This is our sixty-fifth election in this project. The entire rules follow.
This election will end at 11:59:59 PM EDT on June 17, 2011
The prior election, and the ballots of the 1999 voters, are in this thread
Researcher/advocate/mod
This is our sixty-fifth election in this project. The entire rules follow.
This election will end at 11:59:59 PM EDT on June 17, 2011
The prior election, and the ballots of the 1999 voters, are in this thread
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Researcher/advocate/mod
Rules
1) All BBF users in good standing may participate. However, if there is more than one vote being cast from any one computer or IP, it must be cleared in advance. Should there be unannounced multiple votes from the same IP, I will investigate the circumstances, and all user names involved may be barred from this project as a result, and all but one of the multiple usernames permanently banned from the site. I only anticipate exceptions for family members living in the same home, but I will entertain requests on other bases. Please note that I and the other mods who participate in the project have the capability of determining the IP from which posts come, and I for one intend to monitor same. I have had to deal with a single user manipulating a project with multiple votes, and I don't intend to repeat the experience.
2) Elections will require a 10 voter quorum. If we do not get ten voters and there are candidate(s) who would be elected no matter what the voters needed to make a quorum did, those candidate(s) will be inducted. Otherwise, no one will be inducted. Further, if we fail to elect a full complement of candidates for the ballot in question in two of any four consecutive elections, the portion(s) of the project failing to meet the election requirement will end. If, for instance, we're doing fine on the player end but not the contributor end, I would drop the contributor end under this rule.
3) We will start in 1936, just as Cooperstown did. For the first election (1936), voters will rank their top 20, taking 10. After that we will go to having voters rank their top 12 players. Points awarded 12-11-10, etc. We will take the top five through 1940, then top three players per year elected until 2010, then two per year. If a voter does not number his selections, I will try to get him/her to do so. If they do not do so before the end of the election period, I may in my sole discretion invalidate the ballot. I have included this provision in order to ease the process of recording the votes. On another point, I know, the 1936 backlog is huge--but that was a historical issue they couldn't avoid, so neither will we.
4) We will also have a contributor ballot, which will elect one a year through 1985, then one every three (3) years. Contributors will be ranked 1 through 5, with points awarded 5-4-3-2-1. Voters may choose to participate in either one of the ballots or both.
5) It is permissible to vote for a candidate on both the contributor and player lists.
6) You are allowed to change your ballot at any time the voting is open. However, if you change your ballot, you've got to notify me (jalbright) by PM or by a new post in the voting thread, or the changes likely will not be registered.
7) Players are eligible at the later of age 45 or the first year thereafter in which the player does not play. If the birthdate is not known, add five years to the first time the player misses a season and has less than 10 games the next season. There is an exception for early death, in which case the year of death plus two will be used if that yields an earlier date.
8) Contributors become eligible at age 65 or in the year of death plus two. whichever comes first.
9) Each election will run for approximately two weeks unless expressly altered by the project manager, contributors and players done simultaneously.
10) No one is excluded from being a candidate, regardless of the league they played in, except those elected in either the contributor or player ballots. At that point, they are removed from further consideration. If there are players who returned to the Negro Leagues or Japan after going to the majors, the departure from the majors will be their career end date for purposes of this project.
11) The standard for including a player on one's ballot is that the player must in the voter's opinion be among the very best eligible players (preferably the number voted on, but if a voter wishes to support someone they feel is 15th in a 12 person ballot instead of one of the top 12, it's too close for anyone to reasonably object. On the other hand, supporting the 25th best eligible candidate on a 12 person ballot is probably beyond the pale). I reserve the power to invalidate ballots which I do not feel are a reasonably knowledgeable, good faith effort to rank the players. One issue I am quite concerned about is that I do not want to see what clearly appear to be attempts to manipulate the ballot so as to elect a candidate. In isolation, I probably could live with this, but if it became a widely used tactic, the project would devolve into something I have no desire to be associated with. Moreover, I think that this position asks everyone else to cast legitimate votes so that you can manipulate the system to favor your pet candidates. I cannot accept that, as it strikes me as unfair to other voters. For example, you can't expect to favor even a legitimate HOF candidate like Bill Dahlen over Babe Ruth to get Dahlen elected without being asked to provide a reasonable justification for ranking Dahlen over Ruth. If you can provide a reasonable justification in that scenario, the ballot will stand. If not, you will be asked to make a change. I realize voters will sometimes have idiosyncratic choices, and I try to allow for that. However, a clear flouting of a consensus is apt to be met with a request that the ballot be justified pursuant to this rule. Certainly, a reasonable justification does not indicate in essence simply that you want Dahlen elected. Furthermore, if I invalidate multiple ballots by the same individual as failing to meet this rule, that individual will forever lose the right to have his/her ballots counted. Voters are encouraged to consider character, sportsmanship, and compliance with the rules and spirit of baseball in their rankings of players.
12) I will post lists of eligible players and contributors before each election. If you have a question about the eligibility of a candidate, please ask. I will provide a list of future eligibility dates as well.
