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Thread: FOUR Strikes and You're Out: Positional OPS+

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by GiambiJuice View Post
    1966 - Catcher - Joe Torre
    I was not expecting that. You are correct
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

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  2. #102
    Nobody else seems to have any interest/insight on the 60s second baseman. I've mentioned McAuliffe and Morgan- any thoughts?

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRon View Post
    Nobody else seems to have any interest/insight on the 60s second baseman. I've mentioned McAuliffe and Morgan- any thoughts?
    McAuliffe qualifies as a second baseman in 1962, 1967, 1968, and 1969. If his top seasons occurred outside those years, it's probably not him. Someone familiar with his career should consider that in whether to eliminate him as a possibility. As for additions to McAuliffe and Morgan, the only player I can think of is Rod Carew. The selection doesn't begin until the late '60s, so if he took a few years to round into form, then he's probably out too. Again, that's something for another person to answer.

    I think we should still take some shots at the 1970s right fielder. Brett and I narrowed it down to 1973 Reggie Jackson, 1978 Dave Parker, and 1979 Dave Winfield. There is no guarantee one of them is right, but we consider them the best possibilities.

    Because I am more confident in that, I am going to take a swing. Since brett has suspended his guessing, there is no way I can win. We both have three strikes, and he has far more correct answers. If I'm right, great, but if not, I'm willing to take one for the team.

    How about Reggie Jackson 1973 for right field?

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by AstrosFan View Post
    McAuliffe qualifies as a second baseman in 1962, 1967, 1968, and 1969. If his top seasons occurred outside those years, it's probably not him. Someone familiar with his career should consider that in whether to eliminate him as a possibility. As for additions to McAuliffe and Morgan, the only player I can think of is Rod Carew. The selection doesn't begin until the late '60s, so if he took a few years to round into form, then he's probably out too. Again, that's something for another person to answer.

    I think we should still take some shots at the 1970s right fielder. Brett and I narrowed it down to 1973 Reggie Jackson, 1978 Dave Parker, and 1979 Dave Winfield. There is no guarantee one of them is right, but we consider them the best possibilities.

    Because I am more confident in that, I am going to take a swing. Since brett has suspended his guessing, there is no way I can win. We both have three strikes, and he has far more correct answers. If I'm right, great, but if not, I'm willing to take one for the team.

    How about Reggie Jackson 1973 for right field?
    What about Pete Rose at second base? Though Carew makes sense.

  5. #105
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    Would you guys like a hint? Or maybe you should recruit some people to help you out? There's only about five answers to go.
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

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  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett View Post
    What about Pete Rose at second base? Though Carew makes sense.
    Good thought. Rose is available from 1963 through 1966. Anyone know anything about those seasons for him?

    A disclosure: I am using the Lahman fielding database to see if a player has played at least 50% of his games at a position. This tells me nothing of his performance, only whether he qualifies for the position, and so I think I am playing within the rules.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
    Would you guys like a hint? Or maybe you should recruit some people to help you out? There's only about five answers to go.
    We could use some of the people who voted earlier to take a few shots. Guessers have dwindled. If we remain stuck at the few we have still trying, we may need a hint.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by brett View Post
    What about Pete Rose at second base? Though Carew makes sense.
    Hmmm.... Rose was a second baseman he first 4 years of his ML career, but as I remember, he really became a more effective hitter after he left 2B. I think he might have hit .300 a time or two at 2B, but I think his best seasons offensively came later. So, he's possible, but....

    I think Carew didn't come up until about 67- maybe it was 66. So, he's a possibility too but his best years were in the 70s.

    Since McAuliffe was a shortstop during some of his prime, I'm inclined to think it was Morgan, though McAuliffe- and maybe the other 2- remain possibilities.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRon View Post
    Hmmm.... Rose was a second baseman he first 4 years of his ML career, but as I remember, he really became a more effective hitter after he left 2B. I think he might have hit .300 a time or two at 2B, but I think his best seasons offensively came later. So, he's possible, but....

    I think Carew didn't come up until about 67- maybe it was 66. So, he's a possibility too but his best years were in the 70s.

    Since McAuliffe was a shortstop during some of his prime, I'm inclined to think it was Morgan, though McAuliffe- and maybe the other 2- remain possibilities.
    How about Bobby Richardson? I don't enough about him to say for sure without looking up - but he had a few solid years in the 60's. I don't think Rose qualifies at 2B and not sure about Carew - he probably peaked in the 70's. Same with Morgan.
    WAR? Prove it!

