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  1. #1
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    Negro League data

    I'm going to start a thread with Negro League data. I've got a bunch of guys whose data I will put in alphabetical order, and then a post with some general data. After that, posts are welcome. If we get more info, I may add an index of where to find data to this post.

    Please note all this data was originally posted in Baseball Think Factory, but not all in one thread. I copied and pasted everything to concentrate it into this one thread.

    Jim Albright
    Last edited by jalbright; 05-18-2007 at 09:46 AM.
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  2. #2
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    Newt Allen Data

    Teams: 22-44 KC Monarchs, Stl 31, Det 32, Homestead 32

    Seasonal Data from Holway

    1923 no data
    1924 .277 for KC; 2b
    11-39 in World Series vs. Hilldale
    1925 .307 for KC; 10 3b (4th), 16 sb (3rd); 2b; all-star
    11-27 in playoff vs. Stl.
    7-27 in World Series vs. Hilldale
    1926 .232 for KC Monarchs; 2b
    5-28 in playoff vs. Chi Am
    1927 .330 for KC Monarchs; 2b, all-star
    1928 .280 for KC Monarchs; 12 sb (3rd); 2b
    1929 .284 for KC Monarchs; 24 2b (3rd), 23 sb (3rd); 2b, all-star
    1930 .333 for KC Monarchs; 2b, all-star
    1931 .300 for KC Monarchs; ss
    12-33 in World Series vs. Grays
    1932 .268 for Homestead; 7 sb (3rd); 2b
    .364 for KC Monarchs; 2b, all-star
    2-2 vs. Major-league competition
    1933 No Data (Monarchs barnstorming)
    1934 No Data (Monarchs barnstorming); ss
    1935 No Data (Monarchs barnstorming); 2b
    4-12 vs. major-league pitching (backed by semipro teams)
    1936 .385 for KC Monarchs; 2b, all-star
    1937 .389 for KC Monarchs; ba 2nd, 6 2b (4th), 7 sb (3rd); 2b, all-star
    5-21 in playoff vs. Chi Am Giants
    3-11 in World Series vs. Homestead
    7-15 vs. major-league competition
    47-175 in Cuban Play
    1938 .267 for KC Monarchs; 2b
    1939 .265 for KC Monarchs; 2b
    1940 .323 for KC Monarchs; ba 5th, 4 2b (2nd); lf
    1941 .245 for KC Monarchs; ss and manager
    1942 .318 for KC Monarchs; rf
    4-15 in World Series vs. Homestead
    1943 no data
    1944 .247 for KC Monarchs; lf

    Career
    .300 mean avg. for 17 seasons with batting statistics



    Career Data from MacMillan 8th

    792 g, 3250 ab, 961 hits, 135 2b, 42 3b, 20 hr, .296 ba, .382 sa.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

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  3. #3
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    Here are Beckwith's Macmillan stats:

    Year--G--AB--H--D--T-HR-SB-AVE-SLG
    1920-15-046-10-01-01-00-01-217-283
    1921-34-113-45-05-04-04-00-398-619
    1922-48-159-48-11-02-03-03-302-453
    1923-60-232-75-19-09-13-05-323-651
    1924-33-119-48-08-01-07-07-403-664
    1925-47-174-70-14-01-14-02-402-736
    1926-34-119-43-07-01-09-01-361-664
    1927-46-188-63-13-02-07-01-335-537
    1928-(no data)
    1929-40-163-62-10-02-11-06-380-669
    1930-50-200-96-10-03-19-00-480-845
    1931-51-190-66-03-00-16-00-316-616
    1932-03-012-04-01-00-01-00-333-667
    1933-02-009-04-00-00-00-00-444-444
    1934-12-011-03-01-00-00-00-273-364
    1935-01-004-00-00-00-00-00-000-000
    tot-476-1739-637-103-26-104-26-366-635
    John Beckwith data

