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Thread: Ryan Braun busted for PED use; faces 50 day ban

  1. #451
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew C. View Post
    So when do the mods show up and warn people for personal attacks and inappropriate language?
    Just as soon as we're aware of it. Some folks seem to think we're just sitting around picking our noses, but we work hard to do the right thing with the resources we have. No one can be everywhere.

    Anyway, I've gone through the latest pages of this thread and taken appropriate actions where necessary.
    Put it in the books.

  2. #452
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaysFan_98 View Post
    Enough bro if you can't debate and you can't take others opinions without getting upset you don't belong seriously enough with the childish attacks what are you 10? My two year old son acts better then you Jesus H Christ.
    This is a good example of the type of post that's not allowed. I've left it alone as an example of what not to do.

    Focus on the post, not the poster.
    Put it in the books.

  3. #453
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    Quote Originally Posted by EdTarbusz View Post
    As long as they weren't being tampered with I wouldn't care.
    And the director of the most prestigious testing lab in this hemisphere stated that Braun's sample arrived unaltered, completely sealed and taped with the forensic tape... Unchanged since Braun himself participated in capping the samples and sealing them. The bag they were in. Same. The box? Same.
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  4. #454
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    Quote Originally Posted by KevinWI View Post
    Okay, I'll stop harassing the urine collector if people some harassing Braun.

    Oh wait, that won't happen? Guess I'll continue my character assassination of the urine collector then.
    The Urine Man did not fail a test. The guy who peed did. There is a difference.

    Many respected anti-doping professionals have stated they feel the sample was handled in an appropriate manner. Is keeping the sample in the custody of the fully trained, educated collector better than dropping it off at a business until Monday, where it would potentially come into contact with multiple employees with various levels of professionalism, training, work ethic etc?

    Obviously, both MLB and the MLBPA feel that way, hence the provision in thenCBA allowing collectors to store samples themselves in certain circumstances.

    The arbiter who cast the deciding vote either interpreted the passage in a new manner, knows more about how the collector acted and how the specimen was handled than we do than we do (obviously).



    Braun failed the test and that can't be changed. The sample was sealed with his involvement and arrived in the same condition it was in the last moment Braun laid eyes on it. Getting around those facts, and exonerating a man after a narrow 2-1 vote does not work for a lot of people myself included.

    Re: "Cardinalism" as weakly suggested by others. I'd fire McGwire myself if asked. When my 8 year old son found out McGwire used, he left his "Big Mac" aluminum bat in the team bat bag after the end of the season. He didn't want it. Smart kid. PED users are being treated PERFECTLY by HOF voters imo.
    Last edited by StanTheMan; 02-26-2012 at 06:42 AM.
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  5. #455
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    Any news out there... as reported by Dan Patrick... our esteemed pee collector's body language at the arbitration hearing was less than stellar. Reports of nervousness, etc. May not mean much. May mean something or at least be a piece of the puzzle.

    After sending a few initial tweets.. my sig is bouncing around twitter right now, lol. EDIT - I'll of course change the sig some day - so the phrase in question is "If the pee didn't ship you must acquit!"
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  6. #456
    He was nervous in front of a hearing? Wow, imagine that.

  7. #457
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    Read a good observation this morning:
    MLB told the world that they are "angry at the results", which is a direct slap in the face to the player involved. This is their idea of supporting a system they agreed to. Braun will be justified to turn his back on all future "requests for support" from MLB, such as the ASG and so forth.

    Bunch of bozos running this part of the show.

    Also: "If you didn't ship the pee, he must go free"
    Last edited by CandlestickBum; 02-26-2012 at 08:15 AM.

  8. #458
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanTheMan View Post
    The Urine Man did not fail a test. The guy who peed did. There is a difference.

    Many respected anti-doping professionals have stated they feel the sample was handled in an appropriate manner. Is keeping the sample in the custody of the fully trained, educated collector better than dropping it off at a business until Monday, where it would potentially come into contact with multiple employees with various levels of professionalism, training, work ethic etc?
    Obviously, both MLB and the MLBPA feel that way, hence the provision in thenCBA allowing collectors to store samples themselves in certain circumstances.

