Page 12 of 12 FirstFirst ... 2101112
Results 221 to 240 of 240

Thread: RA Dickey

  1. #221
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    1,003
    I found it hilarious how you tackled none of my points, and just created a superficial argument abundant with your usual bias against the Wilpons.

    And what do you mean by "this isn't an honest rebuild"? So we're half-heartedly building towards the future? Does that even make sense? We'll probably be in the playoff hunt by 2015 (2016 at the latest) - when Wright is approaching middle age. He'll still be productive and an effective ball player at that age.

  2. #222
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Beautiful Shea Stadium
    Posts
    4,414
    Quote Originally Posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    I found it hilarious how you tackled none of my points, and just created a superficial argument abundant with your usual bias against the Wilpons.

    And what do you mean by "this isn't an honest rebuild"? So we're half-heartedly building towards the future? Does that even make sense? We'll probably be in the playoff hunt by 2015 (2016 at the latest) - when Wright is approaching middle age. He'll still be productive and an effective ball player at that age.
    Sorry you refuse to get the point. I'll repeat: dumping peak talent (and yes, regardless of age Dickey is peak talent) for prospects is the traditional strategy of teams that never win. Sometimes it works, but trading certainty for possibility is inherently a low percentage play. That's why the teams that most famously employ it have no rings.

    Payroll is down another $30 million or so this year and not a single big league quality player has been added yet.

    The reason a team in the most lucrative market in the world is using this method is the owners are denuding the team of as much revenue as they can and sticking it in their pockets. This, of course, is priority number one. If it wasn't they wouldn't fail to sign their number two draft pick because he wouldn't sign for below slot (among other things).

    What's so hard to understand about this???
    Last edited by Mongoose; 12-22-2012 at 03:04 PM.


    "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

  3. #223
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Far NE Philadelphia
    Posts
    7,510
    It's interesting going back and seeing what worked and what didn't when it comes to moving proven commodities for prospects. Many here in Philly believe it was the trade of Jim Thome to the ChiSox that helped start their run as it opened up a spot for Ryan Howard who was making no money at the time.

    When the trade was made, the return was an okay CF in Aaron Rowand along with some prospects. One of those prospects was Gio Gonzalez who, later on, was sent back to Chicago along with Gavin Floyd for SP Freddie Garcia - which will go down as one of the worst trades in recent Phillies memory.

    Had the Phils held onto Gio and let him develop (as the A's did), his breakout year in 2010 may have led to many different decisions. The biggest one in being, since he was a lefty - and the Phils already had Cole Hamels, there'd be no need to go after Cliff Lee. Gio would have been very inexpensive and even with his new deal is only about $8M of AAV - compared to approximately $25M AAV for an aging Cliff Lee. Just that extra $17M would give them the flexibility to address other avenues, and it also would have meant he wouldn't be a National.

    Lots of other woulda's, should's and coulda's of course. But it's sometimes fun to go back and see how things transpired moving forward.

    Back in '07, the Braves traded Mark Teixeira to the Angels. They let him hit FA following the 2008, and since he signed with the Yankees, they received the 25th pick overall in the '09 draft - giving them #24 & #25. They used that twenty fifth pick on Mike Trout.

    I still think this move helps both teams in the direction they're heading. The Jays are in win-now mode and the Mets' window should open up in a few years. We've seen the value in a top-flight catcher with Posey in SF, and even Mauer keeping the Twins from being more of an afterthought than they'd normally be. If Travis continues on his path, you all will be very happy having him in your everyday lineup when the Mets become players for the NL East once again in a few years.
    "Chuckie doesn't take on 2-0. Chuckie's hackin'." - Chuck Carr two days prior to being released by the Milwaukee Brewers

  4. #224
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    5,539
    Blog Entries
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by filihok View Post
    Amateur psychoanalysis aside...


    A pretty cool gif of why Dickey is difficult to hit


    http://www.fangraphs.com/not/index.p...ling-knuckler/
    Quote Originally Posted by Paulypal View Post
    Thank you for that. That is an awesome piece of footage. I think the catcher was surpised he even caught it.
    Quote Originally Posted by VIBaseball View Post
    What astounds me about that pitch is that it's over the plate -- the heart of the plate! -- at all times despite the multiple changes in direction.
    I agree. Super footage!