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  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Zito75 View Post
    How about Bobby Richardson? I don't enough about him to say for sure without looking up - but he had a few solid years in the 60's. I don't think Rose qualifies at 2B and not sure about Carew - he probably peaked in the 70's. Same with Morgan.
    I'd be VERY surprised if Richardson's the guy. He had very little power and almost never walked. Almost all his offensive value came from his BA.

  11. #111
    I'll take a flyer- Joe Morgan 1967- 2B 1960s.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRon View Post
    I'll take a flyer- Joe Morgan 1967- 2B 1960s.
    Brave of you to guess, but incorrect. You have one strike left.

    If you guys can't rally any help, I will give you hint on each player (though they'll be difficult) or grant you another strike. If this is still going by All-Star Break, BBF has to wire me 500 dollars.
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

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  13. #113
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    Hint time:

    The 1960s second baseman attended Washington Heights High School. His agent was Jerry Simon. He worked as a batting coach following retirement.
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

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  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
    Hint time:

    The 1960s second baseman attended Washington Heights High School. His agent was Jerry Simon. He worked as a batting coach following retirement.
    Well since Pete Rose was born and raised in Cinncinnatti its not him.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
    Hint time:

    The 1960s second baseman attended Washington Heights High School. His agent was Jerry Simon. He worked as a batting coach following retirement.
    Hmmm.... I don't know what high school Morgan went to, but I'm pretty sure it was in Oakland, California. I don't remember him being a batting coach, but my memory could be failing me.

  16. #116
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    Unfortunately I don't have any other hints without giving him away. I'll also spill the beans for the 1970s shortstop:

    He was born in West Virginia and began in the Philadelphia farm system at age 18.
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

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  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
    Unfortunately I don't have any other hints without giving him away. I'll also spill the beans for the 1970s shortstop:

    He was born in West Virginia and began in the Philadelphia farm system at age 18.
    That sounds like Toby Harrah.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
    Hint time:

    The 1960s second baseman attended Washington Heights High School. His agent was Jerry Simon. He worked as a batting coach following retirement.
    I used up my guesses but Rod Carew grew up in the Bronx near Yankee Satdium which is just across the river from upper Manhattan where Washington Heights can be found and NYC students do not always go to a HS down the block.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by ian2813 View Post
    That sounds like Toby Harrah.
    Don't know. Are you wagering a guess? If so I need a year

    Quote Originally Posted by PVNICK View Post
    I used up my guesses but Rod Carew grew up in the Bronx near Yankee Satdium which is just across the river from upper Manhattan where Washington Heights can be found and NYC students do not always go to a HS down the block.
    True that you're guesses are used but you are more than welcome to help collaborate with the others for an answer.
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

    Cast your vote in the Dead-Ball Era Hall of Fame today!

  20. #120
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    Bumping this. If we've lost interest, I'll give the answers
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

    Cast your vote in the Dead-Ball Era Hall of Fame today!

  21. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
    Bumping this. If we've lost interest, I'll give the answers
    Lemmee think a little more. I'm pretty busy- my wife broke her foot- but I'll try another guess, hopefully later today.

  22. #122
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    Bumping this. It's been more than a week than the last post, and I think it's time to move on to the next version, if anyone's interested in trying another. But we should probably let this one run through the rest of the day.

  23. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by AstrosFan View Post
    Bumping this. It's been more than a week than the last post, and I think it's time to move on to the next version, if anyone's interested in trying another. But we should probably let this one run through the rest of the day.
    Allright- second base 1960s- I don't think it's Rose, there's no way it's Richardson, I've already guessed Morgan, though he's still a possibility. McAuliffe wasn't from NYC. The school thing makes me believe it's Carew. As I said earlier, he came up in 66 or 67- I'll give him a few years to get going. How about

    Rod Carew 1969?

    If I'm wrong, that's my 4th strike.

  24. #124
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    Correct, BigRon.

    At this point, we might as throw in all of our guesses
    "Allen Sutton Sothoron pitched his initials off today."--1920s article

    Cast your vote in the Dead-Ball Era Hall of Fame today!

  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrus4189Cobb View Post
    Correct, BigRon.

    At this point, we might as throw in all of our guesses
    Do you mean everyone is free to vote, even those who have struck out?

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