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Thread: Andre Dawson Elected To HOF!

  1. #1
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    Andre Dawson Elected To HOF!

    Just Andre this time around...

    Link:

    http://bbwaa.com/

  2. #2
    WOW! I just read Marty Noble's reason for not voting Alomar based on the Hirschbeck incident, and his play during his year and change as a Met.

    I wonder how many others felt the same?

  3. #3
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    The Official Vote:
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    This is one of the worst selections to date. I was against Jim Rice getting in, but even Rice was a much better hitter than Dawson.

    This is going to the pave the way for Joe Carter, and every other half-decent hitter with a lot of RBIs...

    Boo!!!!



    For what it's worth, Tim Raines is much more deserving and he recieved less than half the votes Dawson got.
    Last edited by GiambiJuice; 01-06-2010 at 11:21 AM.
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    Whoever voted for David Segui needs to lose their priviledge...
    “Well, I like to say I’m completely focused, right? I mean, the game’s on the line. It’s not like I’m thinking about what does barbecue Pop Chips and Cholula taste like. Because I already know that answer — it tastes friggin’ awesome!"--Brian Wilson

  6. #6
    Now there is no excuse for not having Dewey Evans in there.

    He nearly gets in on offense alone, and was right up there with Al Kaline and Roberto Clemente as a defensive RF.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by GiambiJuice View Post
    This is one of the worst selections to date. I was against Jim Rice getting in, but even Rice was a much better hitter than Dawson.

    This is going to the pave the way for Joe Carter, and every other half-decent hitter with a lot of RBIs...

    Boo!!!!
    You mean Joe Carter who couldn't even gain 5% his one and only year on the ballot?
    Bill Tom George Mark Bob Ernie Soupy Alex Sparky
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    Jonathan Neil Roger Anthony Ray Thomas Art Don
    Gates Philip John Warrior JEDI

  8. #8
    I'm really ticked that Blyleven didn't get in. Wow--missed it by five votes. That's just wrong.

    And the folks who didn't vote for Alomar because the first ballot is somehow sacred really annoy me.

  9. #9
    One thing they should have done in addition to voting Andre Dawson in, is to vote Edgar Martinez (Mariners) in.

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    Congratulations to the Hawk, Andre Dawson. How does Alomar & Larkin not get in though?!?

    the Hall of Fame has lost some credibility for me though. Ever since Bill Mazeroski was elected. I just felt that anyone with a lifetime 260 Avg., 2016 hits, 138HR's and 853RBI's should not be in the Hall. I don't care if he has 8 golden gloves.
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  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by KHenry14 View Post
    Whoever voted for David Segui needs to lose their priviledge...
    Agreed. 0 All Star selections, 0 MVP votes, 0 Gold Gloves, 0 leading the league in anything. Steroid user. Probably one of the worst Hall of Fame votes any writer has ever made.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle1 View Post
    One thing they should have done in addition to voting Andre Dawson in, is to vote Edgar Martinez (Mariners) in.
    Edgar Martinez could not run or field or throw

    he was truly a one dimensional player

    and his offense, which is all he has going for him, is not Hall of Fame standards

    309 Homers and 1261 RBI would be questionable numbers for a player who played defense, played it well and ran well

    that he did none of those other things make him not even a borderline candidate
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
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  13. #13
    Ever since Bill Mazeroski was elected. I just felt that anyone with a lifetime 260 Avg., 2016 hits, 138HR's and 853RBI's should not be in the Hall. I don't care if he has 8 golden gloves.


    you realize Forbes Field greatly reduced home runs?

