Results 1 to 24 of 24

Thread: BBF Mets franchise HOF round two

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34

    BBF Mets franchise HOF round two

    This election will close on October 29, 2011, at 7:00 a.m EDT.

    This is the second round for this franchise. The first round is here


    We inducted the following players:
    Dwight Gooden
    Keith Hernandez
    Howard Johnson
    Jerry Koosman
    Mike Piazza
    Tom Seaver
    Darryl Strawberry

    And the following contributors:
    Frank Cashen
    Gil Hodges
    Davey Johnson

    PLEASE READ THE FORMAT AND RULES SECTION BEFORE VOTING. THANK YOU.

    FORMAT AND RULES

    Purpose: The purpose of this project is to create a Hall of Fame for each franchise whereby each franchise will honor those individuals whose contributions and accomplishments are most notable, significant, and enduring to that franchise's history. This project is not about simply honoring those with the best statistics with each franchise.

    Standards: Each franchise has its own unique history and context, and thus contributions and accomplishments that may stand out remarkably within one franchise's history, may not be so remarkable in another franchise's history. Standards from franchise to franchise will inherently vary, and thus there should be no impetus to create equal standards among the franchises or to aspire to the standards of the National Baseball Hall of Fame. Consequently, subjectivity within the context of the franchise in question will play an inevitable role when considering an individual's contributions and accomplishments with respect to that franchise. In sum, a franchise's Hall of Fame should be unaffected by the standards and contexts of other franchises as well as the National Baseball Hall of Fame, and should be entirely a product of its own history.

    Election Format: Elections will be conducted one franchise at a time starting in chronological order with the oldest continuously and currently operational franchise. Each election will last approximately five days.
    - Ballot Size: Voters can select up to 15 players and 5 contributors per election. There is no minimum ballot size.
    - Ballot Editing: To account for ongoing discussion, voters may edit their ballots as often as necessary through the end of an election.
    - Election Percentage: Any individual that is listed on at least 75% of either the player or contributor submitted ballots will be elected to that team's Hall of Fame. In instances where an individual receive votes as both a player and a contributor, that individual will be elected if listed on at least 75% of ballots in either category or if the individual's combined vote total is at least 75% of the category with the greatest number of ballots submitted.
    - Subsequent Rounds: After an election has been performed for each franchise, a second round of elections will commence, again proceeding in chronological order. A third round of elections (and perhaps beyond) may also be held depending on interest.

    Eligibility:
    - Players: Players may be considered by any currently operational franchise for which they appeared and are eligible either immediately upon officially retiring or after having not appeared at any level of professional baseball for an entire season for reasons not due to injury.
    - Contributors: Individuals that contributed in other capacities to a franchise may be considered, including managers, coaches, executives, owners, and broadcasters. Mascots are eligible. Contributors that are still active may only be elected by their current employing franchise, and cannot be considered by prior employing franchises until no longer active (this does not apply to individuals who are employed by a franchise only in nominal and/or non-integral ways, such as in scouting, consulting, or public relations capacities).
    - Multiple Capacities: The totality of contributions and accomplishments with respect to a franchise are to be considered, and thus an individual can only be elected once by a franchise. For purposes of ballot size limits, an individual should be designated either a player or contributor based on what the voter perceives to be the individual's greater role with the franchise. An individual should not be listed as either a player or contributor merely to facilitate ballot space for the other category.
    - Relocations/Renaming: Franchises that have relocated and/or been renamed, may still consider and elect individuals that were with the franchise prior to the relocation/renaming.
    - Multiple Franchises: An individual may be considered and elected by multiple franchises.

