Great Baseball Fueds

[Brian McKenna]

Thought it might be nice to discuss some of the big feuds in history.

John McGraw v. Ban Johnson
McGraw v. nearly anyone who wasn't his employer or toady
Larry MacPhail v. anyone around after his 10th drink
Johnson v. Charles Comiskey
Johnson v. John Brush
Johnson v. Landis
McGraw v. Barney Dreyfuss
McGraw v. Wilbert Robinson
MacPhail v. Leo Durocher
Billy Martin v. George Steinbrenner
Steinbrenner v. Winfield
Babe Ruth v. Leo Durocher
Branch Rickey v. Negro league officials
Gus Greenlee v. Negro league officials
Evers v. Tinkers

Many of these relationships ran hot and cold.

There are plenty of others.

[Captain Cold Nose]

Clemens vs. Piazza, though certainly not to the extent of the others. Separate leagues and all.

Munson vs. Reggie (though this changed through time).

LaSorda vs. Kingman.

Rose vs. Biancalana (courtesy of Letterman)

[Chickazoola]

Joey Belle vs Omar Vizquel after the publication of Omar's book. Belle phoned in the Jim Rome Show to trash Omar.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Babe Ruth vs Lou Gehrig

Omar Vizquel vs Jose Mesa

[GiambiJuice]

Ted Williams vs. Boston sportswriters and fans.

Marge Schott vs. Jewish people (not really a feud, she just hated us)

A-Rod vs. Jeter (though it seems to have cooled off a bit)

Schilling, Variteck, etc... vs. A-Rod

[OleMissCub]

Cobb v. Crawford
Bonds v. Kent

[Urbanshocker13]

Babe Ruth vs Lou Gehrig

The Ruth and Gehrig fued is strange because they where actually close friends until the whole Mrs. Gehrig (Lou's Mom) Ruth's wife fight thing and Ruth and Gehrig friendship was never the same. The Ruth Gehrig feud has been made a bigger deal over the years, to some saying that they always hated each other and where even jealous of each other. Lou looked up to the Babe when he was younger and they where good friends through most of their time playing together.

[hellborn]

Vizquel-Mesa was scary...Jose said he was going to bean Omar, THEN kill him.
Dan Shaughnessy vs. Carl Everett
Everett vs. Evolution
Ruth vs. Cobb (in their playing days)
DiMaggio vs. the Kennedys
Dan Duquette vs. Roger Clemens
Pedro Martinez vs. Gerald Williams
Giants vs. Dodgers was truly bitter for years
Harry Caray vs. George Frazier
Caray vs. the Busch family
Johnny Temple was involved in a bitter feud with another Johnny
Jackie Robinson vs. Dixie Walker
Jackie Robinson vs. Bob Feller
Billy Martin vs. Reggie Jackson
Earl Weaver vs. Ron Luciano
Earl Weaver vs. Jim Palmer
Cobb vs. Williams
Ruth vs. Colonel Ruppert
Ruth vs. Landis
Ruth vs. Judge Fuchs
Fisk vs. Munson

[hellborn]

The Ruth and Gehrig fued is strange because they where actually close friends until the whole Mrs. Gehrig (Lou's Mom) Ruth's wife fight thing and Ruth and Gehrig friendship was never the same. The Ruth Gehrig feud has been made a bigger deal over the years, to some saying that they always hated each other and where even jealous of each other. Lou looked up to the Babe when he was younger and they where good friends through most of their time playing together.

Judging from photos, the two were inseparable in pregame activities until the very early '30s.
I doubt that Lou joined Babe in visiting speakeasies and brothels after the game, though...

[Brian McKenna]

Did Feller really ask not to share the HOF platform with a black man in 1962?

[Urbanshocker13]

I don't know if Fans count, but how about White Sox Fans VS. Cubs Fans?
They seem to REALLY hate each other! Allot lot more than Yankee Red Sox Fans do!

[Gee Walker]

Dick Allen vs. many, but most notably the first Frank Thomas.
Rogers Hornsby vs. Sam Breadon.
Charlie O. Finley vs. Bowie Kuhn.
Pete Rose vs. Bart Giamatti.
Denny McLain vs. The World.

[Chickazoola]

Did Feller really ask not to share the HOF platform with a black man in 1962?

I am pretty sure that's not the case. Feller was a pragmatic supporter of integration into baseball, in that he supported whatever would benefit baseball and himself. I think he has been outspoken about Jackie Robinson being overrated as a baseball player, but as far as I know there was no prejudice involved. Feller is pretty myopic but not a bigot.

[Bill Burgess]

Babe Ruth vs. Miller Huggins
Babe Ruth vs. Joe McCarthy
Babe Ruth vs. Ed Barrow

[Brian McKenna]

I am pretty sure that's not the case. Feller was a pragmatic supporter of integration into baseball, in that he supported whatever would benefit baseball and himself. I think he has been outspoken about Jackie Robinson being overrated as a baseball player, but as far as I know there was no prejudice involved. Feller is pretty myopic but not a bigot.

