.

by the way: candlestick park averages but 2 degrees less than does the oakland coliseum during a baseball season's six months -- at the stick it is all about the wind and the fog .

Slightly off topic question for you: What's the status of Candlestck Park? Are the 49ers happy there? I haven't heard anything about a new football stadium. Is there talk about building one and what are the chances of it being built (Politics, financing etc.)? Is the Stick holding up well?

We onlyget news down here on our own stadium plans, which it looks like the NFL has whittled down to either a remodeled Coliseum or an new Anaheim site.

[west coast orange and black]

Jake83:Your fellow Gnat fan was the one said Insert Name Park did not have any wind

then what do you make of this:
mojorisin71: "There rarely is any wind at SBC/AT&T/Pac Bell Park anyway."

[mojorisin71]

the location of pac bell is much better, mojo, but to say that there is rarely any wind tells me that you do not go there often.

by the way: candlestick park averages but 2 degrees less than does the oakland coliseum during a baseball season's six months -- at the stick it is all about the wind and the fog .

Being from Southern California, I don't make as many trips up north as I'd like (I used to go up there a lot when I was younger), but SBC runs circles around the Stick. I've been to only a couple of games up there, and both have been day games.

The Coliseum is another story, as I no longer have the 3rd deck to choose from when buying tickets. I'm still planning to go up there this June to the Dodgers/A's series.

[Jake83]

. There is no wind at SBC Park. Have you ever been to a game at SBC? .


Right here post on pg. 4 after I made a statement about the Bay Area wind

[Jake83]

Being from Southern California, I don't make as many trips up north as I'd like (I used to go up there a lot when I was younger), but SBC runs circles around the Stick. I've been to only a couple of games up there, and both have been day games.

The Coliseum is another story, as I no longer have the 3rd deck to choose from when buying tickets. I'm still planning to go up there this June to the Dodgers/A's series.


Stay out of the left field bleachers on Wed nights. It is Raider night at Mcafee with discount Wed. nights.

[UnderPressure]

You Angel fans are really a class act.

What's an Angel fan?

[mojorisin71]

Stay out of the left field bleachers on Wed nights. It is Raider night at Mcafee with discount Wed. nights.
I had a lengthy conversation about the Coliseum this past weekend with a very close friend of mine who lives in Oakland, and while the cheap Raider nights sounds like a good idea financially, the LA/Oakland series will actually be on the weekend.

[Jake83]

What's an Angel fan?


A misguided Dodger fan

[mojorisin71]

What's an Angel fan?
Contrary to popular belief, Angels attendance has been near the top in the AL their 45-year existence. It was not uncommon to see Angel caps in the late 80s/early 90s in the LA area along with Dodger caps. It is only until Arte Moreno bought the team that there's been a "rivalry" with the Angels and Dodgers.

[west coast orange and black]

Elvis9045: the status of Candlestck Park... the 49ers... talk about building one and the chances of it being built... holding up well?

the stick is a terrible venue, elvis (but it's our terrible venue :).)

it has not held up well over the years, elvis. the destination location notwithstanding, the stadium has not enjoyed any decent makeover and continues to squat in its greyness, unattended for most of the year.

the 49ers desparately want a new stadium that has sky boxes for additional revenue. the proposed new stadium would be built in what is now the parking lot (so the stadium and lot would kinda switch places) and a commercial business area is supposed to be incorporated in the design. but the location of the stick is the largest hurdle facing developers. it seems that nearby hunter's point is so great of a negative as to override any/all development plans.

the chances for a new stadium in the near future are very very slim without a pouring in of private money (see pac bell), as san francisco, as tiny as it is, has many special interests that continue to strike down planning advancements.

[Jake83]

Contrary to popular belief, Angels attendance has been near the top in the AL their 45-year existence. It was not uncommon to see Angel caps in the late 80s/early 90s in the LA area along with Dodger caps. It is only until Arte Moreno bought the team that there's been a "rivalry" with the Angels and Dodgers.


I do not consider them rivals. They are like the little kid on the block looking for their place.

[Gagne#3 8]

There is no comparsion bewteen the City of San Francisco (we are not talking about the East Bay) to Los Angeles. Our ballaprk is much newer and nicer Dodger Staduim should be bulldozed. We have won in the Last 10 years more than you. Vin Scully is an old man and his voice is not like fine wine.


Show some class and quit makin ignorant statements about the Mecca of West Coast Baseball and the legend Vin

[Mattingly]

I've been to Dodger Stadium several times. It is vastly overrated. Jake, have you even been to SBC Park? It blows away Dodger Stadium is soooo many ways.
What are the difference in amenities between Dodger Stadium and SBC Park? I've never been to either, so can you convince me that one is more fan- or player-friendly than the other?

Also, SBC has that "drink" in McCovey's Cove where all the kayakers have taken to catching you-know-who's longballs. What are some unique attractions at Dodger Stadium? Kind of like "the ivy at Wrigley" type of thing.

I love Vin Scully but he needs to retire. His perfomace has gone down hill significantly over the past 10 years.
What's with all the complaints about the legendary Vin Scully? Care to elaborate on this a bit? I'm also surprised they aren't preceded by some kind of honorary tribute to his longetivity.

[Jake83]

What makes Dodger Staduim:

1. The Dodgers

2. Center of West Coast and National League Baseball

3. The location Chavez Ravine was hand picked by Walter O' Mally to put Dodger Staduim. Centered around freeways and with a view of downtown from the South parking lot.

4. 1 of 3 private funded ballaprks

5. The Palm Trees down the foul lines the scoreboard in right center.

6. In 1978 Dodger Staduim first ballpark to host 3 million fans

7. Dodgers force to forfeit a game because of fans throwing baseball onto the field at umpries and Cardinal players in 1995.

8. The Celebrities you see at Dodger Staduim every game
Two statements about Dodger Staduim
Dodger Stadium is unique in that it has been relatively unchanged since it was opened in 1962. It was designed to be expanded to a capacity of over 80,000 with better outfield seating, but the backed bleachers and their distinctive covers still reign in the outfield, leading to instant recognition during the baseball highlights on ESPN.

It also has the reputation of being the cleanest ballpark in baseball: it is scrupulously scrubbed down after every home game, and the entire stadium is repainted during every off season.



And there really is something very special about Dodger Stadium; it is certainly of the three most historic ballparks in the majors (only Fenway Park and Wrigley Field surpass it, and they each have 50+ years in head starts). It just reeks of California in a way that Angel Stadium can only dream of. With the palm trees and idyllic panorama in the background and Hollywood stars occasionally in the stands, Dodger Stadium seems to exist in its own little world. And it certainly is an oasis: the area surrounding Chavez Ravine is more than a little rundown (like most of Los Angels is these days), but enter the grounds of Dodger Stadium and things change for the better.

[Jake83]

Mattingly it is like me asking you what makes Yankee Staduim you can not put it in words.

[Mattingly]

Mattingly it is like me asking you what makes Yankee Staduim you can not put it in words.
Hey, that's Matt to you, pal. :p :crazy :D

Yeah, but how do you say you can't put the feeling of Dodger Stadium after having answered the question? I'm still scratching my head on that one. Didn't you just describe some of the things that make Dodger Stadium unique amongst the others?

If someone asked for something unique about Yankee Stadium, I'd add those "bridge" things they have (I could never remember the names of those). Then there's Monument Park. Then there's the black seats. Then there's the notorious RF bleacher seats (the fans of whom have been known to be roudy). :D

Well, since Scully was briefly covered, I'm surprised nobody mentioned two of the biggest drawing cards both missing significant time in 2005: Gagne and Barry. How effective will those two be, and will San Diego have a decent just-over-.500 chance if both are running at full throttle in 2006?

Yeah, I ask way too many question. Still, stuff like that interests me. :D

[Jake83]

I think it is the aura of both ballaprks. The Yankees and Dodgers are very similar in many ways. The aura has been created by past players and championships. That cannot be put into words. I think Fenway or Wrigley are more classic ballparks than either Yankee or Dodger Staduim. But in the realm of baseball and baseball history Yankee and Dodger Staduims are the Meccas of Baseball

[Mattingly]

I think it is the aura of both ballaprks. The Yankees and Dodgers are very similar in many ways. The aura has been created by past players and championships. That cannot be put into words. I think Fenway or Wrigley are more classic ballparks than either Yankee or Dodger Staduim. But in the realm of baseball and baseball history Yankee and Dodger Staduims are the Meccas of Baseball
All are also meccas of baseball in that their names haven't been changed since their inception, and stand the test of time. To me, that's a dedication to the beauty of baseball within itself.

I'll have to look up which is older (Fenway or Wrigley), but Fenway did open a few days after the Titanic went down in April 1912. Interestingly, the Royal Mail Ship was on its way to New York City when tragedy struck ... :D :p

How much does it mean to you that Los Angeles was the first west coast team? I definitely need to study my ballparks, since I'm not sure when the SF Giants opened their first park. I only remember Candlestick and that's about it. :o :(

[Jake83]

All are also meccas of baseball in that their names haven't been changed since their inception, and stand the test of time. To me, that's a dedication to the beauty of baseball within itself.

I'll have to look up which is older (Fenway or Wrigley), but Fenway did open a few days after the Titanic went down in April 1912. Interestingly, the Royal Mail Ship was on its way to New York City when tragedy struck ... :D :p

How much does it mean to you that Los Angeles was the first west coast team? I definitely need to study my ballparks, since I'm not sure when the SF Giants opened their first park. I only remember Candlestick and that's about it. :o :(


They played in Seals Staduim first until 61 or 62 I believe

[Honus Wagner Rules]

I think it is the aura of both ballaprks. The Yankees and Dodgers are very similar in many ways. The aura has been created by past players and championships. That cannot be put into words. I think Fenway or Wrigley are more classic ballparks than either Yankee or Dodger Staduim. But in the realm of baseball and baseball history Yankee and Dodger Staduims are the Meccas of Baseball
Jake,

You need to lay off the "sauce". ;) In the realm of baseball history nothing comes close to Yankee Stadium. Ummm...26 world Series titles will do that. :)

So supposed aura are you talking about?

[Honus Wagner Rules]

They played in Seals Staduim first until 61 or 62 I believe
The 'Stick opened up in 1962.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

What are the difference in amenities between Dodger Stadium and SBC Park? I've never been to either, so can you convince me that one is more fan- or player-friendly than the other?

Also, SBC has that "drink" in McCovey's Cove where all the kayakers have taken to catching you-know-who's longballs. What are some unique attractions at Dodger Stadium? Kind of like "the ivy at Wrigley" type of thing.

What's with all the complaints about the legendary Vin Scully? Care to elaborate on this a bit? I'm also surprised they aren't preceded by some kind of honorary tribute to his longetivity.
I have listened to Vin since the 1790s and he doesn't "paint as detailed a picture" as he used to with his word play. He's still decent by not the Vin of the past. I don't fault him for this, he is geting up in years. I wonder if he has plans to retire? If so, who will the Dodgers replace him with?

[Jake83]

I have listened to Vin since the 1790s and he replace him with?


You must be bloddy over 200 years old

[Honus Wagner Rules]

What are the difference in amenities between Dodger Stadium and SBC Park? I've never been to either, so can you convince me that one is more fan- or player-friendly than the other?

Also, SBC has that "drink" in McCovey's Cove where all the kayakers have taken to catching you-know-who's longballs. What are some unique attractions at Dodger Stadium? Kind of like "the ivy at Wrigley" type of thing.

What's with all the complaints about the legendary Vin Scully? Care to elaborate on this a bit? I'm also surprised they aren't preceded by some kind of honorary tribute to his longetivity.

People have to remember dodger Stadium is 45 years old. All stadiums have to change eventually. If Dodger Stadium is "timeless" they it wouldn't need any rennovation right? All ball parks need changes from time to time.

SBC is a modern park in every sense of the word. I live in the South Bay about 45 minutes south of San Francisco. I usually take the train to SBC. It stops right across the street. There are plenty of bathrooms, vendors and every seat gives you a great view. The seats are really up close to the action, very little foul territory. Another thing is the great weather. Only once did I ever have to wear a jacket in the sixe seasons I've been going there. Growing up at Candlestick that was a huge improvement!

[Dravecky43]

How much does it mean to you that Los Angeles was the first west coast team? I definitely need to study my ballparks, since I'm not sure when the SF Giants opened their first park. I only remember Candlestick and that's about it. :o :(
Well, I don't believe you can call either team the first West Coast team. They both started over here in 1958. I hear that the dodgers' owner suggested the idea to the Giants' owner, but I also hear that the Giants thought about it first. There's really no way to know.

When the Giants moved they started play in Seals Stadium. Played there for two seasons and opened The 'Stick in 1960.

[Dravecky43]

You must be bloddy over 200 years old
And that makes Scully how old?

[Elvis]

If Dodger Stadium is "timeless" they it wouldn't need any rennovation right?

Wrong. That isn't what timeless means. Timeless paintings and other works of art including historic buildings all need restoration after time.

Even a kid knows that.



All ball parks need changes from time to time.


I suppose you're refering to the 8 combined names of the Giants 2 ballparks.

[Dravecky43]

Even a kid knows that.
Why do some people always feel the need to degrade others with personal attacks? I don't know if you took a Critical Thinking class in your school years, but a personal attack is not a valid argument. If you want to know more, let me know.

[Elvis]

Why do some people always feel the need to degrade others with personal attacks? I don't know if you took a Critical Thinking class in your school years, but a personal attack is not a valid argument. If you want to know more, let me know.

Why do some Norcal people always feel the need to degrade others with personal attacks? :laugh

[Jake83]

Why do some people always feel the need to degrade others with personal attacks? I don't know if you took a Critical Thinking class in your school years, but a personal attack is not a valid argument. If you want to know more, let me know.


This is not the place for childless insults. Keep your post directed at baseball

[Gagne#3 8]

People have to remember dodger Stadium is 45 years old. All stadiums have to change eventually. If Dodger Stadium is "timeless" they it wouldn't need any rennovation right? All ball parks need changes from time to time.




Lets try to keep an open mind and your hatred of the Dodgers out of your biased statements

[Gagne#3 8]

Why do some people always feel the need to degrade others with personal attacks? I don't know if you took a Critical Thinking class in your school years, but a personal attack is not a valid argument. If you want to know more, let me know.


Haven't you ever taken a logic class. Every statement is subjective. Your took a statement that wasn't even directed towards you as an insult. This thread the rules are a little more relax but lets keep the attacks directed towards baseball and not make them personel

[Where is Chone Figgins]

You Dodger fans are too uptight if anyone mentions something about your precious Vin Scully or your so called center of West Coast Baseball you get offend. Lighten up Dodger fans maybe people could stand you more

A regular Dodger fan

http://www.lakenetnwi.org/member/bridges/Home.h1.gif

[UnderPressure]

Wannabe rivals of the Dodgers or Giants can post in here( That is you Padre, Angel and A's fans)

Not a great idea, dude. Some Angel fan here is trying fit in this great Dodger-Giant rivalry. And he's kinda annoying. Someone make him an "A's-Angels Rivalry" thread or something.

EDIT: I also love his sig. 1 World Championship and 5 division titles. He forgot his 2002 WildCard Championship.

[Jake83]

SF Giants' accomplishments

I love it brilliant


Oh, The Angel fan I forgot............................................ ..............That is how much attention I pay to them

[BayBaseballFan]

Not a great idea, dude. Some Angel fan here is trying fit in this great Dodger-Giant rivalry. And he's kinda annoying. Someone make him an "A's-Angels Rivalry" thread or something.

EDIT: I also love his sig. 1 World Championship and 5 division titles. He forgot his 2002 WildCard Championship.


He reminds me of Dodger fans

[BayBaseballFan]

What are the difference in amenities between Dodger Stadium and SBC Park? I've never been to either, so can you convince me that one is more fan- or player-friendly than the other?

Also, SBC has that "drink" in McCovey's Cove where all the kayakers have taken to catching you-know-who's longballs. What are some unique attractions at Dodger Stadium? Kind of like "the ivy at Wrigley" type of thing.

What's with all the complaints about the legendary Vin Scully? Care to elaborate on this a bit? I'm also surprised they aren't preceded by some kind of honorary tribute to his longetivity.


Vin has always has slways been somewhat of a boring broadcaster. He is very intelligent and formal but I do not see him being like what Dodger fans say " the best broadcaster in sports"

[west coast orange and black]

Elvis9045: Why do some Norcal people always feel the need to degrade others with personal attacks?

no need to single out "norcal people", man.
stuff comes from all corners, from all sides.

[Elvis]

Vin has always has slways been somewhat of a boring broadcaster. He is very intelligent and formal but I do not see him being like what Dodger fans say " the best broadcaster in sports"

Actually, sir, it was his PEERS AND SPORTSWRITERS who voted him into the HOF and voted him broadcaster of the century...NOT Dodger fans.

[Elvis]

Elvis9045: Why do some Norcal people always feel the need to degrade others with personal attacks?

no need to single out "norcal people", man.
stuff comes from all corners, from all sides.

It was a tongue-in-cheek post. I found it hilarious how she/he responded to a "personal attack" by denouncing "personal attacks" and then ended it with a "personal attack". :laugh

Sorry about that.

[Bluesteve32]

Hmmmmmmmmm ... Ali-Frazier? No, that's long gone.

Magic-Bird? Nahhhhhhhh, nobody's ever heard of them.

King-Evert? Bahh, humbug.

Nope, that's it. Giants-Dodgers must be the greatest rivalry in all of pro sports. :p

Wouldn't Army-Navy, the two academies that produce the future leaders for our country's military (and many become quite successful after careers in the military), actually have something to say about the greatest rivalry. May not be the best football anymore, but it is still a rivalry, nonetheless.

[Bluesteve32]

you know the rivalry im talking about. its the only one that means anything.

Watching a lot of ESPN, I see.

The Dodgers-Giants is much more bitterthat Yankees-Red Sox ever was. Besides, it travelled 3000 miles across the country, too.

[Bluesteve32]

It will be an very unlikely day when I worry about the joke of a franchise down in Orange County
Congratulations, this year's Senior class wil be the first not to be alive when the Dodgers won their last WS.

[Bluesteve32]

What's an Angel fan?


Great quote coming from somebody who was four months old when the Dodgers won their last WS!:laugh

[Bluesteve32]

I do not consider them rivals. They are like the little kid on the block looking for their place.

That was because you are not old enough to remember the Grich, Lynn, Baylor, Reggie, Carew and the other playing for the Angels. Also, ther ewas no interleague play back then.

[Bluesteve32]

Well, I don't believe you can call either team the first West Coast team. They both started over here in 1958. I hear that the dodgers' owner suggested the idea to the Giants' owner, but I also hear that the Giants thought about it first. There's really no way to know.

When the Giants moved they started play in Seals Stadium. Played there for two seasons and opened The 'Stick in 1960.

From what I understand, Stoneham was thinking of moving to Mineapolis and O'Malley told hem to hold that thought (sort of) and was dealing with LA on the side. OM convinced Stoneham to move to the West Coast and the rivalry would be left intact. The Giants announced it their pending move before OM did, but they moved the same season.