13) My eligibility lists come from all persons in the BBF HOF, BBTF Hall of Merit, and Cooperstown, plus all persons getting a vote in a BBF HOF election in the past year and a half or in a BBWAA election. This is a relatively comprehensive list, and thus I must request that if you want another candidate included, you provide some justification for why said candidate is worthy of getting a vote in this project. The main area I think this might come into play is if a voter supports a person who was eligible for the final selections from the recent pre WWII or Negro League committees but not on my master list. That fact alone would serve as ample justification for putting said candidate on the list. We may learn more about Cuban ball or what have you and thus include others after a case is made for them, however. The contributor list is undoubtedly not as comprehensive, and this fact will be taken into consideration. For players, any request for a multiple time all-star in the all-star era will be approved. Players of that quality will generally be approved without much ado. However, when a player lacks that kind of qualification, I will likely ask for you to get a second from among our voters via a post in the current election thread. When in doubt, I will also require a second for suggested contributors. If a second is forthcoming, the player will be added. If not, the request will be rejected. I want to limit requests and seconds to players or contributors you actually might vote for.
14) Other than the sportsmanship and character issues, players are to be evaluated solely upon their play. I would prefer that if a player is qualified by his play standing alone that he be elected on that basis. However, a candidate may only be elected either as a contributor or a player, but not both. Contributors are the area where the entire body of work during his career in the sport, including his play, managing, scouting, executive, writing, broadcasting or other work in the sport is relevant. Contributors are to be ranked based on who the voter thinks is most worthy of induction into the Contributor group in this project.
15) Any ballot with two (2) or more spots unfilled with eligible candidates is invalid. In the event of the listing of ineligible names, I will try to notify the voter so that he/she can correct the ballot before the end of the voting period. If the change is made timely, it will count. If not, and there are two or more invalid names, the ballot will not be considered valid. If there is only one, the ineligible name will be stricken and all names after it on the affected ballot will be moved up one spot.
16) Any players listed beyond the 12th place for any ballot but the first (in which case it is 20th place) will be ignored. If more than one person is listed as tied for the last available place and the ballot is oversize, all names will be dropped, which may lead to the invalidation of the ballot.
17) Ties are not permitted in ballot listings. I reserve the right to invalidate ballots for use of ties in the rankings, be it within a single ballot or over the course of several ballots. If the voter does not correct such a listing voluntarily, except in the case of an oversize ballot tie for the last eligible place, if do not invalidate the ballot, I will choose the placement of the two "tied" candidates, generally preferring the candidate preferred by the other voters.
18) For any ties between candidates straddling the in/out line of selections, the first thing considered is the ranking of the candidates by the ballots cast. If there are more than two candidates tied, use a 2-1-0 or whatever is appropriate for the number of players tied system. If a voter does not list a candidate, he receives zero points in the tiebreaker procedure. Once one person separates from the tied group, restart with the remaining candidates until there are only as many candidates as the rules call for being elected. If they remain tied after this process, the candidate with the most votes received wins. If it is still tied after that, those with the most #1 votes as the next step, then the most #2 votes and so on to see if that breaks the tie. If not, we will induct all candidates who remain tied at that point.
19) One thing we're going to have to be aware of is the timeline in the case of at least a few contributors. Two which jump out at me are Buck O'Neill, 1976, and Branch Rickey, 1946. I intend to eventually vote for both men, but in 1946, Jackie Robinson was still in Montreal. Really, Branch should wait until at least 1947 after Jackie's success in the majors to get credit for that move. If you think Rickey belongs in the top 5 in 1946 without his role in breaking the color line, that's fine--but he shouldn't get credit for that important success until it actually happened. Buck O'Neill did some important things up until 1976, but after that he was in Ken Burns' Baseball and he was instrumental in the establishment of the Negro Leagues Hall of Fame (both occurred in or around 1994). If you think he belongs based on accomplishments before those two things, that's perfectly acceptable, but please don't credit him with them before they actually happened.
20) I will maintain a thread of the project's history and rules which will provide a listing of all elected candidates.
21) Feel free to ask questions by either sending jalbright a PM, or by posting a question in voting thread
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Researcher/advocate/mod
The players who become eligible in 2000 are:
The contributors who become eligible in 2000 are:Code:Clark , Jack Lemon , Chet Martinez , Dennis Morris , Jack Reardon , Jeff Scott , Mike Smith , Lonnie Wilson , Willie Yount , Robin
Code:Alou , Felipe Uecker , Bob
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Researcher/advocate/mod
The 1999 player candidates who were not elected had these results in that election:
The 1999 contributor candidates who were not elected had these results in that election.Code:players……………… votes pts Roush , Edd 6 50 Cepeda, Perucho 5 39 Hernandez, K 9 38 Ochiai, H 6 37 Brock, Lou 5 36 Rixey , Eppa 5 33 Reuschel, Rick 6 31 Koyama, Masaaki 5 29 Aparicio, Luis 5 22 Evans, Dwight 4 22 Beckley , Jake 4 20 Grimes , B 3 20 Sheckard , J 4 17 Berger , Wally 3 16 Dawson, Andre 3 15 Freehan, Bill 4 15 Smith, Reggie 3 15 Bando, Sal 2 14 Childs , Cupid 2 10 Shocker, Urban 3 9 Lundy , Dick 1 7 McVey , Cal 1 7 Sewell , Joe 1 7 Fingers, Rollie 1 6 Howard, Frank 1 6 Cepeda, Orlando 1 5 Mullane , Tony 1 5 Trouppe, Quincy 1 5 Evans, Darrell 1 4 Gomez, Lefty 1 4 Maranville , R 1 3 Newcombe, Don 1 1 Pierce, Billy 1 1
I strongly suggest that you pay attention to this list, as the leaders of the holdovers are likely to join any strong newcomer candidates as the leaders for winning induction.Code:contributor………… votes pts Abe, Iso 6 18 Scully, Vin 6 16 Caylor , O. P. 4 15 Ferguson, Bob 6 14 Evans, Billy 4 10 Williams, Dick 5 8 Elias, Al Munro 3 7 Jobe, Frank 1 5 Pesky , Johnny 1 5 Caray, Harry 1 4 Smith, Red 1 4 Martin, Billy 1 3 Harvey, Doug 1 2 McCarthy, Tommy 1 2 O'Doul, Lefty 1 2
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Researcher/advocate/mod
Members of the Best of Baseball Hall. Last election's inductees are in red.
