Manny Ramirez's Defense

[Williamsburg2599]

one outfielder that comes to mind that I believe Manny is better defensively is Barry Bonds... where was he on that list?

PLEASE tell me you mean this year and not career wise.

[MRamirez24]

yes, i mean this year.. i know very well how good he USED to be, i know of the gold gloves, etc... i'm ASSUMING that the original post made was about this year, so my response was for this year...

[MudvilleMike]

Manny is a truly horrible fielder. The problem isn't the bonehead gaffes (whether scored an error or not, depending on type), but the dozens of balls he never gets close to. That said, I do think he tries and has made some very nice plays. He's just a very limited athlete and not very bright.

p.s. I don't want to argue with any Manny fans. I like him, I really do.

[MudvilleMike]

I am aware he has a reputation as a bad fielder, but has he been worse than usual this year?

He's probably a little better this year, which isn't saying much.

[brose3312]

Manny is a truly horrible fielder. The problem isn't the bonehead gaffes (whether scored an error or not, depending on type), but the dozens of balls he never gets close to. That said, I do think he tries and has made some very nice plays. He's just a very limited athlete and not very bright.

p.s. I don't want to argue with any Manny fans. I like him, I really do.

Harsh words about Manny"s defense. It is safe the assume that the guy will never win a GG BUT he has worked hard and has learned, which is where I take exception to your "not so bright" comment, to learn the intricacies of the Monster. At time he does not get to balls he should but there are several times that he has played a ball off the wall perfectly and has either thrown a runner out at second or held a runner at first. He now can get the ball off of a carom and in one motion fire to second. I am not saying he is a great fielder but his a smart fielder.

[DickZ]

Well, I'm sure that Manny concentrates better in the big games, but I can point to a certain WS Game 1 that was a little bit rough. I thought that Keith Foulke was going to head out to LF and box Manny's ears.

Luckily, a certain slugging 2Bman took the heat off Manny by clanging one off the RF foul pole the next half inning....

Manny is legendary for working like nobody else on his hitting. I don't think that ethic extends to his glovework, but he is definitely better than he used to be.

Sent by wireless internet from an unwired cave in southern Virginia:
Manny's sliding boner where he took that huge divot and toppled over is now featured on a greatest bloopers DVD. We can laugh about it now, but it wasn't all that funny when it happened. I came unglued, as I'm sure lots of us did.

Thank goodness for Mark Bellhorn's homer that you mentioned, the one that rattled the foul pole and put us back on top to stay.

[VTSoxFan]

Thinking back to that pratfall in the WS, at the moment that it happened I wasn't sure if Manny was going to get up -- it looked as if he had hyperextended one knee and sprained the other, and it was actually with a sense of relief that I watched him scramble after the ball he'd missed. It was only an error -- not two busted legs.

I have read in so many places that Manny works on his defense, and has said that he wishes that he were better with the glove. It's just not the best part of his game (by a mile!)... still, I'd rather see him out there than Wily Mo.

Anyone ever read "The Tao of Manny", an essay from 2004 on the Remy Report by A. Knoefel Longest? His bat is the yin, his glove is the yang.

[hellborn]

Sent by wireless internet from an unwired cave in southern Virginia:
Manny's sliding boner where he took that huge divot and toppled over is now featured on a greatest bloopers DVD. We can laugh about it now, but it wasn't all that funny when it happened. I came unglued, as I'm sure lots of us did.

Thank goodness for Mark Bellhorn's homer that you mentioned, the one that rattled the foul pole and put us back on top to stay.

Hey DickZ,
Discover any new species of blind salamander down there?
Manny's pratfall took place just after he ran by Renteria's ground ball single to let a run in...guess he wanted to prove that he could mess up pop flies, too. The play on Walker's ball wasn't trivial, but you couldn't play it much worse than Manny did. Unless you whacked it hard enough in the air to knock it over the Monster (Canseco could probably do that).
Earlier in that half inning, Marquis was inserted as a PR and promptly tripped his way down to 2B and plopped on the base like it was beanbag chair. Some of his teammates were laughing hysterically on the bench after that. Looking back, it is all pretty comical, but I was almost apoplectic over Manny...there is classic footage of a Bosox fan with his hand on his forehead and the most anguished look on his face in the stands.
Hellborn had the RF foul pole zoned in for a couple of games there, also banged it in the ALCS game 7 (prompting McCarver to say that the ensuing rattling was "the worst sound he'd ever heard"). He did a good job spraying his XB hits around the field during that hot steak...homered to LF to support Schilling, the 2 extreme pull HRs to RF, and the laser 2B off the wall in CF.

Annie, never read "The Tao of Manny", but I'd bet that it's good. If you haven't seen "The Tao of Baseball" by Go, it is a very thoughtful, interesting, and serious book...Bill Bob says check it out!

[DickZ]

Hey DickZ,
Discover any new species of blind salamander down there?
Manny's pratfall took place just after he ran by Renteria's ground ball single to let a run in...guess he wanted to prove that he could mess up pop flies, too. The play on Walker's ball wasn't trivial, but you couldn't play it much worse than Manny did. Unless you whacked it hard enough in the air to knock it over the Monster (Canseco could probably do that)...

Hellborn had the RF foul pole zoned in for a couple of games there, also banged it in the ALCS game 7 (prompting McCarver to say that the ensuing rattling was "the worst sound he'd ever heard"). He did a good job spraying his XB hits around the field during that hot steak...homered to LF to support Schilling, the 2 extreme pull HRs to RF, and the laser 2B off the wall in CF.
.....

Hellborn,

I haven't seen any blind salamanders in here, but there are lots of Red Sox fans in this cave who are prematurely planning their World Series victory celebrations, and lots of others who are prematurely convinced we won't even make it to the playoffs. Some people are in both groups, switching back and forth depending on what happened the night before. Those are the two groups I was trying to get away from by hiding in this cave in the first place, so maybe I'll just leave now and won't wait for our ten-game lead to be restored.

Yes, Manny had errors on two consecutive plays which surrendered our early lead in World Series Game 1. I'm sure I was just as anguished as that fan in the stands. Our nerves were all still quite jangled from the gut-wrenching ALCS.

And yes, I also remember both of Bellhorn's foul-pole homers, and I remember thinking it was close to the BEST sound I've ever heard despite McCarver's comments. Very much like beautiful music.

Your cousin Mark was a great example of why patience is necessary - remember all the chants for POKEY - POKEY - POKEY? Pokey couldn't have rattled the foul-poles like that - nor could he have hit that kid sitting in the first row of the left field stands in Yankee Stadium in ALCS Game 6, which made the Bloody Sock Victory possible.

[hellborn]

Hellborn,

...

Your cousin Mark was a great example of why patience is necessary - remember all the chants for POKEY - POKEY - POKEY? Pokey couldn't have rattled the foul-poles like that - nor could he have hit that kid sitting in the first row of the left field stands in Yankee Stadium in ALCS Game 6, which made the Bloody Sock Victory possible.

Oh, yes...Tito's patience did pay off, bigtime. Bellhorn's stats for the postseason as a whole were not very impressive, but his hits were so huge when he did get hot. Pokey was SO slick with the glove, but that bat...well, I just remember early in that season when he got all of a pitch, and drove it all the way to the base of the Monster. That was about the best he could do...that team was more or less built around guys who carried big sticks and could mostly play decent defense. Damon, Millar, Bellhorn, Mueller, Varitek, Nixon...Manny was hid pretty well in LF. Can't get into the postseason with that team and then decide that, no, that was wrong, let's bring out the glove men.
I time I really liked Schilling opening his mouth was when he spoke up in defense of Bellhorn in that postseason...more or less said that the sportswriters didn't seem to appreciate him, but his teammates sure did.

[Toledo Inquisition]

I know this is an old thread, but a buddy and I were discussing Manny's glove, and his desire vs. abilities. Most of these original posters are no longer around, but anyone currently here have a point of view on whether most of Manny's failings were laziness or lack of range and judgment?

[hcorday]

I know this is an old thread, but a buddy and I were discussing Manny's glove, and his desire vs. abilities. Most of these original posters are no longer around, but anyone currently here have a point of view on whether most of Manny's failings were laziness or lack of range and judgment?

First of all, Manny was not the worst fielder ever, but I would rate him less than average. He was better at fielding balls off the wall than Mike Greenwell, who would go back until his back was against the wall, then run forward to try to catch up with the ball on the rebound, At least Manny would stop and turn around for the rebound before he got to the wall. He just was not into playing the field and was lackadaisical, to say the least. He did get to balls hit not too far to his left and right. Did not make a lot of errirs on balls he could get to. He had a bad, inaccurate arm. Playing him in LF hid a lot of his problems.