Do you approve of Omar?

**NJMetfan4life** · 05-04-2010, 08:38 PM

I haven't made one of these for a while, so I'll put the old links up here. It's a pretty straight forward question.
NOTE: The poll will have your name anonymous so that nobody would feel pressure to change there vote to something that everyone would like.

**NJMetfan4life** · 05-04-2010, 08:54 PM

In poll #1(11/30/07): 10% approved(2 votes) 40%(8 combined) said keep him, 20%(4 votes) were undecided and 30%(6 votes) said to fire him

In poll #2(12/29/07): 25%(3 votes) approved, 58%(7 combined) were undecided, and 17%(2 votes) called for his job.

In poll #3(1/30/08)(Day after Santana trade): 90%(9 combined) loved him, and 10%(1 vote) were Undecided

In poll #4(3/25/08):69%(11 votes) approved, 25%(4 votes) wanted him gone, and 6%(1 vote) was Undecided

In poll #5(7/19/08): 86% approved(6 votes) while 14% were undecided (1 vote)

#1. http://baseball-fever.com/showthread...t=Approve+Omar

#2. http://baseball-fever.com/showthread...t=Approve+Omar

#3. http://baseball-fever.com/showthread...t=Approve+Omar

#4. http://baseball-fever.com/showthread...t=Approve+Omar

#5. http://www.baseball-fever.com/showth...(-)&highlight=

**Gr8Beldini** · 05-06-2010, 04:53 AM

Yes I do, but I also approve of cold toilet seats.

**Strawman** · 05-15-2012, 02:44 PM

It's officially time to reconsider the reign of one Omar Minaya, whose talents on the baseball talent side of the management equation are readily apparent among the young Mets on this year's team.

1. Omar did a great job recruiting the young Met players now filling crucial positions on the team. He deserves the thanks of all Mets fans.

2. He was terrible at public relations. Really terrible.

3. His record with big free agents was mixed (at best).

**Cowtipper** · 05-15-2012, 03:21 PM

He made some pretty good trades. He netted the Mets Delgado, LoDuca, Maine, El Duque, Roberto Hernandez, Oliver Perez, Luis Castillo and, most notably, Johan Santana. Perez and Maine, though they were disappointing toward the end of their Mets tenures, were solid for at least a couple years.

For the players he acquired, he didn't really lose much--all the guys sent for Santana have mostly become duds, with the pitchers (Mulvey, Guerra and Humber) totaling for a combined 12 career big league wins...all of which belong to Humber. Carlos Gomez, the other guy in the trade, didn't turn out as well as a lot of Mets fans thought he would. Lo Duca cost the Mets two guys who never made the big leagues, while Delgado cost the Mets only Mike Jacobs (solid, but no Delgado), Yusmeiro Petit (dud) and a minor leaguer. Maine lost the Mets Kris Benson, who wasn't much of a loss, and El Duque lost the Mets Jorge Julio, who wasn't much of a loss.

In terms of trades, Minaya was a pretty decent deal maker.

**PVNICK** · 05-16-2012, 03:45 AM

OMFG someone spent their free time to dredge through the bowels of the archives and pull this up.

**Strawman** · 05-16-2012, 07:06 AM

Originally Posted by Cowtipper

He made some pretty good trades. He netted the Mets Delgado, LoDuca, Maine, El Duque, Roberto Hernandez, Oliver Perez, Luis Castillo and, most notably, Johan Santana. Perez and Maine, though they were disappointing toward the end of their Mets tenures, were solid for at least a couple years.

For the players he acquired, he didn't really lose much--all the guys sent for Santana have mostly become duds, with the pitchers (Mulvey, Guerra and Humber) totaling for a combined 12 career big league wins...all of which belong to Humber. Carlos Gomez, the other guy in the trade, didn't turn out as well as a lot of Mets fans thought he would. Lo Duca cost the Mets two guys who never made the big leagues, while Delgado cost the Mets only Mike Jacobs (solid, but no Delgado), Yusmeiro Petit (dud) and a minor leaguer. Maine lost the Mets Kris Benson, who wasn't much of a loss, and El Duque lost the Mets Jorge Julio, who wasn't much of a loss.

In terms of trades, Minaya was a pretty decent deal maker.

Good point about the trades. You're right - and I didn't realize it. I think Omar's record was decidedly mixed, but I also think his overall work is totally underrated - and frankly responsible for a lot of the excitement around this year's team, so far.

**redban** · 05-16-2012, 08:06 AM

Well, he did little for the farm system and he had a bunch of terrible contracts.

What I didn't like was how he threw money at people. From his 1st off-season, going for Pedro, Delgado, and Beltran; to his last off-season signing Bay. It felt as if we were trying to be the Yankees.

And there was also the whole Latinization thing, "Los Mets" and all.. he denied that he did it intentionally, but do you believe him?

Overall, I'm happier with Alderson.

**Strawman** · 05-16-2012, 08:31 AM

Originally Posted by redban

Well, he did little for the farm system and he had a bunch of terrible contracts.

