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Thread: BBF VC Progressive HoF Contributors Election: 2011

  1. #1
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    BBF VC Progressive HoF Contributors Election: 2011

    Below is our master ballot of contributors. Please feel free to suggest new candidates to consider as I'm only caretaker of this end of the project and could have easily overlooked someone:

    Code:
    Contributors Ballot:
    
    Felipe Alou
    Cap Anson
    Emmett Ashford
    Buzzie Bavasi
    Sy Berger
    Jack Brickhouse
    Jack Buck
    Harry Caray
    O.P. Caylor
    Frank Chance
    Happy Chandler
    Nestor Chylak
    Fred Clarke
    Bobby Cox
    Candy Cummings
    Bob Davids
    Jacques Doucet
    Barney Dreyfuss
    Billy Evans
    John B. Foster
    Bud Fowler
    Curt Flood
    Jim Fregosi
    Ford Frick
    Cito Gaston
    Pat Gillick
    Curt Gowdy
    Gus Greenlee
    Clark Griffith
    Howie Haak
    Bucky Harris
    Doug Harvey
    Ernie Harwell
    Roland Hemond
    Whitey Herzog
    Gil Hodges
    Ralph Houk
    Cal Hubbard
    Fred Hutchinson
    Bill James
    Frank Jobe
    Davey Johnson
    Ewing Kauffman
    Tony La Russa
    Hal Lanier
    Ring Lardner
    Al Lopez
    Effa Manley
    Billy Martin
    Gene Mauch
    Lee MacPhail
    Tommy McCarthy
    Tim McCarver
    Bill McKechnie
    Shigeru Mizuhara
    Tim Murnane
    Danny Murtagh
    Jim Mutrie
    Shigeo Nagashima
    David Neft
    Frank Osborn
    Pete Palmer
    Lou Piniella
    Harry Clay Pulliam
    Jerry Reinsdorf
    Henry Grantland Rice
    Larry Ritter
    Jackie Robinson
    Wilbert Robinson
    Jacob Ruppert
    Red Schoendienst
    Bud Selig
    Bob Sheppard
    Red Smith
    Alfred H. Spink
    George Steinbrenner
    Horace Stoneham
    C.I. Taylor
    Joe Torre
    Kazuto Tsuruoaka
    Bob Uecker
    Chris Von der Ahe
    Bob Watson
    Charles Weeghman
    Lee Weyer
    Sol White
    Phillip Wrigley
    Tom Yawkey
    Dick Young
    
    *I tried to provide links for these contributors so 
    participants could get a better sense of who they were.  
    Some links just have a mention of the person and some 
    clue as to their contribution.  If someone knows of a more 
    informative link for any of these players, please speak up 
    and I will edit this list to add that information.

    The following participants ballots will be counted though anyone is free to post a ballot, nominate a player or add to the discussion whether or not they are a member of the committee:

    BigRon
    Jalbright
    Fielding Marshall
    Ace Venom
    dgarza
    Paul Wendt
    jjpm74
    cowtipper
    PVNick
    SavoyBG
    Brad Harris
    Domenic


    Since there are no voting limit restrictions for the Players VC, you can vote for as many contributors as you wish. If a blank ballot is cast here, there should be a justification for it.

    Voting will commence immediately and conclude when the regular 2011 election concludes which is Sunday, January 16 at 4:00 PM EST. Any contributor appearing on a minimum of 9 ballots (or 75% of the ballots submitted if all 12 members do not vote) is elected. No tallying will be done until time has expired and I ask that participants please refrain from posting comments about who the front runners are. Participants are encouraged to post ballots early and may edit as many times as they wish up to the voting deadline. They do not need to contact me if they make a change.

