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  • PeteU
    replied
    Originally posted by majorleads View Post
    Now we're blaming lack of newspaper coverage for the Marlins pathetic attendance? Unreal! The reason why the Marlins don't draw is because the people who live in Miami that can afford to go and have the time do not stay in South Florida during the summer time. Then you have Broward and during the summer nobody likes to get on I-95 or the turnpike after work and head down to Joe Robbie in 100 degree heat/humidity. Palm Beach is a lost cause because hardly anyone is travelling down there and then have to come home late at night. And now the rocket scientists of Dade County have decided to put a beautiful ballpark in a much much much worse location. If I was a Dade county resident I would be furious because in the end it will end up costing the taxpayers a boatload of cash when there's a lack of tourism dollars.


    Oh and nobody reads newspapers anymore.
    If you bothered to actually read the prior posts, I wasn't blaming attendance woes in general on newspapers. I was blaming the fact that a doubleheader wasn't scheduled until the evening before, and the newspapers barely publicized the facts. So when barely anyone knows that the game is starting at 3 pm instead of 7 pm, and very few people show up at the very, very start of the first game, it makes for an embarassing photo op which people like you love to play up, but didn't actually reflect reality. I'm not delusional and I know the Fish have had attendance woes for well over a decade. But to take advantage of this one instance out of context isn't reflecting reality.

    And yes, plenty of people still read newspapers. Maybe not as many as a decade ago, but plenty of folks get their information---including their sports information--from the newspapers.

    As for the Dade County location for the new park, why not? Miami is the most concentrated and populous area in the South Florida metro region.

    But go ahead and make your little predictions before a game has been played there. And give me the winning lotto numbers while you're at it.

    Leave a comment:


  • rx2003
    replied
    far be it from me to defend our local high school newsletters, the ss and the herald, but they do know that s florida is and always will be football country,,,and if people cared or clomored for baseball like they do for football they would devote more coverage...i will say this much I went to mets/marlins game the other day and i didnt find out till the day b4 that the start was 5pm....by reading the daily news,,,,

    for what its worth i have been here from new york since 95 and i can say the fanbase of the fish never recovered since the 97 firesale...2003 the attendance was horrible until sept when the fish were close to winning the wild card...

    the heat played to half empty arena's until shaq got there and again until lebron........

    Leave a comment:


  • majorleads
    replied
    Originally posted by Chevy114 View Post
    The lack of newspaper support is just one of the issues brought up why the marlins draw so low. I don't think Baseball is as expensive as you are making it sound, the average person can afford tickets and I think miami has a lot of average people who will go to a game once its portraied correctly in the media (print or tv).

    Nobody reads newspapers anymore. Also, it's not just the cost of tickets, but travel expenses too along with higher food costs and parking. Plus there is no public transportation to Joe Robbie except for a few park and rides but people don't use that like they did back in the 70's and 80's when I would take that to the Orange Bowl on occasion. And of course there is the weather and nobody likes to sit outside during the summer time in South Florida. That sun is STRONG. If there is no AC people would rather stay home. Then you throw in South Florida as being one of the worst sports towns in the country. Even the Dolphins can't sell out anymore and they get all the coverage. Hurricanes don't draw well either, certainly not like the OB days. Another thing, the area where Joe Robbie is nobody likes to travel there. And certainly nobody likes to travel where the new stadium will be, dome or no dome. Not happening. This has epic disaster written all over it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Chevy114
    replied
    Originally posted by majorleads View Post
    Now we're blaming lack of newspaper coverage for the Marlins pathetic attendance? Unreal! The reason why the Marlins don't draw is because the people who live in Miami that can afford to go and have the time do not stay in South Florida during the summer time. Then you have Broward and during the summer nobody likes to get on I-95 or the turnpike after work and head down to Joe Robbie in 100 degree heat/humidity. Palm Beach is a lost cause because hardly anyone is travelling down there and then have to come home late at night. And now the rocket scientists of Dade County have decided to put a beautiful ballpark in a much much much worse location. If I was a Dade county resident I would be furious because in the end it will end up costing the taxpayers a boatload of cash when there's a lack of tourism dollars.


    Oh and nobody reads newspapers anymore.
    The lack of newspaper support is just one of the issues brought up why the marlins draw so low. I don't think Baseball is as expensive as you are making it sound, the average person can afford tickets and I think miami has a lot of average people who will go to a game once its portraied correctly in the media (print or tv).

    Leave a comment:


  • majorleads
    replied
    Originally posted by DrBear View Post
    In the newspaper's defense, if each of the parents of those high school kids buys a copy of the paper, that's probably more single-copy sales than the usual amount of Marlins fans who would buy the paper that day.

