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Thread: 2012 Red Sox Season Thread

  1. #261
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    The Red Sox has shown that they can hit BAD pitching, can they hit descent pitching??? Middlebrook is hitting around 380 at Pawtucket and hit his 9th HR last night.

  2. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwissRedSoxFan View Post
    How big is the chance, that he will have a TB-kinda-year in Boston during his contract? Still pretty high imo. But not looking good right now. I hope he feels ashamed of himself a little bit.
    I agree, but he has been pretty much useless in the first two years of his contract (two years in his prime). Right now, it looks ugly.
    Watching Derek Jeter make 40 defensive plays and then watching Adam Everett make 40 defensive plays at the same position is sort of like watching video of Barbara Bush dancing at the White House, and then watching Demi Moore dancing in Striptease. (Bill James)

    Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power. If he can continue to hit .260 or so, he'll be useful, and he probably has a future as a backup infielder. (Keith Law)

  3. #263
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    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    The Red Sox has shown that they can hit BAD pitching, can they hit descent pitching??? Middlebrook is hitting around 380 at Pawtucket and hit his 9th HR last night.
    There is a point to your post. The Sox seem to feast on pitchers that aren't top notch and struggle a bit more against pitchers that are top notch. But should we really be surprised that the Sox - as any other team in mlb - looks worse against Verlander than against Nick Blackburn? Probably not.

    Of the top of my head, the 2012 edition of the Red Sox have scored big against David Price (certainly top notch) and Jeremy Hellickson (last year's RoY).

    If they want to get to the postseason and more so if they want to succeed in the postseason they need to hit well against top notch starters. But it's still a long way until October and a lot can happen in that time.

    As for Middlebrooks, I assume most of us are aware of his great start to the season and quite happy about it. However, the Sox are smart enough to know that the best place for him currently (and likely until about mid season, barring an injury) is Pawtucket.
    Watching Derek Jeter make 40 defensive plays and then watching Adam Everett make 40 defensive plays at the same position is sort of like watching video of Barbara Bush dancing at the White House, and then watching Demi Moore dancing in Striptease. (Bill James)

    Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power. If he can continue to hit .260 or so, he'll be useful, and he probably has a future as a backup infielder. (Keith Law)

  4. #264
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    Well i don't really agree, the Red Sox have not hit very average pitchers the last couple years, specially on the road and have made them look like All star pitchers. As far of Middlebrook the point was that the Red Sox has a history of holding on to players too long and them having to throw in prospects to be able get rid of such players, now its the time to trade Youkilis, its well known in the industry that Middlebrook is ready for the big leagues.

  5. #265
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    Wow. I don't even know where to start?!

    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    As far of Middlebrook the point was that the Red Sox has a history of holding on to players too long and them having to throw in prospects to be able get rid of such players
    Care to name a few examples of players the Sox held on too long (and had to throw in valuable prospects to get rid of them) in recent years. Maybe Garciaparra? Pedro? Manny? Damon?

    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    now its the time to trade Youkilis
    well, major trades don't happen right now (nor would you want to do that right now). The earliest possibility is at the deadline, really, and there's still quite a bit of time until then.
    As a side note, I suggested the Sox should think about trading Youkilis for a pitcher in the offseason. I then suggested that a possible replacement they could target without giving up a ton would be this guy.

    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    its well known in the industry that Middlebrook is ready for the big leagues
    I guess that depends on the definition of "ready". But of course the Red Sox FO are just a bunch of dilettantes that have no clue. Maybe you would be willing to enlighten us as to what your status as an insider in "the industry" is.

    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    the Red Sox have not hit very average pitchers the last couple years, specially on the road and have made them look like All star pitchers.
    Sorry, but that's just unadulterated *********! Either you don't understand the game of baseball or you are delusional.
    Watching Derek Jeter make 40 defensive plays and then watching Adam Everett make 40 defensive plays at the same position is sort of like watching video of Barbara Bush dancing at the White House, and then watching Demi Moore dancing in Striptease. (Bill James)

    Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power. If he can continue to hit .260 or so, he'll be useful, and he probably has a future as a backup infielder. (Keith Law)

  6. #266
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    People seem to think that the time to trade Youk is now. That's absurd. The time to trade Youk if you wanted something of value was 2-3 years ago.

    You're not getting a bullpen savior for him right now. He's coming off two injury-shortened seasons, is struggling in the early goings, and makes a TON of money. No team is taking him on right now unless the Sox eat a bunch of money, and we wouldn't get anything useful in return.

    The smart thing to do is let him work his way out of his slump and see if someone is willing to part with a solid prospect for him at the deadline (when 1/2 of his salary has already been paid).
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  7. #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by Therwil Flyer View Post
    Wow. I don't even know where to start?!