    Quote Originally Posted by Strawman View Post
    Look at the batter's face as the ball crosses the plate - brilliant!

    We're gonna miss Mr. Dickey.
    Indeed.

    P.S. Mongoose, I needn't remind you that this isn't the ownership thread.
    "And their chances of getting back into this ballgame are growing dimmer by the batter."


    Put it in the books.

  5. #225
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    1,003
    Sorry you refuse to get the point. I'll repeat: dumping peak talent (and yes, regardless of age Dickey is peak talent) for prospects is the traditional strategy of teams that never win. Sometimes it works, but trading certainty for possibility is inherently a low percentage play. That's why the teams that most famously employ it have no rings.
    Really? Then why doesn't every team in the MLB employ your method of running a ballclub? What team other than a choice few spend their way to a ring? You'd rather continue to lose than flip peak talent for young, cost-controlled players?

    Don't get me wrong - keeping top talent is critical to winning and contending, but we aren't winning. What don't you understand about that?

  6. #226
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Beautiful Shea Stadium
    Posts
    4,414
    Quote Originally Posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    Really? Then why doesn't every team in the MLB employ your method of running a ballclub?
    Because they don't have the advantage of being based in New York.

    When Wilpon hijacked the team the Mets ruled this town. I've watched as the Mets were redefined into a second, and now third or fourth rate franchise. Fact is the money is generated to fill almost any hole with a first rate signing AND perpetually rebuild by spending for the best talent in the amateur draft and among international free agents. Unfortunately Mets related revenue is not reinvested in the team; it's funneled into the Wilpons' pockets.

    Quote Originally Posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    What team other than a choice few spend their way to a ring? You'd rather continue to lose than flip peak talent for young, cost-controlled players?
    This is a false choice. The Mets can retain good players, fill holes through free agent signings, take on needed talent other teams want to salary dump AND perpetually obtain cost controlled players through signing high ceiling amateurs. The fact that they choose not to is the crux of the problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    Don't get me wrong - keeping top talent is critical to winning and contending, but we aren't winning. What don't you understand about that?
    We aren't winning because the team is being denuded of operating capital and its best players by an ownership that doesn't care about winning.

    Given Alderson's mandate this trade was probably the best he could do. The problem is his mandate is geared towards cutting costs, not fielding the best team possible.


    "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

  7. #227
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    1,866
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Grimm View Post
    It's interesting going back and seeing what worked and what didn't when it comes to moving proven commodities for prospects. Many here in Philly believe it was the trade of Jim Thome to the ChiSox that helped start their run as it opened up a spot for Ryan Howard who was making no money at the time.

    When the trade was made, the return was an okay CF in Aaron Rowand along with some prospects. One of those prospects was Gio Gonzalez who, later on, was sent back to Chicago along with Gavin Floyd for SP Freddie Garcia - which will go down as one of the worst trades in recent Phillies memory.

    Had the Phils held onto Gio and let him develop (as the A's did), his breakout year in 2010 may have led to many different decisions. The biggest one in being, since he was a lefty - and the Phils already had Cole Hamels, there'd be no need to go after Cliff Lee. Gio would have been very inexpensive and even with his new deal is only about $8M of AAV - compared to approximately $25M AAV for an aging Cliff Lee. Just that extra $17M would give them the flexibility to address other avenues, and it also would have meant he wouldn't be a National.

    Lots of other woulda's, should's and coulda's of course. But it's sometimes fun to go back and see how things transpired moving forward.

    Back in '07, the Braves traded Mark Teixeira to the Angels. They let him hit FA following the 2008, and since he signed with the Yankees, they received the 25th pick overall in the '09 draft - giving them #24 & #25. They used that twenty fifth pick on Mike Trout.