    Now we're blaming lack of newspaper coverage for the Marlins pathetic attendance? Unreal! The reason why the Marlins don't draw is because the people who live in Miami that can afford to go and have the time do not stay in South Florida during the summer time. Then you have Broward and during the summer nobody likes to get on I-95 or the turnpike after work and head down to Joe Robbie in 100 degree heat/humidity. Palm Beach is a lost cause because hardly anyone is travelling down there and then have to come home late at night. And now the rocket scientists of Dade County have decided to put a beautiful ballpark in a much much much worse location. If I was a Dade county resident I would be furious because in the end it will end up costing the taxpayers a boatload of cash when there's a lack of tourism dollars.


    Oh and nobody reads newspapers anymore.

    Leave a comment:


  • DrBear
    replied
    In the newspaper's defense, if each of the parents of those high school kids buys a copy of the paper, that's probably more single-copy sales than the usual amount of Marlins fans who would buy the paper that day.

    Leave a comment:


  • Captain Cold Nose
    replied
    The Palm Beach Post is Passable.

    Leave a comment:


  • TommieAgeefan
    replied
    [QUOTE=PeteU;1925728]
    Originally posted by Paul W View Post

    It's not the market's fault. It's the local media's fault for not sufficiently covering the local major league team.

    I get the Sun-Sentinel. Rarely do I see the Marlins' score on the front page of the sports section--it's usually buried back on page 4 or 5. What does get front page coverage? High school sports. I'm sorry, but unless you are a) a student at a local high school or b) an alumni of a local high school, you aren't likely going to care about what the pole vaulting team at St. Thomas Aquinas High School is doing. Yet you have a major league baseball team in town--whether its a winning season or not--and they get banished to the back pages.

    Perhaps the Miami Herald might have better Marlins' coverage, but the Sun-Sentinel's Marlins coverage is atrocious.
    The Sun-Sentinel is atrocious, period. The Miami Herald isn't much better, but they are the N. Y. Times compared to the S-S. Media in general (like many other aspects of life) are lacking in South Florida. (Why did I move here again? Oh, yeah, the 2-day long winter)

    Leave a comment:


  • PeteU
    replied
    [QUOTE=Paul W;1925666]
    Originally posted by PeteU View Post
    ...the Marlins not really being all that competitive as of late...combined with the Dolphins starting up their season and all the fun coming out of UM football, the Marlins have been getting virtually zero media attention in town. They have been buried in the back pages... QUOTE]

    prime reason why metro dade/miami is a marginal market - boondoggle dome or not.
    It's not the market's fault. It's the local media's fault for not sufficiently covering the local major league team.

    I get the Sun-Sentinel. Rarely do I see the Marlins' score on the front page of the sports section--it's usually buried back on page 4 or 5. What does get front page coverage? High school sports. I'm sorry, but unless you are a) a student at a local high school or b) an alumni of a local high school, you aren't likely going to care about what the pole vaulting team at St. Thomas Aquinas High School is doing. Yet you have a major league baseball team in town--whether its a winning season or not--and they get banished to the back pages.

    Perhaps the Miami Herald might have better Marlins' coverage, but the Sun-Sentinel's Marlins coverage is atrocious.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paul W
    replied
    [QUOTE=PeteU;1921347]...the Marlins not really being all that competitive as of late...combined with the Dolphins starting up their season and all the fun coming out of UM football, the Marlins have been getting virtually zero media attention in town. They have been buried in the back pages... QUOTE]

    prime reason why metro dade/miami is a marginal market - boondoggle dome or not.

    Leave a comment:


  • TommieAgeefan
    replied
    Originally posted by PeteU View Post
    D-Train pulled the number down? Nice.

    Glad to see things seem to be working out for him again. I was always a big fan of his, and was sad when things appeared to take a dive for him. I actually went to school with his future wife, believe it or not.
    I am also glad that Dontrelle seems to be doing well w/ the Reds. Too bad the rotation worked out that he didn't face the Marlins, he would've had a good chance to get his first win of the season! (When I found out that he had been called up by the Reds, I consulted the schedule and was actually considering going to the game if he had been scheduled to pitch. But looking through the schedule and projecting the rotation, I determined that he would miss the Marlins So it appears that the May 18th game vs the Cubs will be my final one at Joe Robbie/Sun Life/Dolphin/Dolphins/Land Shark/Sun Life/your name here Stadium LOL (I actually attended games under the Joe Robbie, Pro Player and Sun Life names).

    Leave a comment:


  • PeteU
    replied
    Originally posted by marlins739 View Post
    I had tickets in advance for this game, strongly considered not going when the skies opened up at 4:30 in West Palm Beach, and decided to go just to see the old ballpark one last time. Dontrelle Willis pulled the number down to a standing ovation from the literal crowd of 6 or 7 thousand..
    D-Train pulled the number down? Nice.

