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Thread: Ebbets Field

  1. #1

    Ebbets Field

    You may be just the person I'm looking for, Richard. And by the way, what a great site. Great photos from football, too.

    I used to think this photo of my father and grandfather was taken at Ebbets Field. (See my thread at Brooklyn Dodgers titled, "Pic Magazine photo at Ebbets Field", particularly my last comment about May 30, 1939.) Now I have reason to believe it may have been taken at the Polo Grounds. The two things that kept me from thinking it was the Polo Grounds are, I recall the railing along the third and first base lines curving toward the outfield, and second, my family lived in Brooklyn. But, on the other hand, maybe the photo is deceiving and maybe my father and his dad decided to take a drive to Manhattan. What do you think?
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    Last edited by chashale; 05-01-2007 at 08:41 AM.

  2. #2
    In my opinion, it does not look like the POLO GROUNDS. My reasoning is the stands visible on the third base side are too straight. PG had a curvature to those stands. Any other opinions?

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by TJH1923 View Post
    In my opinion, it does not look like the POLO GROUNDS. My reasoning is the stands visible on the third base side are too straight. PG had a curvature to those stands. Any other opinions?
    I agree this photo was not taken at the polo grounds.
    LONG LIVE THE POLO GROUNDS 1891-1964
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  4. #4
    Thank you, guys. My original instincts were that it is Ebbets Field. I think I'll stick with that assumption.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by TJH1923 View Post
    In my opinion, it does not look like the POLO GROUNDS. My reasoning is the stands visible on the third base side are too straight. PG had a curvature to those stands. Any other opinions?
    I also think this is NOT the PG.

    Curvature of the box seats... agreed.

    What about the dugouts? The dugouts at the PG were definitely more towards the first and third base bags than in most parks. You should probably be able to see the third base dugout, or at least part of it, in the photo... but you can't. It looks like the dirt walkways from the plate leading to the dugouts go to locations that are closet to Home than the bases.

    Also, look at the top of the photo, especially a the bits of the field that show through the support beams of the stadium right above the subjec't heads. With the way the left field wall practically ran away from the foul pole at such an odd angle, I would think you should see nothing but grass there.... but in the photo it looks like stands and people? Hard to make out though.

    Also, in the photo, does the left field line continue at an odd angle when it reaches the fence? This may be a foul pole, hard to tell. It is definitely not a continuation of the left field line, IMO.

    Lastly... would the last row of the upper deck be this far back at the PG? Would it have been even farther?
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by chashale View Post
    You may be just the person I'm looking for, Richard. And by the way, what a great site. Great photos from football, too.

    I used to think this photo of my father and grandfather was taken at Ebbets Field. (See my thread at Brooklyn Dodgers titled, "Pic Magazine photo at Ebbets Field", particularly my last comment about May 30, 1939.) Now I have reason to believe it may have been taken at the Polo Grounds. The two things that kept me from thinking it was the Polo Grounds are, I recall the railing along the third and first base lines curving toward the outfield, and second, my family lived in Brooklyn. But, on the other hand, maybe the photo is deceiving and maybe my father and his dad decided to take a drive to Manhattan. What do you think?
    I'm in the same boat as everyone else. I am almost 100% positive that isn't the Polo Grounds. I would bet money on Ebbets or perhaps even that diamond in the Bronx.

    The key is (just as you mentioned) the shape of the foul territory behind home plate. It has the same angle as both stadiums had. Yankee Stadium can probably be thrown out because the framework of the stadium above them doesn't look right. Yankee Stadium had straight girders and if I'm not mistaken Ebbets had the angled ones. Although there almost seems to be too much foul territory there to be Ebbets, its about right for Yankee Stadium though. This is definately odd.

    This is however just my two cents although this picture intrigues me so I will look much deeper into it a little later on. Finals are this week and next week so once my schedule slows up a bit I will put a lot more time into it.

    Do you have any idea when it was taken?


    Richard
    Last edited by RichardLillard1; 05-03-2007 at 12:09 AM.

  7. #7
    As to when I think the photo was taken, my guess is 1939, although I'm not positive. My father would have been twelve then and that's how old he looks in the picture. I spoke with my mother yesteday and when I asked her how old he was when the photo was taken, she said, "I think he was twelve.

    Here's what I just posted at my "Pic Magazine photo at Ebbets Field" thread on Musial6's suggestion that it might have been taken on May 29, 1939.

    "Good thought and sound reasoning Musial6, however, here's why I think that might not be the day. If you look closely at the photo, the umps have on light colored pants. It just so happens that on May 30, 1939 it is reported by baseball library.com that "In an attempt to spruce up their appearance, National League umpires wear white gabardine trousers with blue jackets." So if that were the first day they wore them, and if they are in fact white pants, I probably should be looking forward, not back. I see that the following weekend the Dodgers played the Cubs at Ebbets and maybe that's it. But then again, what if it was reported that they started wearing the white gabs on the 30th, but some umps had them on the 29th. Stranger things have occurred. Another thing I want to look at is the weather for that time period. As you can see, my father and grandfather have on sweaters and jackets, which would probably rules out a warm day."
    Last edited by chashale; 05-03-2007 at 05:05 AM.

