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Thread: Frank Thomas for HOF?! HA!

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  1. #1

    Frank Thomas for HOF?! HA!

    I can't believe how much support that guy gets on these boards! After signing with the A's, he said that he believes there is no doubt he'll make the HOF even if he doesn't reach 500 HRs. He's a HOF joke! He had a few great seasons (ok, he was one of the best players in the game for a while) but then he switched to DH and STILL manages to get hurt on a regular basis. He couldn't even play in the World Series when Chicago finally got there again! And his numbers are really not that great, especially when he is known almost exclusively for his offense. I mean, even ELHALO, Mr. "Reggie Jackson, Robin Yount, Paul Molitor, Kirby Puckett, Ryne Sandberg, etc. don't belong in the Hall" has called Thomas a "lock" in other threads! I mean, even his managers are so fed up with his lack of playing that they wanted to get rid of him! Hall of Famer, I don't think so! (And who's idea was it to try to start a "Who's the better hitter?" poll between him and Lou Gehrig? Did you really think that would even be close?)

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    I can't believe how much support that guy gets on these boards! After signing with the A's, he said that he believes there is no doubt he'll make the HOF even if he doesn't reach 500 HRs. He's a HOF joke! He had a few great seasons (ok, he was one of the best players in the game for a while) but then he switched to DH and STILL manages to get hurt on a regular basis. He couldn't even play in the World Series when Chicago finally got there again! And his numbers are really not that great, especially when he is known almost exclusively for his offense. I mean, even ELHALO, Mr. "Reggie Jackson, Robin Yount, Paul Molitor, Kirby Puckett, Ryne Sandberg, etc. don't belong in the Hall" has called Thomas a "lock" in other threads! I mean, even his managers are so fed up with his lack of playing that they wanted to get rid of him! Hall of Famer, I don't think so! (And who's idea was it to try to start a "Who's the better hitter?" poll between him and Lou Gehrig? Did you really think that would even be close?)
    Umm...He had more just a "few" great seasons. Try an entire decade. Also he won two MVP awards and in his prime was often referred as "The right-handed Ted Williams". That's high praise if you ask me. If you don't think he's a HOF then I don't know what to say you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Honus Wagner Rules
    Umm...He had more just a "few" great seasons. Try an entire decade. Also he won two MVP awards and in his prime was often referred as "The right-handed Ted Williams". That's high praise if you ask me. If you don't think he's a HOF then I don't know what to say you.
    If you think he is, I don't know what to say to you?
    I agree his is NOT HoF material. I guess we just have a difference of opinion and viewpoint, despite whatever others might throw in from sabermetrics.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigerfan1974
    If you think he is, I don't know what to say to you?
    I agree his is NOT HoF material. I guess we just have a difference of opinion and viewpoint, despite whatever others might throw in from sabermetrics.
    Is Jeff Bagwell a Hofer? Why isn't Thomas a HoFer?

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    Here are all the HoF first baseball:

    Cap Anson
    Jake Beckley*
    Jim Bottomley*
    Dan Brouthers *
    Orlando Cepeda *
    Frank Chance *
    Roger Connor *
    Jimmie Foxx
    Lou Gehrig
    Hank Greenberg *
    George Kelly *
    Harmon Killebrew*
    Buck Leonard
    Willie McCovey
    Johnny Mize
    Eddie Murray
    Tony Perez *
    George Sisler
    Bill Terry *

    I count about 11 HoF first basemen that Thomas is clearly better.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Honus Wagner Rules
    Here are all the HoF first baseball:

    Cap Anson
    Jake Beckley*
    Jim Bottomley*
    Dan Brouthers *
    Orlando Cepeda *
    Frank Chance *
    Roger Connor *
    Jimmie Foxx
    Lou Gehrig
    Hank Greenberg *
    George Kelly *
    Harmon Killebrew*
    Buck Leonard
    Willie McCovey
    Johnny Mize
    Eddie Murray
    Tony Perez *
    George Sisler
    Bill Terry *

    I count about 11 HoF first basemen that Thomas is clearly better.
    Ah, Honus Wagner must be turning in his grave right about now with you using his name like that...to consider Thomas a first baseman is ridiculous...how long was he a first baseman as opposed to DH?