    The arbiter who cast the deciding vote either interpreted the passage in a new manner, knows more about how the collector acted and how the specimen was handled than we do than we do (obviously).



    Braun failed the test and that can't be changed. The sample was sealed with his involvement and arrived in the same condition it was in the last moment Braun laid eyes on it. Getting around those facts, and exonerating a man after a narrow 2-1 vote does not work for a lot of people myself included.

    Re: "Cardinalism" as weakly suggested by others. I'd fire McGwire myself if asked. When my 8 year old son found out McGwire used, he left his "Big Mac" aluminum bat in the team bat bag after the end of the season. He didn't want it. Smart kid. PED users are being treated PERFECTLY by HOF voters imo.
    FedEx is exceptionally equipped to handle things such as urine samples. They handle all sorts of chemical and biological packages internationally and are highly trained to do so. If you wanted to say, ship a sample of Ebola virus for instance, FedEx would be a good choice.

    (just pointing this out, I still believe the sample was likely un-tampered with)
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  9. #459
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    Quote Originally Posted by CandlestickBum View Post
    Read a good observation this morning:
    MLB told the world that they are "angry at the results", which is a direct slap in the face to the player involved. This is their idea of supporting a system they agreed to. Braun will be justified to turn his back on all future "requests for support" from MLB, such as the ASG and so forth.

    Bunch of bozos running this part of the show.

    Also: "If you didn't ship the pee, he must go free"
    The union also agreed to the system in place, and doubtlessly know that this sort of handling procedure was done in the past. They likely sat on it until the right moment to use it, too. Is this their idea of supporting the system?
    San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

    "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

  10. #460
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich the Giants fan View Post
    FedEx is exceptionally equipped to handle things such as urine samples. They handle all sorts of chemical and biological packages internationally and are highly trained to do so. If you wanted to say, ship a sample of Ebola virus for instance, FedEx would be a good choice.

    (just pointing this out, I still believe the sample was likely un-tampered with)
    Which may be why the collecter waited for the Fed Ex office to open on Monday morning.

  11. #461
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    Quote Originally Posted by CandlestickBum View Post
    Read a good observation this morning:
    MLB told the world that they are "angry at the results", which is a direct slap in the face to the player involved. "[/B]
    I don't see it that way. I think that MLB is angry at the results because a probable PED user got off on a technicality.

  12. #462
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    He's all natural, baby. The haters will have to accept the fact that he's been 100% exonerated.

    He is awesome.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by GiambiJuice; 02-26-2012 at 08:33 AM.

  13. #463
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    Quote Originally Posted by EdTarbusz View Post
    I don't see it that way. I think that MLB is angry at the results because a probable PED user got off on a technicality.
    Fine, but then they went public with it.

    A process which they were a part of developing and agreed to, and are expected to support. They have acted like a 6 y.o. having a temper tantrum after breaking a toy.

    Which is why none of the leaks are officially sourced, right? Because they are standing up for what they believe? No, it's being leaked out the back door. Why?

    Sorry you don't understand how morally and ethically bankrupt this is.

  14. #464
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    Donnie, Bum, Rich, Ed....

    Completely agreee with most of those recent posts. 6 or 7 of them... whatever the number. but....


    Fed-Ex
    is fully trained. Are the weekend Kinko's staff better equipped to handle the contents of the package in a manner improving upon how the man who has collected samples for various Pro Sports would handle it? BETTER? No. Adequate? Perhaps. Excellent at it? Also could be true. But we KNOW the collector would handle it properly. He did just that, as the sample arrived 100% unaltered and untampered with.

    MLB certainly feels he got off on a technicality. Knowing what I know (not nearly the whole story of course) I agree with Ed and MLB.

    Bum, MLB disagreeing with the arbiter is NOT an indication of lack of support for the system, merely on man's interpretation of the events.
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  15. #465
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    Quote Originally Posted by CandlestickBum View Post

    Sorry you don't understand how morally and ethically bankrupt this is.

    Morals and ethics are being pissed on (pun intended) all over the place, mostly by MLB.