    Maz hit twice as many road homers as he did in home games

    and some of those road parks, the Astrodome, Dodger Stadium were awful as well

    put Mazersoski in Fenway and he probably approaches Doerr's home run feats
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
    2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://somgamersparadiseforum.smfforfree4.com/index.php

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    Edgar Martinez could not run or field or throw

    he was truly a one dimensional player

    and his offense, which is all he has going for him, is not Hall of Fame standards

    309 Homers and 1261 RBI would be questionable numbers for a player who played defense, played it well and ran well

    that he did none of those other things make him not even a borderline candidate
    You couldn't be more wrong. Look at some actual numbers that have meaning. Look at his lifetime BA, OBP, and Slugging %. It's a shame that he was managed badly and wasn't put in the field to play more first base, but that's Lou Pinella for you. Edgar played in the steroid era where basically every other month, someone was raking his 500th hr. over the fence. Edgar was a pure hitter. He had an eye deficiency, and basically had only one eye to see the baseball with. He would spend hours before games to literally work his eye out so that he could see the baseball. Edgar Martinez's character, great lifetime OBP numbers, and his ability to step up his play and hit even better in tough situations (especially the playoffs) are why he deserves to be in the HOF. The DH award was named after him, not to mention his batting titles. And you're damn right he was one dimensional (though should have been more). Go look at some footage of him hitting. He was a pure hitter. One of the best! I'd take him over Alomar on character for one thing.
    Last edited by Trickyhop; 01-06-2010 at 01:21 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    Edgar Martinez could not run or field or throw

    he was truly a one dimensional player

    and his offense, which is all he has going for him, is not Hall of Fame standards

    309 Homers and 1261 RBI would be questionable numbers for a player who played defense, played it well and ran well

    that he did none of those other things make him not even a borderline candidate
    You are cherry picking two stats. What about his 2 batting titles. Leading a very tough league in OBP 3 times? A league with Frank Thomas, Albert Belle and Jim Thome and Manny Ramirez, and other great hitters in their primes.

    Or his OPS+ which is 39th all-time including 19th century players.

    Or his 500+ doubles

    I agree that the fact that he was DH should hurt his case a lot and I'm not sure I would vote for him for that reason. But to say his offense does not meet hall of fame standards is selling him very short IMHO.

    Oh, and we was top-10 in batting average 7 times, OBP 11 times, SLG 6 times, OPS+ 9 times. etc... Edgar was a dominant, dominant hitter. Much better than dozens of hitters in the Hall.
    RIP Bill Burgess - a gentleman and a scholar - Baseball-Fever will never be the same without you.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by KHenry14 View Post
    Whoever voted for David Segui needs to lose their priviledge...
    Who are these clowns, we see this every year, some of the voting.

    Add this to Segui, Karros, Hentgen, Appier, one vote each.
    I would love to see these clowns that did that voting, interviewed and give an explanation................just fo laughs.

  17. #17
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    No one should have gotten in out of this group. So, have the veterans committee guys make speeches and that's it. Whitey Herzog will be 10 times more entertaining than Dawson anyway.....
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

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    Quote Originally Posted by StanTheMan View Post
    No one should have gotten in out of this group. So, have the veterans committee guys make speeches and that's it. Whitey Herzog will be 10 times more entertaining than Dawson anyway.....
    You really think Alomar doesn't deserve to be in? what about Larkin, who is probably a top-10 shortstop of all time?
    RIP Bill Burgess - a gentleman and a scholar - Baseball-Fever will never be the same without you.

  19. #19
    Congrats, Andre Dawson. He's always been a favorite of mine so I'm glad to see him make the HOF.

    I wonder if the 'spitting incident' caused Alomar not to make it first ballot. Just a rambling thought...

    A big increase for Blyleven from '09's results. Man, just 5 votes too. Atleast we are inclined to believe he'll be apart of the 2011 class.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by GiambiJuice View Post
    You really think Alomar doesn't deserve to be in? what about Larkin, who is probably a top-10 shortstop of all time?
    Please see my post above..... I obviously don't. Alomar will get in eventually, I'm okay with that. Normally, I abhor the wait three, five, or in Dawson's case, what NICE ballots? But make Alomar wait a little.

    It's almost as if Dawson hung around long enough to perhaps be considered one of the better players left on the ballot and "OOOOPS!" he got in.