    Care to name a few examples of players the Sox held on too long (and had to throw in valuable prospects to get rid of them) in recent years. Maybe Garciaparra? Pedro? Manny? Damon?



    well, major trades don't happen right now (nor would you want to do that right now). The earliest possibility is at the deadline, really, and there's still quite a bit of time until then.
    As a side note, I suggested the Sox should think about trading Youkilis for a pitcher in the offseason. I then suggested that a possible replacement they could target without giving up a ton would be this guy.


    I guess that depends on the definition of "ready". But of course the Red Sox FO are just a bunch of dilettantes that have no clue. Maybe you would be willing to enlighten us as to what your status as an insider in "the industry" is.


    Sorry, but that's just unadulterated *********! Either you don't understand the game of baseball or you are delusional.
    Thats right i don't understand the game, you are the expert, i should know that, how come didn't i realize that

  8. #268
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    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    the Red Sox have not hit very average pitchers the last couple years, specially on the road and have made them look like All star pitchers. As far of Middlebrook the point was that the Red Sox has a history of holding on to players too long and them having to throw in prospects to be able get rid of such players, now its the time to trade Youkilis, its well known in the industry that Middlebrook is ready for the big leagues.
    Reacting like this after posting something (that is false) is not really cool. Post it and back it up with a few stats or true observations. Or just think before you write. Because everybody is laughing, since you keep telling us that the Red Sox can't hit. Want to know why?

    Red Sox offense 2012 overall in MLB:

    2nd in batting average (.291), 4th in OBP (.344), 2nd in slugging (.480), 3rd in OPS (.824). (Even in absolute numbers they are top notch, having played two games less than most teams: 4th in total bases (287), .5th in hits and 1st in doubles (49)).

    Away: 4th in batting average (.277), 9th in OBP (.327), 4th in slg (.433), 5th in OPS (.760).

    Home: They are 1st in avg, 3rd in OBP, 1st in slg and 1st in OPS.

    Red Sox offense 2011 overall MLB:

    2nd in batting average (.280), 1st in OBP (.349), 1st in slg (.461), 1st in OPS (.810), 1st in runs (875), 1st in hits (1600), 1st in doubles (352), 9th in triples (39), 3rd in HR (203), 1st in total bases (2631), 1st in RBI (842).

    away: 6th in BA (.265), 2nd in OBP (.337), 1st in slg (.444), 2nd in OPS (.780), 2nd in total bases.

    home: 1st in BA, 1st in OBP, 2nd in slg, 2nd in OPS, 2nd in total bases.

    Red Sox offense 2010 overall MLB:

    6th BA, 3rd in OBP, 2nd in slg, 1st in OPS, 1th in total bases.

    away: 7th in BA, 7th in OBP, 1st in slg, 1st in OPS, 1st in total bases.

    home: 8th in BA, 6th in OBP, 4th in slg, 3rd in OPS, 4th in total bases.

    Even if we are stats-oriented and you, as you claim, are "scout-oriented", you can't deny the facts, that the Red Sox have been on of the best offenses away and at home the "last couple of years". That the Red Sox have made the opponent "very average pitchers look like All-Stars", you can copy and paste into the San Diego, Pittsburgh and Seattle message board and you might get a few nods.

    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    As far of Middlebrook the point was that the Red Sox has a history of holding on to players too long and them having to throw in prospects to be able get rid of such players
    Instead of telling TF he is the expert, which we all are not, otherwise we wouldnt post into this message board for fun, but sell our precious opinions to Bud Selig, I would love to see you back up your claim. What are you talking about? Lars Anderson?

    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    Now its the time to trade Youkilis, its well known in the industry that Middlebrook is ready for the big leagues.
    Now is not the time to trade Youkilis. His value is at an all-time low. He has one year left on his contract, has a low batting average and still gives you a better chance at winning as Middlebrooks over the whole season imo. On the other end of the table we have Middlebrooks, who will hopefully be our 3rd baseman in 2013. The Red Sox do good in not bringing him up right now. He only has 133 at bats above AA. He is red hot, but the Red Sox don't need him right now and will let him struggle first at AAA and be certain that he doesnt reach super-two-status. It would be stupid to get him now and pay him more arbitration years in 2015 or so, pay the salary of Youk (he will turn it around anyway) even if we don't get a real upgrade at 3rd for the whole season. Or do you think he would take Youkilis' no. 5 spot?
    Last edited by SwissRedSoxFan; 04-26-2012 at 01:24 PM.

  9. #269
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    In general, you shouldn't post opinions on an internet message board if you can't handle people disagreeing with you.

    Heck, that's what these places are for...if we all agreed, this place would be DULL!

    Or am I wrong?
    Visit my card site at Mike D's Baseball Card Page.

  10. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by scaffolds View Post
    Thats right i don't understand the game, you are the expert, i should know that, how come didn't i realize that
    I didn't say I was an expert. Nor did I mean to suggest that you have no clue. But explain this: How can a team be consistently among the top 3 offensive teams when -as you suggest - they only hit well against bad pitchers but not against good or even mediocre pitchers? Please explain your thinking.