    I still think this move helps both teams in the direction they're heading. The Jays are in win-now mode and the Mets' window should open up in a few years. We've seen the value in a top-flight catcher with Posey in SF, and even Mauer keeping the Twins from being more of an afterthought than they'd normally be. If Travis continues on his path, you all will be very happy having him in your everyday lineup when the Mets become players for the NL East once again in a few years.
    Now that was an intelligent, well thought, fair and balanced post!! And from a Phillies fan!! Thanks for sheading some light on why it is not always best to just go out and buy the most expensive pieces each year and why IT IS a baseball decision to work and keep within a budget.

  8. #228
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    1,003
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongoose View Post
    Because they don't have the advantage of being based in New York.

    When Wilpon hijacked the team the Mets ruled this town. I've watched as the Mets were redefined into a second, and now third or fourth rate franchise. Fact is the money is generated to fill almost any hole with a first rate signing AND perpetually rebuild by spending for the best talent in the amateur draft and among international free agents. Unfortunately Mets related revenue is not reinvested in the team; it's funneled into the Wilpons' pockets.



    This is a false choice. The Mets can retain good players, fill holes through free agent signings, take on needed talent other teams want to salary dump AND perpetually obtain cost controlled players through signing high ceiling amateurs. The fact that they choose not to is the crux of the problem.



    We aren't winning because the team is being denuded of operating capital and its best players by an ownership that doesn't care about winning.

    Given Alderson's mandate this trade was probably the best he could do. The problem is his mandate is geared towards cutting costs, not fielding the best team possible.
    You do realize the Wilpons are in actually financial distress, right? Everything else you spout is just conspiratorial nonsense that you never back up with hard evidence. There needs to be a serious infusion of revenue, seeing as were running dry severely. To the point where Alderson said that he couldn't hand out any more $10+M contracts. Hype up the city all you want, but if ownership doesn't get it together we're going to have to rebuild the traditional way.

  9. #229
    The clueless Wilpons and their willing lackey Alderson will never do anything as admirable as R.A. Dickey did upon leaving the Mets.

    R.A. Dickey pens bittersweet farewell to the team and city that gave him a 'chance'

    A little over a year ago I was knocking around book titles with my publisher when we finally found a keeper. The minute I heard the words, “Wherever I Wind Up,” I liked the cadence of them. I liked the mystery of them.

    Most of all, I liked the way they captured the essence of my nomadic pitching life — which has now taken another completely unforeseen turn.

    I never expected to be writing a farewell “holiday card” to Mets fans. I never expected to be doing anything but celebrating the joy of the season with my wife and kids and looking toward the spring, and the start of my fourth season with an organization that gave me maybe the greatest gift an athlete can get:

    A chance.

    A chance for a fresh start. A chance to prove that maybe I could be somebody on a big league mound, an authentic and trustworthy pitcher, not just a retread with a weird name and an even weirder pitch — a man who was so in need of financial stability that he had to get talked out of taking a guaranteed contract to go pitch in Korea.

    The Mets gave me that chance almost exactly three years ago, and I will always be grateful to them for that. Only God could’ve written the narrative that has played out in the three years since. That is what I want to focus on, and what I want to hold in my heart.

    I am not going to lie to you, though. The trade was hard for me at first. This is where my heart was, where I wanted to be, where I lived out a story of redemption and felt that every one of you shared it with me in some form or fashion. I loved pitching for you. I loved your passion, the way you embraced me from the start, and the way you seemed to appreciate the effort I was putting forth. Every time I’d walk off the mound after an outing, I’d look in your faces, the people behind the dugout, and felt as if all your energy and support was pouring right into me — even when I was lousy. It gives me chill bumps thinking about it even now.

    Every organization has to do what it feels is in its best interest, and I have no doubt that that’s what the Mets did by trading Josh Thole, Mike Nickeas and me for two young players who, by all accounts, are terrific prospects. It doesn’t make saying goodbye any easier.

    From the beginning of last season to the end — when you cheered with all you had that Thursday afternoon when I won my 20th game — I felt that this was a shared journey, that we were all in it together. What a great way for an athlete to feel.