Players
ContributorsCode:Hank Aaron Pete Alexander Dick Allen Cap Anson Luke Appling Richie Ashburn Earl Averill Frank Baker Ernie Banks Ross Barnes John Beckwith Cool Papa Bell Johnny Bench Charlie Bennett Yogi Berra Akira Bessho Bert Blyleven Lou Boudreau Ken Boyer Roger Bresnahan George Brett Dan Brouthers Mordecai Brown Ray Brown Willard Brown Jim Bunning Jesse Burkett Roy Campanella Rod Carew Max Carey Steve Carlton Gary Carter Bob Caruthers Oscar Charleston Fred Clarke John Clarkson Roberto Clemente Ty Cobb Mickey Cochrane Eddie Collins Jimmy Collins Roger Connor Stan Coveleski Sam Crawford Joe Cronin Bill Dahlen George Davis Dizzy Dean Ed Delahanty Bill Dickey Martin Dihigo Joe DiMaggio Larry Doby Bobby Doerr Don Drysdale Dennis Eckersley Buck Ewing Red Faber Bob Feller Wes Ferrell Carlton Fisk Elmer Flick Whitey Ford Willie Foster Nellie Fox Jimmie Foxx Frankie Frisch Pud Galvin Lou Gehrig Charlie Gehringer Bob Gibson Josh Gibson Jack Glasscock Joe Gordon George Gore Goose Goslin Goose Gossage Frank Grant Hank Greenberg Bobby Grich Heinie Groh Lefty Grove Stan Hack Billy Hamilton Isao Harimoto Gabby Hartnett Harry Heilmann Billy Herman Pete Hill Paul Hines Rogers Hornsby Carl Hubbell Kazuhisa Inao Monte Irvin Joe Jackson Reggie Jackson Ferguson Jenkins Hughie Jennings Grant "Home Run"Johnson Walter Johnson Addie Joss Al Kaline Masaichi Kaneda Tim Keefe Willie Keeler Charlie Keller Joe Kelley King Kelly Harmon Killebrew Ralph Kiner Sandy Koufax Nap LaJoie Bob Lemon Buck Leonard Pop Lloyd Ted Lyons Biz Mackey Sherry Magee Mickey Mantle Juan Marichal Eddie Mathews Christy Mathewson Willie Mays Willie McCovey Joe McGinnity Bid McPhee Joe Medwick Jose Mendez Minnie Minoso Johnny Mize Dobie Moore Joe Morgan Stan Musial Shigeo Nagashima Hal Newhouser Kid Nichols Phil Niekro Katsuya Nomura Sadaharu Oh Alejandro Oms Jim O'Rourke Mel Ott Satchel Paige Jim Palmer Gaylord Perry Eddie Plank Charlie Radbourn Pee Wee Reese Robin Roberts Brooks Robinson Frank Robinson Jackie Robinson Bullet Joe Rogan Pete Rose Red Ruffing Amos Rusie Babe Ruth Nolan Ryan Ron Santo Louis Santop Mike Schmidt Tom Seaver Al Simmons Ted Simmons George Sisler Enos Slaughter Hilton Smith Ozzie Smith Duke Snider Warren Spahn Tris Speaker Victor Starffin Willie Stargell Joe Start Turkey Stearnes Harry Stovey Mule Suttles Don Sutton Ezra Sutton Bill Terry Sam Thompson Luis Tiant Joe Torre Cristobal Torriente Pie Traynor Dazzy Vance Arky Vaughan Rube Waddell Honus Wagner Bobby Wallace Ed Walsh Paul Waner John M. Ward Willie Wells Zack Wheat Deacon White Hoyt Wilhelm Billy Williams Smoky Joe Williams Ted Williams Jud Wilson Dave Winfield George Wright Early Wynn Jimmy Wynn Carl Yastrzemski Cy Young
Code:Doc Adams Mel Allen Walter Alston Sparky Anderson Red Barber Ed Barrow Buzzue Bavasi Ed Bolden Alexander Cartwright Henry Chadwick Frank Chance Charlie Commiskey Charles Conlon Tom Connolly Jim Creighton Jack Dunn Leo Durocher Rube Foster Ford Frick Gus Greenlee Clark Griffith Ned Hanlon Vic Harris Whitey Herzog William Hulbert Miller Huggins Ban Johnson Tetsuharu Kawakami Bill Klem Kenesaw Landis Tommy Lasorda Al Lopez Connie Mack Larry MacPhail Joe McCarthy John McGraw Bill McKechnie Marvin Miller Walter O'Malley Buck O'Neill Dickey Pearce Cum Posey A. J. Reach Francis Richter Branch Rickey Phil Rizzuto Jacob Ruppert Frank Selee Ben Shibe Matsutaro Shoriki Billy Southworth Al Spalding Alfred Spink J. G. T. Spink Casey Stengel C. I. Taylor Kazuto Tsuruoka Bill Veeck Earl Weaver George Weiss Sol White J. L. Wilkinson Harry Wright
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Researcher/advocate/mod
The complete list of eligible players:
The complete list of eligible contributors:Code:Adams , Babe Adams , Bobby Adams , Sparky Allen , Johnny Alou , Jesus Alou , Matty Alou, Felipe Altrock , Nick Aparicio, Luis Archer , Jimmy Arlett , Buzz Austin , Jimmy Avila, Bobby Bailey , Bob Baker , Dusty Bancroft , Dave Bando , Sal Barry , Jack Bartell , Dick Battin , Joe Bauer , Hank Baylor , Don Beaumont , Ginger Beckert, Glenn Beckley , Jake Belanger , Mark Bell , Buddy Bender , Chief Benton , Larry Berg , Moe Bergen , Marty Berger , Wally Berry , Charlie Bibby , Jim Bigbee , Carson Billingham , Jack Bishop , Max Blackwell , Ewell Blades , Ray Blair , Paul Blass , Steve Blue , Lu Blue , Vida Bluege , Ossie Bodie , Ping Boley , Joe Bond , Tommy Bonds , Bobby Boone, Bob Bottomley , Jim Bowa , Larry Boyer , Clete Bradley , Bill Brecheen , Harry Breitenstein , Ted Brewer , Jim Bridges , Tommy Brock, Lou Browning , Pete Bruton, Bill Buckner , Bill Burdette , Lew Burgess , Smoky Burns , George J. Burroughs , Jeff Bush , Joe Bush , Donie Bush , Guy Cadore , Leon Camilli , Dolph Camnitz , Howie Campaneris , Bert Campbell , Bill Candelaria , John Cardenal , Jose Cardenas , Leo Carrasquel. Chico Carrigan , Bill Carroll, Clay Case , George Cash , Dave Cash, Norm Cavaretta , Phil Cedeno , Cesar Cepeda , Orlando Cepeda , Perucho Cey , Ron Chandler , Spud Chapman , Ben Chapman , Ray Chapman , Sam Chase , Hal Chesbro , Jack Childs , Cupid Cicotte , Eddie Cissell , Bill Clark , Jack Clark , Watty Clarkson , Bus Clift, Harlond Coakley , Andy Colavito, Rocky Collins , Shano Combs , Earle Concepcion , Dave Conroy , Wid Coombs , Jack Cooper , Andy Cooper , Mort Cooper , Walker Cooper , Wilbur Courtney , Clint Cox , Billy Crandall , Doc Crandall, Del Cravath , Gavvy Criger , Lou Critz , Hughie Cross , Lave Crowder , Al Cruise , Walt Cruz , Jose Cuccinello , Tony Cummings , Candy Cuyler , Kiki Dandridge , Ray Danning , Harry Dark , Alvin Daubert , Jake Davis , Curt Davis , Harry Davis , Spud Dawson , Andre Day , Leon DeCinces, Doug Dempsey , Rick Dent , Bucky Derringer , Paul DiMaggio , Dom Dinneen , Bill Doak , Bill Donaldson, John Donlin , Mike Donovan , Bill Dooin , Red Downing, Bryan Doyle , Jack Doyle , Larry Dropo , Walt Duffy , Hugh Dugan , Joe Dunlap , Fred Dykes , Jimmy Earnshaw , George Easter, Luke Edwards , Hank Ehmke , Howard Elberfeld , Kid Elliott , Bob Elliott , Jumbo Ellis , Dock Enatsu , Yutaka Ennis, Del Ens , Jewel Erskine , Carl Evans , Darrell Evans , Dwight Evers , Johnny Face, Roy Fairly , Ron Falkenberg , Cy Ferrell , Rick Fingers , Rollie Fitzsimmons , Freddie Flanagan , Mike Fletcher , Art Flood , Curt Fonseca , Lew Forsch, Bob Foster , Eddie Foster , George Fraser , Chick Freehan, Bill Fregosi , Jim Furillo , Carl Galan , Augie Garner , Phil Garver, Ned Garvey , Steve Gelbert , Charlie Gleason , Kid Gomez , Lefty Gonzalez , Mike Gowdy , Hank Grant , Eddie Grantham , George Griffey, Sr, Ken Grimes , Burleigh Grimm , Charlie Grissom , Marv Groat, Dick Gromek , Steve Grove , Orval Guidry, Ron Gustine , Frank Haas , Mule Haddix, Harvey Hafey , Chick Hahn , Noodles Haines , Jesse Hallahan , Bill Harder , Mel Hargrave , Bubbles Hargrove , Mike Harrah , Toby Harrelson , Bud Harris , Bucky Hatton , Grady Hearn , Jim Hebner , Richie Hegan , Jim Helms, Tommy Hemus , Solly Henrich , Tommy Herman , Babe Hernandez , Keith Hernandez , Willie Herzog , Buck Hickman , Jim Higgins , Mike Hiller , John Hinchman , Bill Hodges, Gil Holmes , Tommy Holtzman , Ken Honeycutt , Rick Hooper , Harry Hooton, Burt Horton , Willie Hough, Charlie Houtteman , Art Howard , Frank Howard, Elston Hoy , Dummy Hoyt , Waite Hrabosky , Al Huggins , Miller Hunter , Catfish