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Thread: Valentin Returning To Mets

  1. #1
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    Valentin Returning To Mets

    http://www.nypost.com/seven/11132006...el_sherman.htm

    By MICHAEL MORRISSEY, MARK HALE and JOEL SHERMAN
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    November 13, 2006 -- As a reward for emerging as the productive replacement to Kaz Matsui at second base, Jose Valentin has agreed to a contract with the Mets that will more than quadruple his salary.

    Valentin has agreed to terms on a one-year deal with a vesting option for 2008 that would guarantee him $4 million - and considerably more if the option vests.

    It's a huge pay raise for the 37-year-old infielder, who earned a relatively economical $912,500 last season and reportedly was courted by a handful of other teams this month. The vesting option for 2008 is based on plate appearances, and the agreement was reached pending a physical.

    Valentin batted .271 with 18 homers and 62 RBIs in 384 at-bats, and he played great defense at second despite not playing there since 1994

    Valentin was a surprise starter in 2006 after languishing on the bench during the first month of the season, becoming a key component as the Mets climbed to the top of the National League.
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  2. #2
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    Hmmm. Teams often make mistakes assuming a guy will due this year what he did last year when his track record says otherwise. Valentin posted a 112 OPS+ last year which is his highest since 2001 and reverses four consecutive years of decline. I guess if he sucks you can keep him from vesting for 2008.
    Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball

  3. #3
    Terrible Terrible Terrible. I honestly thought if he were to come back, it would be for around $2 million or less -- not for $3-4 million. This is flat out stupid. We need a real 2B, not some guy who has a good year for the first time in 4+ years. The guy is 37 years old. How many good seasons are left in him? Zero if I were to guess. God, this is why I think Minaya is stupid.
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  4. #4
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    Probably resigned as a bench player. If all he got was a year with an option, I doubt he'll be playing every day. Especially because of the continued interest in not only Alfonso Soriano, but also Julio Lugo. Lugo wouldn't play any position except starting at second base with the Mets.
    Last edited by Dalkowski110; 11-13-2006 at 11:04 AM.
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  5. #5
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    I'm actually quite okay with this signing, as well as the pay raise. We can only hope JosÚ contributes to the next season as well as he did for this one, but more importantly, I've long believed that players should be paid based on past performance (rather than potential future performance). I feel that this is Valentin's just reward for contributing so well to the '06 Mets.

    Good for him.
    Put it in the books.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by milladrive
    I'm actually quite okay with this signing, as well as the pay raise. We can only hope JosÚ contributes to the next season as well as he did for this one, but more importantly, I've long believed that players should be paid based on past performance (rather than potential future performance). I feel that this is Valentin's just reward for contributing so well to the '06 Mets.

    Good for him.
    No offense, but that's a bit ignorant. Keeping players around that won't contribute, especially for more money, is a good way to run a franchise into the ground.
    ~MOE

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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalkowski110
    Probably resigned as a bench player. If all he got was a year with an option, I doubt he'll be playing every day. Especially because of the continued interest in not only Alfonso Soriano, but also Julio Lugo. Lugo wouldn't play any position except starting at second base with the Mets.
    Hes gonna be the everyday 2B. Even the Mets wouldnt give him 3 mil to be a platoon player. Plus he wouldnt come back unless guarenteed starting job

  8. #8
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    Sorry, but Valentin is not going to be the starting second baseman. A single nymets.com archives report from a while back isn't gonna convince me. If there are still NUMEROUS sources coming from inside the Mets saying they're pursuing at least Lugo and Loretta (Soriano is also being pursued, but he could wind up in the outfield), then why? What's the point? There have been higher-paid backups...
    Last edited by Dalkowski110; 11-13-2006 at 02:00 PM.
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by moebarguy
    No offense, but that's a bit ignorant. Keeping players around that won't contribute, especially for more money, is a good way to run a franchise into the ground.
    Yeah, you're probably right about my na´vetÚ. I'm just a Utopian at heart.

    Of course, though, there's nothing that says he won't contribute. The Mets are not a dumb organization (...except when outta the blue and orange they throw away their 27yo extremely supportive regular rightfielder).
    Put it in the books.

  10. #10
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    Of course, if Valentin does come back at least semi-regularly, and we win the bidding war on Alfonso Soriano, there's always this complex scenario...

    Vs. Lefthanded pitching, you'd have Soriano at second, Valentin on the bench, and Milledge in LF.

    Vs. Righthanded pitching, you'd have Soriano in left, and Valentin at second, with Milledge on the bench.
    Last edited by Dalkowski110; 11-13-2006 at 02:12 PM.
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by milladrive
    Yeah, you're probably right about my na´vetÚ. I'm just a Utopian at heart.

    Of course, though, there's nothing that says he won't contribute. The Mets are not a dumb organization (...except when outta the blue and orange they throw away their 27yo extremely supportive regular rightfielder).
    On the contrary, the Mets are a pretty dumb organization. They've made some of the worst trades in history, and countless free agent signings that have backfired. They have made various errors in judgement, and although Valentin will just cost them $3 million, it is still a mistake.
    ~MOE

    Moonlight Graham
    ...one game, no at-bats...


    RisingApple.com

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalkowski110
    Of course, if Valentin does come back at least semi-regularly, and we win the bidding war on Alfonso Soriano, there's always this complex scenario...

    Vs. Lefthanded pitching, you'd have Soriano at second, Valentin on the bench, and Milledge in LF.

    Vs. Righthanded pitching, you'd have Soriano in left, and Valentin at second, with Milledge on the bench.
    Whether he comes off the bench or starts, $3 million is too much for him. There is no way that he will produce like he did last season. He shouldn't start for us at 2B. And even if he is just a bench player, $3 million for that is borderline insane.
    ~MOE

    Moonlight Graham
    ...one game, no at-bats...