    Franchise History
    - Founded: 1962 (NL for entire existence)
    - Former Locations/Names:

    Titles
    - World Series Championships: 2 (1969, 1986)
    - Pennants: 4 (1969, 1973, 1986, 2000)
    - Division Titles: 5 (1969, 1973, 1986, 1988, 2006)
    - Wild Card Berths: 2 (1999, 2000)

    Helpful Links
    The following links are all courtesy of baseball-reference.com, baseball-almanac.com, and wikipedia.com, and may assist voters in determining an individual's impact on this franchise:
    - Franchise Almanac
    - All Batters
    - All Pitchers
    - Batting Leaders
    - Pitching Leaders
    - Most Common Positional Starters
    - Most Common Pitching Staff Alignments
    - Managers
    - Notable Owners and Executives
    - Notable Broadcasters

    Award Recipients
    - MVP Recipients (0):

    - Cy Young Recipients (4): Dwight Gooden (1985), Tom Seaver (1975), Tom Seaver (1973), Tom Seaver (1969)

    - RoY Recipients (4): Dwight Gooden (1984), Darryl Strawberry (1983), Jon Matlack (1972), Tom Seaver (1967)

    - Batting Triple Crown (0):

    - Pitching Triple Crown (1): Dwight Gooden (1985)

    Multiple All Star Selections (no adjustment for double selections for 1959-1962)
    Code:
    Rank 	Player			Selections
    1	Tom Seaver		9
    t2	Mike Piazza		7
    t2	Darryl Strawberry	7
    4	David Wright*		5
    t5	Carlos Beltran*		4
    t5	Gary Carter		4
    t5	Dwight Gooden		4
    t5	John Stearns		4
    t9	Keith Hernandez		3
    t9	Jon Matlack		3
    t9	Jose Reyes*		3
    t12	Richie Ashburn		2
    t12	Bobby Bonilla		2
    t12	David Cone		2
    t12	Sid Fernandez		2
    t12	Tom Glavine		2
    t12	Jerry Grote		2
    t12	Bud Harrelson		2
    t12	Todd Hundley		2
    t12	Ron Hunt		2
    t12	Howard Johnson		2
    t12	Jerry Koosman		2
    t12	Pedro Martinez		2
    t12	Willie Mays		2
    t12	Jesse Orosco		2
    t12	Rick Reed		2
    t12	Frank Viola		2
    t12	Billy Wagner		2
    
    * Player is currently active
    Notable Managers (with at least 300 games managed with this franchise or at least one pennant win)
    Code:
    Manager			Games		Win %	WS Titles	Pennants	Div Titles	Wild Cards
    Yogi Berra		588		.497
    Dallas Green		512		.447			1		1
    Gil Hodges		649		.523	1		1		1
    Art Howe		323		.424
    Davey Johnson		1012		.588	1		1		2
    Jerry Manuel		417		.489
    Willie Randolph		555		.544			1
    Casey Stengel		582		.302
    Joe Torre		709		.405
    Bobby Valentine		1003		.534			1				2
    Wes Westrum		380		.375
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    Players:
    Edgardo Alfonzo
    David Cone
    Sid Fernandez
    Cleon Jones
    Al Leiter
    Jon Matlack
    John Stearns



    Contributors
    Ralph Kiner
    George Weiss
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Off in left field
    Posts
    4,996
    Players
    Edgardo Alfonzo
    David Cone
    Ron Darling
    Lenny Dykstra
    Sid Fernandez
    Bud Harrelson
    Cleon Jones
    Al Leiter
    Dave Magadan
    Jon Matlack
    Kevin McReynolds
    John Olerud
    Rick Reed
    John Stearns
    Mookie Wilson

    Contributors
    Yogi Berra
    Willie Randolph
    Bobby Valentine
    Last edited by Nerdlinger; 10-16-2011 at 09:20 AM.
    *** Submit your personal HOF as your ballot for the Single Ballot BBF Hall of Fame! ***

  4. #4
    Players:

    Tommy Agee
    Wally Backman
    Hubie Brooks
    Gary Carter
    Dave Cone
    Sid Fernandez
    George Foster
    John Franco
    Jerry Grote
    Bud Harrelson
    Ed Kranepool
    Lee Mazzili
    Tug McGraw
    Rusty Staub
    Mookie Wilson

    Contributors:

    Ralph Kiner
    Bob Murphy
    Lindsey Nelson
    William A. Shea
    Mel Stottlemyre

    Player Queue:

    Lenny Dykstra
    Kevin McReynolds

    Contributor Queue:

    Joe McIlvaine
    Last edited by jjpm74; 10-15-2011 at 05:07 PM.