Hutchinson , Fred Irwin , Charlie Jackman , Will Jackson , Sonny Jensen , Jackie John , Tommy Johnson , Bob Johnson , Davey Johnson , Judy Jones , Charley Jones , Fielder Jones , Sam P. Jordan , Tim Jorgenson , Mike Judge , Joe Jurges , Billy Kaat, Jim Kamm , Willie Kawakami , Tetsuharu Kell , George Keltner , Ken Kerr , Dickie Kessinger , Don Killefer , Bill Kilroy , Matt Kinder , Ellis Kingman , Dave Klein , Chuck Kling , Johnny Kluszewski, Ted Knabe , Otto Koosman , Jerry Koyama, Masaaki Kremer , Ray Kress , Red Kuenn, Harvey Kuhel , Joe Kuzava , Bob Lange , Bill Lanier , Hal Larkin , Henry Larsen, Don Latham , Arlie Lavagetto , Cookie Law, Vern Lazzeri , Tony Leach , Freddy Leach , Tommy Lee , Bill Lee , Bill (Spaceman) Leever , Sam Lemon , Chet Leonard , Dennis Leonard , Emil (Dutch) Lewis , Duffy Lewis, Buddy Lindstrom , Freddie Lobert , Hans Lockman , Whitey Lolich, Mickey Lollar, Sherm Lombardi , Ernie Lonborg , Jim Long , Herman Lopat , Ed Lopes , Davey Lopez , Al Lowe , Bobby Lowenstein , John Lucas , Red Lundy , Dick Luque , Dolf Luzinski, Greg Lyle , Sparky Lyons , Denny Madlock , Bill Maglie , Sal Maloney, Jim Mancuso , Gus Manush , Heinie Maranville , Rabbit Marberry , Firpo Marion , Marty Maris, Roger Marquard , Rube Marshall , Mike G. Martin , Morrie Martin , Pepper Martinez , Dennis Mathews , Bobby May , Lee Mays , Carl Mazeroski , Bill McAleer , Jimmy McCarthy , Tommy McCarver , Tim McCormick , Frank McCormick , Jim McDaniel , Lindy McDougald, Gil McGowan , Bill McGraw , Tug McInnis , Stuffy McLain , Denny McLean , Larry McMahon, Don McManus , Marty McMillan, Roy McNally , Dave McVey , Cal Meadows , Lee Messersmith , Andy Meusel , Bob Miksis , Eddie Milan , Clyde Millan , Felix Miller , Bing Miller , Dots Miller , Hack Monday , Rick Money , Don Monroe , Bill Moon, Wally Moore , Jo-Jo Moore , Terry Moran , Pat Morris , Jack Mostil , Johnny Mota, Manny Mulcahy , Hugh Mullane , Tony Mungo , Van Munson , Thurman Murcer , Bobby Murphy , Danny Murray , Red Myer , Buddy Nehf , Art Nettles , Graig Newcombe , Don Newsom , Bobo Nicholson , Bill Niekro , Joe Northey , Ron Ochiai , Hiromitsu O'Doul , Lefty Oeschger , Joe O'Farrell , Bob O'Leary , Charlie Oliva, Tony Oliver , Al O'Neill , Steve O'Neill , Tip Orr , Dave Pabor , Charlie Pafko , Andy Parker , Dave Parrish , Larry Pascual, Camilo Paskert , Dode Pearson , Monte Peckinpaugh , Roger Peitz , Heinie Pennock , Herb Perdue , Hub Perez , Tony Perkins , Cy Perranoski , Ron Perry , Jim Pesky , Johnny Petrocelli, Rico Phillippe , Deacon Pierce , Billy Pike , Lip Piniella, Lou Pinson, Vada Pipp , Wally Podres, Johnny Poles , Spotswood Porterfield , Bob Powell , Boog Power , Vic Pruett , Hub Quinn , Jack Quisenberry , Dan Randolph , Willie Raschi , Vic Raymond , Bugs Reardon , Jeff Redding , Dick Reiser , Pete Remsen , Jack Reuschel , Rick Reynolds , Allie Rice , Del Rice , Jim Rice , Sam Richard, J R Richardson , Bobby Richardson , Hardy Ring , Jimmy Ritchey , Claude Rivers , Mickey Rixey , Eppa Robertson , Dave Roe , Preacher Rolfe , Red Rommel , Eddie Root , Charlie Rosen, Al Roush , Edd Rucker , Nap Rudolph , Dick Ruel , Muddy Russell , Bill Ryan , Jimmy Sain , Johnny Sanguillen , Manny Sauer , Hank Schacht , Al Schaefer , Germany Schalk , Ray Schang , Wally Schoendienst , Red Schreckengost , Ossie Schulte , Frank Scott , Everett Scott , George Scott , Jack Scott , Mike Selkirk , George Severeid , Hank Sewell , Joe Sewell , Luke Sewell , Rip Seymour , Cy Shantz, Bobby Sheckard , Jimmy Sherdel , Bill Shocker , Urban Short , Chris Siebert , Sonny Sievers , Roy Simmons, Curt Singleton , Ken Sisti , Sibby Smith , Earl Smith , Lonnie Smith , Reggie Smith , Sherry Sparks , Tully Speier, Chris Stahl , Jake Stanky , Eddie Stanley , Mickey Staub , Rusty Steinfeldt , Harry Stephens , Vern Stephenson , Riggs Stottlemyre , Mel Street , Gabby Suhr , Gus Sukeforth , Clyde Sundberg , Jim Sutter , Bruce Sweeney , Bill Tannehill , Jesse Taylor , Ben Tebbetts , Birdie Tekulve, Kent Tenace , Gene Tenney , Fred Thevenow , Tommy Thomas , Ira Thomson , Bobby Thornton , Andre Tiernan , Mike Tinker , Joe Tobin , Jim Toney , Fred Torgeson, Earl Torrez , Mike Travis, Cecil Trouppe , Quincy Trout , Dizzy Trucks , Virgil Tudor , John Turner , Terry Uhle , George Valentine , Ellis Valo , Elmer Van Haltren , George Vander Meer , Johnny Veach , Bobby Vernon , Mickey Walberg , Rube Walker , Harry Walters , Bucky Wambsganss , Bill Waner , Lloyd Warfield , Frank Warneke , Lon Watson , Bob Welch , Mickey Werber , Billy Wertz, Vic West , Sam Westrum , Wes White , Sol White , Will White, Frank Whitehill , Earl Williams , Cy Williams , Ken Williamson , Ned Willis , Vic Wills, Maury Wilson , Hack Wilson , Jim Wilson , Jimmie Wilson , Willie Witt , Whitey Wood , Joe Wood , Wilbur Wright , Glenn Wyatt , Whit Yamamoto , Koji Yeager , Steve Yerkes , Steve York , Rudy Young , Pep Youngs , Ross Yount , Robin Zachary , Tom Zimmer , Chief
Code:Abe , Iso Alou , Felipe Ashford, Emmet Autry, Gene Bancroft , Frank Barlick, Al Berger , Sy Brickhouse , Jack Buck , Jack Bulkely , Morgan Busch , Augie Cambria , Joe Campbell , Jim Canel, Buck Caray, Harry Carrigan, Bill Caylor , O. P. Chandler, Happy Chylak , Nestor Conlan , Jocko Cooper , Andy Cummings , Candy Dark , Alvin Davids , Bob Dinneen , Bill Doubleday , Abner Dreyfuss , Barney Dyer , Eddie Dykes , Jimmy Elias , Al Munro Evans, Billy Feller, Sherm Fergsuon, Bob Fetzer, John Flood , Curt Foster , John B. Fowler, Bud Fullerton , Hugh Giles , Warren Gleason , Kid Gonzalez , Mike Gowdy , Curt Grimm, Charlie Haak , Howie Haney , Fred Harridge, Willie Harris , Bucky Harvey, Doug Harwell, Ernie Hemond , Roland Heydler, John Hillerich , John Hodges, Gil Hodges, Russ Houk , Ralph Howsam, Bob Hubbard , Cal Hutchinson , Fred Jobe , Frank Krichell, Paul Kuenn , Harvey Kuhn , Bowie Lanigan, Ernest Lardner , Ring Leavitt, Jr. , Charles W. Luque , Dolf MacPhail, Lee Manley , Effa Martin , Billy Mauch , Gene McCarthy , Tommy McGowan, Bill Mills , A. G. Mizuhara, Shigeru Moran , Pat Murnane, Tim Murtaugh, Danny Mutrie , Jim Navin , Frank Nelson , Lindsey Norworth, Jack O'Day, Hank O'Doul, Lefty O'Neill, Steve Osborn , Frank Pasquel, Jorge Patkin, Max Pesky , Johnny Pompez , Alex Pulliam, Harry Ramirez, Felo Reese , Jimmie Rice, Grantland Richards, Paul Ritter , Lawrence Robinson , Wilbert Schoendienst, Red Scully, Vin Selig , Bud Sewell , Luke Sheppard, Bob Smith, Red Stallings , George Steinbrenner, George Street, Gabby Tanner , Chuck Thayer , Ernest Tyson, Ty Uecker , Bob van der Ahe, Chris Virdon, Bill Warfield , Frank Weyer , Lee Williams , Dick Wilson , Horace Wrigley, Phil Yawkey, Tom
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Researcher/advocate/mod
My ballot
Players
1. Robin Yount
2. Perucho Cepeda
3. Cupid Childs
4. Hiromitsu Ochiai
5. Sal Bando
6. Quincy Trouppe
7. Masaaki Koyama
8. Rick Reuschel
9. Bill Freehan
10. Keith Hernandez
11. Reggie Smith
12. Andre Dawson
Contributors
1. Iso Abe
2. Dick Williams
3. Vin Scully
4. Bob Ferguson
5. Al Munro Elias
Robin Yount goes to the top of the player list. Reggie Smith returns to my ballot, and Andre Dawson makes the list. As for the contributors, Al Munro Elias joins the list, leaving Steinbrenner and Murnane in my contributor queue.
Last edited by jalbright; 06-04-2011 at 09:11 AM.
