2012-2013 Phillies Offseason Thread

[philliesfiend55]

This move adds zero power to the lineup, but that can be addressed in one of the corner OF positions as the options for 3B are slim to none.

Michael Young is probably their man for 3B.

[bluesky5]

I can't help but think this is one more step in the downfall. Worley for Ben Revere. I hope it sounds better in a couple years than it does now.

[Ben Grimm]

I can't help but think this is one more step in the downfall. Worley for Ben Revere. I hope it sounds better in a couple years than it does now.

Actually, I'd rather have seen the Phils hang onto May over Worley. I think Vance is nothing more than a #4 in most rotations whereas May has the stuff to be a #2 - if he learns control. But we'll have to see how this all goes. Revere & possibly Mike Young isn't that impressive and doesn't fill the needs this team has. However, if teh money saved by not spending much on CF & 3B (about $7M total as it stands right now), and that extra money allows Ruben to acquire Hamilton, I think most people would say it was a major success of an offseason.

There's a chance that Revere produces 80% of what Bourn does this season at only 5% of the price - that would be outstanding value. And I'd much rather see Revere, Young & Hamilton over say Bourn, Young & Cody Ross on this team.

[Ben Grimm]

Amaro on WIP live this morning talking about the Revere trade, offer with Texas for Young, etc.

- Says he wanted Revere because he gives financial flexibility not only for now but for years down the road.

- Knows this team still lacks a bit of power, but the FA market offered little (Upton & Hamilton) and teams pay a high premium on that (I think speed is also over-valued which is why Victorino got such a large deal and why Revere may be looked at as an overpay).

- This is the first offseason where he had to fill multiple needs so had to be a bit more judicious about his spending.

- Rumors about moving Halladay or Lee were false. Only way this team wins WS in 2013 is if all three (Hamels of course) take the hill.

- (I'll believe this when I see it) Says he wants to eliminate long-term contracts, especially when paying those years past players' primes.

- Wouldn't discuss strategies, but you can tell by his response he still likes Hamilton alot.

- Says some rumors about the Young trade are true and some are false (I assume that's about the players being given up and/or waiting for his approval).

[bluesky5]

Actually, I'd rather have seen the Phils hang onto May over Worley. I think Vance is nothing more than a #4 in most rotations whereas May has the stuff to be a #2 - if he learns control. But we'll have to see how this all goes. Revere & possibly Mike Young isn't that impressive and doesn't fill the needs this team has. However, if teh money saved by not spending much on CF & 3B (about $7M total as it stands right now), and that extra money allows Ruben to acquire Hamilton, I think most people would say it was a major success of an offseason.

There's a chance that Revere produces 80% of what Bourn does this season at only 5% of the price - that would be outstanding value. And I'd much rather see Revere, Young & Hamilton over say Bourn, Young & Cody Ross on this team.

I've evened out on the deal. My first thought was: Why trade young pitchers when they could have just signed a FA? But the free'd up cash by not signing a FA CF who would essentially be a glorified Ben Revere [who thought we'd ever hear that said] is an excellent idea. As long as the pitchers don't pan out too well... and Ben does.

[bluesky5]

What do you guys think about signing Hamilton?

[Ben Grimm]

This team was best balanced in my opinion back in 2009 - when they had decent starting pitching and very good hitting and speed.

Now that they're top-heavy in regards to pitching with many dollars invested, there simply isn't enough money (or farm system from past trades) to add significant value to the lineup without being creative. Offensively, this team did best when it combined power (3-4 20+ HR guys) and speed (110+ SBs). The power remains to be seen, but prior to Revere, this team had a pace of 60 SBs this season with only Rollins projecting over 20.

There are still alot of IFs on this team. But IF Ryan can stay healthy for 80% of the season, Chase can stay relatively healthy and perform at 75% of what he was, and Jimmy takes his hacks for the fences as usual, that could be 3 20+ HR guys there. Add in either a FA corner OFer with power or a Brown/Ruf platoon, and maybe you can get your 4th position producing that many.