    Newly Eligible
    Jim Fregosi
    Cito Gaston
    Bill James
    Davey Johnson
    Hal Lanier
    Tony La Russa
    Lou Piniella
    Bob Watson

    HALL OF FAME CONTRIBUTORS

    Members of the Progressive HOF elected as Contributors:

    1925: Doc Adams, Alex Cartwright, Henry Chadwick, Harry Wright, William Hulbert, Charlie Comiskey, Jim Creighton
    1930: Rube Foster, Connie Mack, AG Spalding
    1936: Ned Hanlon, Ban Johnson, John McGraw, Frank Selee
    1941: Miller Huggins, Bill Klem, Francis Richter Ed Barrow
    1946: Al Reach, Branch Rickey
    1951: Kenesaw Landis, Joe McCarthy
    1956: Tom Connolly
    1961:
    1966: Ed Bolden, J. G. Taylor Spink, Casey Stengel
    1971: Charles Conlon, Billy Southworth, George Weiss
    1976: Red Barber, Larry MacPhail, J. L Wilkinson
    1981: Mel Allen, Jocko Conlan, Lefty O'Doul, Cumberland Posey, Bill Veeck
    1986: John Ward
    1991: Al Barlick, Leo Durocher, Walter O'Malley
    1996: Jack Dunn, Bob Ferguson, Tetsuharu Kawakami, Marvin Miller, Matsutaro Shoriki
    2001: Walt Alston, Sparky Anderson, Vin Scully, Earl Weaver
    2006: Tommy Lasorda, Buck O'Neill, Dick Williams

    Previous VC Contributors Threads:

    1920
    1925
    1930
    1936
    1941
    1946
    1951
    1956
    1961
    1966
    1971
    1976
    1981
    1986
    1991
    1996
    2001
    2006

    Note: Additional contributors and pioneers can be added if a participant or outsider suggests them to the master ballot. The person suggesting a contributor does not need to be a participant in the project but does need to give a brief explanation at to who the contributor is and why (s)he is worthy of discussion. Any person who is who has contributed to the game of baseball is eligible. The contributor's ballot is not limited to contributions to MLB.
    Last edited by Ace Venom; 01-09-2011 at 03:40 PM.
    RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

  2. #2
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  3. #3
    Ballot:

    Buzzy Bavasi
    Harry Caray
    O.P. Caylor
    Happy Chandler
    Bobby Cox
    Candy Cummings
    Bob Davids
    Ford Frick
    Clark Griffith
    Bucky Harris
    Doug Harvey
    Whitey Herzog
    Gil Hodges
    Cal Hubbard
    Bill James
    Dave Johnson
    Tony La Russa
    Tommy Lasorda
    Al Lopez
    Billy Martin
    Lee MacPhail
    Bill McKechnie
    Shigeru Mizuhara
    Tim Murnane
    Shigeo Nagashima
    Buck O'Neill
    Lou Pinella
    Red Schoendienst
    Bob Sheppard
    George Steinbrenner
    C.I. Taylor
    Joe Torre
    Kazuto Tsuruoaka
    Bob Uecker
    Phillip Wrigley

    Johnson, James, La Russa, Pinella all join my ballot this year.

    I'll also listen to any cases for any contributor not on my ballot.
    Last edited by jjpm74; 01-16-2011 at 07:23 AM. Reason: Added Bob Davids

  4. #4
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    Jack Brickhouse
    Harry Caray
    Happy Chanlder
    Bobby Cox
    Bob Davids
    Jacques Doucet
    Bud Fowler
    Curt Flood
    Ford Frick
    Pat Gillick
    Clark Griffith
    Ernie Harwell
    Doug Harvey
    Whitey Herzog
    Bill James
    Frank Jobe
    Tony La Russa
    Shigeru Mizuhara
    Tim Murnane
    Pete Palmer
    Harry Clay Pulliam
    Jerry Reinsdorf
    Henry Grantland Rice
    Jacob Ruppert
    Bud Selig
    Red Smith
    C. I. Taylor
    Joe Torre
    Kazuto Tsuroaka
    Bob Uecker
    Sol White
    Philip Wrigley
    Last edited by Ace Venom; 01-16-2011 at 12:57 PM.
    RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