    From Holway

    1917 .000 for Chi Giants; ss
    1918 no data
    1919 .188 for Chi Giants; c
    1920 .280 for Chi Giants; ut
    1921 .355 for Chi Giants; ss
    1922 .305 for Chi Am Giants; ut
    1923 .330 for Chi Am Giants, 24 2b, 9 3b, 14 hr; 3b (should be, but isn’t, all star)
    1924 .382 for Bal Black Sox, 5 hr, 16 hr/550 BA leads league; ss (should be, but isn’t, all-star)
    3-8, .375 with 2 HR vs. Phil A’s
    1925 .406 for Bal Black Sox, 24 HR lead league, 22 2b, 50 hr/550 ab; ss, Holway all star, MVP
    (constructed batting line, 264 ab, 107 hits, 22 2b, 8? 3b, 24 hr, .406 ba, .822 slg)
    1926 .311 for Harrisburg Giants, 3 triples; 3b, Holway all star (as dh)
    1927 .362 for Harrisburg Giants, .(223 for a few games with Homestead Grays), 9 hr, 18 2b, 16 hr/550 ab; 3b, Holway all star (constructed batting line, 309 ab, 112 hits, 18 2b, 6? 3b, 9 hr, .362 ba, .547 slg)
    2-10 vs. major-league All-Stars
    1928 .240 for Homestead Grays; ss
    2-17 vs. major-league competition
    1929 .439 for Homestead Grays, 15 hr, 25 hr/550 (330 ab, 23? 2b, 7? 3b, 15 hr, .439 ba, 144 hits, .684 slg) ; ut
    1930 .493 for NY Lincoln Giants, 6 hr, 47 hr/550 ab; 3b, Holway all star, missed time with broken ankle
    1-8 in playoff vs. Homestead
    1931 .350 for Baltimore & Newark Browns, 16 hr, 7 2b, 53 hr/550 ab); 3b, Holway all-star
    5-10 vs. major-league all stars
    1932 no data (teams he played for were not in the East-West league)
    1933 .391 for NY Black Yankees; 3b
    1934 .286 for NY Black Yankees; 3b
    1935 no data, listed in Riley as playing for the Grays, but apparently not a regular




    Career data
    .352 lifetime avg. 767-2176 according to Holway
    mean avg. 1919-34 = .366
    19-60 vs. major-league competition (.319)
    80 hr in 2198 ab, according to Holway
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

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  4. #4
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    Cool Papa Bell Data

    Teams

    22-31 St. Louis Stars, 32 Det/KC/Homestead, 33-38 Pgh Crawfords, 37 Santa Domingo, 38-41 Mexico, 42 Chi Am Giants, 43-46 Homestead Grays

    Seasonal Data from Holway

    1922 No data
    1923 3-1 as pitcher for Stl Stars
    1924 .316 for Stl; 9 sb (4th); cf
    1925 .348 for Stl; 29 2b (1st), 23 sb (1st); cf; all-star
    10-33 in playoff vs. KC
    1926 .355 for Stl; 17 hr (5th), 23 hr/550 (5th), 24 2b (4th), 23 sb (1st); cf, all-star
    1927 .318 for Stl; 18 2b (4th), 13 sb (2nd); cf
    1928 .332 for Stl; 6 3b (5th); cf
    11-27 in playoff vs. Chi Am Giants
    51-157 in Cuban Play
    1929 .309 for Stl; 25 2b (2nd), 28 sb (2nd); cf, all-star
    3-17 in World Series vs. Homestead
    6-22 vs. major-league competition
    1930 .362 for Stl; 17 2b (5th), 15 sb (4th); lf, all-star
    1931 .330 for Stl; cf, all-star
    1-2 vs. major-league competition
    1932 .318 for Det/Pgh,/Hom, . ba 4th; cf, ut, all-star
    396 for KC; 5 3b (3rd), 4 sb (2nd); cf, all-star (all-star in both East-West and South in 32)
    0-3 vs. major-league competition
    1933 .339 for Pgh; 15 2b (4th), 9 3b (3rd), 7 sb (3rd); cf
    2-6 in playoff vs. Nashville
    1934 .364 for Pgh; 5 in ba, 7 sb (1st); cf
    1935 .320 for Pgh; 10 2b (4th), 8 3b (2nd), 9 sb (1st); lf
    3-24 in playoff vs. NY Cubans
    5-16 vs. major-league competition
    1936 .301 for Pgh; cf
    8-19 vs. major-league competition
    3-13 vs. major-league competition
    1937 .120 for Pgh; ut (spent most of season in Santa Domingo)
    21-66 in Santa Domingo
    1938 no data for NeL
    .356 in Mexican League – In Mexico through 1941
    1939 In Mexico
    1940 In Mexico, 167-382, .437 (1st), 12 hr (1st), 17 hr/550 (4th)
    41-168 in Cuban Play
    1941 In Mexico, 132-421, .314, 12 hr (4th), 15 hr/550 (5th)
    1942 .373 for Chi Am Giants; cf
    1943 .297 for Homestead; 3 sb (4th); lf
    8-26 in World Series vs. Birmingham
    1944 .274 for Homestead; 9 2b (3rd), 4 3b (4th); lf
    6-23 in World Series vs. Birmingham
    1945 .253 for Homestead; 5 2b (4th); lf
    4-13 in World Series vs. Buckeyes
    1946 .447 for Homestead; lf, all-star

