Golf Channel, but no baseball channel?

[Williamsburg2599]

Anybody know why there is a golf channel on basic cable and a tennis channel on digital cable (atleast there is around here) but no Baseball Channel? Does anyone have a channel that is dedicated just to Baseball?

[bluezebra]

Anybody know why there is a golf channel on basic cable and a tennis channel on digital cable (atleast there is around here) but no Baseball Channel? Does anyone have a channel that is dedicated just to Baseball?

I have DirecTV, and subscribe to the MLB package. It's a minimal charge, considerating how many games are available. Cable doesn't have a contract to get that package.

Bob

[Williamsburg2599]

I have DirecTV, and subscribe to the MLB package. It's a minimal charge, considerating how many games are available. Cable doesn't have a contract to get that package.

Bob
I've heard of that, I was talking more of a one channel all about Baseball that,like the golf channel, also has instruction, history programs, documentries etc.., maybe even one that would finnaly cover the MLB Draft.

[RedSoxVT92]

I have Dish and I have not seen a channel dedicated soley to baseball only and nothing else. It would be a great idea and I would watch it all the time. It is bizare however that they have things like a golf channel, tennis channel, I even get the horse racing channel.

[Brian McKenna]

I believe the ML draft is done over the telephone.

[Williamsburg2599]

I believe the ML draft is done over the telephone.
It is, but a) It could most likely be changed to a format simular to the NFL, NHL and NBA's drafts(maybe not all 50 rounds). and B) they could cover it how it is now, with cameras with all the GMs as they draft is going on, or they could follow some of the top prospects as they go through their day.

[KHenry14]

More than once I've seen Selig interviewed where he's stated that a MLB channel similar to the NFL Network was about to happen. Why it hasn't happened yet is unknown. How hard could this be???

[efin98]

More than once I've seen Selig interviewed where he's stated that a MLB channel similar to the NFL Network was about to happen. Why it hasn't happened yet is unknown. How hard could this be???

It takes money, talent, money, personnel, money, committments from cable/satelite companies, money, and ALOT of work to get the right to broadcast old games and out of market games.

The NFL got it done quickly because they basically control everything about the league and own the historical archive(NFL Films) so the toughest part for them was getting a few talented personalities and pros and good deals with satelite companies.

[Erik Bedard]

Well, there's YES in NY, and NESN in New England, which are pretty much all-baseball channels... but they never do anything besides Red Sox and Yankees stuff.

[Williamsburg2599]

Well, there's YES in NY, and NESN in New England, which are pretty much all-baseball channels... but they never do anything besides Red Sox and Yankees stuff.
I have NESN and besides repeats of games and actual games its mostly hunting/fishing/infomercials and during Hockey season lots of hockey.

[Redondos]

It takes money, talent, money, personnel, money, committments from cable/satelite companies, money, and ALOT of work to get the right to broadcast old games and out of market games.

The NFL got it done quickly because they basically control everything about the league and own the historical archive(NFL Films) so the toughest part for them was getting a few talented personalities and pros and good deals with satelite companies.

Interesting you say this. There are a lot of people who gripe about the NFL Network showing too much of the NFL Films footage and not enough vintage telecast material shown by the networks (CBS, NBC, ABC, FOX).

In the case of MLB, I would suspect that the main roadblock for a 24 hour channel dedicated solely to baseball would be in proving to cable/satellite providers that there is, indeed, a market and a demand for such a network. I don't think "rights" to the footage itself is much, if any, of an obstacle. MLB has an archive of virtually every game (regular season, postseason, all star game) telecast since 1977. Prior to that, there are a handful of games (mostly World Series games, a few all-star and regular season games) that have been preserved and are now in the hands of either the networks or private collectors.

I don't think there would be shortage of material to be televised in a 24 hour baseball network. Besides the archived MLB games, I think there would be sufficient viewer interest in the early "This Week In Baseball" shows, Home Run Derby, and vintage Little League and College World Series telecasts. Not to mention the scores of baseball movies that have graced the big screen.

[efin98]

Interesting you say this. There are a lot of people who gripe about the NFL Network showing too much of the NFL Films footage and not enough vintage telecast material shown by the networks (CBS, NBC, ABC, FOX).

It's cheaper to throw up the NFL Films show about a certain game than the network-televised game, which is why the NFL Films shows are on there so bloody often.