    There were so many special relationships I formed that made my time with the Mets so much richer. Not just in the clubhouse, either. I enjoyed talking with Bill Deacon, the head groundskeeper, about his craft, and all that went into it. The security people who helped my wife and kids get in and out of the family lounge, the policemen who helped me get out of the parking lot, the folks at the Hodges Gate — so many people went out of their way to be kind to me, and they should know how much it was, and is, appreciated.

    I was going to take out an advertisement to express these thank yous, but decided in the end that there was too much I wanted to say. So I am writing this instead.

    As I move beyond the sadness over leaving here, I know I have a tremendous amount to look forward to. The Blue Jays may need name tags on the first day of spring training, but once we get acquainted, well, this team could be something. I appreciate the welcome I’ve already gotten from them, and what they’re trying to build. We’ll see how it all unfolds.

    God has blessed me in so many ways. His grace and mercy are at the center of my life. I may not pitch for the home team anymore (a friend told me I now have to start calling myself a Canuckleball pitcher ) but wherever I go from here — wherever I might wind up in the future — I hope you know that I will never forget my three years in New York, and never be able to adequately thank you for everything you’ve given me.
    That folks, is sheer class. So I'll be rooting for this jersey in 2013:

    20121223-082041.jpg
    Cleon Jones catches a deep fly ball in F. Scott Fitzgerald's Valley of the Ashes, and a second-grader smiles in front of the black and white television.

  10. #230
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Beautiful Shea Stadium
    Posts
    4,414
    Quote Originally Posted by CokeMachineGlow View Post
    You do realize the Wilpons are in actually financial distress, right? Everything else you spout is just conspiratorial nonsense that you never back up with hard evidence. There needs to be a serious infusion of revenue, seeing as were running dry severely. To the point where Alderson said that he couldn't hand out any more $10+M contracts. Hype up the city all you want, but if ownership doesn't get it together we're going to have to rebuild the traditional way.
    I realize you don't always read my posts thoroughly and probably totally ignore the Ownership/Management thread. With apologies to Milladrive, I feel the need to respond. Here's Doug Stoffa's post from there in which he calculates how much the Wilpons make through television rights. I feel it's generally accurate:

    Quote Originally Posted by dstoffa View Post
    ...Do the math. Collectively everyone who subscribes to pay TV gives more money to ownership (via subscription fees, plus advertising dollars by simply putting your eyes on the channel, and then sometimes even not) than all those who buy tickets.

    According to the Television Bureau of Advertising, 85.2% of TV homes in the NYC DMA receive their television through cable. 12.4% receive it through an alternate delivery system (which may also cross over with the number who get it through cable TV). Only 3.8% of TV Homes get their TV via antenna.

    http://www.tvb.org/media_comparisons...et?ads_mkt=137

    The subscriber fees each RSN in NY is provided in this Times article:
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/12/sp...ight.html?_r=0

    Here are the number of TV homes in the NY DMA:
    http://www.tvb.org/media/file/TVB_Ma...DMA_Ranks2.pdf

    There are 7.384 million TV homes in the NY DMA. Let us assume that 85.2% of those home subscribe to cable TV, and inherently their RSN's. SNY commands $2.55 / mo / sub, thats $16 million a month, or $192 million a year JUST in subscriber fees. We are also not even considering revenue generated by selling ads on said RSN. It wouldn't surprise me if the ownership takes is $250 million in subs + ad fees + National TV money (ESPN / FOX)...
    Google the following quote: "An increase of just two hundred thousand fans would also add about twenty-five million to the team’s coffers."

    It appears on page 11 of this article:

    Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...#ixzz2FuGR7200

    By that reckoning 2 million fans equals $250 million. The Mets drew 2,242,803 million last year.

    In addition to cost of tickets they charge fees on tickets, for food alcohol and souvenirs, for parking...

    Total revenue then was probably in the $500 million range. Even if you assume the attendance figures were artificially inflated total revenue still had to be well north of $400 million.

    This isn't a "conspiracy theory"; it's simply adding up all the relevant information. I don't know how much money the Wilpons themselves have, but the Mets generate enormous cash flow. It has to be going somewhere. If it's not going into the team, it must be going into the Wilpons' pockets

    The strategy that drove this trade resulted not from a desire to improve the team, but from a lust to drain as much revenue as possible over the next 3 years or so. That's my gripe with the trade.