    Career, according to Holway
    1561-4754, .328
    73 hr., 8/550 ab
    52-152 vs. major-league competition
    Mean avg. 320 for 19 seasons with statistics



    Career data from MacMillan 10th edition
    943 g, 3707 ab, 1248 hits, 194 2b, 64 3b, 63 hr, 143 sb, .337 ba, .475 slg
    Season Team AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB Avg
    1928-29 Cienfuegos 157 44 51 10 7 5 -- 17 .325
    1929-30 Cienfuegos 220 52 57 14 4 3 -- -- .259
    1930-f Cienfuegos 16 2 4 1 1 1 -- -- .250
    1930-w Cienfuegos 38 9 13 0 1 0 -- 2 .342
    1940-41 Almendares 138 24 41 5 3 2 16 11 .297

    Notes:

    1928-29 -- Led league in runs, home runs, and stolen bases. On New Year’s Day hit 3 inside-the-park home runs at spacious Aida Park in Cienfuegos.

    1929-30 -- Led league in at-bats, runs, and doubles. Cienfuegos won the pennant race; Figueredo’s text says Bell won the MVP award, though the list of MVP winners shows Bell’s teammate Willie Wells (.322, 43 runs) for that year.

    1930-f -- Regular season ended after 5 games because of dispute about new stadium (La Tropical) lease.

    1930-w -- A short special season (Unico) was played in place of incomplete regular season; Cienfuegos played 9 games.

    The feature of his Cuban League record that seems remarkable to me is his high rate of runs scored relative to hits. It suggests a) he must have been drawing quite a few walks, and b) it seems unlikely that he was thrown out much on the bases
    I wasn't sure if anybody else has the Mexican League encyclopedia. Here are Bell's stats there, which also give us some W/K data:

    YR--G---AB--H---D--T-HR--R--RBI-W--K-HP-SH-SB-AVE-SLG
    38-040-160-051-07-06-06-051-17-20-12--1--1-09-356-588
    39-058-226-080-16-02-05-055-24-26-19--1--6-12-354-509
    40-089-382-167-29-15-12-119-79-45-24--0--3-28-437-686
    41-100-421-132-21-15-04-085-48-65-26--1--4-14-314-463
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

  5. #5
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    Chet Brewer

    A big challenge in analyzing Brewer is the portion of his career that may be undocumented.

    Here's his career line from Macmillan 8th:

    Chet Brewer
    1925-1932 NeL
    1933 in semipro ball
    1934-37 NeL (no data for 1934-35)
    1938-40 "Latin America,"
    1941 NeL,
    1942-45 "Latin America,"
    1946-48 NeL

    89-63, .596. 166 g, 115 gs, 97 cg, 1110 ip, 1075 hits, 283 bb, 552 k, 14 so, 3 sv

    If some of that Latin American play is in Mexico, we should be able to get stats, but if it isn't, we won't. 5. Dr. Chaleeko Posted: May 06, 2005 at 04:28 PM (#1317359)
    Here's what Riley's got for him:

    1924Gilkerson's Union Giants
    1925KC Monarchs
    1926KC Monarchs (11-3)
    1927KC Monarchs (8-7)
    1928KC Monarchs (7-9)
    1929KC Monarchs (17-3)
    1930KC Monarchs (15-11 from 30-32)
    1931KC Monarchs/Crookstone MN
    1932KC Monarchs/Washington Pilots
    1933KC Monarchs
    1934KC Monarchs
    1935KC Monarchs/Brooklyn Royal Giants/Bismark ND
    1936NY Cubans (5-2)/Bismark, ND
    1937Dominican Republic (2-3)/Post Tourney
    1938Mexican League (8-3, 1.82)
    1939Mexican League (16-6, 2.50)
    1940KC Monarchs
    1941KC Monarchs/Philadelphia Stars
    1942Cleveland Buckeyes
    1943Cleveland Buckeyes
    1944Mexican League (8-12, 5.11)
    1945?????
    1946KC Monarchs/Cleveland Buckeyes
    1947Cleveland Buckeyes (12-6)
    1948Cleveland Buckeyes (5-5)
    1949Cleveland Buckeyes

