View Poll Results: Vote for the Three (3) Most Deserving to be in the HOF

Voters
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  • Dizzy Dean

    9 56.25%
  • Lonny Frey

    0 0%
  • Josh Gibson

    16 100.00%
  • Hank Greenberg

    15 93.75%
  • Sammy Hughes

    0 0%
  • Connie Marrero

    0 0%
  • Frank McCormick

    1 6.25%
  • Joe Medwick

    8 50.00%
  • Van Mungo

    0 0%
  • Buck O'Neil

    2 12.50%
  • Schoolboy Rowe

    0 0%
  • Dixie Walker

    1 6.25%
Multiple Choice Poll.
Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: Hall of Fame Cleanup #28 – Players Born 1910-11

  1. #1
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    Hall of Fame Cleanup #28 – Players Born 1910-11

    This time we’ll get it right. This is the 28th poll to survey the BBF scholars as to who really deserves to be in the Hall of Fame from the game’s “Golden Age” 70 to 100 years ago. From the list of players provided, vote for exactly three players that you think most deserve to stand among the greats. For more background and links to all elections go here: Hall of Fame Cleanup – Who Really Belongs? Polls stay open about a month so if you've just discovered this project, go back and vote in the earlier polls.

    The average number of players per year in the Hall born from 1880-1940 is 2.6. There are 92 players in the Hall born between 1884 and 1911, when there “should” be only 73. The most intense period is from 1898-1903, with 30 HOF players born in those six years. Many of our “favorites” are from that brief span: Kiki Cuyler, Waite Hoyt, Earle Combs, Hack Wilson, Jim Bottomley, Heinie Manush, Travis Jackson, Chick Hafey and Tony Lazzeri, to name a few.

    So this project is mainly about identifying those 19 extra players inhabiting the Hall’s player rolls. And it may be more than 19; there are also a few overlooked stars that we may choose ahead of the marginal players in the Hall, such as Sherry Magee, Stan Hack, Heinie Groh, Joe Jackson, Dick Redding, John Beckwith, and a few other Negro leaguers.

    We will judge players using the Hall’s stated criteria: “Voting shall be based upon the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) on which the player played.” However, that doesn’t mean we are required to interpret this in the same way as the Hall voters did. We will apply it from a modern outlook, comparing players using sophisticated statistical analysis and viewing players from the historical perspective we’ve gained. Try to avoid voting for players based on fame, name recognition and cherished assumptions; do a little research. We are looking to avoid the mistakes made by the HOF voters.

    So study the candidates and choose the three (3) players here who, in your judgment, most deserve to be with the immortals in the HOF. Remember, a player must finish “in the money” in two polls in order for him to be elected. We will again have a couple runoff polls at the end to fill up to our quota of 2.6 players per season.

    A few notes on the stats below:
    --For pitchers career WAR includes their offense.
    --“4.0 Yrs” is the number of years a guy performed at an all-star level, at least 4 WAR. For pitchers it does not include offense.
    --”WS” is career Win Shares from Bill James.
    --”oHOFm” is the old Hall of Fame Monitor number from BB-Ref, where 70 signifies a candidate, 100 signifies a likely election and 130 signifies almost certain election.
    Code:
    Player	        WAR	Born	PA/IP	4.0 Yrs	 WS	oHOFm
    Hank Greenberg	57.6	1911	 6097	  7	267	188
    Joe Medwick	55.5	1911	 8143	  7	312	201
    Dixie Walker	42.5	1910	 7670	  4	278	 82
    Lonny Frey	38.8	1910	 6402	  4	208	 23
    Frank McCormick	34.7	1911	 6206	  3	202	 86
    Dizzy Dean	44.9	1910	1967.1	  6	181	112
    Schoolboy Rowe	43.5	1910	2219.1	  5	180	 64
    Van Mungo	32.4	1911	2113.0	  4	147	 31
    Connie Marrero	 8.4	1911	 735.1	  0	 44	  4
    ---Black Baseball---						
    Josh Gibson		1911				
    Sammy T. Hughes 	1910				
    Buck O'Neil 		1911
    Last edited by Freakshow; 01-16-2014 at 10:31 AM.
    Eradicate, wipe out and abolish redundancy.

    Free El Duque!(and Mark Mulder) -- discover how the HOF rules are cheating this renowned member of Torre's Yankees dynasty and ask the HOF to include him on the ballot for the next BBWAA election.