  5. #5
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    Cox
    Davids
    Gillick
    Harris
    Herzog
    James
    LaRussa
    Martin
    McKechnie
    Mizuhara
    Tsuruoka
    Last edited by jalbright; 01-15-2011 at 09:53 PM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  6. #6
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    Buzzie Bavasi
    Bob Davids
    Pat Gillick
    Doug Harvey
    Whitey Herzog
    Bill James
    Frank Jobe
    Tony La Russa
    Billy Martin
    Bill McKechnie
    Shigeru Mizuhara
    Alfred H. Spink
    George Steinbrenner
    C.I. Taylor
    Kazuto Tsuruoaka
    Sol White
    Philip Wrigley
    Last edited by Domenic; 01-10-2011 at 06:30 AM.

  7. #7
    Jack Buck
    Harry Caray
    Nestor Chylak
    Fred Clarke
    Barney Dreyfuss
    Curt Flood
    Clark Griffith
    Doug Harvey - He waited way too long in real life, let's not make him wait longer here. SABR rates him as the 2nd greatest umpire after Klem.
    Ernie Harwell
    Bill James
    Ring Lardner
    Tommy McCarthy
    Wilbert Robinson
    Red Smith
    George Steinbrenner
    Philip Wrigley

  8. #8
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    7,258
    Blog Entries
    4
    Emmett Ashford
    Jack Brickhouse
    Jack Buck
    O.P. Caylor
    Nestor Chylak
    Bobby Cox
    Candy Cummings
    Barney Dreyfuss
    Billy Evans
    John B. Foster
    Bud Fowler
    Curt Flood
    Clark Griffith
    Doug Harvey
    Ernie Harwell
    Gil Hodges
    Cal Hubbard
    Fred Hutchinson
    Frank Jobe
    Al Lopez
    Effa Manley
    Tommy McCarthy
    Bill McKechnie
    Shigeru Mizuhara
    Tim Murnane
    Jim Mutrie
    Shigeo Nagashima
    Jackie Robinson
    Jacob Ruppert
    Red Smith
    Alfred H. Spink
    C.I. Taylor
    Kazuto Tsuruoaka
    Chris Von der Ahe

  9. #9
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    I edited my ballot to include Harvey and Wrigley - oversights on my part. I thought both had been selected, for some reason.

  10. #10
    Just keeping this on the page.

  11. #11
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    I'm giving this a bump. I'm going to send out some PM reminders soon.
    RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

  12. #12
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    Posts
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    Frank Bancroft
    Buzzie Bavasi
    Sy Berger
    O.P. Caylor
    Frank Chance
    Happy Chandler
    Fred Clarke
    Bobby Cox
    Harry Dalton
    Bob Davids
    Barney Dreyfuss
    Jack Dunn
    Al Munro Elias
    John B. Foster
    Pat Gillick
    Gus Greenlee
    Clark Griffith
    Bucky Harris
    Whitey Herzog
    Ralph Houk
    Bill James
    Frank Jobe
    Davey Johnson
    Tony La Russa
    Ring Lardner
    Al Lopez
    Effa Manley
    Billy Martin
    Bill McKechnie
    Shigeru Mizuhara
    Tim Murnane
    Danny Murtagh
    David Neft
    Pete Palmer
    Lou Piniella
    Grantland Rice
    Jacob Ruppert
    Ben Shibe
    Alfred H. Spink
    George Steinbrenner
    C.I. Taylor
    Joe Torre
    Kazuto Tsuruoaka
    Ty Tyson
    Sol White
    "It is a simple matter to erect a Hall of Fame, but difficult to select the tenants." -- Ken Smith, Spink Award winner

  13. #13
    Sy Berger
    O. P. Caylor
    Happy Chandler
    Nestor Chylak
    Candy Cummings
    Bob Davids
    Barney Dreyfuss
    Billy Evans
    Ford Frick
    Cito Gaston
    Howie Haak
    Doug Harvey
    Roland Hemond
    Tommy McCarthy
    Tim Murnane
    Frank Osborn
    Harry Clay Pulliam
    Henry Grantland Rice
    Jacob Ruppert
    Alfred H. Spink
    George Steinbrenner
    Bob Uecker
    Bob Watson
    Charles Weeghman
    Sol White