  5. #5
    jalbright and DJC, I notice John Franco is not present on either of your ballots. It can't be overstated how important Franco was to this franchise. He was the face of the franchise for 15 years and their closer for most of that time.

  6. #6
    Yes, Franco and Kranepool should be inducted long before Howard Johnson. How did he ever get in as a charter member?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    Quote Originally Posted by jjpm74 View Post
    jalbright and DJC, I notice John Franco is not present on either of your ballots. It can't be overstated how important Franco was to this franchise. He was the face of the franchise for 15 years and their closer for most of that time.
    He also amassed only 12.8 WAR in those 14 seasons. Pass.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by jalbright View Post
    He also amassed only 12.8 WAR in those 14 seasons. Pass.
    1. WAR is not a reliable tool when looking at relievers.

    2. You have Cleon Jones on your ballot who managed a whopping 17.3 WAR as an everyday player.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    3,322
    Players
    Edgardo Alfonzo
    Gary Carter
    David Cone
    Sid Fernandez
    John Franco
    Cleon Jones
    Ed Kranepool
    Al Leiter
    Jon Matlack
    Tug McGraw
    Mookie Wilson

    Contributors
    Ralph Kiner
    Bobby Valentine
    Last edited by Domenic; 10-16-2011 at 09:15 AM.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    3,322
    Quote Originally Posted by DJC View Post
    Players
    Carlos Beltran
    Just a head's up - Beltran is still active and therefore ineligible here.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Off in left field
    Posts
    4,996
    Quote Originally Posted by Domenic View Post
    Just a head's up - Beltran is still active and therefore ineligible here.
    Thanks. I must have been thinking of Carlos Delgado.
    *** Submit your personal HOF as your ballot for the Single Ballot BBF Hall of Fame! ***

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    Quote Originally Posted by jjpm74 View Post
    1. WAR is not a reliable tool when looking at relievers.

    2. You have Cleon Jones on your ballot who managed a whopping 17.3 WAR as an everyday player.
    WAR isn't perfect, but if he was, oh, a total of 10 WAR higher in the three measures I look at, I could go for him. As it is, he has 5.2 WAR in his best 3 seasons and a best 5 consecutive of 7.2. Jones had 15.3 in his best 3, and 16.6 in his best 5, plus his best season was for a world champion. Even so, he just squeaks in for me, basically because he really put everything into 3 years. Franco was there a long time, but IMHO he wasn't ever overwhelming with the Mets. It's also hard to do enough to get in when those whole 14 years total just over 700 IP. Interestingly, Franco was more valuable with the Reds in all three measures: 13.5 career, 9.0 best three, and 12.6 in best 5 consecutive. Basically, if he could have had a peak for the Mets like he had with the Reds, I think I'd support him.
    Last edited by jalbright; 10-16-2011 at 09:31 AM.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  13. #13
    Players:

    Edgardo Alfonzo

    David Cone

    Sid Fernandez

    Cleon Jones

    Al Leiter

    Jon Matlack

    Mookie Wilson

    Contributors:

    Ralph Kiner

    Bob Murphy

    Lindsey Nelson

  14. #14
    I'm going with the older bunch this time around.

    Tommie Agee
    Wally Backman
    Gary Carter
    Ron Darling
    Lenny Dykstra
    Sid Fernandez
    Jerry Grote
    Bud Harrelson
    Cleon Jones
    Ed Kranepool
    Jon Matlack
    Lee Mazzilli
    Tug McGraw
    Rusty Staub
    Mookie Wilson

    Contributors:

    Ralph Kiner
    Bob Murphy
    Lindsey Nelson
    Bill Shea
    Last edited by Cowtipper; 10-18-2011 at 03:11 PM.
    Check out my stuff for sale on eBay! Currently for sale: Lots of Dave Winfield and Vernon Wells!

