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Thread: Best/worst announcer ever

  1. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by ol' aches and pains View Post
    So the three spikngs of Robinson in two games with the Cardinals don't amount to a racial incident? There was no intent on the part of the Cardinals to injure Robinson? Sorry, I don't buy it.
    On Slaughter's part maybe, but it doesn't sound like Robinson believed there was any intent on Garagiola's part. The Cardinals blamed the spikings on Robinson's unfamiliarity with playing first base.

  2. #162
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    Seems like there might be another thread warranted here... Just an observation.
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  3. #163
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    Sorry, you're quite right, and let the record show I tried to disengage in post#156, but was dragged kicking and screaming back into the fray. I'll behave myself now...
    What's the rumpus?

  4. #164
    good Quotes

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  5. #165
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    Greg Pappa. Oakland A's, and sometimes forced upon us Giants fans too. He also does Oakland Raiders games.
    "There's no crying in Baseball!"
    -...unless your son throws a no-no for the Giants!

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Green View Post
    .


    Garagiola is an incredibly talented broadcaster. I don't denigrate his ability. But Harry Caray was his mentor and they ended up not speaking. Lindsey Nelson once referred to Joe as the single most ambitious person he ever met. Joe undercut Curt Gowdy at NBC. And while Scully and Garagiola worked together tremendously--I think the greatest TV baseball crew ever, and perhaps the best TV broadcasting pair ever--when Joe left amid criticism of his analysis, he did say Vin talked too much and overpowered the broadcast. Red gave his version of events, and whatever their merit, I wonder about Joe's version and where the truth lies.
    Supposedly Caray got miffed after Joe left STL for NBC in the early 60's and never gave Harry any credit for giving him a shot in the Cards broadcast booth in 1955 and also teaching him a lot about broadcasting. Joe could tell a funny story, but according to Caray he really had a weak voice which he didn't know how to project. Harry also said that at the 1964 WS he went up to shake hands with Joe, who was doing the Series on NBC radio with Rizzuto, just ignored him. Harry had given preferential treatment to Joe over Jack Buck when the 3 of them worked together from 55-62, I guess because Joe was also a native St. Louisan and a fellow paisano.

    About 10 years ago Buck said that Musial and Joe, who had been business partners in some venture ended up not speaking to each other, it got pretty ugly. I don't know any details, but I'll say you never have heard bad things about Musial, while Joe's name has been mentioned several times.

    It should be mentioned that Joe has done a lot for an organization that I believe is called BAT...they raise funds to take care of older, indigent, former players who were played before the enourmous salaries and pensions and have found themselves down on their luck for various reasons.
    It Might Be? It Could Be?? It Is!

  7. #167
    I'd add that Joe G. also has done a lot to combat the use of chewing tobacco (newly elected Hall of Famer Doug Harvey nearly died of cancer from it and would appear with him). I don't want to suggest that Joe is a rotten human being.

    Another note: Harry also said he did more to help Joe than he did to help Skip. Skip got even, though. Pete Van Wieren was saying where the Braves would be on their next road trip and mentioned Chicago. Skip said--and you could hear the laughter in his voice and in the background--"Chicago? Isn't that where that nut leads the crowd in the 7th inning stretch?"

    I also think of something else Lindsey said: show me an announcer with a big job and I'll show you someone who had to cut up some people to get there. Also, they could just be prima donnas. As much as I love Vin Scully, in 1966, the first time the team announcer had to share the play-by-play with Curt Gowdy, Vin wouldn't speak during Gowdy's air time and left him hanging. They didn't get along for a long time after that. I am pretty sure that age and wisdom have triumphed in Vin's case over that kind of silliness.

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Green View Post
    I also think of something else Lindsey said: show me an announcer with a big job and I'll show you someone who had to cut up some people to get there. Also, they could just be prima donnas.
    With regards to this, how about a mention of Howard Cosell, who may have been the worst baseball commentator, at least at network level. It's hard to believe it's been about 25 years since he left ABC and someone who have to be pressing 40 to have much of a memory of Howard, but during the 70's and early 80's he was, by far, the biggest announcer in sports and one of the most well known celebrities in the country. He started at ABC doing boxing, the only sport that he called the action [can't ever forget "DOWN GOES FRAZIER!! DOWN GOES FRAZIER!!] his interviews with Ali were priceless. Became a mega-star with MNF in 1969, he worked great with Don Meredith, while Gifford, a pretty average play by play guy, basically just gave down, distance, etc. and Howard dominated the show. During this time, whether on MNF or his radio show, Cosell used to harangue how baseball was a esssentially a boring and dying sport. Until ABC began doing it in 1976 and Howard was able to get himself on the broadcasts by postseason. If you have ever seen the Chambliss hr in Game 5 of the 76 ALCS or Reggie's 3 HR's in the final game of the 77 WS, Howard jumped in during the middle of Keith Jackson's call, as he would usually do anytime anything exciting happened during a game or MNF, come to think of it. Jackson was more of a football guy who probably tolerated Howard as long as they kept him off his college football broadcasts, but it would have been interesting, to say the least, to see what would have happened if Howard had been working the booth for MLB with Caray, Scully or Garagiola doing play by play and he jumped in.
    It Might Be? It Could Be?? It Is!

  9. #169
    In light of how Cosell ruined those two great moments in 76 and 77 with his motormouth intrusions, just imagine him in the booth when the ball went through Buckner's legs! It's a dreadful thing to consider.