    Lifetime Lg Total: 127-79, .617

    Also
    1930-1931Cuba
    1933Toured Orient
    ????Panama
    ????Panama
    1947Caguas (PR Lg) (7-3)
    Chet Brewer Data from Holway

    1925 4-1 for KC; team 63-20. #6 on team in dec.. +0.22 WAT
    1926 14-1 for KC; 3rd in wins, 1st in wp, 75 K 2nd in league; team 65-19, #3 on team in dec. +2.19 WAT
    1927 9-6 for KC; team 58-33, #3 (tie) on team in dec., –0.67 WAT
    1928 7-9 for KC; team 49-32; #3 on team in dec., -3.34 WAT
    1929 17-3 for KC; 2nd in wins, 1st in wp, 1st in TRA,; all-star, GSA; team 66-14, #2 on team in dec., +0.67 WAT
    1930 13-10 for KC; 5th in wins, 109 K 2nd in league; team 54-33, #1 on team in dec., -1.7 WAT
    1931 2-2 for KC; team 21-6, #3 on team in dec. (tie), -1.3 WAT
    1932 5-6 total (2-6 for WAS; 3-0 for KC), #4 on WAS in dec, team 16-35, -0.49 WAT, #2 on KC in dec. (tie), team 9-5, +1.36 WAT
    1933 No data for KC (barnstorming)
    1934 No data for KC (barnstorming)
    1935 No data for KC (barnstorming)
    1936 5-7 for NY Cubans; #1 on team in dec., team 25-22, -1.9 WAT
    1937 Santa Domingo (2-3)
    1938 MeL (8-3)
    1939 MeL (16-6)
    1940 Macmillan says “Latin America”; Riley says KC; Holway has no NeL data, could have toured with the KC “B”Team. Was he in the MeL?
    1941 2-6 total (0-1 for KC, 2-5 for PHI), #5 on KC in dec., team 24-6, -0.83 WAT, #2 on PHI in dec. (3-way tie), team 12-28, -.12 WAT
    1942 No data. Macmillan says “Latin America,” Riley says Cleveland. Was he in the MeL?
    1943 No data. Macmillan says “Latin America,” Riley says Cleveland.
    1944 MeL (8-12)
    1945 No data. Macmillan says “Latin America.” Riley says nothing.
    1946 9-10 total (7-9 for CLE; 2-1 for CHI), #1 on CLE in dec., team 19-25, +0.14 WAT; #5 on CHI in team dec., team 19-21, +0.62 WAT
    1947 12-6 for CLE, 1st in league in wins, 2nd in TRA, 3rd in K (91); team 44-17, #1 on team in dec., -1.40 WAT
    1948 5-5 for CLE, 5th in league in TRA (3.22); team 26-27, #3 on team in dec., +0.12 WAT

    Adding seasonal totals gives a record of 104-72, .591
    Holway’s All-Time Victories list puts him at 87-63, .589 (ah, the discrepancies)
    Brewer collected black or gray ink in 1926, 1929, 1930, 1947, 1948
    His career wins above team are –7.8 .

    Chet Brewer's Mexican League stats

    Yr--W--L--ERA--G---IP---H--BB--SO-HB-WP
    38-17-05-1.88-22-182.3-124-53-153--3-02
    39-12-07-2.50-26-176.3-129-48-122--5-01
    44-03-12-5.10-28-146.3-161-73-042--0-10

    Totals:
    W-32
    L-24
    ERA-3.03
    G-76
    IP-505
    H-434
    BB-174
    SO-317
    HB-8
    WP-13

    In the California Winter League, Brewer's record over 13 seasons was 43-13.

    Comparing some of the top NeL pitchers in this league:

    Chet Brewer 43-13
    Andy Cooper 22-6
    Reuben Currie 26-19
    Bill Foster 24-1 (!)
    Robert Griffith 20-2
    Satchel Paige 56-7
    Andrew Porter 23-6
    Bullet Rogan 42-14
    Jim Willis 41-10

    From 1931 to 1936, Paige was 50-2 (!!); his record is brought down by a 6-5 record from 1943-47.

