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Thread: Cardinals hall of fame

  1. #41
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    Lee Smith had more saves with the Cardinals, and more in his career, than Sutter. Should be in the HoF instead of Sutter, should have his number retired instead of Sutter, should be in the Cards Hall along with Sutter.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
    Lee Smith had more saves with the Cardinals, and more in his career, than Sutter. Should be in the HoF instead of Sutter, should have his number retired instead of Sutter, should be in the Cards Hall along with Sutter.
    Pfft. Izzy has more Cardinal saves than both Smith or Sutter. Does that mean he should have his number retired? No. Bruce Sutter was the best at what he did for years, including the 1982 playoff run concluding with his striking out Stormin' Gorman Thomas to clinch our 9th World Series title. If they want to add Lee Smith to the Hall, that is fine. He was pretty good at what he did too -- but was never as dominating like Sutter was. If the Birds add Smith to our Hall, that is fine as well.
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  3. #43
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    Pfft. Compare the stats with Caridinals:

    Pitcher -- Yrs - Gms - Saves- Sv/Yr
    Sutter ---- 4 -- 247 -- 127 --- 32
    L. Smith -- 4 -- 243 -- 160 --- 40

    No statistical evidence that Sutter was more deserving than Smith.

    In that same WS, in which retiring Thomas alone is sufficient for HoF credentials. there shouldn't have been a Game 7, but for Sutter. In Game 5, Sutter gave the Brewers two insurance runs in the 8th. The Cards came back with two in the ninth, which would have tied the game, had Sutter not yielded the two runs. So for the '82 series, I'm calling it a wash for Sutter.
    Last edited by jtur88; 09-24-2015 at 11:34 AM.

  4. #44
    At least Edmonds is in this HOF

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by JessePopHaines16 View Post
    At least Edmonds is in this HOF
    Yep, Jimmy got screwed. I'm not surprised that he got a low total, but I am surprised that he couldn't even get 5%. That is ridiculous. Just like Ted Simmons, Lou Whitaker, Kenny Lofton and a slew of very deserving players -- all screwed on that first ballot. Oh well.
    "It ain't braggin' if you can do it." Dizzy Dean

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Herr28 View Post
    Yep, Jimmy got screwed. I'm not surprised that he got a low total, but I am surprised that he couldn't even get 5%. That is ridiculous. Just like Ted Simmons, Lou Whitaker, Kenny Lofton and a slew of very deserving players -- all screwed on that first ballot. Oh well.
    Our hall of fame gives the HOFers better looking blazers anyway.

  7. #47
    No offense to the Cardinals but the nominees for this years class isn't all that impressive. If they aren't going to put Sam Breadon and Pepper Martin in as locks then put them on the ballot for the fans to vote at least.

  8. #48
    Congrats to Sam Breadon and Terry Moore on making the HOF. Pepper should make it the next year. The fan choices is slim pickens after Simmons last year.

  9. #49
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    I wonder what their cutoff was on number of seasons with the team. Bobby Wallace was on the Cardinals three years in two stints, Jake Beckley for four, Jesse Burkett for three yet are not on the list. Roger Bresnahan was a player manager and on the team for four years. Miller Huggins was with the team for several years as a player before becoming the manager for five seasons. Pete Alexander was also with the team four years.

    Bill Doak and Slim Salee would be players pre-1920 who should be considered.

    Pretty soon they will have to start limiting it to how many get in each year.

  10. #50
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    Harry Caray for sure. How is he not in now?
    Last edited by JR Hart; 04-18-2017 at 06:39 AM.
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  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by JR Hart View Post
    Harry Caray for sure. How is he not in now?
    Pretty sure the fan voting HOF we are referencing (and subsequent museum) is players only to this point.

    Anyway, I don't think most St.Louis fans under the age of 50 even know Carey was a Cardinal announcer. He was here for 25 years, but I don't think his status of iconic figure was established il well after he was a Cubby announcer.
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  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bothrops Atrox View Post
    Pretty sure the fan voting HOF we are referencing (and subsequent museum) is players only to this point.

    Anyway, I don't think most St.Louis fans under the age of 50 even know Carey was a Cardinal announcer. He was here for 25 years, but I don't think his status of iconic figure was established il well after he was a Cubby announcer.
    He was enormously popular during the Cardinals run in the 1960s. There was an article about him in Sports Illustrated in 1968. KMOX was huge back in the day. We got it in clear at night in Watertown SD, which is 710 miles from StL. Harry was the best, during his run with the Cardinals. IMO, it's a huge oversight and shows a lack of knowledge and appreciation for what he did for the Cardinals.

    Buck is in and Harry was Buck's mentor.
    Last edited by JR Hart; 04-18-2017 at 01:10 PM.
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  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by JR Hart View Post
    He was enormously popular during the Cardinals run in the 1960s. There was an article about him in Sports Illustrated in 1968. KMOX was huge back in the day. We got it in clear at night in Watertown SD, which is 710 miles from StL. Harry was the best, during his run with the Cardinals. IMO, it's a huge oversight and shows a lack of knowledge and appreciation for what he did for the Cardinals.

    Buck is in and Harry was Buck's mentor.
    I never said he wasn't great or important or wasn't beloved at the time. I said he 1. isn't all that well remembered today for being a Cardinal compared to his Cubs days. If you polled sports fans, I would bet 95% would identify him as a Cubs announcer. WGN and all. And I said 2. that the HOF we are talking about is players only at this point. Neither of those are debatable. Who will get in is about rules and current perception. Not what was understood to be true 50 years ago.

    Let me correct myself. The original inductees included non-players and were automatic inductees if they were already in the HOF as a Cardinal. Since fans started voting - it has been players only. I am sure if non-players become eligible to be selected again, Carey will be voted in quite easily. The team also convenes occasionally to induct someone like Kissel who they know will not be remembered by fans. Now, they could have a special team induction if they feel like fans will not vote for Carey. And I am telling you - the voting body of on-line fans will not vote for Harry Carey, deserved or not. Even in St. Louis. people under 50 do not think of Carey as a Cardinal.


    But honestly, with Willie McGee, Terry Moore, and Bob Forsch elected by fans, I have already lost interest in who is selected going forward.
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  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bothrops Atrox View Post
    I never said he wasn't great or important or wasn't beloved at the time. I said he 1. isn't all that well remembered today for being a Cardinal compared to his Cubs days. If you polled sports fans, I would bet 95% would identify him as a Cubs announcer. WGN and all. And I said 2. that the HOF we are talking about is players only at this point. Neither of those are debatable. Who will get in is about rules and current perception. Not what was understood to be true 50 years ago.

    Let me correct myself. The original inductees included non-players and were automatic inductees if they were already in the HOF as a Cardinal. Since fans started voting - it has been players only. I am sure if non-players become eligible to be selected again, Carey will be voted in quite easily. The team also convenes occasionally to induct someone like Kissel who they know will not be remembered by fans. Now, they could have a special team induction if they feel like fans will not vote for Carey. And I am telling you - the voting body of on-line fans will not vote for Harry Carey, deserved or not. Even in St. Louis. people under 50 do not think of Carey as a Cardinal.


    But honestly, with Willie McGee, Terry Moore, and Bob Forsch elected by fans, I have already lost interest in who is selected going forward.
    I understand your point. Harry was so popular is the age of cable TV, that everyone associates him with the Cubs. But, it's too bad that huge slice of baseball history, Harrry and KMOX, has been forgotten.
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  15. #55
    Bernie Miklasz thinks that Ray Lankford deserves to be in there.

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