  10. #170
    I'll say you never have heard bad things about Musial

    there is some data that Curt Flood was denied to eat at Musials restaurant and Musial tried to cover it up saying they were closing

    whether it is 100% true or partially true or 100% false, you do hear things about Musial that arent flattering

    using the word never is easy to contradict
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
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  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    I'll say you never have heard bad things about Musial

    there is some data that Curt Flood was denied to eat at Musials restaurant and Musial tried to cover it up saying they were closing

    whether it is 100% true or partially true or 100% false, you do hear things about Musial that arent flattering

    using the word never is easy to contradict
    Totally unsubstantiated. Flood said this in his bitter 1972 bio, but Musial said he came in late, after the kitchen was closed. I'd also bet that alcohol was involved. In any case, St. Louis had a very active civil rights community in the 60's and if the towns most popular and visible upscale restauant, which attracted sports, show biz and political celebrities, was denying service to blacks it would have been a big story way before Flood's book came out.

    I'll stand by what I said about never hearing any negatives regarding Musial.
    It Might Be? It Could Be?? It Is!

  12. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by 64Cards View Post
    If you have ever seen the Chambliss hr in Game 5 of the 76 ALCS or Reggie's 3 HR's in the final game of the 77 WS, Howard jumped in during the middle of Keith Jackson's call, as he would usually do anytime anything exciting happened during a game or MNF, come to think of it. Jackson was more of a football guy who probably tolerated Howard as long as they kept him off his college football broadcasts, but it would have been interesting, to say the least, to see what would have happened if Howard had been working the booth for MLB with Caray, Scully or Garagiola doing play by play and he jumped in.
    ABC offered Scully Monday Night Football in 1970, as it was starting. He turned it down, citing his work with the Dodgers. But he reportedly did not want to work with Cosell.

    I agree: Cosell was a pioneer in a lot of ways, but his baseball broadcasting was abysmal, and I think of when he grabbed the microphone after the Chambliss homer in 1976. Scully might have throttled him. But I also think of something interesting that Bob Edwards said in his memoir of Red Barber--that he was surprised to hear Red speak nicely about Cosell, but Red said that Cosell did what he had to do to make it, and I think Red got that, given his use of southern phrases and the like.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by 64Cards View Post
    Totally unsubstantiated. Flood said this in his bitter 1972 bio, but Musial said he came in late, after the kitchen was closed. I'd also bet that alcohol was involved. In any case, St. Louis had a very active civil rights community in the 60's and if the towns most popular and visible upscale restauant, which attracted sports, show biz and political celebrities, was denying service to blacks it would have been a big story way before Flood's book came out.

    I'll stand by what I said about never hearing any negatives regarding Musial.
    there were two incidents

    Musial was not there the first incident

    what does alcohol was involved mean?

    he is not perfect, sorry
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
    2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://forums.delphiforums.com/GamersParadise
    3. My table top gaming blog: http://cary333.blogspot.com/

  14. #174
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    Fire Joe Morgan

  15. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by songtitle View Post
    Fire Joe Morgan
    This year, for the first time, Jon Miller is up for the Frick Award. He's certainly deserving--this will be his 34th season of play-by-play and he is a great broadcaster. But how many people don't know how good he is because they don't hear him on the Giants, but instead hear him saddled with Morgan and, last year, Steve Phillips?

  16. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Green View Post
    This year, for the first time, Jon Miller is up for the Frick Award. He's certainly deserving--this will be his 34th season of play-by-play and he is a great broadcaster. But how many people don't know how good he is because they don't hear him on the Giants, but instead hear him saddled with Morgan and, last year, Steve Phillips?
    I remember when Miller worked for the Red Sox..and when he worked for Baltimore, you could get the WTOP signal in Boston at night and still hear him.
    Man, do I *HATE* the Yankees!!!!!!

  17. #177
    Let's keep this thread about announcers, shall we? That's already been touched upon once by the moderator of this forum. Thanks.
    Dave Bill Tom George Mark Bob Ernie Soupy Dick Alex Sparky
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  18. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by ol' aches and pains View Post
    Sorry, you're quite right, and let the record show I tried to disengage in post#156, but was dragged kicking and screaming back into the fray. I'll behave myself now...
    No worries - I was actually hoping that the Garagiola-Robinson talk might continue in another thread. I found it quite interesting.
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Green
    This year, for the first time, Jon Miller is up for the Frick Award. He's certainly deserving--this will be his 34th season of play-by-play and he is a great broadcaster. But how many people don't know how good he is because they don't hear him on the Giants, but instead hear him saddled with Morgan and, last year, Steve Phillips?
    You know, I've always thought somewhat poorly of Miller. But now that I think about it, it might only be because I hear him with Morgan all the time.
    WAMCO!

  19. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richmond Hill Phoenix View Post
    No worries - I was actually hoping that the Garagiola-Robinson talk might continue in another thread. I found it quite interesting.
    I think that debate went about as far as it could go without getting ugly. It was time to end it.

    My wife loves to fall asleep to the sound of Jon Miller's voice on Sunday nights. She says it has a very soothing quality, FWIW. I like Miller, and don't really mind Morgan, either. I'd take them over Buck and McCarver in a heartbeat.
    What's the rumpus?

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Green View Post
    This year, for the first time, Jon Miller is up for the Frick Award.
    Miller and Morgan should get the Frick and Frack award for the lows they've set for the last 20 years on ESPN. They've become the thing that just wouldn't go away and made it impossible for me to ever have any use for Sunday Night Baseball.

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