The Return of the Jedi (Andy Pettite)

[GiambiJuice]

The title of this entire thread- in and of itself- proves how incredibly (read: sickly) prevalent the coastal bias is in baseball...particularly pointed towards NY. It conjures lore and infuses effusive, ongoing, and ultimately very much unwarranted hype and sophistry. Pettitte is just one of dozens who got nabbed; his record is (and stats are) much better than they should be, because of the rotations he's been placed on. On a .500 or small market team, you people wouldn't even remember him beyond referencing him obliquely in a discussion of some other Yankee.

If Pettitte had come up in the Mariners or Padres farm system, nobody here would give a ****, would hardly raise an eyebrow...much less wear jerseys, get nostalgic, and carry on threads containing hundreds of posts on the guy.

We can't help it that New York is the epicenter of baseball (and sports in general) in America and that the Yankees will always be the most interesting and relevant team in either league.

It's an inconvenient truth for Yankee haters.

[csh19792001]

We can't help it that New York is the epicenter of baseball (and sports in general) in America and that the Yankees will always be the most interesting and relevant team in either league.

It's an inconvenient truth for Yankee haters.

Substitute "most hyped" for "most interesting"

They had a real ball club in the 90's, made of home grown, humble, guys who were real teammates. Guys like O'Neil and Brosius. This was before they starting trying- and not even with any transparency, at that- to straight up buy championships. (We've seen how incredibly well buying the biggest egos with the best stats and traying to mash them together in the clubhouse has worked the past 10 years.)

http://www.theonion.com/articles/yan...very-playe,32/

The turning point for me- when everything corrupt and sickening about that franchise- came in 03' when the Marlins- 20th in payroll- but a real TEAM, totally outplayed the Yankees with twice the heart and a fraction of the purported talent.

What's inconvenient is that there is still a total lack of fiscal parity in MLB. What is tremendously refreshing is watching the most arrogant and overindulgent team in sports history win only one World Series in the last 10 years. I'd invite someone not from NY and not a NYY fan to watch the YES Network for a week....especially the "Yankeeographies"..talk about cloying, disingenuous tripe. One hagiography after the other. They pain a total degenerate like Mickey Mantle out to be a hero to kids across the world, and worthy sainthood.

[quagmire]

And why are you here in the Yankees forum in a thread talking about the return of Pettitte, trash talking the Yankees? I don't come to the Cardinals forums and trash talk your team. Especially if a team favorite retired and comes back......

[GiambiJuice]

They had a real ball club in the 90's, made of home grown, humble, guys who were real teammates. Guys like O'Neil and Brosius. This was before they starting trying- and not even with any transparency, at that- to straight up buy championships. (We've seen how incredibly well buying the biggest egos with the best stats and traying to mash them together in the clubhouse has worked the past 10 years.)

1) Neither O'Neill nor Brosius were homegrown Yankees.
2) Look at the 2009 Yankees, the most recent championship team. Oh nevermind, you're right, They didn't get any significant contributions that year from their homegrown guys....

...except for Derek Jeter, Jorge Posada, Andy Pettitte, Mariano Rivera, Robinson Cano, Melky Cabrera, Brett Gardner, Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain, David Robertson, Phil Coke, Hideki Matsui (technically not "homegrown", but has only played for the Yankees) Alfredo Aceves, and I can keep going...

Now let's compare them with the most recent world champion, the 2011 St Louis Cardinals:

Your five primary starting pitchers for last season's championship run were Chris Carpenter, Jaime Garcia, Kyle Loshe, Jake Westbrook, and Edwin Jackson. Only one of them (Gracia) is homegrown. Carpenter, Lohse, and Westbrook were signed as Free Agents and Jackson arrived in a midseason trade.

Two of you top 3 position players, Berkman and Holliday. Homegrown? Yeah right. Berkman was signed as a Free Agent and Holliday arrived in a midseason trade and you liked him so much that when he became a free agent, you gave him $120 million to stay. So that's 4 of your 5 starters and 2 of your 3 best hitters poached from other teams.

I haven't done the research, but I would be surprised if the 2009 Yankees weren't one of the more "homegrown" world series champions of the past decade.

You can step down off your soapbox now.

[solderjockey]

made of home grown, humble, guys who were real teammates. Guys like O'Neil and Brosius.

who ironically weren't home grown.

They pain a total degenerate like Mickey Mantle out to be a hero to kids across the world, and worthy sainthood.

At the time the extra curricular stuff wasn't made public.

[WEB]

Even the media is quoting me on him:
DOUBLE TALK:

What Andy Pettitte said: “It’s time to put my pom-poms on and be a cheerleader.”

What Andy Pettitte meant to say: “I would fit in perfectly in the YES broadcast booth.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ch...#ixzz1zM4huLLY

[TonyStarks]

Even the media is quoting me on him:
DOUBLE TALK:

What Andy Pettitte said: “It’s time to put my pom-poms on and be a cheerleader.”

What Andy Pettitte meant to say: “I would fit in perfectly in the YES broadcast booth.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ch...#ixzz1zM4huLLY

Enough already! If you wanna talk baseball that's fine, but if you're going to be trolling here do me a favor...don't.

[WEB]

My friend, the rules at BF are very clear we can produce newspaper articles with information with regard to a topic.

That is what the New York Daily news wrote on Sunday.

There is however no rule that says it must be positive or it gives anyone the right to discuss other members.

Rule of thumb per BF admins, discuss the post, not the poster.
Thank You.