  14. #14
    Felipe Alou
    Cap Anson
    Buzzie Bavasi
    Sy Berger
    Jack Brickhouse
    Jack Buck
    Harry Caray
    O.P. Caylor
    Frank Chance
    Happy Chandler
    Nestor Chylak
    Fred Clarke
    Bobby Cox
    Candy Cummings
    Bob Davids
    Jacques Doucet
    Barney Dreyfuss
    Billy Evans
    Bud Fowler
    Ford Frick
    Pat Gillick
    Curt Gowdy
    Clark Griffith
    Howie Haak
    Halsey Hall (nomination)
    Doug Harvey
    Ernie Harwell
    Roland Hemond
    Whitey Herzog
    Ralph Houk
    Cal Hubbard
    Fred Hutchinson
    Bill James
    Frank Jobe
    Davey Johnson
    Tony LaRussa
    Al Lopez
    Lee MacPhail
    Billy Martin
    Gene Mauch
    Tommy McCarthy
    Bill McKechnie
    Shigeru Mizuhara
    Danny Murtaugh
    Jim Mutrie
    Shigeo Nagashima
    David Neft
    Frank Osborn
    Pete Palmer
    Lou Piniella
    Jerry Reinsdorf
    Henry Grantland Rice
    Lawrence Ritter
    Jackie Robinson
    Wilbert Robinson
    Jacob Ruppert
    Bob Sheppard
    Bud Selig
    Alfred H. Spink
    Horace Stoneham
    C.I. Taylor
    Joe Torre
    Kazuto Tsuruoka
    Bob Uecker
    Chris Von der Ahe
    Lee Weyer
    Sol White
    Phillip Wrigley
    Tom Yawkey
    Dick Young
    RIP Dave Niehaus
    RIP Gary Moore

  15. #15
    Brad, we've already inducted Jack Dunn.

    I realize it's late in the project, but...

    I can't help but feel that we need to devote more attention and discussion to this end of the project. Several candidates I would consider obvious, considering our standards--Bob Davids (the founder of SABR), Bobby Cox, Whitey Herzog (how can we have Dick Williams but not Herzog?), Doug Harvey (if we're going to have umpires, he should be one of the top choices)--are somehow struggling to get in. I don't think it's that the majority of voters think Bobby Cox shouldn't be in, but rather that they may not even realize that he's eligible.

    Just my 2 cents.
    RIP Dave Niehaus
    RIP Gary Moore

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fielding Marshall View Post
    I can't help but feel that we need to devote more attention and discussion to this end of the project. Several candidates I would consider obvious, considering our standards--Bob Davids (the founder of SABR), Bobby Cox, Whitey Herzog (how can we have Dick Williams but not Herzog?), Doug Harvey (if we're going to have umpires, he should be one of the top choices)--are somehow struggling to get in. I don't think it's that the majority of voters think Bobby Cox shouldn't be in, but rather that they may not even realize that he's eligible.

    Just my 2 cents.
    I'll run another contributors election, though it will likely be concurrent with the 2015 (or 2013?) cycle. I've noticed a few omissions as far as significant contributors go. I'll need to take some time compiling a new list and I would like some recommendations from other participants in the project.
    RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

  17. #17
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    This election is closed. Here are the final results of the election.