    Also, feel free to answer the other questions I asked in my previous post. Who are the players the Red Sox held on to too long?
    Last edited by Therwil Flyer; 04-26-2012 at 02:13 PM.
    Watching Derek Jeter make 40 defensive plays and then watching Adam Everett make 40 defensive plays at the same position is sort of like watching video of Barbara Bush dancing at the White House, and then watching Demi Moore dancing in Striptease. (Bill James)

    Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power. If he can continue to hit .260 or so, he'll be useful, and he probably has a future as a backup infielder. (Keith Law)

  11. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike D. View Post
    In general, you shouldn't post opinions on an internet message board if you can't handle people disagreeing with you.

    Heck, that's what these places are for...if we all agreed, this place would be DULL!

    Or am I wrong?
    I disagree. ;-)
    "He's tougher than a railroad sandwich."
    "You'se Got The Eye Of An Eagle."

  12. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyK View Post
    I disagree. ;-)
    unfortunately Tony, you will need to back that up with stats

  13. #273
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    Tazawa looked really good I thought and Rich Hill will be activated soon. Hill was nasty before he went down last year. Hope this will help to stabilize the pen. (Yes I can back up all of that;-) )
    Watching Derek Jeter make 40 defensive plays and then watching Adam Everett make 40 defensive plays at the same position is sort of like watching video of Barbara Bush dancing at the White House, and then watching Demi Moore dancing in Striptease. (Bill James)

    Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power. If he can continue to hit .260 or so, he'll be useful, and he probably has a future as a backup infielder. (Keith Law)

  14. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyK View Post
    I disagree. ;-)
    WAAAAA!

    Um....yes...I mean "that's cool".
    Visit my card site at Mike D's Baseball Card Page.

  15. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by Therwil Flyer View Post
    Tazawa looked really good I thought and Rich Hill will be activated soon. Hill was nasty before he went down last year. Hope this will help to stabilize the pen. (Yes I can back up all of that;-) )
    Tazawa had become a bit of a "forgotten man", but before his injury, he was considered a guy with a good amount of upside who might be ready in short order. The switch to the pen is good for him, I think. He's got the potential to be a solid arm in the pen.

    I agree on Hill...sounds like he could be activated soon (goodbye Justin Thomas?) and could be a stabilizing force (or at least a nice lefty option along with Morales).

    I still think Melancon will be a major contributor this year. He's pitched well in Pawtucket so far (only 3.1 IP, but still) and if he can get right, that goes a LONG way towards solidifying the pen.
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  16. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike D. View Post
    In general, you shouldn't post opinions on an internet message board if you can't handle people disagreeing with you.

    Heck, that's what these places are for...if we all agreed, this place would be DULL!

    Or am I wrong?
    i'm with you. We are also here to debate, exchange informations and to know that we are not alone when we cheer or hate when things go as they go. But you also have to be cool with critics if you are talking nonsense, which is relative of course...

  17. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Boxer View Post
    unfortunately Tony, you will need to back that up with stats

    hahaha. Yeah, right.

  18. #278
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    Could someon explain Aaron Cook's "opt out clause" for me? Does it really mean he could walk after May 1? If so, wouldn't it be prudent just to bring him up?
    "I believe in the Church of Baseball. I tried all the major religions and most of the minor ones. I've worshipped Buddha, Allah, Brahma, Vishnu, Siva, trees, mushrooms and Isadora Duncan. I know things. For instance, there are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. When I learned that, I gave Jesus a chance." ~Ron Shelton, from Bull Durham

  19. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by maximum jack View Post
    Could someon explain Aaron Cook's "opt out clause" for me? Does it really mean he could walk after May 1? If so, wouldn't it be prudent just to bring him up?
    Yes, if he's not on the major league roster by May 1st, he can opt to become a FA and sign with any team.

    The only problem with bringing him up is who do you boot from the rotation? Doubront has pitched well, and Bard has a lot of potential. The other guys are all signed for good money.

    Cook is dominating AAA hitters, but has a career ERA over 4.50 (in Colorado, yes, but also in the NL).
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  20. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike D. View Post
    Yes, if he's not on the major league roster by May 1st, he can opt to become a FA and sign with any team.

    The only problem with bringing him up is who do you boot from the rotation? Doubront has pitched well, and Bard has a lot of potential. The other guys are all signed for good money.

    Cook is dominating AAA hitters, but has a career ERA over 4.50 (in Colorado, yes, but also in the NL).
    I heard, he had two opt outs. One by May 1st and one by June 1st. Like Mike said, I really don't want to dump anybody from the rotation right now. We can try to trade him or just let him opt out. I think Hill will replace Thomas not too far from today.

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