[White Knight]

My friend, the rules at BF are very clear we can produce newspaper articles with information with regard to a topic.

That is what the New York Daily news wrote on Sunday.

There is however no rule that says it must be positive or it gives anyone the right to discuss other members.

Rule of thumb per BF admins, discuss the post, not the poster.
Thank You.

The rules are clear that you can't go in a Yankee forum (or Mariners, or Red Sox, etc.) and post constant negativity about that team. If it's a pro-player thread in that specific forum, only Yankee fans are allowed to criticize that player (like GiambiJuice with Jeter).

[WEB]

The rules are clear that you can't go in a Yankee forum (or Mariners, or Red Sox, etc.) and post constant negativity about that team. If it's a pro-player thread in that specific forum, only Yankee fans are allowed to criticize that player (like GiambiJuice with Jeter).

This topic was not designated to be pro player only and does not say so in the topic description. The first page of this thread is full of Pettitte criticism nor is there any rule at BF that require a member to be a fan of any team when posting negative newspaper information about any specific player.

The rules do however say if you disagree with comments you are free to ignore that post which I respectfully suggest you do if it bothers you because that's not my intention.
Thank You.

[dominik]

This topic was not designated to be pro player only and does not say so in the topic description. The first page of this thread is full of Pettitte criticism nor is there any rule at BF that require a member to be a fan of any team when posting negative newspaper information about any specific player.

The rules do however say if you disagree with comments you are free to ignore that post which I respectfully suggest you do if it bothers you because that's not my intention.
Thank You.

I think we should not just insist on rules here. Criticism is OK but this is a yankee forum and guys here want to enjoy the yanks. this subforum is not meant to be objective but a fan forum. so calling a yankee hero a cheater (even if it is true) will not get you much love.

do you understand this?

[quagmire]

My friend, the rules at BF are very clear we can produce newspaper articles with information with regard to a topic.

That is what the New York Daily news wrote on Sunday.

There is however no rule that says it must be positive or it gives anyone the right to discuss other members.

Rule of thumb per BF admins, discuss the post, not the poster.
Thank You.

Think Tony knows the rules since he is the moderator of this forum.

There is a rule against trolling which you clearly are doing. You don't go to a forum and post just negative crap against what that forum is a fan of. I wouldn't go to a Toyota forum( I am a fan of GM) and post constant negative things about Toyota, bash Toyota, etc. So why are you doing it here?

[TonyStarks]

My friend, the rules at BF are very clear we can produce newspaper articles with information with regard to a topic.

That is what the New York Daily news wrote on Sunday.

There is however no rule that says it must be positive or it gives anyone the right to discuss other members.

Rule of thumb per BF admins, discuss the post, not the poster.
Thank You.

I am pretty familiar with the rules and I've been an active poster for quite some time as well.

I've made my suggestion to you...if you wish to ignore then you are doing so at your own peril. I'm not going to go back and forth with you on this. I've said what I had to say on the matter. If you disagree with someone or dislike a player that's fine, as my fellow posters here know I am not a Jeter fan and I have voice the opinion without trolling...which is exactly what you are doing.

I'm not going to repeat myself.

[WEB]

The media propaganda is flying today with contradictions everywhere in two local papers, let's hope MLB is doing it's job monitoring this rehab.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yanke...iYbM2XLvkY9C6K
Pettitte’s return on hold after setback

An X-ray taken Friday didn’t show the amount of healing Dr. Chris Ahmad, the Yankees’ team physician, wanted to see.

“Obviously it’s healing up, but it hasn’t healed up as much as [Ahmad] thought,’’ Pettitte told The Post before last night’s game against the Red Sox at Yankee Stadium.

Pettitte, 40, pointed to his workout program on the recent West Coast tour that started in Oakland and ended in Seattle as a possible reason for the slower healing.

“In Seattle it swelled up,’’ Pettitte said. “I did a little too much in Seattle. Now I am laying low.’’

Pettitte threw off flat ground with his foot in a boot in Oakland, but wasn’t spotted on the field during the three days in Seattle.

“[Ahmad] didn’t see the healing in weeks two to four that he saw in the first two weeks,’’ Pettitte said. “I have to take it easy.’’

When Pettitte will be able to throw off a mound isn’t known.

“I think it’s healing, but it’s not at the point where he can get off the mound,’’ manager Joe Girardi said.
**********************************
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...icle-1.1124710
Brian Cashman says Andy Pettitte on schedule to return to Yankees in September


Andy Pettitte might be discouraged by the slow nature of his rehab, but Brian Cashman said the lefty’s fractured left fibula is exactly where the team expected it to be.

“As far as I’m concerned, there are no issues with Pettitte,” the GM said Sunday. “He’ll be back; that’s the bottom line. It’s no different than it was before.”

[VIBaseball]

If it's a pro-player thread in that specific forum, only Yankee fans are allowed to criticize that player (like GiambiJuice with Jeter).

Up to a point, I agree with WEB -- and disagree with this.

An honest, balanced critique, respectfully phrased, is the province of all fans. Baiting/taunting is the no-go zone.

[WEB]

Up to a point, I agree with WEB -- and disagree with this.

An honest, balanced critique, respectfully phrased, is the province of all fans. Baiting/taunting is the no-go zone.

All due respect, please let's only just discuss Monday's articles as related to the injury update, the rest is over three weeks old nor did I post these baseball articles today to make it a continuing debate over BF rules.

Topic only please.

Thank You.

[White Knight]

Guess who's back and better than ever? Andy!