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Thread: Why is Joe Dimaggio in the HOF?

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan66
    better cf's, cobb, mays, mantle, speaker, charleston, griffey jr, williams, and a few others that i dont remember
    I'm sorry, by Williams, do you honestly mean Bernie Williams? Ted was a LF, so that doesn't fit, and I can't think of any other Williams who'd really go there. If so, you're just being ridiculous.
    "Simply put, the passion, interest and tradition surrounding baseball in New York is unmatched."

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  2. #52
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    Other than slugging percentage, here are DiMaggio's top 100 career marks, giving him absolutely no credit for his three years in the service.:

    OPS+ 23rd
    RBI 38th
    avg 43rd
    runs created 55th
    HR 63rd
    total bases 75th
    runs scored 79th, and I saved this one for you because you insist on attacking him for his "low" OBP: 63rd.

    Source: baseball-reference.com

    The HOF has 140 major league position players in it. Please explain how with all the evidence we've presented he's not among those top 140.

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  3. #53
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    And, just to point out, the word you mean to be using is have. Would have, not would of. I'm trying desperately to think of any circumstance under which "would of" would be gramatticaly correct... I can think of a few with a comma in the middle ("General Motor's financial outlook would make an accountant weep more than any other corporation's would, of the businesses in the Fortune 500."), but I'm drawing a blank at any instance where just a straight "would of" would be in the remotest bit proper.
    "Simply put, the passion, interest and tradition surrounding baseball in New York is unmatched."

    Sean McAdam, ESPN.com

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Honus Wagner Rules
    Before the Steriod Era only two players had a career .600+ slugging percentage. Another weak argument.
    No, thats not true. Ruth, Williams, Gehrig, Foxx, and Greenberg all had SLG over .600.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murderers Row
    No, thats not true. Ruth, Williams, Gehrig, Foxx, and Greenberg all had SLG over .600.
    Oops you're right! I forgot about Foxx and Greenberg. I confused my self because I knew Ruth and Williams were 1-2 when I was a kid.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan66
    dimaggio's career just wasnt long enough. most of the greats of that era had more leads examples

    gehrig led in BA 1X, obp 5X, slg 2X, runs 4X, h 1X, tb 4X, hr 3X, rbi 5X

    foxx led in ba 2X, obp 3X, slg 5X, runs 1X, tb 3X, hr 4X, rbi 3X

    they face much tougher competition

    joe d was not the best player on those teams as that honor goes to gehrig

    he was not a deserving all star every year

    his numbers are good but not hof like

    his only great seasons were 1937 and 1941

    he didnt steal bases either and his only comptetion throughout his career wa ted williams

    dimaggio is similar to vernon wells or bernie williams...good but not hof
    You're joking, right? I mean, I can't believe I'm reading this.
    "I do not care if half the league strikes. Those who do it will encounter quick retribution. All will be suspended and I don't care if it wrecks the National League for five years. This is the United States of America and one citizen has as much right to play as another. The National League will go down the line with Robinson whatever the consequences. You will find if you go through with your intention that you have been guilty of complete madness."

    NL President Ford Frick, 1947

  7. #57
    a couple other thing if i remember correctly dimaggio isnt on top 50 warp3 list..........and i think pretty low on eqa...........

    although ya are starting to make sense........still higher than 10 as a CF is hard to explain

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan66
    joe was never deemed a great defensive cf.........so thats a non factor

    again who knows the numbers he would of put up...theres no tellin...so credit isnt earned
    If you believe this, you have NO idea of the opinon of DiMaggio's contemporaries.
    "I do not care if half the league strikes. Those who do it will encounter quick retribution. All will be suspended and I don't care if it wrecks the National League for five years. This is the United States of America and one citizen has as much right to play as another. The National League will go down the line with Robinson whatever the consequences. You will find if you go through with your intention that you have been guilty of complete madness."

    NL President Ford Frick, 1947

  9. #59
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    I'll just post one more number-56.
    I realize that one record in itself should not make a player HOF worthy. But that streak, along with the other statistics that have been posted make Joe D pretty HOF worthy to me.
    And he hit in 63 in the PCL, which was considered a great Minor league back then, maybe even worthy of MLB status.
    Last edited by soberdennis; 07-23-2006 at 06:12 PM.

    Welcome back ARod. Hope you are a Yankee forever.
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  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan66
    Manny Ramirez has a 156 OPS+ in 13 seasons.

