Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Advice from you coaches for this dad

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • dragoncoach
    started a topic Advice from you coaches for this dad

    Advice from you coaches for this dad

    We're a bit frustrated right now. My wife, my son and I all have the same frustrations/concerns. My son approached me with it - my wife and I don't like talking about these things in front of him.

    I coached my son up until last fall. So I do realize that I have high standards. We went from A ball to AAA ball. My son went to a new team with all strangers, and he's doing well. He's excelling and having fun - for the most part. it's been building for a couple of weeks now or maybe even longer.

    So here's the scenario:

    Team has a core group of players - it's obvious - 4 of the 5 bat in the top 5 of the lineup every game. The other 4 players move around a little bit. My son "lost" the 3B job this spring. He's now playing RF, backup C, and he pitches here and there. That I'm fine with. He's been learning a new skill this year - it's his first at catcher.

    In the fall, he led the team in batting average. This spring he's 3rd. Two kids are batting ,500, mine's at .476 after a slow start. Next up is batting .348 and it goes down from there. The team has 4 triples, all from my son. He's 1 of only 3 kids to hit a home run. He's got 7 extra base hits - next highest is 4.

    He started batting 9th last fall - totally understandable, he was 1 of 2 new kids. (they only have 9 players too). He moved up to 7th over the fall and started this year 7th. He's batted 8th a couple of times, but has been 7th all spring. Last weekend he expressed concern to me over why he wasn't allowed to move up in the lineup. I told him to keep working at it and let his bat do the talking. He has.

    Today - he was moved up to 6th, and I think it excited him a little. In the game he went 2/3 with 2 triples and 3 RBIs. One other kid doubled for the only other extra base hit. The 2 balls he hit were deep over the center fielders' head on a 310' field (we were playing on the wrong fields for 12yo - would have probably been over the fence on our regular fields.

    In the 2nd game of the double header (pool play), the coach made one switch... he switched my son back to 7th back to the regular lineup. The team played pretty well in the first game. They lost 10-8, but put up a great fight. They haven't been winning much, so putting up a great fight was a successful game in my eyes. The kid who got moved up to 6th had 2 walks and a strikeout in game one. He was 0-2 with 2 Ks in game 2. Maybe he wanted someone on base for my son? I still can't see one of the clear top 3 hitters batting that low using any baseball logic.

    What I'm asking is, how do I handle this?

    My son was down after the games and he played great. Most of his frustration was that move back to 7th in the order after his good game. I was clueless on what to tell him. My comments were something like: "Keep on working and showing them, stay positive, life isn't fair.. etc etc" He said he thinks he should be batting 5th - I say well you might be right, but you have two choices: be frustrated and it might affect your play - or stay posiitive, use it as motivation and keep on doing your best.

    What would you do here? I thought about telling the coach about my son's frustration, but I don't want to be "that dad". I'm not here to demand playing time, but at the same time, I just don't know what to tell my son.

    Tomorrow's a new day and we'll probably get over it, but if he bats 7th tomorrow, I'm sure there's going to be some frustration floating around.

    Thanks for your time - it feels better to at least vent, and I'd be curious for all your thoughts.

  • FP26
    replied
    Originally posted by mattun View Post
    I'm pretty sure the kid asking is way more effective than the dad asking. Way back in 10U kid pitch, a dad had fairly rose colored glasses and had been feeling competitive with my kid since T-ball for whatever reason. So he had his kid go and ask the coach to play both my kid's most common starting position and spot in the order (what a surprise) based on his keen batting eye for walks and desire to get better on defense with more opportunities... uh huh. Maybe it doesn't work as well with a 12 year old on a competitive team as a 9 year old, but the coach told my wife after "What am I gonna do? It's rec and he asked."
    Sometimes what the kid wants and what the parents want is completely different. In 12u rec softball I tried to rotate all of our players between infield and outfield. One girl in particular didn't seem to like any of the infield positions, but found a home in center field. She liked it and did well at it. Her mom came to me after one of the games complaining that Veronica wanted to play infield. I knew that wasn't the case. For the next game I started her at 2nd base. After two innings at 2nd base, Veronica requested to go back to center. I asked her to start the next inning at 2nd base and then I would switch her. Our team recorded one out. I walked out of the dugout and said "do you still want to move back to center" loud enough so the parents in the stands could hear me. She replied "yes please". Her mom never complained about it again.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattun
    replied
    I'm pretty sure the kid asking is way more effective than the dad asking. Way back in 10U kid pitch, a dad had fairly rose colored glasses and had been feeling competitive with my kid since T-ball for whatever reason. So he had his kid go and ask the coach to play both my kid's most common starting position and spot in the order (what a surprise) based on his keen batting eye for walks and desire to get better on defense with more opportunities... uh huh. Maybe it doesn't work as well with a 12 year old on a competitive team as a 9 year old, but the coach told my wife after "What am I gonna do? It's rec and he asked."

