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Thread: 1901 - Present Keeper League Discussion

  1. #126
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    I've been silent so far regarding the franchise player on a single team through his career discussion but thought I'd weigh in. I actually don't have any problem with the rule as it is currently written. As an aging superstar with the franchise tag begins to fade, management can decide to if he's worth the franchise player's salary and either keep him or allow him to be a FA. If for sentimental reasons, I want to sign the former FP as a RFA, I can overpay market price and keep him or I can let him walk. I think this closely mimics what happens in real life. There are plenty of aging stars who think they're worth more than their career franchise are willing to pay them and they finish the last year or two of their career with a different team. The market, and to a degree the original team's sentimentality for the player, will determine what happens.
    Dan
    CKL - Maloy Boys
    P2PKL - Detroit Tigers

  2. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmadachik View Post
    I plan on changing the playoffs to 7 games for both rounds
    Good, glad to hear that.

    The bottom 4 teams going to the lottery is also a change I am making but haven't written it in yet
    Glad to hear that too.

    The franchise player rule is just a way to keep up to 2 players at below market value. I think with the RFA we will see some overbidding for players and I like the Idea of having a couple lifers available that won't break the bank.
    I'm definitely not opposed to it, as I was one of the original proponents of the Franchise Player rule. It was merely offering the alternative option.

    Let me say that I think you've done a great job whipping this together, and I hope it has the same success as the CKL has had.
    You see, you spend a good deal of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time. J. Bouton

  3. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by scubadan View Post
    I've been silent so far regarding the franchise player on a single team through his career discussion but thought I'd weigh in. I actually don't have any problem with the rule as it is currently written. As an aging superstar with the franchise tag begins to fade, management can decide to if he's worth the franchise player's salary and either keep him or allow him to be a FA. If for sentimental reasons, I want to sign the former FP as a RFA, I can overpay market price and keep him or I can let him walk. I think this closely mimics what happens in real life. There are plenty of aging stars who think they're worth more than their career franchise are willing to pay them and they finish the last year or two of their career with a different team. The market, and to a degree the original team's sentimentality for the player, will determine what happens.
    Actually, under the RFA rule I don't think you would even be overpaying, or not very much. RFAs are likely to get bid to their true market value, or very close to it, and the present team only has to match the highest offer, not raise it, in order to keep the player. You might occasionally overpay slightly if you choose to keep the guy, but probably not by very darn much.

    I personally think the RFA rule was a real stroke of genius on Rich's part and is a great rule. As for Franchise Players, I also like Rich's idea of one batter and one pitcher, although if you're going to have more than one my absolute preference would be letting the owner choose both. This FP thing seems to be the last issue to be hammered out, and getting a lot of discussion on it is a good thing.
    You see, you spend a good deal of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time. J. Bouton

  4. #129
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    Thanks guys. I think we are going to roll with the Franchise player rule as it is currently written. As things stand now we are at a firm 11 owners and on the fence with one more. I will be releasing a final file for the 1901 season once I get the team info, and I would like to draw for the redraft so we can start putting together our draft boards. I will work it so our offseason does not coincide with the CKL off season from this point on.
    Last edited by rmadachik; 02-08-2012 at 09:24 PM.
    Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah

  5. #130
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    If I may offer one belated suggestion to the franchise player debate, what about letting people have any number of "franchise players" but at an ever increasing cost? The first one would cost 10 or 12 million, whatever we decided on. The next one could cost 4 or 5 million more and the third another 4 or 5 million. So it could be something like this:
    1st Franchise player 10 million
    2nd Franchise player 15 million
    3rd Franchise player 20 million

    If you cut one, the remaining franchise players still have the same contract. So if you have 3 and you cut your 10 million man, the other two still have 15 and 20 million dollar contracts, but your next franchise player will only cost 10 million.
    "I will calmly wait for my induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame."
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  6. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Windy City Fan View Post
    If I may offer one belated suggestion to the franchise player debate, what about letting people have any number of "franchise players" but at an ever increasing cost? The first one would cost 10 or 12 million, whatever we decided on. The next one could cost 4 or 5 million more and the third another 4 or 5 million. So it could be something like this:
    1st Franchise player 10 million
    2nd Franchise player 15 million
    3rd Franchise player 20 million