    Not all pitchers have complete strikeout and innings pitched records; of these, the only ones whose records are complete are:

    Currie, 162 K, 94 W, 402 IP
    Griffith, 228 K, 29+ W, 214 IP
    Paige, 770 K, 138+ W (2 seasons with 121 IP are missing walks), 572 IP
    Rogan, 351 K, 189 W, 516 IP
    I haven't posted them yet, but I've gotten as far as I can go on the career leaderboards.

    Anyway, so here's where Brewer falls on the Holway-based career U.S. NgL leaderboards.

    WINS 14th with 104

    LOSSES 11th with 73

    DECISIONS 12th with 177

    WINNING PCT .588
    (50+ decisions) 45th
    (25+ decisions) 67th
    (10+ decisions) 105th

    ADJ PCT OF TEAM DECISION 20.23%
    (50+ decisions) 42nd
    (25+ decisions) 60th
    (10+ decisions) 89th

    WAT 795th (out of 812)at -6.3

    WAT PER DECISION -0.35
    (50+ decisions) 90th (of 122)
    (25+ decisions) 138th (of 205)
    (10+ decisions) 211th (of 335) 24. Dr. Chaleeko Posted: May 22, 2005 at 03:32 PM (#1354572)
    Brewer's place on seasonal wins leaderboards

    1926: 3rd most wins in NNL with 14, 6th in NgLs.

    1929: t-2nd most wins in NNL with 17, t-3rd most wins in NgLs.

    1930: 4th most wins in NNL with 13, 5th most in NgLs.

    1946: 2nd in NAL with 8 wins, t-6th most wins in NgLs.

    1947: Led NAL with 12 wins, t-2nd most wins in NgLs.

    More information:

    1930: t-4th most losses in NNL and NgLs.

    1936: t-4th most losses in NgLs.

    1941: t-4th most losses in NNL, t-3rd most losses in NgLs (was with two teams).

    1946: Led NAL and NgLs in losses.

    1947: Led NAL and was 4th in NgLs in losses.

    1948: t-4th most losses in NAL and t-5th in NgLs.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

  6. #6
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    Dave Brown Data

    From Riley
    1920 10-2
    1921 11-3
    1922 8-3
    1923 4-7

    17-12 in three Cuban seasons
    7-3 in 1923/4 Cuban league

    From Holway
    1918 No Data
    1919 No Data
    1920 11-4, 2.71 TRA for Chi Am Giants; Holway all star
    1921 11-3, 2.18 TRA for Chi Am Giants; Holway all star
    2-2 in World Series vs. Hilldale & Bacharach Giants
    1922 16-7, 3.04 TRA for Chi Am Giants; Holway all star
    2-0 with 0.82 TRA in World Series vs. Bacharachs
    4-3 in Cuban Play
    1923 7-9, 3.86 TRA for NY Lincoln Giants
    4-2 in Cuban Play
    1924 22-11 (no TRA) for NY Lincoln Giants
    2-4 in Cuban play
    1925 No Data

    PLACEMENT OF DAVE BROWN ON HOLWAY-BASED LEADERBOARDS

    WINS 29th with 67 wins

    LOSSES 66th with 34 losses

    DECISIONS 40th with 101

    WIN PCT .663
    (Minimum 50+ decisions) 16th
    (Minimum 25+ decisions) 27th
    (Minimum 10+ decisions) 49th

    ADJ PCT OF TEAM DECISIONS 28.8%
    (Minimum 50+ decisions) 5th
    (Minimum 25+ decisions) 9th
    (Minimum 10+ decisions) 21st

    WAT 18th with 10.9

    WAT/DECISION .107
    (Minimum 50+ decisions) 16th
    (Minimum 25+ decisions) 29th
    (Minimum 10+ decisions) 52nd

    PLACEMENT ON YEARLY WINS LEADERBOARDS

    1920 t-5th in NNL with 11 wins.

    1921 t-7th in NNL with 11 wins.

    1922 t-4th in NNL with 16 wins.

    1923 4th in ECL with 7 wins, t-8th in NgLs.

    1924 2nd in NgLs and ECL with 22 wins.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

  7. #7
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    Biz Mackey Data

    Teams: 20-22 ABCs, 23-31 Hilldale, 32??, 33-35 Phi Stars, 36-37 Wash Elite Giants, 38-39 Bal Elite Giants, 39-41 Newark Eagles, 42-44 ??, 45-47 Newark Eagles

    1920 .315 for Ind ABCs; 3b
    2-5 vs. major-league competition
    1921 .317 for Ind ABCs; 13 hr (3rd), 25 hr/550 (3rd), 10 3b (5th); 2b; all-star
    4-7 vs. major-leage pitchers in California league
    1922 .344 for Ind ABCs; ut
    1923 .441 for Hilldale; ba 1st, 9 hr (2nd), 20 hr/550 ab (5th), 4 3b (5th); c; all-star, MVP
    5-20 vs. Major-League competition
    1924 .357 for Hilldale; ba 3rd, 20 2b (3rd); ss; all-star
    10-40 in World Series vs. KC
    47-152 in Cuban Play
    1925 .346 for Hilldale; 12 sb (5th); c; all-star
    1926 .313 for Hilldale; 10 hr (3rd), 17 2b (1st), 14 sb (1st); c, all-star
    1927 .315 for Hilldale; c, all-star
    1-10 vs. major-league competition
    1928 .360 for Hilldale; ba would be 5th in league, too few ab; c
    3-8 vs. major-league competition
    1929 .308 for Hilldale; c, all-star
    1930 .397 for Hilldale; 4 3b (3rd), 2 sb (2nd); c, all-star
    1931 .359 for Phi Stars; ba 1st; c, MVP
    1932 No Data
    1933 .298 for Phi Stars; c
    1934 .299 for Phi Stars; ut
    7-19 in playoff vs. Chi Am Giants
    1935 .257 for Phi Stars; c
    3-11 vs. major-league competition
    1936 .257 for Was Elite Giants; 3 3b (4th); c
    0-3 vs. major-league competition
    1937 .375 for Was Elite Giants; (high enough to place in leaders, not enough ab); c
    1938 .285 for Bal Elite Giants; c
    1939 .256 for Newark Eagles; 4 hr (4th), 28 hr/550 (4th); c
    6-12 in playoffs
    1940 .281 for Newark Eagles; c
    1941 .264 for Newark Eagles; c
    1942 no data
    1943 no data
    1944 no data
    1945 .279 for Newark Eagles; c
    1946 no data, manager of Newark Eagles
    1947 .220 for Newark Eagles; c and manager

    Career, according to Holway
    1383-4292, .322
    26-74, .354, against major-league competition
    50 hr, 6 hr/550 ab
    MVP 1923, 1931
    All-star 1921 (2b), 1923, 1924 (ss), 1925, 1926, 1927, 1929, 1930
    Fielding 1920 3b, 1921 2b, 1922 ut, 1924 ss, 1923, 1925-47 c
    Mean avg. for 22 seasons with data, .315

    Career according to MacMillan 10th
    802 g, 2925 ab, 942 hits, 117 2b, 43 3b, 60 hr, .322 ba, .453 slg
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

  8. #8
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    MAX MANNING
    NEGRO LEAGUES
    &#xtm; wat/ tm avg tm
    YEAR LG TEAM W L pct dec WAT dec dec decs in lg
    1939 NNL NWK 4 4 .500 18% -1.4 -.18 45 33
    1940 NNL NWK 14 7 .667 39% 2.5 .12 54 57
    1941 NNL NWK 5 2 .714 21% .9 .12 34 41
    1942 NNL NWK 6 7 .462 27% -.9 -.07 49 41
    1946 NNL NWK 13 1 .929 18% 2.4 .17 76 52
    1947 NNL NWK 15 6 .714 27% 4.5 .21 79 60
    1948 NNL NWK 10 4 .714 100% 0.0 .00 14 37
    TOTAL 67 31 .684 28% 8.0 .08 351 321

    As I recollect, Manning served two or three years in the war, but I'm not sure about that.

    Also, someone please correct me if I have the facts wrong, but I think he might have played minor league ball, but he hurt his arm which ruined his big-league aspirations. 3. Dr. Chaleeko Posted: July 11, 2005 at 01:48 PM (#1463917)
    At lunch I was able to gather a little more info from Holway, Riley, and Cisneros.

    1) Manning was indeed drafted and served 1943-1945.

    2) Riley says he pitched in Cuba from 1946-1949, I assume he means in the CWL. He then spent 1950 in Venezuala in Maricaoba.

    3) He finished off his career by pitching two seasons in Mexico, 1951 and 1953.