    Leave a comment:


  • sunderB
    replied
    Originally posted by dragoncoach View Post


    Its 12u. Fully competitive. All tourneys, no league. First tournament, the coach told the boys hed bat them according to their performance. My son feels cheated.
    At the end of the day, be thankful he is in the lineup everyday. Plenty kids that aren't getting that opportunity on teams across the country and may be deserving as well. I agree with what others have said that the position in the order is typically more ego driven.

    But if your son truly feels cheated, I think he is old enough to approach the coach about it himself. He may have to be coached by you on how to approach the coach, but I would let him do it on his own. He has to pose his questions correctly and most reasonable coaches will appreciate that the kid was mature enough to come to him on his own and will likely be honest with him. There is a big difference in a coaches ears between "Why am I not batting at the top of the lineup" vs "What can I do further to earn a spot nearer the top of the lineup? You mentioned to the team that the lineup would be based on performance, and I have been working hard to try to earn my way to a higher spot in the order." Keep it positive, keep it team oriented such as "I want to be able to be able to be in position to better help the team win".

    Leave a comment:


  • johnlanza
    replied
    Originally posted by dragoncoach View Post
    I never found the ball - it went deep into the woods unfortunately.
    Com'on Man! - You gotta go back in those woods and find that ball!

    Originally posted by dragoncoach View Post
    In the second inning - up 1-0, my son jacked a homer so hard that pretty much the entire crowd knew it was gone the moment he hit it.
    We lost in the championship game. My son was sitting on deck or in the hole when quite a few rallies ended.
    I will say that I understand the frustration/disappointment of the batting order that you've mentioned in this thread. But if your son was hitting higher in the lineup, would he have had the same opportunity to crush that HR? Hitters gonna hit. No doubt about it. But maybe they would have pitched to him differently, and then he never would have created that HR memory.
    Keep going strong, and keep being a proud dad.

    Leave a comment:


  • pthawaii
    replied
    Personally, if the coach is a decent coach, I give them slack on the daddy bias. I don't pretend it's not there (that's harder for me to do), I acknowledge it's there and then accept it. Coach is volunteering 10-15 hrs a week helping a team of players practice, play games and generally develop and have fun. Often coaches spend their own money on top of all that. So at the rate coaches get paid, if they want to bat their kid up a few spots in the lineup, no biggy to me. Granted, it's really painful when you lose games due to it, strand runners etc. but in the end, given what the coach gets paid, you're getting a deal and the problem will go away too when he starts school ball. To be honest though, if I were you I'd want to share/vent with someone as well, because as a coach you always want to strategize to win and it's painful to see coaching decisions that cause you to loose. I'm the same way.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattun
    replied
    Originally posted by dragoncoach View Post

    This is good input. Maybe there is some of this going on.
    He could easily be just worried he'll further depress his kid if he drops him in the lineup. If you like the coach other than the lineup stuff, you might be wary of his kid getting frustrated with baseball and wanting to quit... because there goes your coach too.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattun
    replied
    Maybe it's time to see if the cleanup hitter's dad wants to come along with you to join another team.

    Leave a comment:


  • bbrages
    replied
    Lil dragon has tons of extra base hits (10 out of 13 this year), coach's kid has zero.

    I can put up with dragon's one extra strikeout for his having four more walks than coach's kid... go dragon!

    Leave a comment:


  • dragoncoach
    replied
    Originally posted by jamzg5 View Post

    Exactly my thought. One kid on middle school leads the team in batting average, but couldn't break a plate glass window with the loopers being hit. Same for pitching. If a kid's facing the weaker teams because he throws strikes isn't the long term solution just based off of ERA. I'm a moneyball guy just like anyone else, but there's the naked eye that tells you a lot as well. My advice is don't foster any whining (don't take it personally) because now, later, HS, etc isn't going to matter what your opinion is and how the stats are interpreted. Those end of night confessionals with wife in bed can lead to conversations made in your kid's presence that can make things even worse. Your kid has to earn it outright and be a no brainer to 11 other kid's parents why he is where he is and hitting where he's hitting.
    Appreciate the input - we do our best to not talk about these things in his presence - but we may be able to do a better job at responding to him when he brings it up.

    Though he's not the bloop kind of kid. He's crushing the ball. It's pretty obvious from comments we've heard from players / other parents that my son is clearly passing the naked eye test.

    Edit: I will heed your advise to not foster any whining for him. I've always been tough on him, but I could improve on how I handle conversations when he mentions his frustration about the batting order.
    Last edited by dragoncoach; 05-14-2018, 12:36 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • dragoncoach
    replied
    Originally posted by mattun View Post

    They only have 3 homers and 4 triples. Clearly the BA argument could be small sample size. There could be emotional snowflakes on the field or in the parents too. Moving one of those core kids down in the lineup could make him an emotional wreck and create a downward spiral that will suck the entire team into chaos and eventual disbandment. Or maybe he's just one of those coaches who doesn't like having three easy outs in a row at the bottom of the lineup and is letting the new kid protect against that rather than messing with his breaking up the roles of his regular players seems like the easier tactic.
    This is good input. Maybe there is some of this going on.

    Leave a comment:


  • dragoncoach
    replied
    Originally posted by Viking0 View Post
    Of course, there could be a lot of good reasons to bat a kid later. That is why a kid should simply ask the coach in a respectful manner, just like if you at school and disagreed with a grade, or at the job and disagreed with a promotion. I have had kids ask me why they play in x position or bat in y position. I simply tell them why. If a coach can't handle that, then I think there may be a problem with the coach. Also, as I said, it is not as if the kid is sitting, just batting a little bit later. I would emphasize that to my kid as well. There is a difference between a little and a lot of out of whack. If, in the end, the coach doesn't really have a good reason, have your kid just live with it. None of us will set up a lineup perfectly.
    Well he can't sit because the team only has 9 healthy players (one is hurt). In the couple of games before he got hurt - he did rotate through the bench with 2 other kids. Last fall they only had 9 players on roster.

    Leave a comment:


  • jamzg5
    replied
    Originally posted by coachrjb View Post
    Stats can go both ways. If you look at the stats the "coaches kid" has 8 more ABs than your son, but has one fewer strike out. The "coaches kid" strikes out once every 4 ABs vs your son once ever 2.8 ABs. The "coaches kid" is putting the ball in play 75% of his ABs, your son 64%. I say all of this to say, stop using stats to determine who should be batting where in the lineup. He might have the lowest batting avg but he is putting the ball in play. Why can't he bat 5th?

    I have a kid on my team that is the king of dink and dunk hits. And I have another kid it has been smashing the baseball but it's right at defenders. The dink and dunk kid is batting over .400 but he bats 8th, the other kid that is smashing, but right at people is batting .210 but I still bat him within the top 5
    Exactly my thought. One kid on middle school leads the team in batting average, but couldn't break a plate glass window with the loopers being hit. Same for pitching. If a kid's facing the weaker teams because he throws strikes isn't the long term solution just based off of ERA. I'm a moneyball guy just like anyone else, but there's the naked eye that tells you a lot as well. My advice is don't foster any whining (don't take it personally) because now, later, HS, etc isn't going to matter what your opinion is and how the stats are interpreted. Those end of night confessionals with wife in bed can lead to conversations made in your kid's presence that can make things even worse. Your kid has to earn it outright and be a no brainer to 11 other kid's parents why he is where he is and hitting where he's hitting.

    Leave a comment:


  • dragoncoach
    replied
    Originally posted by coachrjb View Post
    Stats can go both ways. If you look at the stats the "coaches kid" has 8 more ABs than your son, but has one fewer strike out. The "coaches kid" strikes out once every 4 ABs vs your son once ever 2.8 ABs. The "coaches kid" is putting the ball in play 75% of his ABs, your son 64%. I say all of this to say, stop using stats to determine who should be batting where in the lineup. He might have the lowest batting avg but he is putting the ball in play. Why can't he bat 5th?

    I have a kid on my team that is the king of dink and dunk hits. And I have another kid it has been smashing the baseball but it's right at defenders. The dink and dunk kid is batting over .400 but he bats 8th, the other kid that is smashing, but right at people is batting .210 but I still bat him within the top 5
    Stats don't tell the whole story I agree.

    The coaches kid is putting the ball into play, but he's swinging off his front foot - all arms and slapping weak grounders. (note - coach and his son stayed after practice to work on hitting Thurs - my son stayed too. This weekend he looked like he found some of his old groove - he mixed in a couple solid line drives - AND I might have been his loudest cheerleader. The kid was in a slump that the entire team/crowd had noticed - so we were all excited that he came out of it some.)

    When my son puts the ball into play, he's been crushing it. I don't remember any of his XBHs not going over the outfielder's heads. He's turning heads on the team - I'm just still curious what HC sees or doesn't see. (as I re-read this I do remember one not going over their head, he scorched a line drive that the CF couldn't reach and bounced past him to the fence)

    Last fall (this same team) my son was the last on the team to strikeout. He was so focused on not striking out, that he was putting the ball weakly into play way too often. We worked on this. I actually told him I'd like to see him strikeout more - explaining to him that I want him to swing with a purpose. 10 of his 13 hits this spring are XBHs.

    This weekend he added 4 Ks to his total. He was 5 for 11 with 2 doubles, 2 triples and one dinger. He had 0 singles. He also struck out twice late on Sunday after catching 2 games in a row in the 90 degree heat. He's new to catcher - so I kinda threw those 2 Ks out.

    Also, after rereading this, I realize it may not be a big enough sample size. Maybe I let the daddy-bias sneak in a bit - I try really hard to keep that in check.

    Leave a comment:


  • queue
    replied
    I originally said that there shouldn't be an issue with talking with the coach about it, however, I missed the part where the coach's son was being favored which causes me to retract my statement.

    Just accept it or move on.

    Leave a comment:

Ad Widget

Collapse
Working...
X