    If you cut one, the remaining franchise players still have the same contract. So if you have 3 and you cut your 10 million man, the other two still have 15 and 20 million dollar contracts, but your next franchise player will only cost 10 million.
    Great suggestion Craig. I like this idea, although with the RFA rule Rich has implemented it might not be necessary.
    You see, you spend a good deal of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time. J. Bouton

  7. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmadachik View Post
    Thanks guys. I think we are going to roll with the Franchise player rule as it is currently written. As things stand now we are at a firm 11 owners and on the fence with one more. I will be releasing a final file for the 1901 season once I get the team info, and I would like to draw for the redraft so we can start putting together our draft boards. I will work it so our offseason does not coincide with the CKL off season from this point on.
    Rich, I don't know if you've already answered this question somewhere and I missed it, but I presume this will be a snake style draft rather than a straight draft, correct? That is, whoever gets the #1 pick won't pick again until #24, while the poor schmuck who gets #12 will also get #13.

    I'm also presuming that once you set up the draft list, we will select ballparks in reverse order of the player draft. Is that correct?

    Thanks!
    You see, you spend a good deal of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time. J. Bouton

  8. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by catcher24 View Post
    Rich, I don't know if you've already answered this question somewhere and I missed it, but I presume this will be a snake style draft rather than a straight draft, correct? That is, whoever gets the #1 pick won't pick again until #24, while the poor schmuck who gets #12 will also get #13.

    I'm also presuming that once you set up the draft list, we will select ballparks in reverse order of the player draft. Is that correct?

    Thanks!
    both of those assumptions are absolutely correct
    Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah

  9. #134
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    I posted this before, but I think it was the wrong thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Wade8813 View Post
    Also, are we going to have some sort of waiver system? I'd be against that idea.

    I can't remember off the top of my head... are we going to allow trading for draft picks? I believe CKL does, but I don't remember seeing it spelled out in the rules.
    The Dark Knight is the best movie I've ever seen.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDxgNjMTPIs

  10. #135
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    There is no waivers system. free agents can be signed at any time for a minimum 250k one year contract. Trading for draft picks will definately be allowed and encouraged.
    Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah

  11. #136
    Just checked web site. Great work. BUT... please correct city name. It is ASYLUM with one "S". Not ASSylum. Thanks.
    Ed
    There are 10 kinds of people. Those who get binary and those who don't.

  12. #137
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    Got it Ed ... all fixed
    Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah

  13. #138
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    Heck, I liked Rich's spelling better....
    You see, you spend a good deal of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time. J. Bouton

  14. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by catcher24 View Post
    Heck, I liked Rich's spelling better....
    Still listed as ASSylum on draft pages.
    There are 10 kinds of people. Those who get binary and those who don't.

  15. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by buppers View Post
    Still listed as ASSylum on draft pages.
    I was an English major .... my mind is not made to spell asylum that way lol
    Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah

  16. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by rmadachik View Post
    I was an English major .... my mind is not made to spell asylum that way lol
    Hey, I don't mind changing it to ASSylum Inmates BUTT....It will require me posting a new team Logo
    There are 10 kinds of people. Those who get binary and those who don't.

  17. #142
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    How does this program rate people defensively?

    In other words, does it count Jeter as a good fielder or a bad one?
    The Dark Knight is the best movie I've ever seen.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDxgNjMTPIs

  18. #143
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    --Defensive ratings are strictly by the numbers, not reputation. You see some well regarded fielders with surprisingly low rating and vice versa. Also some guys who got a bad rep by making lots of errors will actually have good range (others will have bad range, but make few errors). And there will be swings in range from year to year, so don't expect the gold glover you draft this year to neccessarily achor your defense going forward.
    --Actually the above is true for seasons actually programmed by DMB. These early seasons are home brews by assorted gamers and may be based more on reputation? They have also been edited by Rich for our league so he would be better able to answer the question on reputation vs defensive stats.