  2. #2
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    Dean
    Gibson
    Greenberg

    I really wish this was 4 so I could vote for Medwick, but there you go.
    “There can be no higher law in journalism than to tell the truth and to shame the devil.” – Walter Lippmann

    "History has proven a thousand times that no man has ever gained from a bargain with The Dark, yet cowards and fools continue to try, and The Dark never turns them away."
    — Myth: The Fallen Lords

    BY THE BOW OF HERACLES

  3. #3
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    Greenberg
    Dean
    Gibson

    Medwick was in there until I came to Gibson's name.
    Buck O'Neill belongs as a contributor but not as a player.

    Is Connie Marrero the first non all-star caliber player to make these polls? I have no recollection of ever coming across his name other than in passing in my past perusals, sortings and rankings based of the baseball card stat leaderboards.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by PVNICK View Post
    Is Connie Marrero the first non all-star caliber player to make these polls? I have no recollection of ever coming across his name other than in passing in my past perusals, sortings and rankings based of the baseball card stat leaderboards.
    Marrero is an overlooked Cuban star who was held out of MLB due to his heritage, if not his color. In his prime he was unquestionably an all-star caliber pitcher, IMO. At ages 40-42 he posted a 117 ERA+ in 517 IP for Washington.

    I have added a link to his bio.
    Eradicate, wipe out and abolish redundancy.

    Free El Duque!(and Mark Mulder) -- discover how the HOF rules are cheating this renowned member of Torre's Yankees dynasty and ask the HOF to include him on the ballot for the next BBWAA election.

  5. #5
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    I'm not seeing any reason to vote for Dean over Medwick. In most of the projects we've done over the years, Dean has usually been a borderline HOF choice, while Medwick always sails in easily.
    Eradicate, wipe out and abolish redundancy.

    Free El Duque!(and Mark Mulder) -- discover how the HOF rules are cheating this renowned member of Torre's Yankees dynasty and ask the HOF to include him on the ballot for the next BBWAA election.

  6. #6
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    Some guys slide up some slide down. Lately it seems, maybe because Herr has been adding to some threads there is a lot on here about Dizzy Dean. Also it seems he comes up as is "high peak short career: Koufax, Dean." Medwick was darn good. A triple crown is nothing to sneeze at nor is being maybe the top offensive force in the NL in the mid to late 30s.

    On Marrero, thanks. I never knew.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by PVNICK View Post
    Some guys slide up some slide down. Lately it seems, maybe because Herr has been adding to some threads there is a lot on here about Dizzy Dean. Also it seems he comes up as is "high peak short career: Koufax, Dean." Medwick was darn good. A triple crown is nothing to sneeze at nor is being maybe the top offensive force in the NL in the mid to late 30s.

    On Marrero, thanks. I never knew.
    Dean: '32-'37 best pitcher on the Cardinals
    Medwick '33-'39 best hitter on the Cardinals
    “There can be no higher law in journalism than to tell the truth and to shame the devil.” – Walter Lippmann

    "History has proven a thousand times that no man has ever gained from a bargain with The Dark, yet cowards and fools continue to try, and The Dark never turns them away."
    — Myth: The Fallen Lords

    BY THE BOW OF HERACLES

  8. #8
    Gibson
    Greenberg
    Dean

    Duckey will have to wait until 1911-12.

  9. #9
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    Shoe-ins:
    Gibson
    Greenberg

    Dean vs Medwick: I pick Dean.
    Great pitching always beat great hitting. Clutch hitting always beat great pitching.

  10. #10
    Missed Hammerin' Hank. Probably doesn't matter though.

  11. #11
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    This poll closes in two days. We have a very close race for the third spot.
    Eradicate, wipe out and abolish redundancy.

    Free El Duque!(and Mark Mulder) -- discover how the HOF rules are cheating this renowned member of Torre's Yankees dynasty and ask the HOF to include him on the ballot for the next BBWAA election.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by 1905 Giants View Post
    Dean
    Gibson
    Greenberg

    I really wish this was 4 so I could vote for Medwick, but there you go.
    Same for me.

  13. #13
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    I don't have time to read about Dizzy Dean and all the recent threads, but this man-love with him is getting a bit way out of hand. Joe Medwick was a far superior player.
    "I am not too serious about anything. I believe you have to enjoy yourself to get the most out of your ability."-
    George Brett

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by yankillaz View Post
    I don't have time to read about Dizzy Dean and all the recent threads, but this man-love with him is getting a bit way out of hand. Joe Medwick was a far superior player.
    I messed up real bad in this poll. Missed Medwick and Greenberg.

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