    "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

  11. #231
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    5,539
    Blog Entries
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongoose View Post
    I realize you don't always read my posts thoroughly and probably totally ignore the Ownership/Management thread. With apologies to Milladrive, I feel the need to respond. Here's Doug Stoffa's post...
    I'm glad I read through. I was about to move four posts to the Management thread until I saw this.

    Apologies accepted, and I understand the compulsions. Let's still try the best we can to steer things in the directions of the thread topics. ...even if it means copying a quote from one thread and replying in the proper one. Thanks much.
    "And their chances of getting back into this ballgame are growing dimmer by the batter."


    Put it in the books.

  12. #232
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    1,866
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongoose View Post
    I realize you don't always read my posts thoroughly and probably totally ignore the Ownership/Management thread. With apologies to Milladrive, I feel the need to respond. Here's Doug Stoffa's post from there in which he calculates how much the Wilpons make through television rights. I feel it's generally accurate:




    Google the following quote: "An increase of just two hundred thousand fans would also add about twenty-five million to the team’s coffers."

    It appears on page 11 of this article:

    Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...#ixzz2FuGR7200

    By that reckoning 2 million fans equals $250 million. The Mets drew 2,242,803 million last year.

    In addition to cost of tickets they charge fees on tickets, for food alcohol and souvenirs, for parking...

    Total revenue then was probably in the $500 million range. Even if you assume the attendance figures were artificially inflated total revenue still had to be well north of $400 million.

    This isn't a "conspiracy theory"; it's simply adding up all the relevant information. I don't know how much money the Wilpons themselves have, but the Mets generate enormous cash flow. It has to be going somewhere. If it's not going into the team, it must be going into the Wilpons' pockets

    The strategy that drove this trade resulted not from a desire to improve the team, but from a lust to drain as much revenue as possible over the next 3 years or so. That's my gripe with te trade.
    The strategy that drove this trade is an attempt to obtain the best catching prospect in baseball who could
    give you twenty homers and ninety RBIs for the next ten years and one of the best pitching prospects in baseball. Most experts love the deal and view it as potentially a deal that may be the deal that helps turn things around in the future. I will guarantee you that if the Mets kept Dickey you would have said it would have been because they got him for under market value and they know they can make money off him because stupid Met fans will pay to see him. No matter what the scenerio, you are able to weave it into a anti Wilpon sentiment. Too much hate.

    Go Team
    Last edited by rjsallstars; 12-23-2012 at 04:50 PM.

  13. #233
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Beautiful Shea Stadium
    Posts
    4,414
    Quote Originally Posted by rjsallstars View Post
    The strategy that drove this trade is an attempt to obtain the best catching prospect in baseball who could
    give you twenty homers and ninety RBIs for the next ten years and one of the best pitching prospects in baseball. Most experts love the deal and view it as potentially a deal that may be the deal that helps turn things around in the future. I will guarantee you that if the Mets kept Dickey you would have said it would have been because they got him for under market value and they know they can make money off him because stupid Met fans will pay to see him. No matter what the scenerio, you are able to weave it into a anti Wilpon sentiment. Too much hate.

    Go Team

    Viewed in a vacuum the move makes sense... My gripes are:

    1) Alderson under the Wilpons has been running the same cheap draft strategy as usual.

    2) If it's a real rebuild you get talent back for Reyes and Wright, too. They got nothing.

    A closer look indicates the main priorities are slashing costs and appeasing those who still buy season tickets. Dealing Reyes and Wright would have greatly accelerated the so-called rebuild, but they're in no hurry. Keeping payroll tiny for years seems to be the goal, winning be damned.

    Long, grueling pursuit of this Moneyball type strategy is playing out as a charade meant to excuse rock bottom payrolls for years and years. "We're rebuilding". For those pathetically desperate to believe in the organization this excuse is enough. Meanwhile year after year of horrible teams are unnecessary in a market like New York. There's enough revenue to rebuild and put a credible team on the field at the same time. 1/3 of all teams make the playoffs now. Tanking half a decade while the Wilpons replenish their bank accounts is unacceptable.