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    disregard this post, mis-read an earlier one.
    Last edited by Brooklyn; 03-01-2006 at 11:54 AM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Honus Wagner Rules
    Here are all the HoF first baseball:

    Cap Anson
    Jake Beckley*
    Jim Bottomley*
    Dan Brouthers *
    Orlando Cepeda *
    Frank Chance *
    Roger Connor *
    Jimmie Foxx
    Lou Gehrig
    Hank Greenberg *
    George Kelly *
    Harmon Killebrew*
    Buck Leonard
    Willie McCovey
    Johnny Mize
    Eddie Murray
    Tony Perez *
    George Sisler
    Bill Terry *

    I count about 11 HoF first basemen that Thomas is clearly better.
    I don't see how one can think Thomas is better than Greenberg? better than Killebrew?
    I 'll give you Cepeda and Perez as I think they are borderline anyway.

    But I feel neither Thomas, nor Bagwell, nor Will Clark (from the other thread) will make the Hall. The next 1st baseman will be McGwire. After that, who knows?
    1968 and 1984, the greatest ever.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Honus Wagner Rules
    Is Jeff Bagwell a Hofer? Why isn't Thomas a HoFer?
    Well, much like Thomas, Bagwell was injured quite ofter, but Bagwell STILL has more HRs than Thomas and was actually able to PLAY when his team finally made the WS. I know its ridiculous to compare HR totals, but batting is really all you can discuss when Frank Thomas is the issue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    Well, much like Thomas, Bagwell was injured quite ofter, but Bagwell STILL has more HRs than Thomas and was actually able to PLAY when his team finally made the WS. I know its ridiculous to compare HR totals, but batting is really all you can discuss when Frank Thomas is the issue.
    Though Bagwell was the better overall player, Thomas was the better hitter. Also first base is not a key defensive position.

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    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    Well, much like Thomas, Bagwell was injured quite ofter, but Bagwell STILL has more HRs than Thomas and was actually able to PLAY when his team finally made the WS. I know its ridiculous to compare HR totals, but batting is really all you can discuss when Frank Thomas is the issue.


    Bagwell is injured quite often? Other than strike shortened years, he's played less than 142 games exactly ONCE (last year), and usually was in the 150's and 160's.

    Bagwell has exactly ONE more home run than Thomas. That's a big difference?

    Bagwell pinch hit a few times in ONE WS at the end of his career (going 1-8), and it gives him a big advantage over Thomas?

    Personally, I'll be shocked if both don't go...with McGwire, they're really the big 3 First Baseman of the time.
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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    Well, much like Thomas, Bagwell was injured quite ofter, but Bagwell STILL has more HRs than Thomas and was actually able to PLAY when his team finally made the WS. I know its ridiculous to compare HR totals, but batting is really all you can discuss when Frank Thomas is the issue.

    I really do not see what being able to play in the world series has to do with whether or not he deserves to be in the hall of fame. Ted Williams did not do much in the 1946 world series. If Ted had not been able to play should he be excluded from the hall? How many players with OPS+ of 161 over close to 7000 at bats are not in the hall. From 91-97 he was close to Ted Williams, not as good, but look at his stats: He had three seasons where he hit close to .350 with 35 or more homeruns. His lowest ops from 91-91 is 178! I would have liked to see afew more great seasons in there, 98, 99, 01, 02, 03, maybe two more years of those 5 where he was as productive as in his prime, but he is easily a hall of famer by any logical argument. Thomas and Bagwell are very similar, and both should go in without an argument, even if injuries prevent them from playing another game. Find me someone with 7000 career atbats and an HR/at bat of 15.5, a BA of .307, an OBP of .427, and an SLG of .568 who is not a hall of famer. In his prime he was absolutely awesome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    Well, much like Thomas, Bagwell was injured quite ofter, but Bagwell STILL has more HRs than Thomas and was actually able to PLAY when his team finally made the WS. I know its ridiculous to compare HR totals, but batting is really all you can discuss when Frank Thomas is the issue.
    so because Bagwell was healthy in October 2005 and put up crap numbers in the World Series, that makes him better than Thomas?


    Thomas is #14 all time in OPS+, thats a Hall of Famer right there.
    Last edited by Blackout; 03-10-2006 at 11:24 AM.

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    N/M, didn't notice I was replying to a 7 year old post. Dang!
    Last edited by CandlestickBum; 03-21-2012 at 06:15 AM.

  15. #15
    I agree that Thomas is at times overhyped on these boards, but there is not a doubt in my mind that he is a Hall of Famer. For a decade, the guy was one of the best hitters to have played. I have him ranked 6th all-time at 1B, and had he spent more time in the field and less at DH, I'd bump him as high as 3rd. If you don't think he's a Hall of Famer, then you must have a short memory. Picture what Albert Pujols is doing now, and then add 10 points of OPS+, and that's what you get for Thomas for about a decade.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigerfan1974
    If you think he is, I don't know what to say to you?
    I agree his is NOT HoF material. I guess we just have a difference of opinion and viewpoint, despite whatever others might throw in from sabermetrics.
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    Thomas is the best hitting 1B since World War II. Not a Hall of Famer? Okay, if your Hall of Fame has about 50 players total, you could leave him out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by abacab
    Thomas is the best hitting 1B since World War II. Not a Hall of Famer? Okay, if your Hall of Fame has about 50 players total, you could leave him out.

    A beautiful post.....

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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Honus Wagner Rules
    Umm...He had more just a "few" great seasons. Try an entire decade. Also he won two MVP awards and in his prime was often referred as "The right-handed Ted Williams". That's high praise if you ask me. If you don't think he's a HOF then I don't know what to say you.
    Hmm...a full decade and two MVP awards...sounds alot like Dale Murphy if you ask me. And comparing Thomas to Williams was always a joke. Dwight Gooden was compared to Koufax at one time, let's put him in there too, eh?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    Hmm...a full decade and two MVP awards...sounds alot like Dale Murphy if you ask me. And comparing Thomas to Williams was always a joke. Dwight Gooden was compared to Koufax at one time, let's put him in there too, eh?!
    Dale Murphy and his career .262 BA? Give me a break. Dwight Gooden has nothing to do with this discussion. For a while Gooden was that good anyway.
    Last edited by Honus Wagner Rules; 03-01-2006 at 11:43 AM.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    I can't believe how much support that guy gets on these boards! After signing with the A's, he said that he believes there is no doubt he'll make the HOF even if he doesn't reach 500 HRs. He's a HOF joke! He had a few great seasons (ok, he was one of the best players in the game for a while) but then he switched to DH and STILL manages to get hurt on a regular basis. He couldn't even play in the World Series when Chicago finally got there again! And his numbers are really not that great, especially when he is known almost exclusively for his offense. I mean, even ELHALO, Mr. "Reggie Jackson, Robin Yount, Paul Molitor, Kirby Puckett, Ryne Sandberg, etc. don't belong in the Hall" has called Thomas a "lock" in other threads! I mean, even his managers are so fed up with his lack of playing that they wanted to get rid of him! Hall of Famer, I don't think so! (And who's idea was it to try to start a "Who's the better hitter?" poll between him and Lou Gehrig? Did you really think that would even be close?)
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    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    I can't believe how much support that guy gets on these boards! After signing with the A's, he said that he believes there is no doubt he'll make the HOF even if he doesn't reach 500 HRs. He's a HOF joke! He had a few great seasons (ok, he was one of the best players in the game for a while) but then he switched to DH and STILL manages to get hurt on a regular basis. He couldn't even play in the World Series when Chicago finally got there again! And his numbers are really not that great, especially when he is known almost exclusively for his offense. I mean, even ELHALO, Mr. "Reggie Jackson, Robin Yount, Paul Molitor, Kirby Puckett, Ryne Sandberg, etc. don't belong in the Hall" has called Thomas a "lock" in other threads! I mean, even his managers are so fed up with his lack of playing that they wanted to get rid of him! Hall of Famer, I don't think so!
    You could start a po- <SMACK!>
    Mythical SF Chronicle scouting report: "That Jeff runs like a deer. Unfortunately, he also hits AND throws like one." I am Venus DeMilo - NO ARM! I can play like a big leaguer, I can field like Luzinski, run like Lombardi. The secret to managing is keeping the ones who hate you away from the undecided ones. I am a triumph of quantity over quality. I'm almost useful, every village needs an idiot.
    Good traders: MadHatter(2), BoofBonser26, StormSurge

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by futurehalloffamer
    And his numbers are really not that great, especially when he is known almost exclusively for his offense.
    So, specifically, which of his his stats do you find not so great?

  24. #24
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    Just for the sake of context, would those who do not support Thomas for the Hall mind sharing with us a list of at least the current players whose candidacy they would support- pitchers need not be included.

    Thank you in advance.
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    Quote Originally Posted by digglahhh
    Just for the sake of context, would those who do not support Thomas for the Hall mind sharing with us a list of at least the current players whose candidacy they would support- pitchers need not be included.

    Thank you in advance.
    Bonds, A-Rod, I-Rod, Jeter, Griffey Jr., just for starters are ahead of Thomas.

    To say nothing of recently retired Sosa, and soon to be retired, Palmeiro.
    (despite my thought to the contrary on them.)
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