    Glad to see things seem to be working out for him again. I was always a big fan of his, and was sad when things appeared to take a dive for him. I actually went to school with his future wife, believe it or not.

    Leave a comment:


  • Chevy114
    replied
    2 things, first the marlins playing at joe robbie is like the usfl playing at the la collisuem, 500 fans look like 20 fans at jr in baseball configuration. Second JR isn't near anything, I mean there are a few houses around it, but it was built like the rest of those 70s and 80s stadiums built far away so you could have plenty of room for parking. So odds are no one is going to walk up to it like they would a game at a downtown park like opacy or Fenway.

    As for competing with major cities, very few teams just get a baseball team out of nowhere and start seling out every game, look at the mariners it took almost 30 years to build a fanbase. Now seattle loves it teams. Even in Tampa we keep hearing about the hurricanes troubles and how bad the qb situation is for the dolphins, so to think a football obessed town is going to put a double header of a meaningless baseball on the front page is asinine.

    P.S. check out the top 10 signs its a miserable sports city, I made #5 for Tampa Yay!

    http://espn.go.com/espn/page2/story/...le-sports-town

    Leave a comment:


  • marlins739
    replied
    Originally posted by PeteU View Post
    Well, that's nice and all, but the Sox have the benefit of 100+ years of history and playing in a sainted Green Cathedral intended for baseball. Ditto for the Yankees. At no time in the past few decades has there been any threat of moving or contracting the team. No major firesales to be spoken of. No threats to the stability of the franchise.

    But, as you see from the 2003 Yankees game, even big history, big market teams like them are not immune from the unexpected. And again, in the long run, actual attendance figures are going to be irrelevant. Like or not, attendance is going to be measured by paid attendance, including all no-shows. And unless we are talking about a World Series game, just about every team is going to have a few thousand no-shows. That 3,000 figure is something that was pulled out of one's rear. For that matter, so could my estimate of the 15,000 or 16,000 that were in the park by the second game (which I saw on television). Paid attendance was over 22,000, meaning 22,000 paid for their seats, whether they showed up in the 1st inning of the first game, 5th inning of the first game, 1st inning of the second game, or not at all.
    Pete, why bother defending this area? Just accept what has been demonstrated time and time again on this board: Baseball fans in Boston and New York are clearly of superior moral fiber than those lost souls in the Sunshine State, and it's no use pretending otherwise. I'm sure when the new mallpark opens, the literal crowd will be in the low double digits, the last local pride we have will be stamped out of us and the Northeast will finally be able to demonstrate its inherent superiority! And that's hoping the concrete (a substandard building material that would never survive a New York winter) doesn't crack open, spilling out all the baby seals that $amson and Loria killed to build the place. THE UGLY TRUTH!

    For real though, I was at the game on Tuesday night. I literally took a headcount in the fifth inning and came up with about 6,000 actual people in seats. Some people obviously were in the bathroom, left early, arrived late, so I'd say another couple thousand people were probably there at some point. The paid crowd was 21,000. This is for a last-place team that had lost 19 of 22 games and 6 in a row, had its most popular player sent to AAA in an ugly front office dispute, has its two biggest stars on the DL, is emphasizing how bad Sun Life is in the television ads for the new park, was playing an opponent (Cincinnati) with an equally bad record, on a hot, rainy Tuesday night in August. They lost another heartbreaker in the 9th. Why would anyone expect a Boston-esque sellout under those circumstances?

    The Red Sox are in first place and play in a ballpark that is an attraction in itself. Different situation. And look at Red Sox attendance numbers in the 60s and early 80s when they weren't that good. There were several years when they averaged below 10,000 paid.

    I had tickets in advance for this game, strongly considered not going when the skies opened up at 4:30 in West Palm Beach, and decided to go just to see the old ballpark one last time. Dontrelle Willis pulled the number down to a standing ovation from the literal crowd of 6 or 7 thousand. The doubleheader was announced in the middle of Tuesday's game, and as Pete said the only story in the sports pages now is the Miami scandal, and by the regularly scheduled game time there was a standard crowd there too. It's hard to watch this pathetic team right now, and with the Hurricanes scandal and an actual hurricane, attendance is going to be low even for us. It'll pick up in the last few weeks as people come see the park for the last time. The paid crowds lately have been much higher than normal, even if the number of people in seats hasn't changed too much.
    Last edited by marlins739; 08-25-2011, 01:39 PM.

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  • Mr. Laser Beam
    replied
    What is the latest status on what will happen to this stadium once the Marlins move out? Are they still going to add seats and/or renovate the stadium to fill in some of that extra space? What about the roof?

    Leave a comment:

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