    Joe D had a 155 OPS+ in 13 seasons.

    i ask again if manny ramirez retired after 2005 is he one of the greatest players of all-time and among the best lf( rf) of all time????? let alone a hof

    again ask yourselves this question
    If Manny retired today, he should walk right into the HOF. If Manny Ramirez is not a HOFer, then who is that's in the game today?
    "I do not care if half the league strikes. Those who do it will encounter quick retribution. All will be suspended and I don't care if it wrecks the National League for five years. This is the United States of America and one citizen has as much right to play as another. The National League will go down the line with Robinson whatever the consequences. You will find if you go through with your intention that you have been guilty of complete madness."

    NL President Ford Frick, 1947

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan66
    a couple other thing if i remember correctly dimaggio isnt on top 50 warp3 list..........and i think pretty low on eqa...........

    although ya are starting to make sense........still higher than 10 as a CF is hard to explain
    No, it's not. Cobb, Mays, Speaker, Mantle, Charleston, are fine. Any other CF you want to put ahead of DiMaggio is not. You say you'd put Griffey ahead? Griffey's career as a useful player essentially lasted 12 seasons (1989 to 2000). You complain about DiMaggio not leading his league in things? Griffey has 26 points of black ink and 160 of grey; DiMaggio has 34 and 226, respectively. Their fielding is roughly comparable (though I'd have DiMaggio ahead), Griffey was the better baserunner, but DiMag was CLEARLY a better hitter. Not really an argument there when one guy's at .325/.398/.579 and the other's at .293/.377/.561.
    "Simply put, the passion, interest and tradition surrounding baseball in New York is unmatched."

    Sean McAdam, ESPN.com

  12. #62
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    Manny's one of the top ten LF's ever and easily a HoF'er, despite being useless in the field and on the basepaths.

    Another thing you have to get over, Dodger, is only looking at SB's to judge a player's baserunning skills. The Yankees have NEVER been a baserunning team; DiMaggio was considered a fine baserunner despite never stealing much, and Mantle was one of the best baserunners ever (arguably the fastest player ever to play major league baseball) despite only stealing 153.
    "Simply put, the passion, interest and tradition surrounding baseball in New York is unmatched."

    Sean McAdam, ESPN.com

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElHalo
    No, it's not. Cobb, Mays, Speaker, Mantle, Charleston, are fine. Any other CF you want to put ahead of DiMaggio is not. You say you'd put Griffey ahead? Griffey's career as a useful player essentially lasted 12 seasons (1989 to 2000). You complain about DiMaggio not leading his league in things? Griffey has 26 points of black ink and 160 of grey; DiMaggio has 34 and 226, respectively. Their fielding is roughly comparable (though I'd have DiMaggio ahead), Griffey was the better baserunner, but DiMag was CLEARLY a better hitter. Not really an argument there when one guy's at .325/.398/.579 and the other's at .293/.377/.561.
    I also give DiMaggio an edge over Griffey being a RH hitter in Yankee Stadium.

    DiMaggio also struck out only 8 more times than he homered, and his Ks only surpassed his HRs in his last season.
    "I do not care if half the league strikes. Those who do it will encounter quick retribution. All will be suspended and I don't care if it wrecks the National League for five years. This is the United States of America and one citizen has as much right to play as another. The National League will go down the line with Robinson whatever the consequences. You will find if you go through with your intention that you have been guilty of complete madness."

    NL President Ford Frick, 1947

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan66
    he should of adjusted to yankee stadium then....williams played in fenway and dominated it.....thas part of greatness how do u face an obstacle....again he should not desereve any credit
    Dodgerfan, this comment suggests that you're grasping at anything and everything, and have very little to no real-life knowledge of a hitters approach and how a pitcher can and will adjust to counter it. For DiMaggio to change his approach would mean his other numbers would suffer big time. Pitchers, realizing that Joe D was now consciously looking to exploit the very short left field line, would counter that in how they pitched to him. His strikeouts would be through the roof, batting average would suffer, OBP and extra base hits would go down. One thing is certain, he couldn't have hit in 72 of 73 straight games with that approach. If he'd done that, you'd really be saying he doesn't belong.
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  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sultan_1895-1948
    Dodgerfan, this comment suggests that you're grasping at anything and everything, and have very little to no real-life knowledge of a hitters approach and how a pitcher can and will adjust to counter it. For DiMaggio to change his approach would mean his other numbers would suffer big time. Pitchers, realizing that Joe D was now consciously looking to exploit the very short left field line, would counter that in how they pitched to him. His strikeouts would be through the roof, batting average would suffer, OBP and extra base hits would go down. One thing is certain, he couldn't have hit in 72 of 73 straight games with that approach. If he'd done that, you'd really be saying he doesn't belong.
    Just looking at that graphic really cements how great Joe D must have been. That left-cener field is horrible!

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Honus Wagner Rules
    Just looking at that graphic really cements how great Joe D must have been. That left-cener field is horrible!
    Like I said Yankee Stadium LF was where Homeruns went to die. I believe it was refered to as Death Valley.
    I have been reading this thread all afternoon and am convinced of one thing. Despite what Dodgerfan says, Joe Dimaggio was one of the greatest players of his time, possibly all time(I will avoid using rankings). He definitely belongs in the HOF.
    If Dodgerfan isn't at least convinced of the last statement, then maybe he should take his anti-Yankee goggles off and reread our resoponses.

    Welcome back ARod. Hope you are a Yankee forever.
    Phil Rizzuto-a Yankee forever.

    Holy Cow

  17. #67
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    Now, I think Joe DiMaggio is one of the most overrated and overhyped players in baseball history, I had him #28 and most people thought that was too low but my new system actually put him at #36, so I have him even lower than I used to. BUT, to say he's not a HOFer is completely ridiculous. I can say he's overrated all I want, I can't deny he's an absolute, no questions asked HOFer.

  18. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by 538280
    Now, I think Joe DiMaggio is one of the most overrated and overhyped players in baseball history, I had him #28 and most people thought that was too low but my new system actually put him at #36, so I have him even lower than I used to. BUT, to say he's not a HOFer is completely ridiculous. I can say he's overrated all I want, I can't deny he's an absolute, no questions asked HOFer.
    You don't give war credit in your system, do you?

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElHalo
    And, just to point out, the word you mean to be using is have. Would have, not would of. I'm trying desperately to think of any circumstance under which "would of" would be gramatticaly correct... I can think of a few with a comma in the middle ("General Motor's financial outlook would make an accountant weep more than any other corporation's would, of the businesses in the Fortune 500."), but I'm drawing a blank at any instance where just a straight "would of" would be in the remotest bit proper.
    The problem is that people are pronouncing it in the contraction form, "would've", and misspelling it "would of".

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murderers Row
    You don't give war credit in your system, do you?
    Pretty sure he does, but not for Joe D.
    "Everyone left here, but I remain at my post, documenting my sports writers and photos. I don't do Ty Cobb anymore. I did for him everything I could do. Work will live on. Personalities will fade.

    Fever members come and go. Not relevant. Your documentations will live FOREVER, my brother. That outweighs all the Fever jack-asses. Ignore what you must, document all you can."
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  21. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Sultan_1895-1948
    Pretty sure he does, but not for Joe D.
    And why is that?

  22. #72
    guys the fact of the matter is this

    Joe played 13 seasons

    he didnt have any magical numbers

    he dindt have 400 hr's

    he only had 2 GREAT historic seasons (1937, 1939)

    had alot of good seasons yet not really diffrent than Bernie Williams

    was a good glove ( not legendary)

    again hes comparable to Ken Griffey Jr ( Griffey stole more bases and was a better glove with more power) but ken's not a top 20 player neither is Joe..........

    maybe he is worthy of the hall...but not deserving to all the praise he gets

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murderers Row
    And why is that?
    Because JoeD spent most of the war doing publicity and USO type events, while Ted Williams was piloting fighter planes. I guess he draws a moral distinction.

    I can't make the same kind of distinction; my paternal grandfather landed on Normandy and took shrapnel to the chest; my maternal grandfather was stationed at a deserted airstrip in New Guinea throughout the war (I believe he was actually sitting on the same airstrip for over three years), lounging on the beach, and saw as much combat in the war as I did. I can't draw distinctions between the two just because of the roles they fell into by the luck of the draw.
    "Simply put, the passion, interest and tradition surrounding baseball in New York is unmatched."

    Sean McAdam, ESPN.com

  24. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by ElHalo
    Because JoeD spent most of the war doing publicity and USO type events, while Ted Williams was piloting fighter planes. I guess he draws a moral distinction.
    That's ridiculous.

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan66
    Griffey stole more bases and was a better glove with more power.
    What might Joe have done in the Kingdome and Cincy's park
    "Everyone left here, but I remain at my post, documenting my sports writers and photos. I don't do Ty Cobb anymore. I did for him everything I could do. Work will live on. Personalities will fade.

    Fever members come and go. Not relevant. Your documentations will live FOREVER, my brother. That outweighs all the Fever jack-asses. Ignore what you must, document all you can."
    - Bill Burgess

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