    More than the exchange of talent (and I do feel dealing certainty for possibility is generally a mistake) I'm annoyed at the additional tanked baseball seasons this deal heralds, and that it's bamboozled some into accepting the tanking.


    "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

  14. #234
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    1,866
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongoose View Post
    Viewed in a vacuum the move makes sense... My gripes are:

    1) Alderson under the Wilpons has been running the same cheap draft strategy as usual.

    2) If it's a real rebuild you get talent back for Reyes and Wright, too. They got nothing.

    A closer look indicates the main priorities are slashing costs and appeasing those who still buy season tickets. Dealing Reyes and Wright would have greatly accelerated the so-called rebuild, but they're in no hurry. Keeping payroll tiny for years seems to be the goal, winning be damned.

    Long, grueling pursuit of this Moneyball type strategy is playing out as a charade meant to excuse rock bottom payrolls for years and years. "We're rebuilding". For those pathetically desperate to believe in the organization this excuse is enough. Meanwhile year after year of horrible teams are unnecessary in a market like New York. There's enough revenue to rebuild and put a credible team on the field at the same time. 1/3 of all teams make the playoffs now. Tanking half a decade while the Wilpons replenish their bank accounts is unacceptable.

    More than the exchange of talent (and I do feel dealing certainty for possibility is generally a mistake) I'm annoyed at the additional tanked baseball seasons this deal heralds, and that it's bamboozled some into accepting the tanking.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongoose View Post
    Viewed in a vacuum the move makes sense... My gripes are:

    1) Alderson under the Wilpons has been running the same cheap draft strategy as usual.

    2) If it's a real rebuild you get talent back for Reyes and Wright, too. They got nothing.

    A closer look indicates the main priorities are slashing costs and appeasing those who still buy season tickets. Dealing Reyes and Wright would have greatly accelerated the so-called rebuild, but they're in no hurry. Keeping payroll tiny for years seems to be the goal, winning be damned.

    Long, grueling pursuit of this Moneyball type strategy is playing out as a charade meant to excuse rock bottom payrolls for years and years. "We're rebuilding". For those pathetically desperate to believe in the organization this excuse is enough. Meanwhile year after year of horrible teams are unnecessary in a market like New York. There's enough revenue to rebuild and put a credible team on the field at the same time. 1/3 of all teams make the playoffs now. Tanking half a decade while the Wilpons replenish their bank accounts is unacceptable.

    More than the exchange of talent (and I do feel dealing certainty for possibility is generally a mistake) I'm annoyed at the additional tanked baseball seasons this deal heralds, and that it's bamboozled some into accepting the tanking.
    Viewed in a vacuum the move makes sense Yes, then why criticize it? If you remember correctly Reyes got hurt before the trade deadline, he had no value when the time came to trade him. We have went into on numerous occasions why you do not give a guy turning 30 with a history of leg problems a 6 year contract. In only one year, the genuis owner who gave it to him has not only traded him but everyone else he overpaid for. Nobody even offered Reyes close to what the Marlins did. If that one dumb owner was not there, Reyes would have resigned with the Mets for a lot less, he had no other offers. I liked Reyes but I am a fan, not a GM or owner. Alderson did the right thing with Reyes, to bad he was hurt at the trade deadline. As far as Wright is concerned you fail to even consider why Wright was signed. What message would have trading Wright sent to the entire Mets organization? Wright came up as a fan of the team. Was drafted by them and has been the perfect employee from day one. Wright was rewarded for his loyalty and hard work. And yes, he should be one of the best third baseman for the next 5 years and was not signed to a ridiculous contract. He also plays one of the least grueling positions on the field. Your storys about the evil Wilpons when it came to Madoff, original pricing of tickets and the lack of Citi field having any "Met feel" were justified in killing Wilpon but that is ancient history.

    You are also flat out wrong as far as draft spending. Again the skimping on minor league talent is ancient history. Please read this story for more details. Facts top style everytime!!
    http://www.nypost.com/p/blogs/minorl...#axzz2FyVJVSVh

  15. #235
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    596
    Quote Originally Posted by VIBaseball View Post
    I *loved* Dickey, and though that Ken Davidoff's recent column in the Post painting him as a me-firster was a disgrace.