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Registered User
Players:
1. Robin Yount
2. Reggie Smith
3. Jimmy Sheckard
4. Sal Bando
5. Cal McVey
6. Rick Reuschel
7. Perucho Cepeda
8. Keith Hernandez
9. Rabbit Maranville
10. Urban Shocker
11. Edd Roush
12. Hugh Duffy
Contributors:
1. Bob Ferguson
2. Felipe Alou
3. O.P. Caylor
4. Al Munro Elias
5. Iso Abe
Given that Edd Roush is getting strong support at this point, he leap frogs over 4 queued up players to join my ballot. Hugh Duffy rejoins at slot 12.
Harry Caray, Happy Chandler, Jocko Conlan, Candy Cummings, Bill Dinneen, Bud Fowler, Vic Harris, Gil Hodges, Ring Lardner, Billy Martin, Shigeru Mizuhara, Tim Murnane, Lefty O'Doul, Red Schoendienst, Vin Scully, George Steinbrenner, Bob Uecker, Dick Williams all being strongly considered at this point on the contributor side.
My queued up players are Wally Schang, Charley Jones, Quincy Trouppe, Bill Freehan, Lou Brock, Hardy Richardson.
I'm unlikely to add a new pitcher anytime soon, unless a strong newcomer emerges as the carryovers go Jack Quinn, Burleigh Grimes, Bruce Sutter, Dan Quisenberry, Eppa Rixey, Don Newcombe, Ron Guidry, Catfish Hunter, Harry Brecheen, Chief Bender.
In my consideration set on the players side are Luis Aparicio, Dave Bancroft, Jake Beckley, Chief Bender, Wally Berger, Max Bishop, Bobby Bonds, Bob Boone, Harry Brecheen, Pete Browning, Lou Brock, Cesar Cedeno, Orlando Cepeda, Cupid Childs, Dave Concepcion, Lave Cross, Andre Dawson, Leon Day, Dwight Evans, Bill Freehan, Steve Garvey, Burleigh Grimes, Ron Guidry, Dummy Hoy, Catfish Hunter, Fielder Jones, Joe Kelley, Tommy Leach, Thurman Munson, Graig Nettles, Don Newcombe, Hiromitsu Ochiai, Tony Perez, Lip Pike, Spotswood Poles, Jack Quinn, Dan Quisenberry, Sam Rice, Hardy Richardson, Eppa Rixey, Edd Roush, Joe Sewell, Rusty Staub, Bruce Sutter, Quincy Trouppe, George Van Haltren. Some may make my ballot, some may not depending on who we are looking at in terms of newcomers.
Registered User
Players:
1. Robin Yount
2. Lou Brock
3. Jake Beckely
4. Hiromitsu Ochiai
5. Edd Roush
6. Masaaki Koyama
7. Tony Mullane
8. Jimmy Sheckard
9. Keith Hernandez
10. Rick Reuschel
11. Ray Dandridge
12. Quincy Trouppe
Contributors:
1. Harry Caray
2. Vin Scully
3. Dick Williams
4. Bob Ferguson
5. Bob Uecker
Last edited by TheMendozaLine; 06-05-2011 at 10:42 AM. Reason: spelling correction
2004 & 2007
Players:
1. Robin Yount
2. Edd Roush
3. Lou Brock
4. Perucho Cepeda
5. Luis Aparicio
6. Dwight Evans
7. Wally Berger
8. Masaaki Koyama
9. Rick Reuschel
10. Eppa Rixey
11. Hiromitsu Ochiai
12. Keith Hernandez
Contributors:
1. Bob Ferguson
2. Iso Abe
3. Vin Scully
4. Billy Evans
5. Dick Williams
Registered User
01. Robin Yount
02. Eppa Rixey
03. Wally Berger
04. Edd Roush
05. Jake Beckley
06. Burleigh Grimes
07. Urban Shocker
08. Perucho Cepeda
09. Hiromitsu Ochiai
10. Luis Aparicio
11. Keith Hernandez
12. Bill Freehan
01. Frank Jobe
02. Vin Scully
03. Lefty O'Doul
04. Iso Abe
05. Dick Williams
1. Robin Yount
2. Lou Brock
3. Bill Freehan
4. Hiromitsu Ochiai
5. Edd Roush
6. Frank Howard
7. Orlando Cepeda
8. Dewey Evans
9. Keith Hernandez
10. Andre Dawson
11. Cupid Childs
12. Tommy Leach
in the wings: Dave bancroft, Tony Perez, Dandridge, Johnny Evers
then: Darrell Evans, Bando, Pinson, Maranville, Sheckard, Reggie Smith and Tommy John to name a few.
1. O.P. Caylor
2. Red Smith
3. Billy Evans
4. Tommy McCarthy
5. Bob Ferguson
OSHA-certified Moderator
1. Robin Yount
2. Edd Roush
3. Keith Hernandez
4. Andre Dawson
5. Burleigh Grimes
6. Luis Aparicio
7. Lefty Gomez
8. Eppa Rixey
9. Jake Beckley
10. Lou Brock
11. Hiromitsu Ochiai
12. Masaaki Koyama
Contributors
1. Billy Evans
2. O.P. Caylor
3. Vin Scully
4. Dick Williams
5. Bucky Harris
Tom Tresh George Kell Mark Fidrych Bob Feller
Ernie Harwell Soupy Sales Alex Chilton Sparky Anderson
Joe Nuxhall Gary Carter MCA Emanuel Steward
Sonny Elliot Dave Brubeck Earl Weaver Stan Musial
Jonathan Winters Neil Armstrong Roger Ebert Anthony Zahler
Ray Manzarek
Bleed the Freak
2000 ballot:
1 Robin Yount
2 Rick Reuschel
3 Dwight Evans
4 Masaaki Koyama
5 Hiromitsu Ochiai
6 Dick Lundy
7 Darrell Evans
8 Jimmy Sheckard
9 Reggie Smith
10 Don Newcombe
11 Bill Freehan
12 Keith Hernandez
Contributors:
1 Johnny Pesky
2 Vin Scully
3 Iso Abe
4 Doug Harvey
5 Al Munro Elias
Registered User
1 Robin Yount
2 Eppa Rixey
3 Keith Hernandez
4 Ed Roush
5 Lou Brock
6 Andre Dawson
7 Luis Aparicio
8 Burleigh Grimes
9 Urban Shocker
10 Jake Beckley
11 Rick Reuschel
12 Bill Freehan
carpe baseball
Players
1. Robin Yount
2. Perucho Cepeda
3. Hiromitsu Ochiai
4. Masaaki Koyama
5. Dwight Evans
6. Rick Reuschel
7. Reggie Smith
8. Bill Freehan
9. Keith Hernandez
10. Jimmy Sheckard
11. Quincy Trouppe
12. Andre Dawson
Contributors
1. O.P. Caylor
2. Dick Williams
3. Bob Ferguson
4. Tim Murnane
5. Al Munro Elias
"When you have no basis for an argument, abuse the plaintiff." -- Cicero
Researcher/advocate/mod
We now have a quorum on the player side, but the contributor side has only nine votes and is such that the tenth vote could change the results. JW is the only voter from last election yet to vote, and if he has not done so by Monday, I will send him a reminder PM.
Next election, we will add the following players:
We will also add David Neft to the contributor list.Code:Guerrero , Pedro Kennedy , Terry Molitor , Paul Murphy , Dale Murray , Eddie Parrish , Lance Puhl , Terry Sutcliffe , Rick Templeton , Garry Welch , Bob
Last edited by jalbright; 06-09-2011 at 05:56 PM.
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
a posse ad esse
Players
1. Robin Yount
2. Eppa Rixey
3. Edd Roush
4. Joe Sewell
5. Rollie Fingers
6. Luis Aparicio
7. Keith Hernandez
8. Wally Berger
9. Bill Freehan
10. Billy Pierce
11. Reggie Smith
12. Graig Nettles
Jack Clark has a chance to make the ballot by current day, but the glut of corner and combo outfielders is growing. Dennis Martinez and Jack Morris make the pitcher's queue near Jerry Koosman and Burleigh Grimes, respectively. Finally, welcome aboard Graig Nettles. Trouppe, the Evanses and Dawson are next in line.
Contributors
1. Al Munro Elias
2. Billy Martin
3. Billy Evans
4. Dick Williams
5. Vin Scully
Felipe Alou sniffs the radar but won't make it as a combo player-manager ahead of Red Schoendienst. I'll cave on Vin Scully then. He was named the #1 sportscaster of all time by his own association in 2009.
September 16, 2012: The Losing Streak Ends
Researcher/advocate/mod
We've got a quorum on both ballots.
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Registered User
Paul Molitor and Eddie Murray appear to be locks for 2001, and Dale Murphy is close as well. I have a soft spot for both Pedro Guerrero and Lance Parrish, but I don't think that either has a significant argument for this project.
David Neft is an interesting candidate - I've read some arguments suggesting that he is one of the most significant name in the groundwork for the SABR movement ... and that's fairly compelling.
Registered User
Anyone care to give a case for David Neft? Was The Baseball Encyclopedia enough to elect him? Is he on the same level as Al Munro Elias and Bill James? I'd like to hear more about his impact.
Researcher/advocate/mod
David Neft Headed up the enormous and enormously important project of creating the first modern baseball encyclopedia, the first Macmillan Encyclopedia. Without that seminal work, where would we be in baseball research? I'm sure someone would have done it by now, but would it have been in time for the likes of Bill James? James is more important IMO because of what he did with information like that provided by Neft, and Elias has a large role in popularizing the use of baseball statistics. For those reasons, I put those two ahead of Neft. If you've done baseball research, BB-ref and Retrosheet in many ways are built on the foundation laid by the first MacMillan encyclopedia. Certainly, when we evaluate players, the encyclopedia format is where most of us start.
For more, see this article: http://bats.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/0...ll/#more-21975
Last edited by jalbright; 06-13-2011 at 06:56 AM.
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Researcher/advocate/mod
We're in the last day of this election. (For real this time, if you saw yesterday's errant post)
Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
Registered User
Thanks for the info. He is a likely for my ballot. The difficulty will be in deciding whether Neft should be ahead of or behind Elias.Originally Posted by jalbright
While we're on the subject, shouldn't Lee Allen get some strong consideration/be eligible here if Neft is?
carpe baseball
Agreed though Murphy will be in the bottom half of my ballot if at all. I'm higher on Parrish than Guerrero, but not enough remaining elections for Parrish to ever see a ballot.
Neft is an intriguing contributor candidate (as is Lee Allen), but I'm unsure where they fall in my queue at this point. Will have to reexamine those not currently on my ballot more carefully.
FWIW, I expect next year to see only one holdover elected, making the horserace very tight for that position.
Last edited by Brad Harris; 06-17-2011 at 01:19 PM.
"When you have no basis for an argument, abuse the plaintiff." -- Cicero
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