  8. #8
    StanTheMan and Richard,
    A few thoughts: I too thought the foul territory might be too big but after looking at numerous photos of Ebbets I think it still works. Perhaps the camera angle is distorting the size. Also, and I should add, I don't know a lot about photography, but from photos I've looked at, if this is Ebbets Field, the space behind where they are sitting would be open. Given how light it is it seems that the stands might be open to the street. That wouldn't have been the case at Yankee Stadium and I'm certain we've ruled out the Polo Grounds. I guess another thing I should find out is whether Ebbets Field had a walkway behind where they are sitting. The photog obviously had some room so it must have been a walkway. Last time I was at Ebbets I was eight so my memory doesn't serve me well on that one.

    Another thing that threw me at first was shadow that is to the right of my grandfather's cap. Looking at old photos of Ebbets Field I note that photogs took shots from this spot. So that shadow is probably a photog. Maybe that was done at all fields but I think I've seen that at Ebbets Field. Was that called the Photographers Circle?
    Last edited by chashale; 05-03-2007 at 05:08 AM.

  9. #9
    I just copied this photo from the Ebbets Field thread. Look up beyond the seats (this would be about where they were sitting) and it appears the girders are quite similar to those in my photo.
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    Last edited by chashale; 05-03-2007 at 05:28 AM.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by chashale View Post
    As to when I think the photo was taken, my guess is 1939, although I'm not positive. My father would have been twelve then and that's how old he looks in the picture. I spoke with my mother yesteday and when I asked her how old he was when the photo was taken, she said, "I think he was twelve.

    Here's what I just posted at my "Pic Magazine photo at Ebbets Field" thread on Musial6's suggestion that it might have been taken on May 29, 1939.

    "Good thought and sound reasoning Musial6, however, here's why I think that might not be the day. If you look closely at the photo, the umps have on light colored pants. It just so happens that on May 30, 1939 it is reported by baseball library.com that "In an attempt to spruce up their appearance, National League umpires wear white gabardine trousers with blue jackets." So if that were the first day they wore them, and if they are in fact white pants, I probably should be looking forward, not back. I see that the following weekend the Dodgers played the Cubs at Ebbets and maybe that's it. But then again, what if it was reported that they started wearing the white gabs on the 30th, but some umps had them on the 29th. Stranger things have occurred. Another thing I want to look at is the weather for that time period. As you can see, my father and grandfather have on sweaters and jackets, which would probably rules out a warm day."
    Just an observation. If your library.com information is correct, the umps uniform would have been reported in May 30th papers from events from May 29th.

  11. #11
    You may be right, TJH. They are not explicit about that. They make it sound like it was the thirtieth but you may be correct. Time to dig out the old New York Daily News or New York Times. Thanks.

  12. #12
    Long story short, its Ebbets. The explanation is a bit boring but here goes anyways...

    The type of framework around the overhead catwalks is a telltale. They used these crossmembers that sort of suspended the catwalks in place while not obsctructing any views to the lower grandstands. This method of construction had been changed by the time Yankee Stadium went up some 20 years later. Yankee Stadium was built using a method of laying the catwalks over girders that already extended out to the upper deck, if that makes sense.

    More oever than that those cat walks weren't above the lower bowl at Yankee Stadium, they were above the middle deck. As the picture plainly shows they are not elevated high enough to be in the middle deck at Yankee Stadium. Pair that with the girder work and this is obviously Ebbets field.

    As to what day it was... no idea, you are going to want to take that up with members here who have really good researching tools. It seems although that they have already begun helping you in that department.


    Richard

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    Ebbets Field

    I couldn't find a thread like the Yankee Stadium Pre-Renovation picture thread and Polo Ground Picture Thread, so here it is!

    1914 April 2 - Opening Day


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    Ray Caldwell, New York AL, pitching in exhibition game which was the first game at Ebbets Field, April 5, 1913


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    Crowd at Ebbets Field, 10/5/20


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    Crowd at Ebbets Field, 10/5/20


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    1920


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    Quote Originally Posted by locke40 View Post
    Ray Caldwell, New York AL, pitching in exhibition game which was the first game at Ebbets Field, April 5, 1913

    Great Pictures Locke40. Same goes with the other threads you have been posting pictures in. Looking at this photo, it seems back when it opened there was a lot of foul ground.

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    4/14/1914


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    Opening Day parade


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    Ebbets Field, Brooklyn, New York. Press room; 1941 May 20


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    Home Plate Bar


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