I thought I read that Feller held a dim view of Doby as well.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

Judging from photos, the two were inseparable in pregame activities until the very early '30s.
I doubt that Lou joined Babe in visiting speakeasies and brothels after the game, though...

lol, you could bet the farm on that. Close they were though. Ruth tried to teach Gehrig everything he knew about hitting, and tried to help him understand his value in terms of contract negotiations. Lou was just timid through and through.

Ruth's bat vs. any ball might be the biggest fued in history

[Sultan_1895-1948]

Babe Ruth vs. Miller Huggins
Babe Ruth vs. Joe McCarthy
Babe Ruth vs. Ed Barrow

Interesting choices Bill. I particularly love the Huggins one. That subject could be written on for hours. There's plenty there. Ya know, you could almost say that the fued was Huggins vs. Huggins in a way. I recall one story where they played an exhibition game and were supposed to meet for a train at a certain time. Ruth was of course mobbed after the game and stayed to sign all autographs while the rest of the team moved on. About 10 minutes before the train left, Ruth comes strolling up, still in uniform, and Huggins blew up. Once again, a chance to make an example out of Babe. When asked where he was, Babe explained that after signing autographs, the kids wanted him to stay and be a coach for one of their teams in a sandlot game. Apparently, the explanation didn't calm Miller down much at all. The examples are many. Ruth was not perfect and he certainly could have treated Huggins with more respect. Unfortunately, he didn't realize that until after the little flea had passed. But Huggins just couldn't deal with Babe. Being inconsistent in his discipline was his biggest issue imo.

[bluezebra]

"Great Baseball Fueds"

Isn't that the name of the late Royal Family of Egypt?

Bob

[Bill Burgess]

Interesting choices Bill. I particularly love the Huggins one.

You're back!! Bout time too. Your work will never be done. Not in the cards.

What about that request line? Coming soon?

[csh19792001]

I thought I read that Feller held a dim view of Doby as well.

How so, exactly? And what info do people have about Feller's purported overt racism? He made some comments that were construed as offensive regarding Latin ballplayers a few years back, but they were probably simply myopic and not necessarily racially motivated.

I don't think any major ML star barnstormed more with Negro Leaguers than Feller during from 1936-47. I've heard him speak very objectively (yet with praise) for the Negro Leaguers he played against. He said that NL teams did "very well" against their big league counterparts. With regards to the hyperbole and cloying musings of some opponents like Buck O'Neil decades later, though, that Negro Leaguers had dominated their white competitors, Feller responded this was patently false and that he "kept books."

Feller was always scrupulous and a stickler for details, especially when it came to facts and anything pertaining to money. To this day, he can recite facts from the 1930's and 40's with astonishing accuracy. I've seen it firsthand on several occasions. Frankly, though, he was always greedy and has become progressively more bitter as the years march on.

[Brian McKenna]

And what info do people have about Feller's purported overt racism?

I don't know - I'm asking.

Granted, Feller's barnstorming would suggest otherwise. But, that doesn't mean it's the whole story.

The fact that Doby often held his tongue in reference to Feller and this issue makes me wonder. The 1962 HOF issue makes me wonder as well.

I'm sure Feller has his benefactors here at BBF. I'm equally sure that Garagiola and others refute any and all charges as well.

It's funny how much of the country stood against black people for so long but to hear all the old ballplayers speak they all loved and respected Robby and Doby from the get-go.

[yanks0714]

Thought it might be nice to discuss some of the big feuds in history.

Larry MacPhail v. anyone around after his 10th drink

I just got finished reading, 'The Roaring Redhead: Baseball's Great Innovator' by Don Warfield. McPhail didn't need to have any drinks in him to be obnoxious. He 'fired' Durocher so many times only to 'forget' about it later. Not defending Leo, he could bring plenty of heat on himself, but frequently Leo hadn't even understood what he'd done to get 'fired'.
But it wasn't just Leo. McPhail 'fired' plenty of people. He was a loudmouth, tempermental, and a my-way-or-the-highway type guy.
BTW, McPhail led quite a life. After reading the book I can acknowledge his accomplishments but can't give him as much respect for the way he handled situations and himself.

[EdTarbusz]

I don't know - I'm asking.

Granted, Feller's barnstorming would suggest otherwise. But, that doesn't mean it's the whole story.

The fact that Doby often held his tongue in reference to Feller and this issue makes me wonder. The 1962 HOF issue makes me wonder as well.

I'm sure Feller has his benefactors here at BBF. I'm equally sure that Garagiola and others refute any and all charges as well.

It's funny how much of the country stood against black people for so long but to hear all the old ballplayers speak they all loved and respected Robby and Doby from the get-go.

During his playing days, Feller was considered to be one the most progressive players regarding race relations. Feller is famous for downgrading Robinson's skills around 1947, saying that Robinson had too much of a football type build to hit well.

[OleMissCub]

I just think sometimes people are loathe to criticize minorities because they are scared of having the race card pulled on them. As someone mentioned earlier, Feller is just myopic and doesn't give a crap what anyone thinks about what he says. He always seemed like an equal opportunity offender to me when talking about other players, be they black, white, hispanic, blue, or green.

He's the epitome of a crotchety old man.