    Code:
    2011 Final Results (9 Votes Cast, 7 Required for Election)
    t1) Bob Davids: 7 Votes (77.78%) - Elected
    t1) Doug Harvey: 7 Votes (77.78%) - Elected
    t1) Bill James: 7 Votes (77.78%) - Elected
    t1) Shigeru Mizuhara: 7 Votes (77.78%) - Elected
    t1) Kazuto Tsuroaka: 7 Votes (77.78%) - Elected
    t6) Bobby Cox: 6 Votes
    t6) Clark Griffith: 6 Votes
    t6) Whitey Herzog: 6 votes
    t6) Tony La Russa: 6 votes
    t6) Bill McKechnie: 6 Votes
    t6) C.I. Taylor: 6 Votes
    t12) O.P. Caylor: 5 Votes
    t12) Happy Chandler: 5 Votes
    t12) Barney Dreyfuss: 5 Votes
    t12) Pat Gillick: 5 Votes
    t12) Frank Jobe: 5 Votes
    t12) Billy Martin: 5 Votes
    t12) Tim Murnane: 5 Votes
    t12) Jacob Ruppert: 5 Votes
    t12) Alfred H. Spink: 5 Votes
    t12) George Steinbrenner: 5 votes
    t12) Sol White: 5 Votes
    t12) Philip Wrigley: 5 Votes
    t24) Buzzie Bavasi: 4 Votes
    t24) Harry Caray: 4 votes
    t24) Nestor Chylak: 4 Votes
    t24) Candy Cummings: 4 Votes
    t24) Ford Frick: 4 Votes
    t24) Ernie Harwell: 4 Votes
    t24) Al Lopez: 4 Votes
    t24) Tommy McCarthy: 4 Votes
    t24) Henry Grantland Rice: 4 Votes
    t24) Joe Torre: 4 votes
    t35) Sy Berger: 3 Votes
    t35) Jack Brickhouse: 3 Votes
    t35) Jack Buck: 3 Votes
    t35) Fred Clarke: 3 votes
    t35) Bud Fowler: 3 Votes
    t35) Curt Flood: 3 Votes
    t35) Bucky Harris: 3 Votes
    t35) Cal Hubbard: 3 Votes
    t35) Davey Johnson: 3 Votes
    t35) Shigeo Nagashima: 3 Votes
    t35) Pete Palmer: 3 Votes
    t35) Lou Piniella: 3 Votes
    t35) Red Smith: 3 Votes
    t48) Frank Chance: 2 Votes
    t48) Jacques Doucet: 2 Votes
    t48) Billy Evans: 2 Votes
    t48) John B. Foster: 2 votes
    t48) Howie Haak: 2 Votes
    t48) Roland Hemond: 2 Votes
    t48) Gil Hodges: 2 votes
    t48) Ralph Houk: 2 votes
    t48) Fred Hutchinson: 2 Votes
    t48) Ring Lardner: 2 Votes
    t48) Effa Manley: 2 Votes
    t48) Lee MacPhail: 2 Votes
    t48) Danny Murtaugh: 2 Votes
    t48) Jim Mutrie: 2 Votes
    t48) David Neft: 2 Votes
    t48) Frank Osborn: 2 Votes
    t48) Harry Clay Pulliam: 2 Votes
    t48) Jackie Robinson: 2 Votes
    t48) Wilbert Robinson: 2 Votes
    t48) Bud Selig: 2 Votes
    t48) Bob Sheppard: 2 Votes
    t48) Chris von der Ahe: 2 Votes
    t70) Emmett Ashford: 1 Vote
    t70) Felipe Alou: 1 Vote
    t70) Cap Anson: 1 Vote
    t70) Frank Bancroft: 1 Vote
    t70) Al Munro Elias: 1 Vote
    t70) Cito Gaston: 1 Vote
    t70) Curt Gowdy: 1 Vote
    t70) Gus Greenlee: 1 Vote
    t70) Halsey Hall: 1 Vote
    t70) Gene Mauch: 1 Vote
    t70) Larry Ritter: 1 Vote
    t70) Red Schoendienst: 1 Vote
    t70) Ben Shibe: 1 Vote
    t70) Horace Stoneham: 1 Vote
    t70) Ty Tyson: 1 Vote
    t70) Bob Watson: 1 Vote
    t70) Charles Weeghman: 1 Vote
    t70) Lee Weyer: 1 Vote
    t70) Tom Yawkey: 1 Vote
    t70) Dick Young: 1 Vote
    Jim Fregosi, Ewing Kaufmann, Hal Lanier and Tim McCarver failed to receive votes and thus will not appear on the next ballot. We elected five candidates this round. Two of the greatest managers in Japanese baseball (Mizuhara and Tsuoruoaka) join the Hall of Fame posthumously. Also joining them posthumously is Bob Davids, the founder of SABR. The living inductees are sabermetrics pioneer and Red Sox advisor Bill James and the umpire Doug Harvey.
    RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

  18. #18
    How is Bobby Cox falling short every round? His exclusion is extremely surprising. He is one of the best managers of all time.

    Domenic, why is Whitey Herzog on your ballot but not Bobby Cox?

    SavoyBG, are Herzog and Cox oversights on your part? You have a much lesser manager in Wilbert Robinson on your ballot.

    Cowtipper, were Cox and Herzog an oversight, or do you not support any managers?
    Last edited by jjpm74; 01-16-2011 at 03:22 PM.

  19. #19
    In general, I don't support managers as "contributors." With contributors, I tend to vote for people who helped or advanced or affected the game as a whole. More or less, managers only help the teams they managed.

    There are of course exceptions. I voted for Gaston because he does have some historical significance, in that he was the African-American manager in Major League history to win a World Series title.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cowtipper View Post
    In general, I don't support managers as "contributors." With contributors, I tend to vote for people who helped or advanced or affected the game as a whole. More or less, managers only help the teams they managed.
    Cox has a considerable resume beyond managing. Under his watch as GM of the Braves, he was responsible for drafting key players that would be part of the Braves dynasty of the 1990's. Herzog has an extensive resume beyond simply being a manager. As all around contributors, you couldn't go wrong with either Cox or Herzog.
    RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Ace Venom View Post
    Cox has a considerable resume beyond managing. Under his watch as GM of the Braves, he was responsible for drafting key players that would be part of the Braves dynasty of the 1990's. Herzog has an extensive resume beyond simply being a manager. As all around contributors, you couldn't go wrong with either Cox or Herzog.
    They only helped the teams they were with, though. That is, they only contributed to their specific teams.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowtipper View Post
    They only helped the teams they were with, though. That is, they only contributed to their specific teams.
    The same is true of Ruppert, Steinbrenner and Watson all of whom you voted for.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cowtipper View Post
    They only helped the teams they were with, though. That is, they only contributed to their specific teams.
    By that logic, we'd only elect commissioners and league presidents. Even players would be disqualified because they only helped the teams they played for. Your logic would also have implied a vote for Bill James, whose ideas have been adopted by more than just the Red Sox.
    Last edited by Ace Venom; 01-16-2011 at 04:25 PM.
    RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by jjpm74 View Post
    How is Bobby Cox falling short every round? His exclusion is extremely surprising. He is one of the best managers of all time.

    SavoyBG, are Herzog and Cox oversights on your part? You have a much lesser manager in Wilbert Robinson on your ballot.
    Don't know why I listed wilbert robinson, he doesn't belong, you're right, but I don't think Herzog does either. As for Cox, he just retired at the end of the 2010 season. I think it's too quick to put him in, and I certainly am not ready to vote for any manager (La Russa) who is still managing in 2011.

    Herzog had a career .532 win%, 3 pennants and one world championship. I don't see why that would get him in. Maybe if he had at least won one pennant with KC he'd get my vote.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Ace Venom View Post
    By that logic, we'd only elect commissioners and league presidents. Even players would be disqualified because they only helped the teams they played for. Your logic would also have implied a vote for Bill James, whose ideas have been adopted by more than just the Red Sox.
    I said I elected CONTRIBUTORS using that basic criteria. Not all individuals.

    It's fantastic when people try to simplify the reasoning of other voters into if/then logic, but it not that simple. Not everyone votes for people following a strict, black and white set of guidelines and criteria.

    I didn't vote for James because he is terribly overrated.

    I voted for Steinbrenner because he had an impact on the game that was pretty far ranging.

    I voted for Ruppert because he commandeered a team that is renowned as one of the best ever. When you think Yankees, you often think of the Yankees from his era.

    I voted for Watson because he was the first African American GM. Notable firsts occasionally get my vote.

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