  19. #144
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    I know a lot (most?) of the home brew seasons rate a high percentage of players as average, unless there is good evidence that rating should be adjusted one way or another. It also depends to an extent on how much time and effort a guy was willing to devote to digging up those fielding stats. I know Scott spent hours doing it because he told me how he went about assigning his fielding ratings, but Scott was a Diamond Mind anomaly, and I doubt there are a dozen guys in the world who devote the amount of time and effort that he did to DM.
    You see, you spend a good deal of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time. J. Bouton

  20. #145
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    lew is right ... in these early homebrew seasons most players do have an average rating. One of the big adjustments I made to the era settings is I have normalized the error rate. There will still be more errors in the first 20 years but not at such an extreme rate. I am going to take lew up on his offer to creat a list of player fielding ratings for a 4 to 5 year period for those owners who are interested.
    Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah

  21. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmadachik View Post
    Rookie pay structure will be as follows:
    1-4: 3M
    5-8: 2.5M
    9-12: 2M
    13-16: 1.5M
    17-24: 1M
    25-32: 750K
    3rd round: 500K
    4th round: 250K
    There will only be 4 rounds
    Quote Originally Posted by rmadachik View Post
    1901 Season Redraft Rules

    All players from the year 1901 will be re-drafted. Player salaries and contract length for this initial draft will be automatic depending on what round they are taken.

    Round 1 - 15M
    Round 2 - 10M
    Round 3 - 8M
    Round 4 - 7M
    Round 5 - 6M
    Round 6 - 5M
    Round 7 - 4M
    Round 8 - 3M
    Round 9-12 - 2M
    Round 13-17 - 1M
    Round 18-21 - 750K
    Round 22-25 - 500K
    Round 26-30 - 250K

    Contract lengths will be as follows

    Round 1-2 - up to 8 years
    Round 3-5 - up to 6 years
    Round 6-10 - up to 5 years
    Round 11-15 - up to 4 years
    Round 16-30 - up to 3 years

    For the first draft you will need to choose contract lengths at the time your pick is made.
    I like the format of the rookie draft better, where the first several picks are differentiated in value. But I think that at least the top picks of the rookie draft should be more like the 1901 redraft, with significantly higher salaries. The #1 rookie each year is almost certainly going to be worth at least $10 mil, and possibly up to $20-25 million. Paying $21 million over 7 years for $175 million in value is absurdly unfair
    The Dark Knight is the best movie I've ever seen.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDxgNjMTPIs

  22. #147
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    Rich, with only 12 teams in the league, you should probably adjust the rookie pay structure. 25-32 will be most of the third round.

    Also, I like the way the CKL does rookie pay. It's more realistic that way (real life rookies get paid far below market value), and also makes rebuilding easier simply by adding cap space. Also, it increases the value of draft picks, leading to more player movement and thus more league activity.

  23. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Bedard View Post
    Rich, with only 12 teams in the league, you should probably adjust the rookie pay structure. 25-32 will be most of the third round.
    I agree with Eric. The rookie pay schedules for P2PKL and CKL are the same. However, P2PKL is a 12 team league, and the CKL is a 16 team league.

    Jack
    Illegitimi Non Carborundum

  24. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Bedard View Post
    Rich, with only 12 teams in the league, you should probably adjust the rookie pay structure. 25-32 will be most of the third round.
    I agree with Eric. The rookie pay schedules for P2PKL and CKL are the same. However, P2PKL is a 12 team league, and the CKL is a 16 team league.

    Jack
    Illegitimi Non Carborundum

  25. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Bedard View Post
    Rich, with only 12 teams in the league, you should probably adjust the rookie pay structure. 25-32 will be most of the third round.

    Also, I like the way the CKL does rookie pay. It's more realistic that way (real life rookies get paid far below market value), and also makes rebuilding easier simply by adding cap space. Also, it increases the value of draft picks, leading to more player movement and thus more league activity.
    I purpose the following

    1-4: 3M
    5-8: 2.5M
    9-12: 2M
    13-16: 1.5M
    17-20: 1M
    21-24: 750K
    3rd round: 500K
    4th round: 250K
    Quote
    "A ballplayer has to just go out and be mean. You can't play half-heartedly. If you do, there's someone right over your shoulder that'll take your job away. If you don't do your job, what they're paying you for, why should they pay you? You just can't put in eight hours, that's what a lot of people don't realize about athletes. Very few people realize the pressure." Dave Kingman

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