    That said, I think the trade is in keeping with what has brought the Mets into past upcycles: getting good *young* pitching.
    Sure, we don't know how Wheeler or Syndegaard are going to pan out yet, or if Harvey will sustain his success.
    Yet it's reminiscent of when Darling, Terrell, and Fernandez were obtained.

    Joe Rigatoni...what do you say?
    I was just catching up on all of the threads when I just saw your post.I apologize for taking this long in responding.
    Thank you for asking me for my opinion.And yes,I agree with you that it is reminiscent of when Darling,Terrell,and
    Fernandez were obtained.Mazzilli,who was once the face of the franchise although he wasn't as valuable as Dickey
    performance wise was traded to the Rangers for Darling and Terrell.Mazzilli,when told he was traded for Darling and Terrell
    said:"I never heard of those guys." Then Bob Bailor and Carlos Diaz were traded to the Dodgers for Fernandez.Then Terrell
    was traded for HoJo.And the rest is history.Naturally we all hope that d'Arnaud and Syndergaard give us the results that
    Darling,Terrell,Fernandez,and when Terrell was traded for HoJo gave.Happy Holidays to all of you!
    "You don't give up any runs,we'll guarantee you
    at least a tie." ~ Grote to Koosman

  16. #236
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Section 538, Row 1
    Posts
    7,726
    If you haven't seen this, you should...

    R.A. Dickey with the tweet of the day (source: Mets Police)
    X
    Archie Bunker: All I can tell you, Edith, is I'm surprised at you! Dragging me off to a moving picture like that! It was absolutely disgusting!
    Edith Bunker: Well, I'm sorry, Archie, how was I to know? I thought it was a religious picture, "Cardinal Knowledge!"

  17. #237
    According to this analysis, Dickey gives his team over 1 WAR even when he's not pitching due to affects of hitters having to re-adjust.

    http://www.fangraphs.com/community/i...dickey-effect/
    So in a season where there are 55 IP after Dickey in games (like in 2012) there would be a 16.6% reduction in runs given up in those 55 innings. If the bullpen’s ERA is 4.20 without Dickey it can be expected to be 3.50 after Dickey. Over 55 IP this difference would save 4.3 runs (or 0.4 WAR).

    Combine this with the saved starter runs and you get 11.9 runs saved or (1.2 WAR). This is Dickey’s underlying value with the team that he creates by baffling hitters. This 1.2 WAR is if Morrow has a 3.00 ERA normally and the bullpen has a 4.00 ERA. If Morrow normally had a 4.00 ERA than his ERA would reduce to 3.54 over the season with 10.2 runs saved for 200 innings (1.0 WAR) and if the bullpen has a 4.00 ERA normally as well, 4.1 runs would be saved there, equating to 14.3 runs saved or a 1.4 WAR over a season.

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by filihok View Post
    According to this analysis, Dickey gives his team over 1 WAR even when he's not pitching due to affects of hitters having to re-adjust.

    http://www.fangraphs.com/community/i...dickey-effect/
    I saw that - and some speculation it will hurt numbers for Niese and Gee.
    Cleon Jones catches a deep fly ball in F. Scott Fitzgerald's Valley of the Ashes, and a second-grader smiles in front of the black and white television.

  19. #239
    Quote Originally Posted by Strawman View Post
    I saw that - and some speculation it will hurt numbers for Niese and Gee.
    Those effects would be very small.

    The author found that the after-Dickey pitchers gave up 14 less runs over a full season. 10 of those runs by the starters who pitched directly after Dickey (other starters were not looked at).

  20. #240
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Long Island NY
    Posts
    3,221
    Finally saw "Knuckleball". I liked it alot. It makes me miss having Dickey around even more. Such a cool, down to earth guy.
    unknown brooklyn cabbie " how are the brooks doin"
    unknown fan "good they got three men on base"
    unknown brooklyn cabbie "which one?"

Page 12 of 12 FirstFirst ... 2101112

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •