Hudgens

[tom.guerry]

I ordered Hudgens "free" DVD advertised in the banner at hsbaseballweb.This is fairly old becasue his son Jordan is young in the video.Overall, some very good stuff, including:

1- very good detail on early parts - swing,stance,grip,load,etc. This perspective seems more and more out of vogue recently with all the "middle" emphasis, but you better get this setup and early stuff right in my opinion.

2- good point on preference for practicing with smallsweetspot/wood. The metal bats have a much larger sweetspot that extends much more toward the handle of the bat which STRONGLY encourages dragging the bat through the zone as the easiest way to adjust which is VERY counterproductive if yiou will EVER have to perform with wood.

3-some good grip info (not perfect but very worthwhile),including looseness of top hand

4- important recognition of/description of universal launch position (he describes this as hand cok at toe touch, no rubber band winding yet) with emphasis on the top hand/bottom arm position as the key. keep hands at back shoulder/keep barrell up.

5-Pretty good stride description, including "reach" feel (something to add to carry/etc)

6-uses the "knob to front hip" cue similar to waht BUSTER has been decribing here

7-good weight shift emphasis

8-retain wrist cok until contact

9-MANY good drills/flaw anaysis,etc

Some not so good stuff, of course, especially too much flex staying in lead leg and omission of "sit"/vertical load info and omission or "rubber band winding" part of swing.

Only $6.95 for shipping. Get'em while they last

[hiddengem]

I ordered Hudgens "free" DVD advertised in the banner at hsbaseballweb.This is fairly old becasue his son Jordan is young in the video.Overall, some very good stuff, including:

1- very good detail on early parts - swing,stance,grip,load,etc. This perspective seems more and more out of vogue recently with all the "middle" emphasis, but you better get this setup and early stuff right in my opinion.

2- good point on preference for practicing with smallsweetspot/wood. The metal bats have a much larger sweetspot that extends much more toward the handle of the bat which STRONGLY encourages dragging the bat through the zone as the easiest way to adjust which is VERY counterproductive if yiou will EVER have to perform with wood.

3-some good grip info (not perfect but very worthwhile),including looseness of top hand

4- important recognition of/description of universal launch position (he describes this as hand cok at toe touch, no rubber band winding yet) with emphasis on the top hand/bottom arm position as the key. keep hands at back shoulder/keep barrell up.

5-Pretty good stride description, including "reach" feel (something to add to carry/etc)

6-uses the "knob to front hip" cue similar to waht BUSTER has been decribing here

7-good weight shift emphasis

8-retain wrist cok until contact

9-MANY good drills/flaw anaysis,etc

Some not so good stuff, of course, especially too much flex staying in lead leg and omission of "sit"/vertical load info and omission or "rubber band winding" part of swing.

Only $6.95 for shipping. Get'em while they last

Umm..I think I'll pass. Like Jbooth said earlier, when taking BP he wants you to strive for hitting ground balls in between homeplate and the pitchers mound. Overemphasis on keeping the barrell above the hands until the point of contact, which to me seems like a linear move toward the ball or a "chop".
No thanks, Been there and done that.

[jbooth]

I ordered Hudgens "free" DVD advertised in the banner at hsbaseballweb.This is fairly old becasue his son Jordan is young in the video.Overall, some very good stuff, including:

1- very good detail on early parts - swing,stance,grip,load,etc. This perspective seems more and more out of vogue recently with all the "middle" emphasis, but you better get this setup and early stuff right in my opinion.

2- good point on preference for practicing with smallsweetspot/wood. The metal bats have a much larger sweetspot that extends much more toward the handle of the bat which STRONGLY encourages dragging the bat through the zone as the easiest way to adjust which is VERY counterproductive if yiou will EVER have to perform with wood.

3-some good grip info (not perfect but very worthwhile),including looseness of top hand

4- important recognition of/description of universal launch position (he describes this as hand cok at toe touch, no rubber band winding yet) with emphasis on the top hand/bottom arm position as the key. keep hands at back shoulder/keep barrell up.

5-Pretty good stride description, including "reach" feel (something to add to carry/etc)

6-uses the "knob to front hip" cue similar to waht BUSTER has been decribing here

7-good weight shift emphasis

8-retain wrist cok until contact

9-MANY good drills/flaw anaysis,etc

Some not so good stuff, of course, especially too much flex staying in lead leg and omission of "sit"/vertical load info and omission or "rubber band winding" part of swing.

Only $6.95 for shipping. Get'em while they last

The best way to go from whatever level of hitter you are to WORSE, is to follow Hudgens' methods.

[WonderMonkey]

Hudgens has had pretty good success with those under his influence. You would think that if his methods were so horrible he wouldn't have had the positions he's had and the time he's had them.

[tom.guerry]

Lots of good pearls in Hudgens stuff unless you know it all already, I guess.

Another very important point He makes which I had not fully appreciated was how head position can influence the back shoulder action and the swing.

One typical flaw he described was how head/chin down forces the back shoulder down.

Good stuff !

[WonderMonkey]

I like his series. I don't agree with everything he says but like with most "accepted" instructionals I can take things away from it.

[jbooth]

Hudgens has had pretty good success with those under his influence. You would think that if his methods were so horrible he wouldn't have had the positions he's had and the time he's had them.

Success? Where? Who? He wrecked the A's last year and got fired.

[hiddengem]

Hudgens has had pretty good success with those under his influence.

And who might this be?

[hiddengem]

I like his series. I don't agree with everything he says but like with most "accepted" instructionals I can take things away from it.

What things would you not take away from it?

[ssarge]

There is absolutely no question that Hudgens is a linear hand path guy. In fact, considerable evidence points to the fact that he teaches exactly what David is re-evaluating - create force with the lower body, then try to keep the hands inside and take them in a straight line to the ball. As David may attest, my observation is that this is not atypical among Major League Hitting Coaches. It IS atypical among successful Major League hitters, however. An irony, for a rank amateur hitting coach like me.

The A's did set an all-time Oakland team hitting mark a couple of years ago. It was only .268 (memory) but in that ball park, this is like .300 in KC or .330 in Fenway (Bill James). However, I believe that is more a tribute to Billy Beane than it is to Hudgins. And I think last year was a disaster, and I guess Billy Beane kind of agreed w/ this assessment.

I suppose Hudgens's poster child is Chavez.

Who I personally think had a much better swing when still under Epstein's residual influence than he does now.


To Tom's point about value in Hudgens's material: I would agree there is some. Personally, I think that value is present in other sources who have more (of the total package) right. While I may be approaching a knowledge level that allows me to weed out good from bad, I'm not sure I want to work that hard. Or should have to, frankly.

Ultimately, I worry about BB Dad or Softball Mom who will buy Hudgin's material, then try to religiously apply it. "Must be right, he's an MLB hitting coach."

Absent the discernment that comes from vast experience and / or typing and reading posts at 2:00am as an internet hitting wonk, a dad or young coach is going to try to follow the material in its entirety. One can only hope that they won't be successful.

Regards,

Scott

[ssarge]

One typical flaw he described was how head/chin down forces the back shoulder down

.

Tom:

I have seen most of the material, but don't have it in front of me.

Don't we want the back shoulder down?

Best regards,

Scott

[swingbuster]

There is absolutely no question that Hudgins is a linear hand path guy.

I know nothing about Hudgins but I want to make a general set of comments about linear hand paths.

When a player makes a good inward turn ( use your own preferred term here) a la get his hands inside the target line with a hip coil and maintains it to foot plant then.....

it is very hard to have a linear hand path. So when people say take your hands to the ball from this position then it MUST go to the ball through turning. If the hands are hidden they usually are forced to move in a circular path and do .

The hand path is determined in a large part by the initial negative move/ load and maintaining this position until front side firm up. IT is a spatial relationship of where the hands are now and where the ball will be soon. If the hands are outside the line then they can be linear and most likely will but the opposite is true too

example..when I tell my players to load the bat inside and maintain that tuck until foot plant they come out rotating pretty well. Even if I am encouraging a healthy weight transfer they have a circular path that was set in the load.

For striders, we discuss take the loaded body forward to foot plant( i know rotation begins just before plant but the shoulders are still back ) and tilt after you form the proper axis( head over belt buckle) and we still try to hit the inside seam in tee work to stop coming over the top.

Linear hand paths are the product of the absence of the " baseball back swing". OR they are merely working cues that do not even describe what is happening sometimes.

Getting the lead hand past the lead hip until release can be misconstrued as a linear cue when it is an axis/ weight shift cue or a hit the ball out front cue ( which is a shift cue as well). If the body did not shift it would be a linear cue. If your body reacts/ shift to move lead hand past the lead leg before release then you will keep your head over belt buckle / shift for a goal and you can maintain a CHP. This cue can stops kids from tilting too early or back foot hitting.

SCOTT.. the following is editorial in nature and is not directed at you just food for thought for all us including me. Your gentlemanly presence, knowledge and comments light up any site you visit

Disguised back foot hitters are very common. Peavy is very aware of that also and it is his best work. You will find that coaches that routinely work with MLB prospects past and present have a goal set, terms and methodology that doesn't alway match this group in terms of " how to teach".

Some of them like Peavy have no use for some of the best selling teaching styles and will tell you he spends most of his time fixing people that have followed other gurus and what has happened and why. They are not all operating in a vaccum and are acutely aware of what is out there and have equal access. IOWS ...they own computers too.

I don't think they are too intimidated by the new world teaching. I think they have a good minds eye for what has worked for them and what they want to see a swing become.

Some of the first archeological finds of human remains have arrows inbedded in their ribs. It is our nature to fight and support one person over the other. But, lets don't sell all those guys too short that have been doing this about twice as long as we have had computers.

After graduating from professional schools the Doctor newbies " know everything but can do nothing; the old experienced guys know nothing but could do everything".

If we don't take a balanced point of view here we are more likely to be wrong. Shooting from home on a key board, it is easy to judge them. Go face to face with them in a crowd of current and ex-players and tell them how much more we know and why...well that would be a little harder. I have been in those places and believe me we listen more than talk. It is only then that we will know where we really are in the food chain.

[WonderMonkey]

Success? Where? Who? He wrecked the A's last year and got fired.

He did well with them during the 90's. I don't have numbers but it's just my overall impression.

[tom.guerry]

Good stuff buster !!

[hiddengem]

.

The A's did set an all-time Oakland team hitting mark a couple of years ago. It was only .268 (memory) but in that ball park, this is like .300 in KC or .330 in Fenway (Bill James). However, I believe that is more a tribute to Billy Beane than it is to Hudgins. And I think last year was a disaster, and I guess Billy Beane kind of agreed w/ this assessment.

I suppose Hudgins's poster child is Chavez.


Scott

I'm pretty sure that last year was the 1st and last year that the Hudgens was the hitting intructor in Oakland. So, that good year they had a couple of years ago was under somebody else, maybe Thad Bosley or somebody before him.
He(Hudgens) was however the Hitting Cordinator for the A's minor league system for a few years before his stop in Oakland. I have since talked to players that went throug their system under him and most if not all of them said his approach went in one ear and out the other.

I highly doubt Chavez was ever under heavy influence of Hudgens because the style of hitting that has made Eric so successful is not what I understand Hudgens to teach.