What I didn't like was how he threw money at people. From his 1st off-season, going for Pedro, Delgado, and Beltran; to his last off-season signing Bay. It felt as if we were trying to be the Yankees.

And there was also the whole Latinization thing, "Los Mets" and all.. he denied that he did it intentionally, but do you believe him?

Overall, I'm happier with Alderson.

Hey, the Latinization thing was fantastic - it's where baseball is these days. It was brilliant strategy. There's only a single real reason to be opposed to that! (Not saying anyone here is, of course).

As for the farm, look at the guys playing now - that was the farm. Omar did very well by it, and you can really only judge by MLB performance, not the lame Baseball America "rankings."

Now, Omar had a huge downside - mixed FA signings and poor PR. I'm not arguing he was a huge success, but the Mets did get close under him.

Too early to compare Minaya and Alderson, but Minaya's in the lead.

**CokeMachineGlow** · 05-16-2012, 12:02 PM

Regarding to your comment on the farm -- hindsight is 20/20.

**Ralf** · 05-18-2012, 05:05 AM

The GM has so little to do with the draft after the first few rounds its silly to give him any real credit. A GM's credit should go with the decision making process regarding player development after the draft, when the guys are moving through the system. In that respect, Omar was pretty bad. He routinely moved guys up the system that were not ready and clearly got hard ons for HIS guys that just were not that good. Who is to really say that any of these guys playing today would even be on the major league roster had Omar remained? Judging by the way he built his 25-man roster, we know for a fact he preferred old veterans to younger players so there is a good chance some of these guys would not even be here. I could totally see a scenario where he passed on a guy like Duda last year and stuck a old vet in the OF instead.

The bottom line is the guy was not a very good GM. I'm sure if you gave any one of the 29 other GMs the Mets GM job in late 2004, they too could have spent big bucks to put together that team in 2005 and 2006. Its recognizing what needed to be done after that is what separates the good GMs from the bad.

**Strawman** · 05-18-2012, 09:41 AM

Originally Posted by Ralf

The GM has so little to do with the draft after the first few rounds its silly to give him any real credit. A GM's credit should go with the decision making process regarding player development after the draft, when the guys are moving through the system. In that respect, Omar was pretty bad. He routinely moved guys up the system that were not ready and clearly got hard ons for HIS guys that just were not that good. Who is to really say that any of these guys playing today would even be on the major league roster had Omar remained? Judging by the way he built his 25-man roster, we know for a fact he preferred old veterans to younger players so there is a good chance some of these guys would not even be here. I could totally see a scenario where he passed on a guy like Duda last year and stuck a old vet in the OF instead.

The bottom line is the guy was not a very good GM. I'm sure if you gave any one of the 29 other GMs the Mets GM job in late 2004, they too could have spent big bucks to put together that team in 2005 and 2006. Its recognizing what needed to be done after that is what separates the good GMs from the bad.

So buy that logic, Sandy Alderson will get zero credit for smart drafts over these couple of years he's here and any improvement to the talent level in the farm system? No, I don't think this is right. In my view, Omar is a great talent evaluator and a so-so front office manager - put those together and he was a an above-average GM. At this stage, his work is paying off big-time for the Mets - better than the current occupier of his former post (granted, his time is relatively brief).

**Ralf** · 05-18-2012, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by Strawman

So buy that logic, Sandy Alderson will get zero credit for smart drafts over these couple of years he's here and any improvement to the talent level in the farm system?...........At this stage, his work is paying off big-time for the Mets - better than the current occupier of his former post (granted, his time is relatively brief).

Yes, thats right. The credit will largely go to DePodesta and the scouts.

If Sandy Alderson or any of the other 29 GMs was given $200m to spend this offseason, I guarantee you he/them could put together a top 5 team. All Omar did was give the best free agents that offseason the most money. Woah! What a genius talent evaluator he was!......lol

**CokeMachineGlow** · 05-18-2012, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by Ralf

Yes, thats right. The credit will largely go to DePodesta and the scouts.

If Sandy Alderson or any of the other 29 GMs was given $200m to spend this offseason, I guarantee you he/them could put together a top 5 team. All Omar did was give the best free agents that offseason the most money. Woah! What a genius talent evaluator he was!......lol

And, uh, who hires those scouts? The GM does. They shouldn't get the full brunt of the credit, but they should be heralded (or vice versa - held accountable) for prospects that pan out, etc.

**Strawman** · 07-08-2012, 07:10 AM

More praise for Omar Minaya today....from Terry Collins!

Manager Terry Collins handed out kudos, though not by name, to former Mets general manager Omar Minaya and other departed executives from the time before the Sandy Alderson regime.

"I just think it's a great tip of the cap to the people ," Collins said. "Sandy's done a great job here and will continue to do a great job here. But once in a while, you reap the benefits of the people before you. And those people put together a pretty good minor-league system and we're seeing the benefits of it."

Strange to say, but this really is Omar's best Mets season in certain ways.