    He did hit 202 home runs from 2006 to 2010. No wait, he didn't.....
    "Herman Franks to Sal Yvars to Bobby Thomson. Ralph Branca to Bobby Thomson to Helen Rita... cue Russ Hodges."

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanTheMan View Post

    He did hit 202 home runs from 2006 to 2010. No wait, he didn't.....
    I don't get it
    RIP Bill Burgess - a gentleman and a scholar - Baseball-Fever will never be the same without you.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Trickyhop View Post
    You couldn't be more wrong. Look at some actual numbers that have meaning. Look at his lifetime BA, OBP, and Slugging %. It's a shame that he was managed badly and wasn't put in the field to play more first base, but that's Lou Pinella for you. Edgar played in the steroid era where basically every other month, someone was raking his 500th hr. over the fence. Edgar was a pure hitter. He had an eye deficiency, and basically had only one eye to see the baseball with. He would spend hours before games to literally work his eye out so that he could see the baseball. Edgar Martinez's character, great lifetime OBP numbers, and his ability to step up his play and hit even better in tough situations (especially the playoffs) are why he deserves to be in the HOF. The DH award was named after him, not to mention his batting titles. And you're damn right he was one dimensional (though should have been more). Go look at some footage of him hitting. He was a pure hitter. One of the best! I'd take him over Alomar on character for one thing.
    BA has little meaning

    OBP is over rated, a slow runner with a high on base percentage is not as valuable as a fast runner with same

    his eye deficiency work ethic and character are irrelevant

    DH are not players with all around skills, but often slow 1 dimensional players like Martinez

    one dimensional player who barely topped 300 home runs

    he is not even borderline

    and the voters agree with me
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
    2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://somgamersparadiseforum.smfforfree4.com/index.php

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    BA has little meaning

    OBP is over rated, a slow runner with a high on base percentage is not as valuable as a fast runner with same

    his eye deficiency work ethic and character are irrelevant

    DH are not players with all around skills, but often slow 1 dimensional players like Martinez

    one dimensional player who barely topped 300 home runs

    he is not even borderline

    and the voters agree with me
    If the voters agree with you, that should tell you something different...

    "OBP is over rated, a slow runner with a high on base percentage is not as valuable as a fast runner with same"

    This statement is irrelevant and has no bearing on this discussion. How many players in MLB history with a .418 OBP were "fast runners"? Off the top of my head, maybe Cobb, Collins and Speaker and a couple more. We are talking elite, top of the pyramid hall of famers.

    Yeah, if Babe Ruth kept his .474 OBP and had Rickey Henderson's speed, he'd be even better... so what?
    RIP Bill Burgess - a gentleman and a scholar - Baseball-Fever will never be the same without you.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by GiambiJuice View Post
    If the voters agree with you, that should tell you something different...

    "OBP is over rated, a slow runner with a high on base percentage is not as valuable as a fast runner with same"

    This statement is irrelevant and has no bearing on this discussion. How many players in MLB history with a .418 OBP were "fast runners"? Off the top of my head, maybe Cobb, Collins and Speaker and a couple more. We are talking elite, top of the pyramid hall of famers.

    Yeah, if Babe Ruth kept his .474 OBP and had Rickey Henderson's speed, he'd be even better... so what?
    I stand by my evaluation

    martinez is a 1 dimensional (offense/hitting) player

    and 302 home runs in your strongest (only) positive category is not Hall of Fame worthy
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
    2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://somgamersparadiseforum.smfforfree4.com/index.php

  25. #25
    How many players in MLB history with a .418 OBP were "fast runners"? Off the top of my head, maybe Cobb, Collins and Speaker and a couple more. We are talking elite, top of the pyramid hall of famers.

    How many Hall of famers are 1 dimensional DHs with less than 303 lifetime homeuns?

    more than a handful of elite players?
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
    2. Strat-O-Matic Baseball Player, Collector and Hobbyist since 1969, visit my strat site: http://somgamersparadiseforum.smfforfree4.com/index.php

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