    Yet I'm more likely to hit 30 HR's next year than Braun is to file a HIPPA violation lawsuit. The unaltered sample, untampered with, damning results etc. would wreck his HIPPA case, no?


    Is the bottom line here, NOT to get herpes? Is that the lesson?
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  16. #466
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    Quote Originally Posted by CandlestickBum View Post
    Fine, but then they went public with it.

    A process which they were a part of developing and agreed to, and are expected to support. They have acted like a 6 y.o. having a temper tantrum after breaking a toy.

    Which is why none of the leaks are officially sourced, right? Because they are standing up for what they believe? No, it's being leaked out the back door. Why?

    Sorry you don't understand how morally and ethically bankrupt this is.
    The players union also had a hand in developing the procedure and are also expected to support it. In attacking the very system they helped set up, it was they who threw the first "tantrum."
    San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

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  17. #467
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    Quote Originally Posted by GiambiJuice View Post
    He's all natural, baby. The haters will have to accept the fact that he's been 100% exonerated.

    He is awesome.
    With having gotten off on a technicality, I don't think anyone has to accept that he's been 100% exonerated. People just have to accept that he won't face any punishment for having rendered a positive test sample.
    San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

    "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

  18. #468
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    Quote Originally Posted by GiambiJuice View Post
    He's all natural, baby. The haters will have to accept the fact that he's been 100% exonerated.

    He is awesome.
    Testing positive and then getting off on a technicality is hardly the same thing as being exonerated.

  19. #469
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    Quote Originally Posted by CandlestickBum View Post
    Fine, but then they went public with it.

    A process which they were a part of developing and agreed to, and are expected to support. They have acted like a 6 y.o. having a temper tantrum after breaking a toy.

    Which is why none of the leaks are officially sourced, right? Because they are standing up for what they believe? No, it's being leaked out the back door. Why?

    Sorry you don't understand how morally and ethically bankrupt this is.
    I don't see this as morally or ethcially bankrupt. In my opinion this is how sports in the 21st century operates.

  20. #470
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    I don't really think that a HIPAA lawsuit would go anywhere. Is insurance involved here? And it's likely that he has already signed off on releasing medical records if HIPAA were to even be involved...
    Mike Hopper
    Former Gateway Grizzlies Intern

  21. #471
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog19 View Post
    I don't really think that a HIPAA lawsuit would go anywhere. Is insurance involved here? And it's likely that he has already signed off on releasing medical records if HIPAA were to even be involved...
    Even though the I in the acronym stands for Insurance, HIPPA deals with more than that. For example.



    .... The HIPAA Privacy Rule regulates the use and disclosure of Protected Health Information (PHI) held by "covered entities" (generally, health care clearinghouses, employer sponsored health plans, health insurers, and medical service providers that engage in certain transactions.) By regulation, the Department of Health and Human Services extended the HIPAA privacy rule to independent contractors of covered entities who fit within the definition of "business associates".
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  22. #472
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    Quote Originally Posted by EdTarbusz View Post
    Testing positive and then getting off on a technicality is hardly the same thing as being exonerated.
    I find a certain hilarious irony involved in trying to explain this point to a user with the nam GiambiJuice. Just a username of course, but telling nonetheless.
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  23. #473
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich the Giants fan View Post
    The players union also had a hand in developing the procedure and are also expected to support it. In attacking the very system they helped set up, it was they who threw the first "tantrum."
    Sorry. Where did the Players Union attack it? Braun followed procedure defending himself. Was that having a tantrum and attacking the process? Not sure what was done by whom that could be referred to this way.

  24. #474
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    Quote Originally Posted by EdTarbusz View Post
    I don't see this as morally or ethcially bankrupt. In my opinion this is how sports in the 21st century operates.
    You make two very different statements with implied causation:
    This is how it's run now.
    Because this is how it's run, it's ethical and not amoral?

    I say then, if that's the case: sports in the 21st century is ethically and morally bankrupt and run by cowards.

  25. #475
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanTheMan View Post
    Bum, MLB disagreeing with the arbiter is NOT an indication of lack of support for the system, merely on man's interpretation of the events.
    It's how that disagreement was acted out on.

    Of course they disagreed, nobody had to tell us that.

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