The Dodgers played at the LA Memorial Coliseum for four seasons and the Giants played at Seals Stadium for 1958 and 1959 and moved to the Stick in 1960. Chavez Ravine was opened in 1962 and both the Dodgers and Angels played there its igaugrual season whith the Angels leaving afterthe 1965 season. The Angels played one season at LA Wrigley in 1961.

[Bluesteve32]

Vin has always has slways been somewhat of a boring broadcaster. He is very intelligent and formal but I do not see him being like what Dodger fans say " the best broadcaster in sports"

Vin Scully was among the finest broadcasters ever to announce a game. However, in 2006, I don't think that is ture. I saw it coming with Chick Hearn, and Vinnie is not the Vinne we all grew up with. BTW, John Miller does a fair Scully impression.

[UnderPressure]

Great quote coming from somebody who was four months old when the Dodgers won their last WS!:laugh

Yes! I was there in the Right Field Pavilion with my mom carrying me. I can remember when my mom almost threw me away when Gibson hit that homerun! I was like, "Mom, what were you thinking?!" Good times.

What about you? What were some of the great moments of your Major League Baseball team when you were 4 months old?

BTW, I was a year and 4 months old when the Dodgers won in '88. :)

[Dravecky43]

It was a tongue-in-cheek post. I found it hilarious how she/he responded to a "personal attack" by denouncing "personal attacks" and then ended it with a "personal attack". :laugh

Sorry about that.

My post did not include a personal attack. I just don't think it's civil making attacks like that. It brings down my level of interest in reading these threads, as I'm sure it does for many other people.

[Ursa Major]

Vin Scully was among the finest broadcasters ever to announce a game. However, in 2006, I don't think that is ture. I saw it coming with Chick Hearn, and Vinnie is not the Vinne we all grew up with. BTW, John Miller does a fair Scully impression.That's not true...

.... Jon Miller does a terrific Vin Scully impersonation, complete with the Farmer John Sausage commercials. It's a thing of beauty, believe me.

I haven't heard Scully for a year or more, and it sounds as though he's not the old Scully, but like his mentor, Red Barber, he doesn't need to be his old self to remain a treasure. I think Miller is the best in baseball -- great voice and cadence and incredibly knowledgeable, and stays away from cliches, with a wicked and sophisticated sense of humor. But, listening to Scully truly brings the sense of the timelessness of baseball -- of sitting at a picnic with some fried chicken and grownups playing catch and all the wonder that goes with being 8 or 13 or 18 or 38.

Scully is Bach; Miller is Beethoven. (Tim McCarver is John Tesh.)

[Elvis]

My post did not include a personal attack. I just don't think it's civil making attacks like that. It brings down my level of interest in reading these threads, as I'm sure it does for many other people.

Snide remark, personal "attack", whatever. They're all cuts off the same steer. :waving

[Elvis]

That's not true...

.... Jon Miller does a terrific Vin Scully impersonation, complete with the Farmer John Sausage commercials. It's a thing of beauty, believe me.

I haven't heard Scully for a year or more, and it sounds as though he's not the old Scully, but like his mentor, Red Barber, he doesn't need to be his old self to remain a treasure. I think Miller is the best in baseball -- great voice and cadence and incredibly knowledgeable, and stays away from cliches, with a wicked and sophisticated sense of humor. But, listening to Scully truly brings the sense of the timelessness of baseball -- of sitting at a picnic with some fried chicken and grownups playing catch and all the wonder that goes with being 8 or 13 or 18 or 38.

Scully is Bach; Miller is Beethoven. (Tim McCarver is John Tesh.)

:clapping :clapping Nice post!

[Jake83]

That was because you are not old enough to remember the Grich, Lynn, Baylor, Reggie, Carew and the other playing for the Angels. Also, ther ewas no interleague play back then.


Because the Angels won a couple of AL West Titles in the early 80's that makes them equal to the Dodgers. Even with interleague play the Angels are not rivals of the Angels. Thw worry about teams in the NL West and the National League.

[Jake83]

Congratulations, this year's Senior class wil be the first not to be alive when the Dodgers won their last WS.


Your infeority complex towards the Dodgers is very entertaining.

[Bluesteve32]

Yes! I was there in the Right Field Pavilion with my mom carrying me. I can remember when my mom almost threw me away when Gibson hit that homerun! I was like, "Mom, what were you thinking?!" Good times.

What about you? What were some of the great moments of your Major League Baseball team when you were 4 months old?

BTW, I was a year and 4 months old when the Dodgers won in '88. :)

Maz's home run in the 1960 WS would qualify.

[Bluesteve32]

Because the Angels won a couple of AL West Titles in the early 80's that makes them equal to the Dodgers. Even with interleague play the Angels are not rivals of the Angels. Thw worry about teams in the NL West and the National League.

Never said that, but they were doormats, either. The set the AL record for attendance twice in that era, too.

[UnderPressure]

Maz's home run in the 1960 WS would qualify.

Nope, it wouldn't. Sorry. Can't blame you, though.

[Bluesteve32]

Your infeority complex towards the Dodgers is very entertaining.

It's is quite funny that most of your great Dodger history happened before you were born? Come on. Things are cyclical just like in the SC- UCLA rivalry. UCLA wins eight straight, and then SC storms back with seven so far, (most quite convincingly) and back to back National titles (UCLA's lone football title was 1954, before I was born) and a chance for a third next week (still Saturday night, here).

The Dodger will rise again and the Angels will have some bad years again, but even you must admit, it is not all Dodgers anymore.

[Bluesteve32]

Nope, it wouldn't. Sorry. Can't blame you, though.

Why not? I was four months old when that happened.

[UnderPressure]

Why not? I was four months old when that happened.

I know, that's why I said "Can't blame you, though." And that's why in the first place, I said "your Major League Baseball" team.

[BasEbaLlKnoItAll]

I know, that's why I said "Can't blame you, though." And that's why in the first place, I said "your Major League Baseball" team.
His Angels werent around then Vic!!

[UnderPressure]

His Angels werent around then Vic!!

Yes, I know that. That's why I put them in italics, to show that I meant it in a sarcastic way. Check it.

[BasEbaLlKnoItAll]

Yes, I know that. That's why I put them in italics, to show that I meant it in a sarcastic way. Check it.
lol oops!!

I kind of figured that but wasnt sure. I also meant my remark sarcastically as well.

[Gagne#3 8]

It's is quite funny that most of your great Dodger history happened before you were born? Come on. Things are cyclical just like in the SC- UCLA rivalry. UCLA wins eight straight, and then SC storms back with seven so far, (most quite convincingly) and back to back National titles (UCLA's lone football title was 1954, before I was born) and a chance for a third next week (still Saturday night, here).

The Dodger will rise again and the Angels will have some bad years again, but even you must admit, it is not all Dodgers anymore.

I love your comparsion of the Dodger-Angel rivarly to USC-UCLA but I think it should be more like UCLA-Basketball vs-Cal St Northridge. There is no comparsion or rivarly.

[Mariachiman]

Congratulations, this year's Senior class wil be the first not to be alive when the Dodgers won their last WS.


I do not mean to come off rude but what does an Angel fan have to do with a Dodger-Giant rivarly thread. You want to be LA and what you want to be included into the greatest baseball rivarly now.

[BayBaseballFan]

Actually, sir, it was his PEERS AND SPORTSWRITERS who voted him into the HOF and voted him broadcaster of the century...NOT Dodger fans.



I never said Vin was not a Hall of Fame broadcaster but to say he was the greatest in all of sports may be a leap

[BayBaseballFan]

Vin Scully was among the finest broadcasters ever to announce a game. However, in 2006, I don't think that is ture. I saw it coming with Chick Hearn, and Vinnie is not the Vinne we all grew up with. BTW, John Miller does a fair Scully impression.


Greatest of all time is a very subjective statement. Every person has their opinion and style so there will be differing points of view on the question of "Greatest Broadcaster of All Time"

[BayBaseballFan]

I love your comparsion of the Dodger-Angel rivarly to USC-UCLA but I think it should be more like UCLA-Basketball vs-Cal St Northridge. There is no comparsion or rivarly.


I believe the Angel-Dodger rivarly is a little more intense than UCLA-Cal St Northridge in basketball.

[Where is Chone Figgins]

Great quote coming from somebody who was four months old when the Dodgers won their last WS!:laugh




They call us a second rate team while we have had more sucess it the last 15 years then them, Baseball is a game of the future and I am an Angel fan because I look towards the future while Dodger fans live in the past and live through their past glory and triumph.

[Where is Chone Figgins]

That was because you are not old enough to remember the Grich, Lynn, Baylor, Reggie, Carew and the other playing for the Angels. Also, ther ewas no interleague play back then.


According to the Dodger gang ( That is what they really are on this board) the Angels didn;t exist before 2002.

[Where is Chone Figgins]

I do not mean to come off rude but what does an Angel fan have to do with a Dodger-Giant rivarly thread. You want to be LA and what you want to be included into the greatest baseball rivarly now.


The orginal poster BigJoke83 invivted us here.



Wannabe rivals of the Dodgers or Giants can post in here( That is you Padre, Angel and A's fans)

[Mattingly]

According to the Dodger gang ( That is what they really are on this board) the Angels didn;t exist before 2002.
I think the perception of Angels isn't their players but their fans. Many felt that they didn't exist in strong numbers until October 2002.

Even when I saw the Yanks play there during that season, I never saw such a strong turnout as during that postseason. I think that if fans had turned out much more often prior to this, then they wouldn't have had such a perception.

Also, if Edison Field weren't informally known as "Yankee Stadium West", that might have helped. You cannot let fans whose team plays almost 3,000 miles away gain sizeable numbers on a regular basis.

The orginal poster BigJoke83 invivted us here.
I presume you'd meant BigJake83? :D

[Gagne#3 8]

I believe the Angel-Dodger rivarly is a little more intense than UCLA-Cal St Northridge in basketball.


It may be but it is nothing like USC-UCLA in any sport

[Gagne#3 8]

According to the Dodger gang ( That is what they really are on this board) the Angels didn;t exist before 2002.


The Dodger Gang???? I have to laugh on that. I do not believe anyone in here has said the Angels in the realm of baseball didn't exsist before 2002

[Elvis]

I never said Vin was not a Hall of Fame broadcaster...

No, you said he was boring

So, does that now mean that one of your qualifications to be one of the select few broadcasters in thet HOF is to be boring?

Or are you just agreeing to the fact that he is in the HOF, but he really doesn't belong there?

I'm confused. And in that previous post you seemed confused why Dodger fans thought Vin was the best, yet you make no mention of being confused by his peers and national sportswriters who feel the same way.

Very confusing...:crazy :crazy :crazy

[UnderPressure]

The orginal poster BigJoke83 invivted us here.

You still would've posted in this thread even if you weren't "invited."

[mojorisin71]

Can we just stick to the topic at hand instead of resorting to name-calling, personal attacks, and blanket statements about other teams?

I believe that there have been a few established facts in this thread:

1) Vin Scully is one of the best broadcasters in the game (as voted by his peers, not just Dodger fans)
2) SBC is a much better upgrade over the Stick (location is key)
3) The Giants have not won anything in San Francisco
4) The Dodgers have not won anything in 17 years (so quit bringing up Kirk Gibson)
5) The Angels/Dodgers "rivalry" began when Moreno changed the team's name (remember, we rooted for Anaheim back in 2002)
6) Some people tend to hate their rivals more than they love their teams (I've seen it a lot at LA/SF games at the Ravine and at SBC)
7) Everyone has a tendency to hype their team as the next dynasty

[Brannu]

Boy oh Boy ... I've missed a lot after these two weeks of vacation. This may be the most important of all. I liked The Dodgers as a kid, moved to LA and followed them in a fairly passionate mode ... except when they played The Cardinals. I've never liked The Giants ... Will Clark killed it for me.

Anyway ... it is good that this idea was kicked off and can be discussed throughout years to come. Fun stuff.

Happy New Year folks ...

Oh ... by the way ... aren't many Dodgers fans also Angels fans ... and vice-versa? Plus ... that really doesn't have the potential to become a REAL rivalry since they won't be in the same division. It's not like they are bloods and crips. (Red and Blue .... bad joke I know.)

[DannyLA]

The Giants have made improvements by signing Matt Morris and trading for Steve Finley

How is Steve Finley an improvement?

[DannyLA]

Dodger Staduim is old and should be torn down. It smells like piss at deserves the name Chavez Latrine

Do you not like it because there are no fireworks or fake fountains in the outfield? Silly Angel fans with their goofy expectations. Go play with your rally monkey.

[Bluesteve32]

Do you not like it because there are no fireworks or fake fountains in the outfield? Silly Angel fans with their goofy expectations. Go play with your rally monkey.

The Legacy of Disney ownership. Compare Fox's and Disney's ownership if you like and compare McCourt's and Arte's, I think the Angels come out ahead. ;)

Oh yeah, love your parking lot. :laugh

[Lprof]

:laugh :laugh What else would be the greatest rivarly in professional sports
I think Packer and Bear fans might disagree with you, as would Cubs and Cardinals fans. As far as I can tell (and admittedly I live in a different part of the country), the rivalry seems to be nothing like what it was in Brooklyn and New York.

[Lprof]

Do you not like it because there are no fireworks or fake fountains in the outfield? Silly Angel fans with their goofy expectations. Go play with your rally monkey.
I'm curious as exactly how Dodger fans (traditionally the big boys in town) react to a world series victory by the 90 pound weakling, at least in terms of team support, the Angels. As a White Sox fan living in Chicago, it is very, very, intereting to see how Cub fans react. I wonder if it is similar.

[Lprof]

I'm curious as exactly how Dodger fans (traditionally the big boys in town) react to a world series victory by the 90 pound weakling, at least in terms of team support, the Angels. As a White Sox fan living in Chicago, it is very, very, intereting to see how Cub fans react. I wonder if it is similar.
By the way, do LA dodger fans realize how hated they have been (as a group, not as individuals) for the hearts they broke--i ndeed, in mor1e than a few cases,lives Ithey actually destroyed in 1957 I think the statute of limitations ever runs out on that. It was, I must admit, quite gratifying to see you lose TWO pro football teams, but somehow it wasn't quite enough satisfaction.

[UnderPressure]

By the way, do LA dodger fans realize how hated they have been (as a group, not as individuals) for the hearts they broke--i ndeed, in mor1e than a few cases,lives Ithey actually destroyed in 1957 I think the statute of limitations ever runs out on that. It was, I must admit, quite gratifying to see you lose TWO pro football teams, but somehow it wasn't quite enough satisfaction.

Why are you blaming the L.A. Dodger fans? It was O'Malley's fault.

[mojorisin71]

By the way, do LA dodger fans realize how hated they have been (as a group, not as individuals) for the hearts they broke--i ndeed, in mor1e than a few cases,lives Ithey actually destroyed in 1957 I think the statute of limitations ever runs out on that. It was, I must admit, quite gratifying to see you lose TWO pro football teams, but somehow it wasn't quite enough satisfaction.
Check the Brooklyn Dodger forums for all the hatred towards LA. It's nothing new, and I'm not going to stop rooting for a team over an incident that happened before I was born. That's why I prefer to keep the LA and Brooklyn Dodgers histories separate.

As for the NFL in LA, we don't need it. We have USC playing on Wednesday for a third consecutive national title.

[Elvis]

By the way, do LA dodger fans realize how hated they have been (as a group, not as individuals) for the hearts they broke--i ndeed, in mor1e than a few cases,lives Ithey actually destroyed in 1957 I think the statute of limitations ever runs out on that. It was, I must admit, quite gratifying to see you lose TWO pro football teams, but somehow it wasn't quite enough satisfaction.

Why are you blaming modern-day Angelinos for what O'Malley (NOT an Angelino) did 50 years ago? :confused:

By the way, L.A. is more of a college football town anyway.

[Dravecky43]

How is Steve Finley an improvement?
Well, it was a proven (though coming off a down year), very talented OF or someone like Jason Ellison, Todd Linden, or last year's starting CF, Marquis Grissom. I don't know about you, but I'd choose a guy who just two years ago had a very good season and is returning to full health and to a league in which he has spent most of his career.

[Jake83]

The Legacy of Disney ownership. Compare Fox's and Disney's ownership if you like and compare McCourt's and Arte's, I think the Angels come out ahead. ;)

Oh yeah, love your parking lot. :laugh


Do you really think Arte has pulled the Angels even with the Dodgers

[Jake83]

Boy oh Boy ... I've missed a lot after these two weeks of vacation. This may be the most important of all. I liked The Dodgers as a kid, moved to LA and followed them in a fairly passionate mode ... except when they played The Cardinals. I've never liked The Giants ... Will Clark killed it for me.

Anyway ... it is good that this idea was kicked off and can be discussed throughout years to come. Fun stuff.

Happy New Year folks ...

Oh ... by the way ... aren't many Dodgers fans also Angels fans ... and vice-versa? Plus ... that really doesn't have the potential to become a REAL rivalry since they won't be in the same division. It's not like they are bloods and crips. (Red and Blue .... bad joke I know.)


No the difference bewteen Angel and Dodger fans is geography.

[Jake83]

I think Packer and Bear fans might disagree with you, as would Cubs and Cardinals fans. As far as I can tell (and admittedly I live in a different part of the country), the rivalry seems to be nothing like what it was in Brooklyn and New York.


Who???????

[Gagne#3 8]

By the way, do LA dodger fans realize how hated they have been (as a group, not as individuals) for the hearts they broke--i ndeed, in mor1e than a few cases,lives Ithey actually destroyed in 1957 I think the statute of limitations ever runs out on that. It was, I must admit, quite gratifying to see you lose TWO pro football teams, but somehow it wasn't quite enough satisfaction.


People hate the best. Jealousy is a bad way to go through life my friend

[Where is Chone Figgins]

You still would've posted in this thread even if you weren't "invited."


The point is that Angel fans were invivted to theis thread

[Where is Chone Figgins]

Do you not like it because there are no fireworks or fake fountains in the outfield? Silly Angel fans with their goofy expectations. Go play with your rally monkey.


Dodger fans living in the past still I see.

[Where is Chone Figgins]

Do you really think Arte has pulled the Angels even with the Dodgers


If you look at the numbers from last year than I say Arte has pulled the ANgels equal to the Dodgers

[DannyLA]

Dodger fans living in the past still I see.

What did my post have to do with "the past"? :confused:

[Mariachiman]

If you look at the numbers from last year than I say Arte has pulled the ANgels equal to the Dodgers


In what attendance no I think the Dodgers were higher. In TV and ratio ratings no I believe the Dodgers were higher In merchandise sales no I believe the Dodgers were higher. How were the Angels equal?

[Captain Cold Nose]

In what attendance no I think the Dodgers were higher. In TV and ratio ratings no I believe the Dodgers were higher In merchandise sales no I believe the Dodgers were higher. How were the Angels equal?
You *ahem* didn't mention how they finished in the standings.

[BayBaseballFan]

How did this thread turn into Angels vs Dodgers. I thought is was about the Giants and Dodgers. Just re-name it the California rivarly thread then

[BayBaseballFan]

Well, it was a proven (though coming off a down year), very talented OF or someone like Jason Ellison, Todd Linden, or last year's starting CF, Marquis Grissom. I don't know about you, but I'd choose a guy who just two years ago had a very good season and is returning to full health and to a league in which he has spent most of his career.


