Joba not being in the Pen is a total mistake

[Hank Parks]

We need a Rivera replacement soon
I don't care what anybody says but Rivera is slowly losing it
Joba is very similar to what Rivera was
I think the Yanks using him in the 7 and 8 innings can win more games than pitching Joba every 4 days
This combo can be like Wettland and Rivera in 96 and they won it all

[Yankeebiscuitfan]

We need a Rivera replacement soon
I don't care what anybody says but Rivera is slowly losing it
Joba is very similar to what Rivera was
I think the Yanks using him in the 7 and 8 innings can win more games than pitching Joba every 4 days
This combo can be like Wettland and Rivera in 96 and they won it all

I think you are right about this. I wasn't too happy about the resigning of Mo. I could have lived with one year.

Both could be a nice 1-2 punch in the 7th, 8th and 9th innings. And if Mo will falter, Joba can take over.

[monkey333]

We need a Rivera replacement soon Mo is signed for 3 more years and we have numerous relief prospects.
I don't care what anybody says but Rivera is slowly losing it Well durr, the guy is nearing 40.Joba is very similar to what Rivera was No. Mo was good as a starter in the minors but he didn't have the potential Joba has as a starter.I think the Yanks using him in the 7 and 8 innings can win more games than pitching Joba every 4 days Why?
This combo can be like Wettland and Rivera in 96 and they won it all Ok. If Joba is playing Rivera then who do you propose is playing Key, Rogers, Gooden, Cone, Pettitte?

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[The_Leff_Fielder]

We need a Rivera replacement soon
I don't care what anybody says but Rivera is slowly losing it
Joba is very similar to what Rivera was
I think the Yanks using him in the 7 and 8 innings can win more games than pitching Joba every 4 days
This combo can be like Wettland and Rivera in 96 and they won it all

Maybe so. But if the Yankees' three big pitching prospects live up to their hype, imagine how unbeatable they'll be in 6 years when they're the top 3 starters.

[Hank Parks]

Forget about 6 years I want them Champs now
Joba in the pen can be the answer

[bigbadwolf]

How long Joba stays in the pen will depend on how the starters perform and just how well the team starts the season. The better the starters perform the longer Joba stays in the bullpen.

[papote46]

I agree, Joba will do more good as a short reliever. Rivera was the best but now he is an average reliever.

[DoubleX]

This is one of those threads that illustrates a major shortcoming with Yankee fans - a lack of perspective. Joba's potential value as a starter is greater than his value as a short reliever. In the long-run, going through some of the growing pains this year with Joba as a starter, could payoff huge down the road if develops into the ace-like pitcher that some believe he can.

Also, Rivera is not the pitcher he was in his prime and is coming off his worst season, but he is still a much better than average reliever.

[bigbadwolf]

I agree to a point. If it were up to me I would have Joba starting also. However, if there is one thing I have learned about baseball that joek has shwon me...it is to leave the decsions like we are discussing to the men on the field who are in charge. There is a reason for everything, and we never know all the facts or whys and wherefores.

[DoubleX]

I agree to a point. If it were up to me I would have Joba starting also. However, if there is one thing I have learned about baseball that joek has shwon me...it is to leave the decsions like we are discussing to the men on the field who are in charge. There is a reason for everything, and we never know all the facts or whys and wherefores.

Decisions like trading for Randy Johnson and Kevin Brown? Decisions like signing Jason Giambi to a long contract? Decisions like trading for the guy you loathe so much, Alex Rodriguez, and then signing him to a 10 year contract this offseason? If you place so much faith in the team's management decisions, then you should have no problem with A-Rod being on the team.

[bigbadwolf]

Decisions like trading for Randy Johnson and Kevin Brown? Decisions like signing Jason Giambi to a long contract? Decisions like trading for the guy you loathe so much, Alex Rodriguez, and then signing him to a 10 year contract this offseason? If you place so much faith in the team's management decisions, then you should have no problem with A-Rod being on the team.

You misconstrued my position. Mangament decisions off the field are quite different than management decisions on the field. The management decision on the field are the only ones which should decide how and when a player should be utilized. I have no problem with anyone in an organization expressing their suggestions on how a player should be utilized, but the final decision should only be made by the mangement team on the field. Since you brought up Arod, that is why he is a third base and the best shortstop ion baseball is at shortstop. Manangement off the field signed Arod to the ten year contract, not the management on the field.

[Mattingly]

I agree to a point. If it were up to me I would have Joba starting also. However, if there is one thing I have learned about baseball that joek has shwon me...it is to leave the decsions like we are discussing to the men on the field who are in charge. There is a reason for everything, and we never know all the facts or whys and wherefores.

Let's play "Yankee management" for awhile. Let's just say that XX here (in the role of Joe Girardi) wants Joba to start ST as a reliever, then wants him to go over to be the starter later on. However, you're in the role of Brian Cashman. Do you ask him to see that Joba gets "X" number of innings before becoming a starter?

Is that "X" a set number? Does it depend upon how well that each of Messrs Wang, Pettitte, Hughes, Kennedy, Mussina are doing at that point? If they're all doing well, do you keep Joba in the pen?

If someone is not doing so well, do you stop the "Chamberlain to the pen" project and put him into the rotation?

Let me know what you would do had you been in a position of power.

[bigbadwolf]

Let's play "Yankee management" for awhile. Let's just say that XX here (in the role of Joe Girardi) wants Joba to start ST as a reliever, then wants him to go over to be the starter later on. However, you're in the role of Brian Cashman. Do you ask him to see that Joba gets "X" number of innings before becoming a starter?

Is that "X" a set number? Does it depend upon how well that each of Messrs Wang, Pettitte, Hughes, Kennedy, Mussina are doing at that point? If they're all doing well, do you keep Joba in the pen?

If someone is not doing so well, do you stop the "Chamberlain to the pen" project and put him into the rotation?

Let me know what you would do had you been in a position of power.

As I stated, anyone in office and or field management may suggest anything and give what in their opinion is a valid reason for such opinion. If I am the field manager, I listen to each person who may give an opinion, and then do whatever I think is necessary to help the team be the best it csn be. There are so many variables that can occur during sprint training and at the start of the season, I personally would think it foolish to have a plan set in stone. A plan yes, set in stone, never, but maleable as needed.

[Yankeebiscuitfan]

This is one of those threads that illustrates a major shortcoming with Yankee fans - a lack of perspective. Joba's potential value as a starter is greater than his value as a short reliever. In the long-run, going through some of the growing pains this year with Joba as a starter, could payoff huge down the road if develops into the ace-like pitcher that some believe he can.

Also, Rivera is not the pitcher he was in his prime and is coming off his worst season, but he is still a much better than average reliever.

I am not used to the fact that you make these kind of harsh remarks. YOU think Joba is more valuable in the starting rotation. That is your opinion. But some people can have another vision. The last two seasons our middle and short relievers were quite shaky. Now we finally have a pitcher who is a good stopper. I think at the moment that he is way more valuable in that job than as a starter. I have had it with the Farsworths and the Ramirezes that keep blowing games.
Until we have found a pitcher that can replace him (inside or outside the origanisation), I want Joba as a set up man.

[DoubleX]

I am not used to the fact that you make these kind of harsh remarks. YOU think Joba is more valuable in the starting rotation. That is your opinion. But some people can have another vision. The last two seasons our middle and short relievers were quite shaky. Now we finally have a pitcher who is a good stopper. I think at the moment that he is way more valuable in that job than as a starter. I have had it with the Farsworths and the Ramirezes that keep blowing games.
Until we have found a pitcher that can replace him (inside or outside the origanisation), I want Joba as a set up man.

I agree that he could be more valuable in the bullpen right now given the circumstances, but it's shortsighted. Putting him in the bullpen now retards his long-term growth. It hurts his arm strength, changes his approach, prevents him from building the stamina needed to be a good starter, and prevents him from developing his secondary pitchers. You're getting a quick-fix for this season at the expense of having a potential ace for years. In the short-run, Joba has more value in relieving, I agree, but the long-term value is in him starting, and that needs to begin ASAP, IMO. It might be a bumpy road at first, but in the long-run, I think you'd prefer to have years of Joba being a good starter than him being a one inning pitcher for this year. The future will become the present, and when that present comes, there may be reason to lament the fact that Joba isn't starting.