    He went a combined 5-9 in 131.33 innings, sporting ERAs of 3.02 and 4.27 in the two seasons. His H, BB, and K rates seem pretty respectable given the league's propensity to high hit rates and low K/BB rates.
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

  9. #9
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    Oliver Marcelle Data

    Expert Assessments
    Selected by 80% of experts polled in _Cool Papas_ for HoF
    BJ -- #3 Third Baseman, behind Ray Dandridge and Judy Johnson
    Holway -- #3 Third Baseman, behind Jud Wilson and Ray Dandridge; selected as all-star four times by Holway

    From Riley

    .305 lifetime Negro-League Average
    1919, 1921-29 seasonal avgs. .229, .305, .364, .295, .343, .308, .255, .306, .296, .288
    .305 lifetime Cuban Winter League average (8 seasons)

    From Holway

    Negro-League Data
    1918 .111 for Bkn Royal Giants
    1919 .462 (20-50) for Bkn Royal Giants; Holway all-star
    1920 .323 for AC Bacharach Giants; Holway all-star
    1921 .299 for AC Bacharach Giants; Holway all-star
    6-15, .400 in playoff vs. Hilldale
    1922 .265 for AC Bacharach Giants
    6 –24, .250 in World Series vs. Chi Am Giants
    1923, .306 for NY Lincoln Giants
    1924 .316 for NY Lincoln Giants
    1925 .321 for AC Bacharach Giants, .174 for NY Lincoln Giants
    1926 .288 for AC Bacharach Giants
    12-36 in World Series vs. Chi Am Giants
    1927 .326 for AC Bacharach Giants; Holway all-star
    8-34, .235 in World Series vs. Chi Am Giants
    1928 .288 for AC Bacharach Giants
    1929 .288 for Balt Black Sox
    1930 .308 for Bkn Royal Giants

    Career Data
    .302, 723-2391

    Cuban Data
    1923 .393 to lead winter league
    1924 .310 (39-126)
    1925 .333 (26-78)
    1927 .336 (40-119)
    1929 .241 (38-158)

    Vs. Major League Competition
    1920 1-4 vs. Babe Ruth all-stars (Carl Mays and Ruth pitch)
    1921 8-19 vs. Phil Athletics
    1929 2-13 vs. All-Star squad (Phil A’s pitchers minus Grove plus Balt Orioles of IL)
    career 11-36, .306
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

  10. #10
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    Luis Marquez

    Here's the raw stats for Marquez

    ngl
    YEAR LG TM AGE PO TMG G AB H TB 2B 3B HR SB BB K AVG SLG
    -------------------------------------------------------------------
    1945 nnl nyc 19 of 26
    1946 nnl 2tm 20 of 22 81 25 31 3 0 1 3 .309 .383
    1947 nnl hom 21 of 250 96 134 15 5 .384 .535
    1948 nnl hom 22 of 39 35 52 .298 .407

    international league
    1949 il nwk 23 of 153 18 69 17 23 3 0 1 3 7 5 .246 .333

    pacific coast league
    1949 pcl por 23 of 187 132 511 150 202 26 7 4 32 40 76 .294 .395
    1950 pcl por 24 of 200 194 775 241 347 41 19 9 38 64 98 .311 .448
    1955 pcl por 29 of 172 112 381 119 169 24 1 8 5 24 67 .312 .444
    1956 pcl por 30 of 168 155 602 207 329 27 10 25 18 43 77 .344 .547
    1957 pcl por 31 of 168 167 610 169 305 31 6 31 13 47 69 .277 .500
    1958 pcl por 32 of 109 335 89 138 13 6 8 2 .266 .412

    american association
    1952 aa mil 26 of 154 136 521 180 280 38 10 14 24 51 91 .346 .537
    1953 aa tol 27 of 154 130 510 149 222 28 3 13 37 .292 .435
    1954 aa tol 28 of 154 58 229 76 120 18 1 8 7 .332 .524
    1955 aa tol 29 of 154 21 75 18 32 6 1 2 0 .240 .427
    1959 aa dal 33 of 154 142 510 176 262 24 4 18 14 .345 .514
    1960 aa dal 34 of 154 144 469 124 169 30 3 3 6 .264 .360
    1961 aa dal 35 of 154 18 43 9 14 3 1 0 0 .209 .326

    eastern league
    1961 el wms 35 of 154 19 54 14 20 1 1 1 1 .259 .370

    mexican league
    1962 mxl pzr 36 of 130 126 460 164 263 28 4 21 9 58 47 .357 .572
    1963 mxl pzr 37 of 134 118 401 126 211 19 3 20 8 43 63 .314 .526