Grissom and Finley are about equal in my opinion

[UnderPressure]

How did this thread turn into Angels vs Dodgers. I thought is was about the Giants and Dodgers. Just re-name it the California rivarly thread then


No, let it stay Dodgers vs. Giants. Get the Angels out of this thread.

EDIT: The title should be Angels and Giants vs. Dodgers.

[UnderPressure]

Dodger fans living in the past still I see.

Why can't you Angel fans be like A's fans? Fans that care more about their team's own division than their neighboring NL team.

[Captain Cold Nose]

No, let it stay Dodgers vs. Giants. Get the Angels out of this thread.
As this is an open board, anyone can post in this thread that wants to. If it is to be a two-team only thread, it does not belong in Current Events and will be moved accordingly.

[mojorisin71]

As this is an open board, anyone can post in this thread that wants to. If it is to be a two-team only thread, it does not belong in Current Events and will be moved accordingly.
You took the words out of my mouth, Captain.

[Jake83]

Any person can post here as long as they follow the fourm guidelines and stay on topic of the thread. If you think someone is crossing the line with something do not respond

[Ursa Major]

By the way, L.A. is more of a college football town anyway.Oh, does L.A. have a college football team? :D

[Jake83]

Oh, does L.A. have a college football team? :D


Not really. I think they are playing in some game tomorrow called the Rose Bowl. For a national championship I believe

[Ursa Major]

Grissom and Finley are about equal in my opinionMarquis Grissom is one of the classiest players and teammates around. It broke my heart when they let him go . . . and he handled the situation with impeccable grace.

But... it was time. His hitting fell off and his mainstay, his speed, hasn't been there. He's been an average outfielder for several years and he's stolen a grand total of 27 bases over the past five years. He just wasn't Marquis anymore. I see that he's just signed a minor leage contract with the Cubs, but they have a packed outfield, so it's hard to see where he'll fit in.

Finley has comparable fielding numbers, better stolen base numbers (for what it's worth) and a ton more power, hitting 36 HRs in his last full, injury free season (2004). And he's a lefty; the Giants are weak from that side outside of Bonds.

[sandlot]

One one the reasons that I became a Yankee fan as kid was because I liked their attitude toward winning. Years later, when I moved to the Bay Area and resumed interest in the transplanted Giants, I became frustrated because after the Mays-Marichal-McCovey years, it seemed like the SF fans had a different attitude; a lot of them would be happy simply to see SF have a winning record against LA, and if SF also managed to prevent the Dodgers from winning the pennant, that was great. They could be content just to watch decent ball in the sunshine and for the Giants to play the role of spoilers. At the same time, I had the sense that LA always expected to take the prize, and beating SF would be icing on the cake. Happily, it seems (looking from a long way away) that the expectations of SF fans have risen, along with (a) Bonds' performance, (b) the quality of the teams, and (c) the contruction of a beautiful yard. Maybe my observations are unfair to any number of loyal SF fans, but that's how I felt for a long time.

[BayBaseballFan]

Marquis Grissom is one of the classiest players and teammates around. It broke my heart when they let him go . . . and he handled the situation with impeccable grace.

But... it was time. His hitting fell off and his mainstay, his speed, hasn't been there. He's been an average outfielder for several years and he's stolen a grand total of 27 bases over the past five years. He just wasn't Marquis anymore. I see that he's just signed a minor leage contract with the Cubs, but they have a packed outfield, so it's hard to see where he'll fit in.

Finley has comparable fielding numbers, better stolen base numbers (for what it's worth) and a ton more power, hitting 36 HRs in his last full, injury free season (2004). And he's a lefty; the Giants are weak from that side outside of Bonds.


That is only if Finley returns to his pre-2005 form which is highly unlikley. Only reason Finley is getting another chance is because he is a center fielder.

[BayBaseballFan]

One one the reasons that I became a Yankee fan as kid was because I liked their attitude toward winning. Years later, when I moved to the Bay Area and resumed interest in the transplanted Giants, I became frustrated because after the Mays-Marichal-McCovey years, it seemed like the SF fans had a different attitude; a lot of them would be happy simply to see SF have a winning record against LA, and if SF also managed to prevent the Dodgers from winning the pennant, that was great. They could be content just to watch decent ball in the sunshine and for the Giants to play the role of spoilers. At the same time, I had the sense that LA always expected to take the prize, and beating SF would be icing on the cake. Happily, it seems (looking from a long way away) that the expectations of SF fans have risen, along with (a) Bonds' performance, (b) the quality of the teams, and (c) the contruction of a beautiful yard. Maybe my observations are unfair to any number of loyal SF fans, but that's how I felt for a long time.



Compared to Yankees fans are expectations are a bit lower. But to say we only care about being the Dodgers is a leap.

[sandlot]

Compared to Yankees fans are expectations are a bit lower. But to say we only care about being the Dodgers is a leap.
As I wrote, I think there's been an upgrade in expectations, and that's welcome. But I honestly felt that for a long time the intensity of the rivalry with LA actually hurt the Giants, because a winning season could be defined as something less than taking the pennant and Series. There might well be other sports rivalries where this is true. During many of the years that I lived in the Bay Area, there was an intensity about winning in Oakland (both A's and Raiders) that you just didn't feel as strongly with The Giants (for the 49ers, winning was very much an expectation). I think Barry has a lot to do with the raised expectations and that it's one of the reasons they've piled on money to keep him there.

[Mattingly]

No, let it stay Dodgers vs. Giants. Get the Angels out of this thread.

EDIT: The title should be Angels and Giants vs. Dodgers.
No, the thread title's fine. So long as it's reasonably related to this rivalry, that's fine. The Angels, like the A's, are also west coast, so if some Padres fans feeling like jumping on board, I'm fine with this.

Now if some Mets, Braves and Nats fans feel like having their own heavy discussion, I think that, like the Cubs-Cards thread, per a separate division, would be advisable.

Sometimes I believe that if a rivalry is somewhat fine-tuned w/o being too exclusive, it helps to focus the discussion matter a bit more.

[zaxxon]

I'm moving to LA in June, and thought great- Dodgers, NL, I'll get to see Mets games again! Then I checked the schedule and saw that the only Mets series is juuuuust before I get there. Balls.

At least I'll know half the team already, as they're Red Sox castoffs. Enjoy Grady Little, guys.

[ElCaminoSS]

I'm moving to LA in June, and thought great- Dodgers, NL, I'll get to see Mets games again! Then I checked the schedule and saw that the only Mets series is juuuuust before I get there. Balls.

