I agree with the HOF part, including the "of course" part. But with that said:
Pudge's offense is enormously overrated. In his first season, he had FIVE walks in 288 plate appearances, a pathetic statistic which resulted in his .264 batting average's being almost indistinguishable from his .276 OBP. This year, in his 16th season, he has 289 plate appearances to date, and all of TEN walks. Thus, he has a .301 batting average, which might impress the uninformed, but a .326 OBP, which sucks and should impress nobody. Of all the supposedly good hitters with long careers, and with a career batting average over .300, his career OBP of .343 has to be just about the worst, and anyone who does not think OBP means a lot more than batting average is being willfully blind in Pudge's cause.
The tragedy here is that all of this was so avoidable. Yeah, I know, "You don't get off the island drawing bases on balls," and all that b.s. Was there not some manager or hitting coach, SOMEWHERE along the line, to kick his butt and tell him, "You will sit on the bench if you persist in swinging at crap! On our team, bases on balls are great assets. They lead to many runs and will result in your getting much better pitches to clobber in the future!"
Why did that never happen? And why did a guy who's supposed to be so smart about pitching and hitting never figure this out for himself?
Oh, well, no use crying over spilled milk, and all that. Bill James says the human body cannot catch more than 1,900 games, and Pudge is getting there quickly. His .343 (and sinking) OBP sure won't keep him in the game, so when his defensive skills go, he's done. I gotta say, though, that when I do see him, he looks very good behind the plate, despite Father Time. He's 5'9" to Piazza's supposed 6'5", which I suspect means Piazza's aged a lot faster as a catcher, so that even though Pudge has caught more games, it looks to me like his knees, etc., have more games left there than Piazza's. (Anyone disagree?)
IF Pudge Rodriguez had learned that taking walks is not an aspersion on one's manhood, and that the very greatest hitters ever took tons of walks, and IF he had drawn walks in even 10 to 12% of his plate appearances throughout his career (like average players do), instead of drawing walks in a pitiful 5.024% of his plate appearances:
(1) He would have a much better BATTING average, because he'd have gotten much better pitches to hit, once pitchers knew he wouldn't swing at all sorts of crap;
(2) He would have at least a reasonable, and probably an excellent, OBP; and
(3) Having gotten many more good pitches to hit, he'd surely have a lot more extra base hits, especially HR's.
This is not speculation. I can't see how anyone could deny any of these things. And IF these things had happened, I'd be right there with the Pudge brigades, even though Piazza would probably still have a slight offensive edge, because it wouldn't be big enough to make up for Pudge's defensive edge. I'd be debating Pudge against Bench, a debate I wouldn't dream of undertaking now.
Pudge had to be a real man, not take walks, and swing at crap. And brother, does it show in that silly .343 OBP next to his .304 career BA.
Pudge has not been Johnny Bench or Jim Sundberg behind the plate. In two generations, when all of us who followed his entire career as adults are gone, people will know by legend that he was an excellent defensive catcher who made too many throwing errors but, like Clemente, was far more than worth that baggage. But they'll see his stats, Piazza's stats, and say, "What? Are you kidding me?"
I would point out, in closing, that the same happened with Frank Robinson vis-a-vis Roberto Clemente. As farcical as this will sound to younger fans here in 2006, when Clemente died his tragic, ultra-heroic death in 1972, a lot of active players and sportswriters ludicrously compared him to Mays, Mantle and Aaron. I'm pretty sure that if polls had been taken of fans for the next 5, 10 or 20 years, he would have consistently come in ahead of Frank Robinson. Which, of course, is ridiculous. Time has set that one straight.
This is not a perfect parallel, because: (1) Frank Robinson was a much better hitter than Piazza; and (2) Frank Robinson was inarguably a very good defensive RF--there were FOUR all-time great defensive RF's born in 1 or 2 years' time: Kaline, Aaron, Clemente and Robinson, of whom Robinson was easily the worst, but he was still great. As a defensive catcher, Piazza must be considered the greatest hitting catcher of all time.
The stats show Piazza to be average or above average in all major stats except the rather big stat of throwing out would-be stealers. I'm not sure I agree. He's huge, heavy and has never struck me as mobile. Obviously he's not horrible by any means, and has several assets, but that one big negative is REALLY big. But he is SO much better a hitter than Pudge, it all comes down to whether Pudge can make it up behind the plate.
A ringing NYET, from me.
BHN
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Originally Posted by baseball junkie
My gosh, that's blasphemy around these parts!!!
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