One fallacy I keep hearing (and this was in response to BJ Upton's signing) is radio hosts and such saying this team needs to reduce strikeouts - not add them. If they took the time to look, they'd see the 2012 Phillies had the FEWEST strikeouts in the NL. When this offense was just getting into a groove back in 2007, they had the 3rd MOST strikeouts in the NL.

[Ben Grimm]

What do you guys think about signing Hamilton?

Personally, I'm not all that big on 3 LHers in a row (Utley, Howard, Hamilton) as we saw how pitchers lined up when Ibanez was hitting 5th. That's one of the main reasons I wanted Upton (or to a lesser point - Swisher) here because they can hit RHed in that spot. But that was also under the assumption that Hamiton would get 6-7 years carrying baggage and soon to enter his downside seasons. BUT, now that 3-4 years is in play, my thoughts have changed. In a 7-year deal, he'd need to be highly productive for four of those seasons to make the investment worthwhile. But at 4 years, he only needs to be at the top of his game for two of them. Much safer IMO.

I still think either another team comes in late (it could even be the Phillies now) like the Angels did with Pujols last year and possibly lay 5 years on the table.

[Ben Grimm]

@Trevmay54

Was an honor to be a part of Phillies organization for the past 5 years. I am truly grateful up for everything they have done for me.

@VANIMAL_49

Hey #Philly loved playing for you guys. I am grateful for the opportunity the @Phillies gave me. Thank you.

[philliesfiend55]

@Trevmay54

Was an honor to be a part of Phillies organization for the past 5 years. I am truly grateful up for everything they have done for me.

@VANIMAL_49

Hey #Philly loved playing for you guys. I am grateful for the opportunity the @Phillies gave me. Thank you.

What's sad is that Worley was working out at Citizens Bank Park when he received the news of the trade.
Worley held a small place in Phillies franchise history. According to one writer's reckoning, when he debuted for the team on July 24, 2010, Worley was the 1,000th Phillie of the
Post-World War Two Era (1946 to present)

This may not be the end of their time in the Phillies organization. Particularly if the Phillies get a new GM in the next few years. Worley will be a Free Agent after the 2016 season. If May reaches the majors in the next two years he'll be a free agent sometime between 2019 & 2021. In this day of Free Agency returning to a team that has dealt you away is always possible. It's always best for a player not to "Burn His Bridges" in these situations.

[Ben Grimm]

Here are the current OFers with the possiblity of another one added either via trade or free agency.

Revere (LH)
Inciarte (LH)
Ruf (RH)
Mayberry (RH)
Brown (LH)
Nix (LH)

Who'll be the odd man (men) out? I think the only thing possibly saving Mayberry is there are few options when it comes to RH hitters on this team. Nix is hanging on only because he has a guaranteed contract, but isn't needed at 1B anymore with Ryan coming back. Brown's in limbo IMO - if the Phils decide to hang onto Nix, he could be moved. Ruf should go down to AAA, but fans want to see him play and he can give some 1B relief so Howard can rest. I think Rule V pick Inciarte will actually stay on the roster. He adds speed off the bench and can be a late-inning defensive replacement in one of the corners.

We'll have to see who (if anybody) is signed/traded for to play RF or LF to get a better idea.

[Ben Grimm]

Michael Young deal could be approved as early as today. Josh Lindblom and a prospect are thought to be sent to Texas while the Rangers will be eating approximately $10M of Young's salary. The saved $5M or so from their payroll will likely be used in their persuit of Zach Greinke.

[Ben Grimm]

Jeff Wilson@JeffWilson_FWST

#Rangers expect Michael Young decision today on trade. Source says club not sure how he's leaning. He knows trade is best for career.

[Ben Grimm]

Bob Brookover's reporting that Michael Young will accept the trade, but there's still some financial details holding things up.

[bluesky5]

Michael Young deal could be approved as early as today. Josh Lindblom and a prospect are thought to be sent to Texas while the Rangers will be eating approximately $10M of Young's salary. The saved $5M or so from their payroll will likely be used in their persuit of Zach Greinke.

Halladay, Lee, Hamels, maybe Greinke. Wow! I would never doubt Amaro again if he pulled that off.