    RisingApple.com

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalkowski110
    Sorry, but Valentin is not going to be the starting second baseman. A single nymets.com archives report from a while back isn't gonna convince me. If there are still NUMEROUS sources coming from inside the Mets saying they're pursuing at least Lugo and Loretta (Soriano is also being pursued, but he could wind up in the outfield), then why? What's the point? There have been higher-paid backups...
    Dont look at the report, look at the money.

  14. #14
    Name me a backup who made 4 mil to just that a Backup...in other words not someone who signed as starter, struggled and then became a backup

  15. #15
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    First off, it's 3 million. Second off...okay...although we'll adjust it to 3 mil...


    Michael Tucker got awfully close with the Royals, and was not slated as a starting outfielder ($2,750,000).

    Todd Hollandsworth from 2001-2002 also got awfully close, earning the same amount that Tucker did.

    Lance Johnson with the 1998-1999 Chicago Cubs (although they may have been eating his Mets contract.)

    Jose Vizcaino in 2000; although he took a huge pay cut afterward, I'm almost positive he was not slated to play every day or at least be platooned.

    Joe Girardi with the 1998 and 1999 Yankees.
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  16. #16
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    And if we're to add platoon players...we get a lot more. One thing in favor of him starting at second, though would be next year's FA second basemen (there are a ton), and that he was signed to a one-year contract. However, I still think the Mets will pursue Alfonso Soriano and platoon him Valentin at second. Soriano would play the outfield when not playing second base. Who would be playing in the outfield when Sori would be playing second? Milledge or Chavez, my guess would be. It may work out something like what I stated above. Also remember that Shawn Green's contract expires at the end of the '07 season. My guess is he won't be resigned. Nor will Valentin. That would put an unknown player at second (though your list looks something like this: Marcus Giles, Michael Young, Cesar Itzuris, Luis Castillo, Mark Grudzielanek, and David Eckstein), while giving Milledge the chance to start regularly (Beltran, of course, would be in center) and Soriano would still be in left. Also, Carlos Gomez, if we still have him, will be coming up by then.
    Last edited by Dalkowski110; 11-13-2006 at 05:50 PM.
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by moebarguy
    On the contrary, the Mets are a pretty dumb organization. They've made some of the worst trades in history, and countless free agent signings that have backfired. They have made various errors in judgement, and although Valentin will just cost them $3 million, it is still a mistake.
    Okay, lemme rephrase. The Mets are currently not a dumb organization (...except when outta the etc., etc.).

    Personally, I can't say it's a mistake, since 2007 hasn't happened yet. ...but you're entitled to your tenacious opinion.
    Last edited by milladrive; 11-13-2006 at 08:56 PM.
    Put it in the books.

  18. #18
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    If Soriano were to sign, I have a hard time seeing him shifting between LF and 2B. I think the club would want him to focus on one or the other.

    I wonder if the Mets will bring Chris Woodward back? He had a bad shoulder and didn't hit. If Valentin can play the outfield (can he?), he could soak up those utility at-bats.

  19. #19
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    True, although it would save money, and I imagine Soriano would be game for it, considering he wants to play second as much as possible. I'd like to see him in LF, personally. I don't think Valentin can play the outfield, btw, but there's always Spring Training to teach a player to do something new...
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  20. #20
    We have Endy to play the OF. Look, I'm not against giving Valentin a spot on the team, although I would have rather signed Tony Graffanino, but giving him $3 mil means he's going to get a bulk of the starts at 2B. One of the reasons why I thought Soriano would sign with the Mets is because we would let him play 2B...
    ~MOE

    Moonlight Graham
    ...one game, no at-bats...


    RisingApple.com

  21. #21
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    In theory, we may yet have the most expensive utility guy in Valentin. Lugo's name (I say Lugo because there is always the option that Soriano would still show up at Shea even if Valentin played second base) is still being mentioned by the Mets even after Valentin was signed. I did find that to be interesting.
    Last edited by Dalkowski110; 11-13-2006 at 09:33 PM.
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalkowski110
    In theory, we may yet have the most expensive utility guy in Valentin.
    It's a joke...I really can't believe it
    ~MOE

    Moonlight Graham
    ...one game, no at-bats...


    RisingApple.com

  23. #23
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    Actually, Joe Girardi cost more as a utility catcher with the Yankees spelling Posada back in 1998 and 1999. There's a guy who can play ONE position. But yeah, I do think it's a little much to spend on a backup. However, this didn't cripple or destroy the '98 or '99 Yankees. I don't foresee as much gloom and doom as you do.
    Last edited by Dalkowski110; 11-13-2006 at 10:14 PM.
    "They put me in the Hall of Fame? They must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel!"
    -Eppa Rixey, upon learning of his induction to the Baseball Hall of Fame.

    Motafy (MO-ta-fy) vt. -fied, -fying 1. For a pitcher to melt down in a big game situation; to become like Guillermo Mota. 2. The transformation of a good pitcher into one of Guillermo Mota's caliber.

  24. #24
    It's just a terrible signing. Now if they want Lugo, he's gonna want 10 mil a year cuz the friggin sub is making 4.

    Why doesn't Omah go after Catalanatto instead? He can play all over the field including 2b (though he needs to shake off some rust) and he's a better hitter than Valentin.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Joltin Joe Giradio
    It's just a terrible signing. Now if they want Lugo, he's gonna want 10 mil a year cuz the friggin sub is making 4.

    Why doesn't Omah go after Catalanatto instead? He can play all over the field including 2b (though he needs to shake off some rust) and he's a better hitter than Valentin.
    I agree. Signing Cat would have been a better option.
    ~MOE

    Moonlight Graham
    ...one game, no at-bats...


    RisingApple.com

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