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Thread: Freakish stats

  1. #21

    Coincidence

    Quote Originally Posted by ipitch View Post
    Sure he was great, but Musial's "feat" is just a coincidence, since he batted .336 at home and .326 on the road.
    That's true. But many unusual stats or records are the result of coincidences, or at least of chance. You've apparently looked it up, and I haven't. But I'm guessing that over his 20+-year career, the difference between the number of hits he would have gotten at home and the number on the road, if he had the same number of at-bats both at home and on the road, would have been less than 100, in some - what? - 10,000 or so at-bats? Roughly the real difference between .336 and .326 [there's only a 1% difference, after all]. Pretty remarkable consistency, the mother of coincidence.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by savior View Post
    That's true. But many unusual stats or records are the result of coincidences, or at least of chance. You've apparently looked it up, and I haven't. But I'm guessing that over his 20+-year career, the difference between the number of hits he would have gotten at home and the number on the road, if he had the same number of at-bats both at home and on the road, would have been less than 100, in some - what? - 10,000 or so at-bats? Roughly the real difference between .336 and .326 [there's only a 1% difference, after all]. Pretty remarkable consistency, the mother of coincidence.
    I checked home/road splits from Musial's era, and the reason I say he was wasn't amazingly consistent is because the league difference between home and road batting averages was approximately .010 (give or take a few points), and his difference was .010. So, his consistency was very ordinary. Like I said before, there are numerous players who were much more consistent when it comes to H/R BAs. Strong words like "amazing" and "remarkable" should be saved for those players, if they should be used at all.
    Last edited by ipitch; 11-07-2010 at 06:55 PM.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ipitch View Post
    Sustained greatness? Obviously.
    (I said that in my last post).

    Amazingly consistent? - Not at all.

    If you're impressed by Musial's 10 point difference, then you must worship Luis Gonzalez, right? He batted .283 at home and on the road. OMG!!!! I'm sure many other players have done the same.
    I'm impressed by .336 at home and .326 on the road over 20+ years. I'm not as impressed by .283.
    What's the rumpus?

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ol' aches and pains View Post
    I'm impressed by .336 at home and .326 on the road over 20+ years. I'm not as impressed by .283.
    You seem to be confusing consistency with greatness. Even if someone batted .201 at home and .199 on the road, their consistency would still be better than Musial's.

  5. #25
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    I don't feel confused. A 1% variance between home/road BA's is consistent enough for me, especially over that long of a career. If you prefer Luis Gonzalez's superior consistency, fine. I'm not confusing greatness and consisterncy, I'm looking at the combination of the two that is evident in Stan Musial's career.
    What's the rumpus?

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ol' aches and pains View Post
    If you prefer Luis Gonzalez's superior consistency, fine.
    Um, it's a fact that he was more consistent! It's not even debatable.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by ipitch View Post
    Um, it's a fact that he was more consistent! It's not even debatable.
    I wasn't debating it.
    What's the rumpus?

  8. #28

    Remarkable AND amazing

    Quote Originally Posted by ipitch View Post
    I checked home/road splits from Musial's era, and the reason I say he was wasn't amazingly consistent is because the league difference between home and road batting averages was approximately .010 (give or take a few points), and his difference was .010. So, his consistency was very ordinary. Like I said before, there are numerous players who were much more consistent when it comes to H/R BAs. Strong words like "amazing" and "remarkable" should be saved for those players, if they should be used at all.
    Well, I'll use the words I choose to use to express my opinion, not yours - and that's all your posts amount to, your opinion. I think your position is silly. So what if the league difference between home and road BA is .01 [we can dispense with the extra zero, can't we?]. Musial did it at a 32-33% level, not .283 or whatever. Instead of just SAYING so, how about citing twenty players who have or had been as consistent at such a high level of BA for as long a period of time, showing their BA's home and away and their home/road differential.

    By the way, WHEN was the league differential .01 ["approximately"]? And which "points" are you giving and which are you taking?

  9. #29
    Jeez-----!

    What most of us on htis thread are talking about is consistent greatness.

    Who gives a holy chaw about a player who is consistently BAD???

    ---Or about consistent nitpicking?

  10. #30
    What's a fact is that you have just got to have your own way, no matter how twisted, and are completely intolerant of those who see the forest as WELL as the trees.

    Debate it all you want. It won't change the truth of it.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by savior View Post
    Well, I'll use the words I choose to use to express my opinion, not yours - and that's all your posts amount to, your opinion. I think your position is silly. So what if the league difference between home and road BA is .01 [we can dispense with the extra zero, can't we?]. Musial did it at a 32-33% level, not .283 or whatever. Instead of just SAYING so, how about citing twenty players who have or had been as consistent at such a high level of BA for as long a period of time, showing their BA's home and away and their home/road differential.
    Um, I never said there were 20 players who did it at such a high level! I'm only arguing that he wasn't amazingly consistent. He was merely par for the course (CONSISTENCY-WISE ONLY).

    What I did do is pick 5 pretty good players, at random, and checked their splits. Two of them had identical home and road averages for their career (Luis Gonzalez and Garret Anderson). I'm not about to spend an hour looking for 18 more of them, but I'm sure they're out there.

    Quote Originally Posted by savior View Post
    By the way, WHEN was the league differential .01 ["approximately"]? And which "points" are you giving and which are you taking?
    In Musial's era, like I said. See here for some examples...
    http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...=MLB&year=1943
    http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...=MLB&year=1946
    http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...=MLB&year=1949
    http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...=MLB&year=1952
    http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...=MLB&year=1955
    http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...=MLB&year=1958

    Eyeballing the stats, it looks like the difference between home and road averages was about .010. I'm not about waste an hour calculating it exactly. There's no point in doing that. It makes little difference if it's .005, .010, or .015.

    To sum up: Musial was a great, great hitter. Consistency-wise, he was par for the course. But, not having the same home and road batting averages is certainly no big deal at all. It doesn't even drop him down one bit in my book.
    Last edited by ipitch; 11-08-2010 at 07:11 PM.

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