    prwl
    1945 prw agu 19 of 40 175 10 .298 .576
    1946 prw agu 20 of 60 224 78 27 14 27 .348 .684
    1947 prw agu 21 of 59 65 20 .296 .482
    1948 prw agu 22 of 80 108 29 .379 .618
    1949 prw agu 23 of 78 233 73 10 23 .313 .572
    1951 prw sj 25 of 72 275 73 3 8 23 .266 .441
    1952 prw sj 26 of 72 288 88 3 .306 .438
    1953 prw may 27 of 80 282 94 5 32 .333 .497
    1954 prw may 28 of 72 165 60 10 5 28 .364 .667
    1955 prw pon 29 of 72 191 47 74 12 3 3 5 .246 .387
    1956 prw may 30 of 72 256 70 111 12 1 9 11 .273 .434
    1957 prw pon 31 of 64 62 209 65 121 15 7 9 5 .311 .579
    1958 prw pon 32 of 64 63 220 68 111 14 4 7 4 .309 .505
    1959 prw pon 33 of 62 56 173 44 71 10 1 5 5 .254 .410
    1960 prw pon 34 of 64 41 79 17 25 6 1 0 3 .215 .317
    1961 prw pon 35 of 80 12 12 1 2 1 0 0 0 .083 .167

    nl
    1951 nl bos 25 of 154 68 122 24 31 5 1 0 4 10 20 .197 .254
    1954 nl 2tm 28 of 154 31 21 1 1 0 0 0 3 2 4 .083 .048
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

  11. #11
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    First, here's Matlock's data from Holway and Riley.

    Leroy Matlock Data

    From Riley

    Born March 12, 1907

    Teams: St. Louis Stars, 1929-31, Detroit/Homestead/Washington 1932, Pittsburgh Crawfords 1933-38, Santa Domingo 1937, Venezuela 1939, Mexico 1940-1942, New York Cubans 1942

    Seasonal Data from Holway

    1929 5-2, team 70-26, #5 in team decisons, -0.1 WAT
    1930 10-3, #3 in league in wp, team 68-24, #2 in team dec. (tie), 0.5 WAT
    1931 1-3, team 23-17, #5 in team dec., -1.4 WAT
    1932 4-1 for Homestead (team 64-28), 2-5 for Was (team 16-35), 0.4 WAT
    1933 11-4, 4th in wins, 4th in wp, 4th in TRA, 4th in K, team 49-31, #3 in team dec., 2.2 WAT, all-star
    1934 14-3, 3rd in wins, 2nd in wp, 5 in K, team 63-22, #3 in team dec., 1.8 WAT
    1935 17-0, 1st in wins, 1st in wp, 1st in TRA, team 47-17, #1 in team dec., 6.1 WAT, all-star, GSA
    1936 9-3, 3rd in wins, 3rd in wp, 1st in TRA, team 39-27, #2 in team dec., 2.3 WAT
    (Note, all his dec. came in the first half of the season. Pitched a lot then, and not at all thereafeter. Holway says he doesn’t know the reason, but Riley has him playing on a black all-star team that entered and won the Denver Post tournament.)
    1937 4-1 in S.D., no team data, 1-0 for Pgh, team 12-16, 0.6 WAT
    1938 3-7, team 24-18, #2 in team dec., -3.6 WAT
    1939 No Data: in Venezuela
    1940 15-10, 3.27 ERA, 101 K in Mexico
    1941 15-7 in Mexico
    1942 9-13 in Mexico, no data for NY Cubans

    Career
    77-31, .713 in NeL competition
    4-1 in Santa Domingo
    39-30 in Mexico

    Yes, Matlock pitched one season in Cuba, 1938-39, splitting his time among two teams and going 6-8. With pennant-winning Santa Clara he was a teammate of Josh Gibson, Ray Brown, Sam Bankhead, Manuel García, and Lázaro Salazar. With third-place Cuba he was a teammate of Bill Holland, Ray Dandridge, and Bill Perkins.
    Yr Team G CG W L Tm W Tm L Tm Pct Pennant WAT % tm dec
    38-39 Santa Clara 8 3 2 4 34 20 .630 * -2.0 11%
    38-39 Cuba 10 4 4 4 25 29 .463 0.3 15%
    38-39 Total 18 7 6 8 -1.7
    Seen on a bumper sticker: If only closed minds came with closed mouths.

    Some minds are like concrete--thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.

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