In the case of MLB, I would suspect that the main roadblock for a 24 hour channel dedicated solely to baseball would be in proving to cable/satellite providers that there is, indeed, a market and a demand for such a network. I don't think "rights" to the footage itself is much, if any, of an obstacle. MLB has an archive of virtually every game (regular season, postseason, all star game) telecast since 1977. Prior to that, there are a handful of games (mostly World Series games, a few all-star and regular season games) that have been preserved and are now in the hands of either the networks or private collectors.

I believe it took Direct TV to pledge their support of the NFL Network to get it on the air, it will be the same way with MLB.

The big problem I think is that MLB may have the playoffs and games of the week on network they don't have the individual games themselves- they would need to go to each team and probably each station or network to get the rest of the games. That will take alot of time, money, and effort to get the rights to all of them and without them the network realy wouldn't have enough stuff to fill out 24 hours...


I don't think there would be shortage of material to be televised in a 24 hour baseball network. Besides the archived MLB games, I think there would be sufficient viewer interest in the early "This Week In Baseball" shows, Home Run Derby, and vintage Little League and College World Series telecasts. Not to mention the scores of baseball movies that have graced the big screen.

That is true. But without constantly repeating themselves over and over again you have only a limited number of GOOD games, episodes, and movies. Plus they also have to compete against themselves too- have to do some creative scheduling to ensure that there isn't competing programming against their own games...

[Redondos]

It's cheaper to throw up the NFL Films show about a certain game than the network-televised game

Why would it be significantly more expensive to replay an old telecast? The old games are already there on tape. It's just a matter of the NFL Network re-airing it, just as ESPN Classic does it for NCAA football and MLB. Doesn't exactly take rocket science to pull that idea off.


The big problem I think is that MLB may have the playoffs and games of the week on network they don't have the individual games themselves- they would need to go to each team and probably each station or network to get the rest of the games.

Read my previous post again. The MLB office has been collecting and archiving virtually ALL televised games (regular season, all-star, postseason) since 1977. Not just national telecasts, but even local and regional productions as well. The MLB office started collecting telecasts originally with the purpose of gathering enough material to produce the show, "This Week In Baseball." Over time, this collection of games grew into the enormous MLB Productions library, which (according to an inside contact of mine) is now in the process of being digitally converted, game by game.

That 1979 Phillies-Cubs game that you can download at mlb.com, the 23-22 slugfest at Wrigley. The video for that game came from mlb's storehouse, not WGN's.

Furthermore, MLB retains a license and rights to all games televised, national and local. C'mon, you've heard this rap 1000s of times before. Repeat after me. Any rebroadcast, reproduction or any other use of the pictures and accounts of this game without the express written consent of Major League Baseball is strictly prohibited. If it's a local broadcast, simply insert the name of the team right before MLB.



That is true. But without constantly repeating themselves over and over again you have only a limited number of GOOD games, episodes, and movies. Plus they also have to compete against themselves too- have to do some creative scheduling to ensure that there isn't competing programming against their own games...

You're kidding me? There must be literally HUNDREDS of baseball movies out there that can be screened. There are more movies about baseball than there are about any other sport. In almost every genre imaginable. (Comedy, drama, musical, historical, etc.) Not all of them are great. But for a network that is marketed specifically towards baseball fans, you don't have to exclusively stick to all-time classics like "The Natural," "Field Of Dreams," or "Damn Yankees." You could show average baseball films, even fluff.

Not enough games? There's been well over 2000+ games each season over the last 30 years, And you still don't think that's enough?

And over the years, there's been tons of interesting baseball related documentaries and interviews that have been produced.

No, it doesn't take me even a millisecond to disagree with you about the shortage of broadcasting material for a 24 hour baseball channel. In fact, the more I think about it, the more I am sure that such a network is long overdue. Selig should take his cue from the NFL, NBA, and the PGA. Let's get a baseball network started!

[brewcrew82]

No, it doesn't take me even a millisecond to disagree with you about the shortage of broadcasting material for a 24 hour baseball channel. In fact, the more I think about it, the more I am sure that such a network is long overdue. Selig should take his cue from the NFL, NBA, and the PGA. Let's get a baseball network started!

I'm sure they could schedule important MiLB games (league champioship series) and possibly get permission to broadcast certain international games (Japan, Mexico, Caribbean etc). Even without the previous mentioned games there is plenty of MLB (both old and new) coverage (or baseball programming) to satisfy subscribers year round.