At least I'll know half the team already, as they're Red Sox castoffs. Enjoy Grady Little, guys.
I hate going to Dodger games when they are playing the mets, the Mets fans go to one game all year and are often loud and obnoxious.

[west coast orange and black]

the absolute worst that i have ever seen at a giants game -- the red sox fans, hands down.

terrible. just terrible. raised by wolves. the whole lot, practically.

[Brannu]

the absolute worst that i have ever seen at a giants game -- the red sox fans, hands down.

terrible. just terrible. raised by wolves. the whole lot, practically.

I saw 'em when they played The Dodgers. Unbelievably obnoxious. Nomo won that game, I believe against Derek Lowe. It was nice to see them walking away with sad/angry faces, though. Gotta love interleague play.

[Gagne#3 8]

Giants fans can be very obnxoiuous themselves espically if the Dodgers are being blow out. That is usually the cause for the outfield bleachers getting very ugly

[Gagne#3 8]

As I wrote, I think there's been an upgrade in expectations, and that's welcome. But I honestly felt that for a long time the intensity of the rivalry with LA actually hurt the Giants, because a winning season could be defined as something less than taking the pennant and Series. There might well be other sports rivalries where this is true. During many of the years that I lived in the Bay Area, there was an intensity about winning in Oakland (both A's and Raiders) that you just didn't feel as strongly with The Giants (for the 49ers, winning was very much an expectation). I think Barry has a lot to do with the raised expectations and that it's one of the reasons they've piled on money to keep him there.


You have to understand that the Giant/Dodger rivarly is not baseball alone. Southern California and Northern California do not get along because of social and political differences. People in LA really could careless about it but San Francisco is different because they are like LA's little brother looking for respect.

[Dravecky43]

if some Padres fans feeling like jumping on board
You mean some of those exist? I've heard about them, but never actually seen one post. This is going to be an amazing moment!:D

[Mattingly]

You have to understand that the Giant/Dodger rivarly is not baseball alone. Southern California and Northern California do not get along because of social and political differences. People in LA really could careless about it but San Francisco is different because they are like LA's little brother looking for respect.
I think that this was brought to attention in the 2002 WS. The so-called "California WS". I remember that in 1989, the A's and Giants played the WS also, and that was also called the "California WS".

How did the rivalry and differences between Northern and Southern California affect how fans treated one another? I'm also not aware of the differences, though I've heard of them from non-baseball fans who lived in different parts of California.

Anyway, any brave soul care to update me, including how this affected when these teams have met?

Thx. :)

You mean some of those exist? I've heard about them, but never actually seen one post. This is going to be an amazing moment!:D
*BONK!*

*hides this upstart away from human beings* :D :p

[mojorisin71]

I think that this was brought to attention in the 2002 WS. The so-called "California WS". I remember that in 1989, the A's and Giants played the WS also, and that was also called the "California WS".

How did the rivalry and differences between Northern and Southern California affect how fans treated one another? I'm also not aware of the differences, though I've heard of them from non-baseball fans who lived in different parts of California.

Anyway, any brave soul care to update me, including how this affected when these teams have met?

Thx. :)

Southern California has to borrow almost everything, including drinking water, from the North, and the bulk of the state budget goes to SoCal. And it's not just the Bay Area residents that hate it (San Diegans also don't get along with Angelenos). I've always liked the Bay Area as a whole, but it's their sports teams I have a problem with :D :gt :evil

[west coast orange and black]

since when does southern california "borrow"? :grouchy
.........................

if the golden state were to ever be divided north and south, angelenos would head north, while very few northerns would head south. :lookitup

[mojorisin71]

since when does southern california "borrow"? :grouchy
.........................

if the golden state were to ever be divided north and south, angelenos would head north, while very few northerns would head south. :lookitup
You're right; "borrow" wasn't the word I was looking for...

I'd actually be one of those people that would head north. But I still wouldn't root for the local teams.

[Jake83]

since when does southern california "borrow"? :grouchy
.........................

if the golden state were to ever be divided north and south, angelenos would head north, while very few northerns would head south. :lookitup


We borrow. We give you guys the chance to come down and be in the sun for awhile.

Anything North of the grapevine I stay away from.

[west coast orange and black]

Gagne#3 8: People in LA really could careless about it but San Francisco is different because they are like LA's little brother looking for respect.

that would be painful if it were true. but it's not.

it is the san francisco bay area that is recognized as the mecca for creative, alternative thinking. it is the place in california where socially and politically, people can be more of who they are without others caring.

those are leadership qualities, not those of followers, and we pride ourselves and respect ourselves for such.

[west coast orange and black]

Jake83: We borrow.
can we have some of that water back when we want, then? :p

We give you guys the chance to come down and be in the sun for awhile
and we give you guys the opportunity to come up here and enjoy real baseball. ;)

[mojorisin71]

and we give you guys the opportunity to come up here and enjoy real baseball. ;)

You mean the Oakland A's? ;)

[Jake83]

Jake83: We borrow.
can we have some of that water back when we want, then? :p

We give you guys the chance to come down and be in the sun for awhile
and we give you guys the opportunity to come up here and enjoy real baseball. ;)


The Bay Area steals water from the interior portions of N. California and you guys are not that much well like either in Central California and Northeast California.

[Jake83]

You mean the Oakland A's? ;)


Too bad the people of the Bay do not see the A's. They have been one of the most successful teams this decade

[Gagne#3 8]

Gagne#3 8: People in LA really could careless about it but San Francisco is different because they are like LA's little brother looking for respect.

that would be painful if it were true. but it's not.

it is the san francisco bay area that is recognized as the mecca for creative, alternative thinking. it is the place in california where socially and politically, people can be more of who they are without others caring.

those are leadership qualities, not those of followers, and we pride ourselves and respect ourselves for such.


So the Beat LA chants when you are playing the Pirates doesn't mean anything.

[west coast orange and black]

mojo: You mean the Oakland A's?

good one, man.

[west coast orange and black]

Jake83: The Bay Area steals water from the interior portions of N. California

it, uh, flows down to us, dude.

[west coast orange and black]

Gagne#3 8: the Beat LA chants when you are playing the Pirates

firstly, i do not play the pirates.
secondly, what in sam hill are you talkin' 'bout?
thirdly, it's "38", i believe, not "3 8"... unless you are talkin' 'bout his mph right now.

[mojorisin71]

So the Beat LA chants when you are playing the Pirates doesn't mean anything.
I wouldn't be talking, as there are plenty of Dodger faithful who felt the need to chant "BALCO" when the Nationals came to town last year.

[west coast orange and black]

dodgers = red sox west = giants south

what kinda math is this, mojo? :mad: