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Thread: "McCarver-isms"

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by runningshoes
    Incapable of sitting there for three hours describing a game in a way that won't make viewers turn the Television off.

    I think you need a certain amount of the arrogance, that many players have, to do the job.
    He may not be better than us, but it's only because we'd all be too embarrassed to say the stupid things McCarver says with any sort of conviction. We'd say things just as lame and stupid, but out of complete desperation and we would, rightly, sound desperate. Being too stupid to realize no one cares about your (McCarver's) shallow point isn't something that, in my opinion, we should be praising.
    "Hall of Famer Whitey Ford now on the field... pleading with the crowd for, for some kind of sanity!"

  2. #27
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    As someone who has semi-defended McCarver on a couple of threads, let me just state that I certainly don't enjoy McCarver for the overused cliches and sometimes overzealous praise of not-quite-so-deserving players. And yes, I have also heard him fumble a statement and found myself either smiling or wincing at his foible, but I enjoy him, for the most part, for what some on this forum seem to think he's lacking in, his insight. I'm not exactly sure what some people have or haven't heard McCarver say over the years, and I certainly haven't seen every game he's ever broadcast, but almost every time I do, a few gems of insight and baseball wisdom do come out of his piehole. He caught in the majors for a very long time (a four decade guy, if memory serves), and when he is dispensing some of his knowledge about the game from a catcher's perspective, I usually find it quite interesting and educational. A catcher has a unique perspective, and one that 'controls' a good part of a ball game, and it's obvious that he is very knowledgable about the nuances and idiosyncrasies of it. That's generally why I listen to him. Well, that and I usually have no other choice!

    I do agree that he tends to like the sound of his own voice too much at times, but I forgive him that, because so does everyone in the broadcast biz, from baseball to political talk. I find his sense of humor refreshing at times, too. I also might look at him in a different perspective from others, having read a couple of his books and enjoying them immensely. One of my favorite passages in the oddly-titled "Oh Baby, I Love It" is when McCarver, as a rookie in 1959, was put up to pinch hit late in a game with the bases loaded and one out. He smoked a line drive right at the pitcher (or some other infielder, but I think it was the pitcher) who snared the ball and tossed it to first base for a double play. When he got back to the dugout, the manager said, "Nice going, McCarver! Do me a favor. Next time, just strike out and keep the inning going!"

    Different people seem to expect and want different things from sportscasters. Some seem to want insight, others entertainment and still others just want them to shut up and announce the game and leave all the extraneous stuff alone (my dad was like that). I want a little of all three. For me, McCarver is the first two, but not the third. Oh well. Two out of three ain't bad, and I think he's okay. I didn't say I think he's great, just a little better than the average sportscaster I've seen. Either I'm in the minority or many of those who like him aren't speaking up. I suspect I'm the former, but who really cares?

    It is telling, however, that those who like and admire Yogi Berra seem to embrace the verbal fouls-ups he (allegedly) made from time to time, yet those who dislike McCarver use them against him like a stiletto. I suppose it's just human nature, though.
    Last edited by Dodgerfan1; 10-24-2006 at 03:15 AM.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan1
    Just like O'Reilly and Hannity, an awful lot of people must like McCarver, or he wouldn't be so successful at what he's doing.
    I sure a lot of people like O'Reilly and Hannity (1/2 of the electorate) as well.
    Unlike most other team sports, in which teams usually have an equivalent number of players on the field at any given time, in baseball the hitting team is at a numerical disadvantage, with a maximum of 5 players and 2 base coaches on the field at any time, compared to the fielding team's 9 players. For this reason, leaving the dugout to join a fight is generally considered acceptable in that it results in numerical equivalence on the field, and a fairer fight.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by iPod
    He may not be better than us, but it's only because we'd all be too embarrassed to say the stupid things McCarver says with any sort of conviction. We'd say things just as lame and stupid, but out of complete desperation and we would, rightly, sound desperate. Being too stupid to realize no one cares about your (McCarver's) shallow point isn't something that, in my opinion, we should be praising.
    But we don't praise it.

    We cut it up.

    it's OK to make light of his commentary but some of us want to end him as is the aim of that ridiculous web site.
    The Cuervo Gold, the fine Columbian, make tonight a wonderful thing.

  5. #30
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    One problem may be that he just doesn't have a knack for jokes. The Groundball statement seems a tongue-in-cheek statement that could be very funny if spoken in the right way, and taken in the right way. And the statement about the ball being down and up is just hilarious...he obviously just mis-spoke, and that's OK, because we all do it. Shoot, we all have typos in our messages here on this forum all the time. Bad English is one thing, a typo is quite another. Well, I'm sure McCarver has had a few verbal typos.
    That said, he says a lot of stupid things. And that list is just a small example. I like good analysis, because I like to get inside the players' and managers' heads and figure out what's going on, what the possiblilties are, the "game within the game" if you know what I mean. But it's true, some things are just stupid. The 19 batters thing is just silly. If he meant 19 straight batters, then it makes sense, but I have a feeling that's not what was happening. But it is hard to speak on your feet like sportscasters do. I tried to do it a couple years ago during the All-Star Fan Fest here in Chicago. They had this video booth, and you could put on headphones, pick from a selection of plays, and then do the play-by-play. A friend and I did it together, (He was color commentary, I was play-by-play) and gave it a shot. It was hard! So, I have a little mercy on these guys. But I don't have mercy on Hawk Harrelson.
    But Tim is professional. He should get a talking to.
    "He can get 10 hits in five at-bats." -Joe Torre, exasperated after seeing Ichiro hit a routine ground ball to shortstop and cross first with an infield single.

  6. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisLDuncan
    Keep in mind that Fox gave Bill O'Rielly and Sean Hannity their own shows, so McCarver to call games isn't exactly the worst thing that Fox needs to take care of.
    Ha ha, good one! Hannity and O'Reilly are morons and ignorant blowhards! (Not to mention bald-faced liars.)


  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan1
    Just like O'Reilly and Hannity, an awful lot of people must like McCarver, or he wouldn't be so successful at what he's doing.
    It's a very sad reflection of the American educational system that people actually like O'Reilly and Hannity. Boy oh boy are there ever a lot of flaming ignoramouses out there.


  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle1
    It's a very sad reflection of the American educational system that people actually like O'Reilly and Hannity. Boy oh boy are there ever a lot of flaming ignoramouses out there.

    Nice to know we have such intelligent, tolerant members here. Thanks for the update. How about back to baseball instead of the childish, juvenile name-calling?

  9. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan1
    Nice to know we have such intelligent, tolerant members here. Thanks for the update. How about back to baseball instead of the childish, juvenile name-calling?
    Hold on, that's simply the cold hard facts, an objective assessment of where we are in this country in terms of education. The popularity of the likes of O'Reilly and Hannity are highly illustrative of that fact.

    http://www.outfoxed.org/clips_trailer_qt.php

    http://www.outfoxed.org/clips_oreilly_best_qt.php
    Last edited by Seattle1; 10-24-2006 at 07:39 AM.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle1
    Hold on, that's simply the cold hard facts, an objective assessment of where we are in this country in terms of education. The popularity of the likes of O'Reilly and Hannity are highly illustrative of that fact.

    http://www.outfoxed.org/clips_trailer_qt.php

    http://www.outfoxed.org/clips_oreilly_best_qt.php
    I can also give you the 'facts' as to my IQ, which would prove I am no 'ignoramous', as you put it, thus putting the lie to your post, but nobody cares, least of all me.

    I'm here to talk baseball, not argue with an intolerant person.

  11. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgerfan1
    I can also give you the 'facts' as to my IQ, which would prove I am no 'ignoramous', as you put it, thus putting the lie to your post, but nobody cares, least of all me.

    I'm here to talk baseball, not argue with an intolerant person.
    Thanks, Dodgerfan1. This is indeed not the place to discuss politics or political commentary.

    In general, don't get too smug in what you view as the correct view, because plenty of intelligent people find you an ignoramus as well, and can provide "facts" as such.

    Tim McCarver. Carry on.
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  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Cold Nose
    Thanks, Dodgerfan1. This is indeed not the place to discuss politics or political commentary.

    In general, don't get too smug in what you view as the correct view, because plenty of intelligent people find you an ignoramus as well, and can provide "facts" as such.

    Tim McCarver. Carry on.
    I have no idea what is going on here, but I have been quite honest in giving my personal views of McCarver on this thread, as well as other subject matter on other threads, and am fairly consistent in making sure I let others know that what I say is my opinion. Whether you agree with it or think me an ignoramus because of it is your opinion too, but insulting it is something I consider childish. I wasn't aware I was on this type of forum, as most everyone seems quite civilized, except for a select few.