[efin98]

Why would it be significantly more expensive to replay an old telecast? The old games are already there on tape. It's just a matter of the NFL Network re-airing it, just as ESPN Classic does it for NCAA football and MLB. Doesn't exactly take rocket science to pull that idea off.

All that reairing costs MONEY. Lots of MONEY.

They have to PAY for the RIGHTS to REAIR the CBS/NBC/ABC/ESPN games AND the INDIVIDUAL broadcast outlets for the OFF NETWORK games. The NFL doesn't have to pay that as they ALREADY have the rights to REBROADCAST thanks to the games being taped by NFL Films(their wholely owned company).


Read my previous post again. The MLB office has been collecting and archiving virtually ALL televised games (regular season, all-star, postseason) since 1977. Not just national telecasts, but even local and regional productions as well. The MLB office started collecting telecasts originally with the purpose of gathering enough material to produce the show, "This Week In Baseball." Over time, this collection of games grew into the enormous MLB Productions library, which (according to an inside contact of mine) is now in the process of being digitally converted, game by game.

That 1979 Phillies-Cubs game that you can download at mlb.com, the 23-22 slugfest at Wrigley. The video for that game came from mlb's storehouse, not WGN's.

Online or hightlights is one thing, but actually airing the games to be rebroadcast over the air is another and on a competing network as well is another thing entirely. I highly doubt the deal allows MLB to directly use the games for a competing network without additional costs paid to the individual networks for the rights.


Furthermore, MLB retains a license and rights to all games televised, national and local. C'mon, you've heard this rap 1000s of times before. Repeat after me. Any rebroadcast, reproduction or any other use of the pictures and accounts of this game without the express written consent of Major League Baseball is strictly prohibited. If it's a local broadcast, simply insert the name of the team right before MLB.

I think there are two seperate things going on there: copyright infringment and broadcast rights.

You have to pay to liscense the use of MLB related logos and whatever other things MLB liscenses, in addition you have to pay for the rights to REBROADCAST the game.



You're kidding me? There must be literally HUNDREDS of baseball movies out there that can be screened. There are more movies about baseball than there are about any other sport. In almost every genre imaginable. (Comedy, drama, musical, historical, etc.) Not all of them are great. But for a network that is marketed specifically towards baseball fans, you don't have to exclusively stick to all-time classics like "The Natural," "Field Of Dreams," or "Damn Yankees." You could show average baseball films, even fluff.

You can still only show so much before people get tired of it and if you keep showing garbage movies people aren't going to tune into the network...Even ESPN Classic doesn't show every movie out there, they show them sparingly to keep people interested.


Not enough games? There's been well over 2000+ games each season over the last 30 years, And you still don't think that's enough?

2000+ but how many of them will draw in people outside of the hard core folks? How many of them had historically significant or even team-related significant moments? There are quite a few but you have to keep mixing it up, eventually you are going to run out of programs and repeat over and over again.


And over the years, there's been tons of interesting baseball related documentaries and interviews that have been produced.

Again this comes back to the rights issue- can MLB get the rights to rebroadcast those documentaries? Will the other networks like HBO or ESPN allow their rebroadcasts especially when the ESPN ones would go directly against their own network???


No, it doesn't take me even a millisecond to disagree with you about the shortage of broadcasting material for a 24 hour baseball channel. In fact, the more I think about it, the more I am sure that such a network is long overdue. Selig should take his cue from the NFL, NBA, and the PGA. Let's get a baseball network started!

At least you bring up good points to my counterpoints but we both agree on this one issue- it's long overdue.

Frankly when the NBA channel succeeded someone at MLB should have gotten their lawyers and accountants together to scrounge up the money to get the ball rolling!!!!

[efin98]

I'm sure they could schedule important MiLB games (league champioship series) and possibly get permission to broadcast certain international games (Japan, Mexico, Caribbean etc). Even without the previous mentioned games there is plenty of MLB (both old and new) coverage (or baseball programming) to satisfy subscribers year round.

Winter with the Caribbean Series, mornings with the Japan Leagues, they could even snag the All Star Games from ESPN or just broadcast their skills competitions...those programs could work if they schedule it right

[Redondos]

All that reairing costs MONEY. Lots of MONEY.

They have to PAY for the RIGHTS to REAIR the CBS/NBC/ABC/ESPN games AND the INDIVIDUAL broadcast outlets for the OFF NETWORK games.

You seem obsessed with the idea that the MLB has to pay the networks for use of the old footage.

Let me make this clear, once and for all since my last post apparently didn't make it clear to you. Major League Baseball OWNS the rights to all of their games once they have been aired and transmitted. Period. The TV networks don't own the rights in perpetuity. Neither do any local stations. MLB doesn't need to seek their permission to use old game footage, no matter who produced them originally. There, is that clear enough for you?

Now,.... you're probably wondering if what I am saying is true? Here's a couple of articles that substantiates what I have been saying. Look under the heading of "express written consent."

http://www.collegiateimages.com/newsletter/oct05.htm

Note that the fan sought written consent from MLB. He did not seek consent from ABC network, which originally televised that particular ALDS game from 1995. He didn't have to. Even if he did, he would have been referred straight back to MLB anyway. That is because ABC no longer has the rights to that game and can't legally grant permission for anyone to use that footage, even if their company did produce the original telecast.

In addition, here is another authoritative statement from the official FAQ of MLB Productions webpage.

May I use Major League Baseball footage I already have?
You must contact the Footage Licensing department of Major League Baseball Properties before using footage for any reason. All Major League Baseball footage is owned by Major League Baseball and cannot be used without a written license from Major League Baseball Properties. The Footage Licensing department can be reached by calling 212-931-7777 or by email at mlbfootage@mlb.com.

Does Major League Baseball Productions produce games for television or radio?
No. Major League Baseball Productions does not produce games for television or radio, but does control all the copyrights to game broadcasts.

There. No mention of having to seek permission, consent, and approval from any TV network or station. MLB owns the rights. ONLY MLB Properties can issue a license.

And still more. Go to your nearest video store and look at the back of the box of one of those A&E baseball DVD sets that present the entire World Series. Any of 'em. 2004, 1986, 1979, 1975. All of these DVDs present the TV network telecasts as they were initially aired, sans commercials. They will all say the same thing.

Copyright Major League Baseball Properties, Inc. Licensed for distribution by Major Leagues Baseball Properties to A&E Television Networks. Major League Baseball trademarks and copyrights are proprietary to Major League Baseball entities. All Rights Reserved.

Once again, absolutely no mention of NBC, ABC, or FOX having any rights or license to this material. Once they were transmitted, that was it. MLB then retained exclusive rights to the games. They gave authorization to A&E to produce DVDs of these games, not the broadcasting networks.

If all this doesn't clear up the issue to you, then nothing will.


Online or hightlights is one thing, but actually airing the games to be rebroadcast over the air is another and on a competing network as well is another thing entirely. I highly doubt the deal allows MLB to directly use the games for a competing network without additional costs paid to the individual networks for the rights.

Uhhh, *personal* doubts and hunches do not amount to substantiated claims. Find me references that would show MLB airing "old" game footage as being a direct violation of the current TV contract that baseball has with FOX or ESPN network, or with any TV station serving as a team's flagship broadcaster.

Don't know why you think otherwise, even for a moment. Classic Sports Network routinely televised old baseball games, even when live games were scheduled.


2000+ but how many of them will draw in people outside of the hard core folks?

A 24 hour network devoted to baseball is supposed to cater to rabid fans of the sport. By nature, any channel that is devoted exclusively to a single genre (football, golf, game show, soap opera, etc.) is designed to appeal to its niche audience. Obviously, a 24 hour baseball channel isn't designed to capture the attention of a large cross-section of the TV viewing public that only has a casual or passing interest in the sport.

Or did you actually think baseball channel programming would post ratings that are going to challenge the likes of American Idol or Lost. :noidea

[TheJourneyman]

I have DirecTV, and subscribe to the MLB package. It's a minimal charge, considerating how many games are available. Cable doesn't have a contract to get that package.

Bob

You can get that via cable, if you are talking the MLB Extra Innings. The only one that is exclusive to Direct TV is football.

[Padday]

This seems to be the same kind of situation as in Ireland with videogames. NFL games are released in Ireland and also do pretty well and have been consistantly been released here for a number of years now but yet not a single baseball game (except mario baseball). These sports have at least equal popularity here. Same with Ice hockey they bring out hockey games here but there isn't even a single ice skating arena in the republic(there are a few in Northern Ireland).

[KHenry14]

The other source of programming that is untapped is broadcasting minor league games, live and otherwise. Rights for that would be low and you could fill a lot of hours with those games. That in combination with classic games, TWIB, Baseball Bunch, movies and innumerable talk shows etc would easily fill the programming.

I guess I am just really curious as to why this hasn't happened yet...

[efin98]

You seem obsessed with the idea that the MLB has to pay the networks for use of the old footage.
(snip)
If all this doesn't clear up the issue to you, then nothing will.

I believe you now that you backed it up. Crystal clear bulletproof evidence.



Obviously, a 24 hour baseball channel isn't designed to capture the attention of a large cross-section of the TV viewing public that only has a casual or passing interest in the sport.

Unless it captures the passing interest it will be a failure. You can't just keep on reairring things over and over again- the network actually has to go out there and create programs that are worth watching by casual folks. Make the programs "fun" and "exciting" while also keep true to the sport.

If done right it could be a success, but it has to go beyond just showing old movies and games.


Or did you actually think baseball channel programming would post ratings that are going to challenge the likes of American Idol or Lost. :noidea

Only a fool would believe that.

[efin98]

The other source of programming that is untapped is broadcasting minor league games, live and otherwise. Rights for that would be low and you could fill a lot of hours with those games. That in combination with classic games, TWIB, Baseball Bunch, movies and innumerable talk shows etc would easily fill the programming.

I guess I am just really curious as to why this hasn't happened yet...

I believe only the all star games are even televised nationally, so those could be good draws. The September post season and the fall/winter leagues could also be tapped into as well to drum up more programming...

[J.P]

I've always wondered the same thing, the NFL has its own channel, so does the NBA, and Golf and Tennis have one too....but no MLB channel......its a pity :(

[maximum jack]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that many "specialty" networks are not exactly 24/7. I can't speak for the the main ones mentioned on this thread because I don't watch any of them, but I'm a Cycling fan so I watch a lot of OLN. Many times when I get up for those early morning mountain stages, there are infomercials on which help defray the costs of running the network (I assume). I'm pretty sure Redondos is right about there already being an audience for the network. I mean even if MLB is not at the level of popularity of the NFL, NBA or PGA, I would have to believe that it is still more popular than than the ATP. And this website is a testament to how knowlegeable and rabid some MLB fans are. Does any other sport hold it's history in such high regard? I doubt it.

[KHenry14]

I don't know about anyone else, but if MLB has vintage games in the can, there are literally hundreds of games from bygone days that i'd like to see again. And I bet I'm not alone in that. Anything from Bob Horner's 4 hr game, to all the no-hitters thrown in the past 40 years, all the AS Games, WS games etc., so there is programming out there. Add in numerous talk shows, dare I say, game shows, and IMO it would be fairly simple to run the network 24/7. And I can't beleive that they'd have a problem getting access to the various cable systems.

And ultimately down the line, it would make a lot of sense to have good ol' live MLB games on the network, just like the NFL Network is doing this year for the first time.

I say it again, I see no good reason why this hasn't been done yet

[W_Marone]

I'd like to watch games of Ruth and Gehrig, those legends of the game. I believe they had cameras back then.

[bhss89]

The key is for all of us to submit letters (email) to MLB to encourage them to creat a baseball channel. College games, international games, minor leagues, archived MLB games, special baseball history programs, winter league games; the possibilities are endless. It would be AWESOME.
Send an email today guys and let's see if they'll listen.

[maximum jack]

The key is for all of us to submit letters (email) to MLB to encourage them to creat a baseball channel.

Great idea, I found a list of the the executives, but no email addresses:

• Allan H. (Bud) Selig Commissioner of Baseball
• Bob DuPuy President & Chief Operating Officer
• Jimmie Lee Solomon Executive Vice President, Baseball Operations
• Tim Brosnan Executive Vice President, Business
• Rob Manfred Executive Vice President, Labor Relations & Human Resources
• Jonathan Mariner Executive Vice President, Finance
• John McHale Jr. Executive Vice President, Administration

[Williamsburg2599]

I suppose I get to be CEO because I have came up with the idea, right?:D

[Redondos]

I suppose I get to be CEO because I have came up with the idea, right?:D

Sure, as long as I get to host a MST3K type of show that lampoons baseball movies. I've always wanted to make fun of "classics" like Field Of Dreamsl or The Bad News Bears.:p