    My website...
    My other website...
    My other, other website...

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    6,830
    Blog Entries
    4
    Cleon Jones
    Jerry Grote
    Tug McGraw

    that's all for me I need more than three or four seaons or else it's the HO guys that had a few good years with a team
    FWIW Franco was excrutiating throughout most of his tenure

    contributors:
    Joan Payson, unless she is ineligible HTF is noone voting for her she only was the owner from 1962 until her death
    Ralph Kiner
    Bill Shea
    Last edited by PVNICK; 10-18-2011 at 04:02 AM. Reason: typos but really to add my own glaring omission - Bill Shea

  16. #16
    Players
    Edgardo Alfonzo
    Gary Carter
    David Cone
    Ron Darling
    Sid Fernandez
    John Franco
    Bud Harrelson
    Cleon Jones
    Ed Kranepool
    Al Leiter
    Jon Matlack
    Tug McGraw
    Rusty Staub
    John Stearnes
    Mookie Wilson


    Contributors
    Ralph Kiner
    Joan Payson (PVNICK is right, she should have been in the first ballot)
    Bob Murphy
    William Shea
    Bobby Valentine

  17. #17
    Players
    Tommie Agee
    Edgardo Alfonzo
    Gary Carter
    David Cone
    Ron Darling
    Sid Fernandez
    John Franco
    Tom Glavine
    Jerry Grote
    Bud Harrelson
    Cleon Jones
    Al Leiter
    Jon Matlack
    Jesse Orosco
    John Stearns

    Contributors
    Ralph Kiner
    Bob Murphy
    Lindsey Nelson
    Joan Payson
    Bobby Valentine

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    We have passed the 6 vote mark, which means we could elect someone.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowtipper View Post
    Contributors to come.
    That's fine, just please either make it in a new post of either make a new post or send me a PM letting me know you've added the contributors. I don't want to miss your update. Thanks.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    6,830
    Blog Entries
    4
    I edited to add Bill Shea who I neglected to vote for. They only named the stadium after him. My bad.

  21. #21
    Contributors added.
    Check out my stuff for sale on eBay! Currently for sale: Lots of Dave Winfield and Vernon Wells!

    My website...
    My other website...
    My other, other website...

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    just giving the thread a bump
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    Only about a day and a half left in this election for anyone who wants to join in.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    southeastern PA
    Posts
    14,567
    Blog Entries
    34
    This election is concluded with nine votes on both ballots. I will post the official results of both elections below, with those over the ======= line elected, those under it not. The player results are first:

    8 Fernandez, Sid
    8 Jones, Cleon
    7 Cone, David
    7 Matlack, Jon
    == ==================
    6 Alfonzo, Edgardo
    6 Leiter, Al
    6 Wilson, Mookie
    5 Carter, Gary
    5 Harrelson, Bud
    5 McGraw, Tug
    4 Darling, Ron
    4 Franco, John
    4 Grote, Jerry
    4 Kranepool, Ed
    4 Stearnes, John
    3 Agee, Tommy
    3 Staub, Rusty
    2 Backman, Wally
    2 Dykstra, Lenny
    2 Mazilli, Lee
    1 Brooks, Hubie
    1 Foster, George
    1 Glavine, Tom
    1 Magadan, Dave
    1 McReynols, Kevin
    1 Olerud, John
    1 Orosco, Jesse
    1 Reed, Rick

    Now the contributors:
    8 Kiner, Ralph
    == ================
    5 Murphy, Bob
    4 Nelson, Lindsey
    4 Shea, William A,
    4 Valentine, Bobby
    3 Payson, Joan
    1 Berra, Yogi
    1 Randolph, Willie
    1 Stottlemyre, Mel
    1 Weiss, George
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
    A Lincoln: I don't think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •