Yankee Dark ages

[Urbanshocker13]

I know it's weird talking about times in the History of a team when the team wasn't good. But I thought with all the great eras and teams the Yankees have had, that have been talked about so much. It would be intersting to talk about the times when the team hasn't been that great, it's still part of Yankee History and some of us grewup with those teams. Also which era do you think was worst, The CBS owned era or the 1980's-early 90's era.

The "CBS ERA" started in 65" and lasted until George steinbrenner bought the team, It's a time when the Yank went from the dominate team in baseball since the time of Ruth to being some years one of the worst. Both the Stadium and The Bronx fell on hard times and the attendance and the Yankees standings fell.

The 80's-early 90's era was a time of over spending for free agents without winning, theres where a few good teams but no playoffs to show for it. Adding to this steinbrenner many embrassing statements and moves. This is also the era I grew up watching, which made the championship in 96" that that much better.

I know we dont usally talk about the lean times, but us who lived and followed the Yankees during these times, good or bad we have memories of those times.

Also out of thses two eras which is worst, falling from top of the baseball hill or spending way too much money for nothing. Which was the worst of the Yankee Dark Ages?
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[oldschoolyankee]

I became a Yankee fan around '69 and lived thru the second half of the CBS-early Steinbrenner period. My memories of that time have become somewhat fuzzy, but I think that period was bleak in that while we had good pitching at that time, we just didn't have the hitters to compete with the Orioles or A's or Tigers (the dominant AL teams of that era). That 1974 season was a real heartbreaker with the Yanks leading the division with a week to go only to lose out at the end.

However...

While the 80's Yankee teams didn't go to the postseason (except for '81 which was a fluke due to the split season system used that year), they did compete each year (1983-'88) and in retrospect, turned out to be the polar opposite of the CBS era...heavy hitting and skimpy pitching. Lineups with Mattingly, Winfield, Baylor, Henderson, et.al., the Yanks could thump with anyone. What killed us was the merry-go-round at shortstop (from Dent to Smalley to Robertson to Meacham to Santana to Espinoza), instability in the outfield (Mumphrey, Griffey Sr, Kemp, "Uptown" Bobby Brown, Ruppert Jones, et. al.), and finally, the starting rotation which really became unstable when Righetti was switched to closer, as well as not having an "ace" after 1985 (when Guidry had his last big season with 22 wins).

To answer the question, the early 90's Stump Merrill era was the absolute worst ball the Yanks played in my lifetime (I'm 45 years old). I'll never forget when someone predicted that Chuck Cary would be a 20-game winner eek: (I don't think that guy won 20 in his whole career!!!). Or Oscar Azocar who couldn't get a walk to save his life. Or Kevin Maas who was on the cover of NY Magazine as the next great thing. Gawd...Dallas Green, Bucky Dent, Stump Merrill!!! Both Winfield and Mattingly rendered irrelevant due to bad backs!!! Steve Sax who forgot how to play second base! Instability at third base (Torey Lovullo or Mike Blowers anyone??).

But...for any fans over the age of 110, how about a shout out for the Highlanders for a TRULY dark and gloomy period in our history 1905 to about 1915 when Ruppert bought the team. That period was SO DARK, its NEVER talked about, no prominent books are written about it and, how many of us can truly discuss that period without consulting the Baseball Encyclopedia? Russ Ford anyone? Hal Chase? Roger Peckinpaugh? I don't think so!!!

[Urbanshocker13]

I forgott to vote for my own poll lol.....

Yeah, early 90's was the worst!!! I am 28 so when I was 10 and 11 kids would actually pick on me for being a Yankee fan!! I remember Espinoza's coke bottle glasses, Mel Hall's jerry curl and alot of loseing. One cool thing about that era for me is I went to Albany Yankee games and got to see the talent thar came up and became the late 90's championship teams.

I didn't add the highlanders years because I figured nobody on this site is even close to old enough to talk about then, but watch there someone on here who is 120 with there gas powered laptop that remerbers those times LOL!

[dougj1]

CBS was the worst owner of a major league ball club you could imagine. They bought out Webb-Topping who knew that the last dynasty with Mantle would soon end, being replaced by some type of free agency...One year they wound up in 10th place, (last) and another I think 9th place....CBS never had a quality management who could make deals, thinking the Yankees would go on forever as a winner.....The only reasonably decent players I recall were Joe Pepitone and Mercer in the late 60s.

[Urbanshocker13]

CBS was the worst owner of a major league ball club you could imagine. They bought out Webb-Topping who knew that the last dynasty with Mantle would soon end, being replaced by some type of free agency...One year they wound up in 10th place, (last) and another I think 9th place....CBS never had a quality management who could make deals, thinking the Yankees would go on forever as a winner.....The only reasonably decent players I recall were Joe Pepitone and Mercer in the late 60s.

Roy White!!!

[oldschoolyankee]

Don't forget, those post Webb-Topping Yanks had a pipeline of good young pitchers which included Fritz Peterson, Mel Stottlemyre, Steve Kline and Stan Bahnsen, as well as the future captain, Thurman Munson! This is in addition to the previously mentioned Bobby Murcer and Roy White. Trouble was, we had no thumpers to replace Mantle and Maris. The hitters we were counting on went bad (Tom Tresh and yes, Pepitone). Seems like other teams had guys who could routinely hit 30 or more home runs (Baltimore with Robinson and Powell, Boston with Yaz and Tony C, Tigers with Norm Cash and Willie Horton, Twins with Killebrew, even the Senators had Frank Howard). Hitting was at a premium in the late 1960s and the Yanks just didn't have it (Jerry Kenney at third base??? What a "slugger" he was).

And I completely forgot about Mel Hall and his jerry curl !! He was one of my favorite players on those awful Stump Merrill teams. It wasn't until years later that I found out that the Yanks got rid of Mel because he and another teammate were "hazing" young and shy Bernie Williams relentlessly.

[HomeRunHomer]

While the 80's Yankee teams didn't go to the postseason (except for '81 which was a fluke due to the split season system used that year)

Actually, the Yankees made another playoff appearance in that decade.

In 1980, they won 103 games and won the A.L. East.

You forgot about that one.

[DisabledMess]

At least George was "trying" to win WS in the 80's and early 90's. CBS didn't care.

[Urbanshocker13]

Don't forget, those post Webb-Topping Yanks had a pipeline of good young pitchers which included Fritz Peterson, Mel Stottlemyre, Steve Kline and Stan Bahnsen, as well as the future captain, Thurman Munson! This is in addition to the previously mentioned Bobby Murcer and Roy White. Trouble was, we had no thumpers to replace Mantle and Maris. The hitters we were counting on went bad (Tom Tresh and yes, Pepitone). Seems like other teams had guys who could routinely hit 30 or more home runs (Baltimore with Robinson and Powell, Boston with Yaz and Tony C, Tigers with Norm Cash and Willie Horton, Twins with Killebrew, even the Senators had Frank Howard). Hitting was at a premium in the late 1960s and the Yanks just didn't have it (Jerry Kenney at third base??? What a "slugger" he was).

And I completely forgot about Mel Hall and his jerry curl !! He was one of my favorite players on those awful Stump Merrill teams. It wasn't until years later that I found out that the Yanks got rid of Mel because he and another teammate were "hazing" young and shy Bernie Williams relentlessly.

Mel Hall really picked on Bernie who is a quite and sensitive type guy, he called him Bambi as well as other things. It really effected Bernie, it took Mattingly taking him aside to help bernie through that.

The early 90's really did suck! Makes me reconsider my vote. Stump Merrill was horrible, you had coked up Steve Howe in the bullpen. They always gave hin 2nd chances everytime he came up positive, I dont know why he sucked. I remember him giving a tip of his hat to the crowd when they booed him after yet another horrible outing, what a jerk! the Yanks where horrible then, but I still remember staying up late watching WPIX during rain delays watching countless Twilight Zones and honeymooners waiting for the game to come back on that the Yanks where going to lose anyway!

[locke40]

I think the CBS years were worse because they were responsible for the decay and then ultimate demise of the greatest Stadium in history.

[Urbanshocker13]

I think the CBS years were worse because they were responsible for the decay and then ultimate demise of the greatest Stadium in history.

I agree with that, Like really cheap "renovations" like a crappy paint job to the front of the stadium.

[oldschoolyankee]

Actually, the Yankees made another playoff appearance in that decade.

In 1980, they won 103 games and won the A.L. East.

You forgot about that one.

Chalk that omission to the early onset of old age !!

[bigtime39]

This thread goes to something I've been pointing out for a long time: outside of the playoffs, where small sample size creates statistical oddities, the only way the Yankees can be kept out of the post-season is when their ownership is bad/out of control.
You should thank your lucky stars that MLB has never figured that out. Otherwise, you'd be operating under an NFL-style economic system right now.

Right now, there are 29 teams right now hoping that Hank Steinbrenner is even crazier than his old man was.

Personally, I'm thankful for the CBS period, as it coincided with the rise of the sixties Orioles teams. Without CBS, they might have finished second every year...and in a no divisions, no wild card system, how fun is that?

[Urbanshocker13]

murrrrrrrrrrrrrfrrrrrr..........I don't want to go down this road again!....We already know both sides of this argument. I don't care! Your team is in first place, I thought we heard the last of you for a while!....I even agreed with you on another thread!!!!!.....please let's not talk about this again!!!

Come on! Let's hear about Jesse Barfield,Steve Balboni, Kevin Maas, Bobby Murcer ECT. To help inspire ypu here is Oscar Gambles Afro and Dion Sanders Jerrycurl!:

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[jimmyjimjimz]

I don't really have much of a say, because I was born in 1983, but the 80's-early 90's were really horrible, in my opinion.