    I have also refrained from insisting that the things I say are 'facts', unless they are provable. They are my opinion, like them or not, and quite honestly, it doesn't make a lick of difference to me who thinks me intelligent and who thinks me a moron. If I cared about that stuff, I would never chime in with an opinion on anything.

    I guess I've run my course on this thread, too. My opinion has been stated.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by efin98
    Those are called viewers, the folks that TV networks fight tooth and nail to get. If there are alot of them it doesn't matter how stupid he sounds to people, they aren't getting rid of him.

    Hey, I watch games with fellow fans and viewers and McCarver isn't liked by any of us. My Dad which is 80 don't even watch "The Game of the Week" to often because of McCarver and Fox don't always show "The Game of the Week" during crunch time in Sept. when college football starts.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by runningshoes
    But we don't praise it.

    We cut it up.

    it's OK to make light of his commentary but some of us want to end him as is the aim of that ridiculous web site.
    Why is wanting to get rid of McCarver such a bad thing? He's terrible. There are better guys out there who could be doing his job. Whether or not anyone on this board happens to be one of those particular people better than him is irrelevant. The fact is they exist, and as long as they do, people will be frustrated that McCarver is doing an inferior job.
    "Hall of Famer Whitey Ford now on the field... pleading with the crowd for, for some kind of sanity!"

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Bedard
    “That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up.”
    "Mt. Everest erupts again!"
    "Something to keep in mind -- it's raining lightly. The infield could be very wet on ground balls."
    "Roy Oswalt is a drop and drive pitcher. What is a drop and drive pitcher? He is a guy who drops and drives. Very simple."
    "Watch Darren Daulton use his mitt like a glove."
    "There is a world of difference between a count of one ball and two strikes is a lot different situation than hitting with two strikes and one ball."
    "Giambi walks too much. He's always clogging up the bases with all that walking."
    "The reason we call that pitch up and in is because the arms are attached to the shoulder."
    "With Guererro, it's not as much a strike ZONE as it is a strike AREA."
    "You see Colon talking into his glove because David Ortiz, from the Dominican Republic, can obviously read lips in Spanish."
    "Beckett's retired 19 batters through Six and a third innings, he's having a phenomonal night..."
    "One thing about ground balls. They don't go out of the ball park."
    "Yankee pitchers have had great success this year against Cabrera when they get him out."
    "Watch Darren Daulton use his mitt like a glove."

    That actually makes sense. A glove and a mitt are different. Gloves have five fingers, mitts do not, except for the thumb. The catcher and first baseman use mitts. All other fielders use gloves. He means that Daulton has good mitt control.

    Bob

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sweet Lou
    One problem may be that he just doesn't have a knack for jokes. The Groundball statement seems a tongue-in-cheek statement that could be very funny if spoken in the right way, and taken in the right way. And the statement about the ball being down and up is just hilarious...he obviously just mis-spoke, and that's OK, because we all do it. Shoot, we all have typos in our messages here on this forum all the time. Bad English is one thing, a typo is quite another. Well, I'm sure McCarver has had a few verbal typos.
    That said, he says a lot of stupid things. And that list is just a small example. I like good analysis, because I like to get inside the players' and managers' heads and figure out what's going on, what the possiblilties are, the "game within the game" if you know what I mean. But it's true, some things are just stupid. The 19 batters thing is just silly. If he meant 19 straight batters, then it makes sense, but I have a feeling that's not what was happening. But it is hard to speak on your feet like sportscasters do. I tried to do it a couple years ago during the All-Star Fan Fest here in Chicago. They had this video booth, and you could put on headphones, pick from a selection of plays, and then do the play-by-play. A friend and I did it together, (He was color commentary, I was play-by-play) and gave it a shot. It was hard! So, I have a little mercy on these guys. But I don't have mercy on Hawk Harrelson.
    But Tim is professional. He should get a talking to.
    A TRUE professional doesn't make stupid remarks, especially in such large numbers. You and your friend are two amateurs, and are not expected to "think on your feet". And McCarver's pontificating on the rules is beyond belief. He "supposedly" read the correct ruling on a situation the other night. I believe someone read it to him.

    Bob

  17. #42

    Yogi Berra vs. Tim McCarver

    One question: why do people reminisce fondly about the nonsensical statements and flubbing up of the English language by Yogi Berra over the years, but are annoyed and/or offended by Tim McCarver butchering the language? What is the major difference? In 30 years will people look back on McCarver in a positive light?


  18. #43
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    All I can say about that is that I've never really been a devotee of the Cute Yogi Quote Club.
    3 6 10 21 29 31 35 41 42 44 47

    “I’m honored to go into the Baseball Hall of Fame with such a great group of men.” - Tom Glavine.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle1
    One question: why do people reminisce fondly about the nonsensical statements and flubbing up of the English language by Yogi Berra over the years, but are annoyed and/or offended by Tim McCarver butchering the language? What is the major difference? In 30 years will people look back on McCarver in a positive light?

    Yogi Berra wouldn't say something like "Mt Everest erupts again" or "There is a world of difference between a count of one ball and two strikes is a lot different situation than hitting with two strikes and one ball" or "The reason we call that pitch up and in is because the arms are attached to the shoulder." Those are simply nonsensical. Yogi's quotes were almost like satirical little jabs at the English language itself.
    "Hall of Famer Whitey Ford now on the field... pleading with the crowd for, for some kind of sanity!"

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by iPod
    Yogi Berra wouldn't say something like "Mt Everest erupts again" or "There is a world of difference between a count of one ball and two strikes is a lot different situation than hitting with two strikes and one ball" or "The reason we call that pitch up and in is because the arms are attached to the shoulder." Those are simply nonsensical. Yogi's quotes were almost like satirical little jabs at the English language itself.
    I asked the same question as Seattle1 did on my post above, and I agree with him. I don't think you can make a blanket statement that all of Berra's quotes are satirical jabs at the language. What about "I take a two hour nap, from one o'clock to four", or "Why buy good luggage? You only use it when you travel"? Those aren't puns, plays on words or spoonerisms, they are just dumb statements. Much like the type those who can't stand McCarver love to criticize him for, yet Berra gets a pass. I do believe I understand what you are saying, but I think the question is still a valid one.

    Even if you consider my comparisons bad examples, they are still verbal blunders and ones that McCarver haters would have jumped all over Tim for. I think it's a double standard but, again, I suppose it's just human nature defend people you like yet criticize those you don't for the same offenses. Almost like the Kenny Rogers/dirt vs pine tar thread. Those who like the Tigers defend him and those who don't criticize him, yet both would probably do a 180 if, say, Jeff Weaver had the substance on his pitching hand and threw a shutout at the Tigers.
    Last edited by Dodgerfan1; 10-27-2006 at 07:44 AM.

  21. #46
    I am convinced that Scooter the Talking Baseball is a McCarver creation.

    Last night's was great..."A sweeping curveball sweeps across the plate. That's why it's called a sweeping curveball".

    Now you tell me who says "sweeping curveball" on the telecast. Niles Crane doesn't. Must be the brain surgeon.

    I like Buck and Tim. I also like making fun of them. I am a Cards fan, so waaa-whoooo!!

    I do miss Vin Scully doing the World Series for NBC. That's he only guy who can call a game solo and smooth as silk.

  22. #47
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    Well I think we can all agree that McCarver is better than Hawk Harelson.
    "he probably used some performance enhancing drugs so he could do a better job on his report...i hear they make you gain weight" - Dr. Zizmor

    "I thought it was interesting and yes a conversation piece. Next time I post a similar story I will close with the question "So, do you think either of them have used steroids?" so that I can make the topic truly relevant to discussions about today's game." - Eric Davis

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  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisLDuncan
    Well I think we can all agree that McCarver is better than Hawk Harelson.
    You can put that on the booooooooooooooooooooard!

  24. #49
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    How about the fact that McCarver is paid to speak and Yogi is not.
    Unlike most other team sports, in which teams usually have an equivalent number of players on the field at any given time, in baseball the hitting team is at a numerical disadvantage, with a maximum of 5 players and 2 base coaches on the field at any time, compared to the fielding team's 9 players. For this reason, leaving the dugout to join a fight is generally considered acceptable in that it results in numerical equivalence on the field, and a fairer fight.

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by nascarfn5
    How about the fact that McCarver is paid to speak and Yogi is not.
    Actually he is, he does the AFLAC commericals aswell as others.
    "he probably used some performance enhancing drugs so he could do a better job on his report...i hear they make you gain weight" - Dr. Zizmor

    "I thought it was interesting and yes a conversation piece. Next time I post a similar story I will close with the question "So, do you think either of them have used steroids?" so that I can make the topic truly relevant to discussions about today's game." - Eric Davis

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqul1GyK7-g

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