Unbreakable baseball records

**redban** · 05-07-2012, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by redban

From 93' - 04', Bonds averaged .680 Slugging %, not too far behind .690.

93-04 is 11 seasons - longer than Ralph Kiner's whole career..

And Bonds was in a pitcher's park.

Basically, .690 slugging is breakable, if a player has a short career in a hitter's park.

You know - now that I mention Ralph Kiner..

What about his record of 7 consecutive seasons of leading the league in homeruns?

That might be unbreakable; Kiner even did it to start his career.

**brett** · 05-07-2012, 08:45 AM

Originally Posted by redban

From 93' - 04', Bonds averaged .680 Slugging %, not too far behind .690.

93-04 is 11 seasons - longer than Ralph Kiner's whole career..

And Bonds was in a pitcher's park.

Basically, .690 slugging is breakable, if a player has a short career in a hitter's park.

Pujols projects to about .702 playing half time in Coors circa 1995-2004.

**White Knight** · 05-07-2012, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by SHOELESSJOE3

Maybe someone the board knows the answer, I can't say for sure.
Seems to me, the streak would be over. The game was played and no hits recorded.
Not a nice way to end it but what other way could it be determined, no hits for that batter.

Well, it could also be seen as no at-bats. It's total gray area.

**brett** · 05-07-2012, 10:35 AM

The streak continues if all plate appearances are walks, however if a batter makes an out in the first then they could walk him the rest of the way. I am pretty sure that the same is true if the first plate appearance is a sac fly. Probably a sac bunt too, though a sac bunt is not a plate appearance.

I see ipitch gave the answer, sac bunts don't count against you.

**fenrir** · 05-07-2012, 01:34 PM

I think Javy Lopez 43 home runs in a single season as a catcher will stand for a very long time.

**RuthMayBond** · 05-07-2012, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by fenrir

I think Javy Lopez 43 home runs in a single season as a catcher will stand for a very long time.

Johnny Bench might tend to disagree with that

**fenrir** · 05-07-2012, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by RuthMayBond

Johnny Bench might tend to disagree with that

He probably would

**RuthMayBond** · 05-07-2012, 02:19 PM

Originally Posted by fenrir

He probably would

Do you know why?

**redban** · 05-07-2012, 02:23 PM

Piazza's career 396 as a catcher might hold up for a while too..

**ipitch** · 05-07-2012, 02:26 PM

Most HRs in a season by catchers (while catching):
Javy Lopez Atlanta 42 2003
Todd Hundley New York 41 1996
Roy Campanella Brooklyn 40 1953
Mike Piazza Los Angeles 40 1997
Mike Piazza New York 40 1999
Johnny Bench Cincinnati 38 1970

**RuthMayBond** · 05-07-2012, 02:28 PM

Originally Posted by ipitch

Most HRs in a season by catchers (while catching):
Javy Lopez Atlanta 42 2003
Todd Hundley New York 41 1996
Roy Campanella Brooklyn 40 1953
Mike Piazza Los Angeles 40 1997
Mike Piazza New York 40 1999
Johnny Bench Cincinnati 38 1970

Ok, I gotcha, "while catching".
Well, if 2nd place is only one HR behind ...

**fenrir** · 05-07-2012, 02:35 PM

Originally Posted by redban

Piazza's career 396 as a catcher might hold up for a while too..

I'm pretty sure Piazza has a few single season records for a catcher. Probably OBP, Slugging%, and OPS. I'm pretty sure he set the record for single season hits as a catcher.

**redban** · 05-07-2012, 02:37 PM

Hundley and Lopez are both linked to steroids though.

I think Lopez admitted it while Hundley was in the Mitchell Report.

**fenrir** · 05-07-2012, 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by redban

Hundley and Lopez are both linked to steroids though.

I think Lopez admitted it while Hundley was in the Mitchell Report.

Steroids or no steroids, it's still the record for now, and I think it will stand for a long time.

**redban** · 05-07-2012, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by fenrir

I'm pretty sure Piazza has a few single season records for a catcher. Probably OBP, Slugging%, and OPS. I'm pretty sure he set the record for single season hits as a catcher.

Career slugging % is Piazza, but single-season belongs to Lopez.

In 03' Lopez slugged .687. Piazza's career high is .638 in 1997. (Although Piazza played about 20-something more games in his season)

**SHOELESSJOE3** · 05-07-2012, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by redban

From 93' - 04', Bonds averaged .680 Slugging %, not too far behind .690.

93-04 is 11 seasons - longer than Ralph Kiner's whole career..

And Bonds was in a pitcher's park.

Basically, .690 slugging is breakable, if a player has a short career in a hitter's park.

That 1993 to 2004 include his years using PED's around 2000, he's not close to .690 without those years after 2000/
It would probably take another user to challenge .690 career or some unforeseen changes in the future of the game to favor the hitters.
I think your other idea could be, hitters park and a short career.

**SHOELESSJOE3** · 05-07-2012, 03:22 PM

Duplicate.

**White Knight** · 05-07-2012, 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by brett

The streak continues if all plate appearances are walks, however if a batter makes an out in the first then they could walk him the rest of the way. I am pretty sure that the same is true if the first plate appearance is a sac fly. Probably a sac bunt too, though a sac bunt is not a plate appearance.

I see ipitch gave the answer, sac bunts don't count against you.

Joe D. had all hits in 56 consecutive games. If someone breaks it with a sac bunt and three walks in between the streak, expect all hell to break loose. There would always be an asterisk, and rightfully so.

**ipitch** · 05-07-2012, 09:48 PM

Originally Posted by White Knight

Joe D. had all hits in 56 consecutive games. If someone breaks it with a sac bunt and three walks in between the streak, expect all hell to break loose. There would always be an asterisk, and rightfully so.

If a player has 4 PAs (a sac bunt and three walks), his streak continues, but it does not lengthen the streak. If it was a 20-game streak before that game, it would still be at 20 games after that game. There would certainly not be an asterisk.

**White Knight** · 05-07-2012, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by ipitch

If a player has 4 PAs (a sac bunt and three walks), his streak continues, but it does not lengthen the streak. If it was a 20-game streak before that game, it would still be at 20 games after that game. There would certainly not be an asterisk.

There wouldn't be an asterisk in MLB's eyes, but there would be one in my eyes and many if not most fans everywhere. To me it ends if he plays in a game without any hits, unless he is taken out before any at-bats.

**ipitch** · 05-07-2012, 10:29 PM

Originally Posted by White Knight

There wouldn't be an asterisk in MLB's eyes, but there would be one in my eyes and many if not most fans everywhere.

How would you know that? Maybe we should run a poll here and find out.

**redban** · 05-09-2012, 06:57 AM

If a player breaks 56 after going 0-0 in a whole game, people would look at it differently from Joe D's original record.

And that's regardless of the record books.

Like during the ABs where the player walks - unless it's an intentional walk - wasn't the hitter trying to get a hit during the AB?

He went up the batter's box, looked at every pitch, probably swung at some and fouled it off, and he didn't get the hit. Even if he walked and didn't make an out, he still didn't get a hit.

**jjpm74** · 05-09-2012, 07:34 AM

1. Hitting more than one bird while pitching in a game.
2. Oldest player ever to play an MLB game.
3. Shortest player ever to play an MLB game.
4. 2 triple plays in one game
5. 4 runs in the same game off 4 home runs by the same player with no one else on base.

**ipitch** · 05-09-2012, 07:47 AM

Originally Posted by redban

If a player breaks 56 after going 0-0 in a whole game, people would look at it differently from Joe D's original record.

Oh well. No matter how many people look at it differently, it won't change anything.

BTW, some people think that Joe D's record is a bit tainted too.
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/Who...3694104&page=1

Like during the ABs where the player walks - unless it's an intentional walk - wasn't the hitter trying to get a hit during the AB?

Wasn't the pitcher trying to throw strikes?

He went up the batter's box, looked at every pitch, probably swung at some and fouled it off, and he didn't get the hit. Even if he walked and didn't make an out, he still didn't get a hit.

He also didn't have an AB.