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Analysis Please - 13 - Drifting

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  • Analysis Please - 13 - Drifting

    upper half and head continue to travel forward after heel plant. but he cant "feel" it.. lots of foul balls and pop ups.

    Last edited by hitwithwood; 04-17-2019, 10:46 AM.

  • #2
    hww...could you post that at normal speed please? Difficult to get a true "feel" or sense of timing or sequencing in such super slo-mo clips.

    Just a word to the wise....I've seen a few guys develop terrible hitting theories (and/or check points) because of what they thought they saw in super slo-mo swing videos that were nothing more than pass-through points in the overall swing.

    For example....one guy years ago tried to start teaching the "lag position" as an actual swing concept or mechanic, when I hope most should know that the lag position is simply and "effect" of the things that happened upstream in the swing, and not an actual specific "cause" that needs to be taught.

    Not saying this is what you're doing "hww", just a pet peeve of mine when folks ask us to look at swings, then post them in a speed that I've never seen a live swing in a game, bp, or anywhere else for that matter.
    In memory of "Catchingcoach" - Dave Weaver: February 28, 1955 - June 17, 2011

    Comment


    • #3
      Not everyone likes this but I like to do some dry turns like the guys at baseball rebellion do. Don't need that rack, just put a bat across the chest. Then put your hand an inch behind the head and have him move the head back during the turn until it touches the hand. You don't actually want the head to move back but it is just an inch and this might give him the right feel. In my experience a cue that creates an active movement is often better than a cue that promotes holding something statically.

      he also could pull back a little longer, his launch is a bit pushy. Basically the hand should still pull back a little as the hip starts so the back hip can get ahead of the back shoulder a little. It should feel a bit like the back hip pulls the rear shoulder down and not so much around first.
      Last edited by dominik; 04-17-2019, 12:42 AM.
      I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

      Comment


      • #4
        Here is a video


        don't slot the elbow at launch. Keep it pulling back as the hips are launched which causes the hip to get ahead of the shoulder and the elbow pulled down without adduction only then the elbow should be lowered as the bad head is turned down.
        I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

        Comment


        • #5
          https://giphy.com/gifs/UU2K3b5bfMFo4KhMlY

          full speed. I'll read comments in a few. thx!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by mudvnine View Post
            hww...could you post that at normal speed please? Difficult to get a true "feel" or sense of timing or sequencing in such super slo-mo clips.

            Just a word to the wise....I've seen a few guys develop terrible hitting theories (and/or check points) because of what they thought they saw in super slo-mo swing videos that were nothing more than pass-through points in the overall swing.

            For example....one guy years ago tried to start teaching the "lag position" as an actual swing concept or mechanic, when I hope most should know that the lag position is simply and "effect" of the things that happened upstream in the swing, and not an actual specific "cause" that needs to be taught.

            Not saying this is what you're doing "hww", just a pet peeve of mine when folks ask us to look at swings, then post them in a speed that I've never seen a live swing in a game, bp, or anywhere else for that matter.

            Full speed

            https://giphy.com/gifs/UU2K3b5bfMFo4KhMlY

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by dominik View Post
              Not everyone likes this but I like to do some dry turns like the guys at baseball rebellion do. Don't need that rack, just put a bat across the chest. Then put your hand an inch behind the head and have him move the head back during the turn until it touches the hand. You don't actually want the head to move back but it is just an inch and this might give him the right feel. In my experience a cue that creates an active movement is often better than a cue that promotes holding something statically.

              he also could pull back a little longer, his launch is a bit pushy. Basically the hand should still pull back a little as the hip starts so the back hip can get ahead of the back shoulder a little. It should feel a bit like the back hip pulls the rear shoulder down and not so much around first.


              Makes sense. For me the "pushy" is a product of the upper body drift/push



              Here is my opinion. I feel like he gets to heel plant early, the ball isnt there yet.. so then he drifts forward to the ball. He does not do this in BP, I'm having an issue trying to get thiis to translate to the game. Way to many "just missed it pitches" way too many foul balls, and way too many pop ups.
              Last edited by hitwithwood; 04-17-2019, 04:40 AM.

              Comment


              • #8



                I'd work on barrel path. Seems to be dropping hands down below ball. Also, need to be short to and long through the ball. And yes, hit behind the ball.
                Last edited by rdbass; 04-17-2019, 05:53 AM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  2019-417-2.gif

                  This is where most of it goes wrong. The front bicep should not be pushing away from the torso here. It seems as if someone has been telling him to push his hands at the ball.

                  EDIT: I just read your comments that he is too early. Maybe the push above is simply a mid-swing adjustment because he is too early. I would video him in a cage, or on a tee and see if he pushes his hands/bicep like the clip above. If he does, then fix what I suggest below.

                  FIX HAND PUSH
                  Honestly I would try the ole Babe Ruth towel 'drill'. Stuff a folded hand towel in his FRONT BICEP and try not to drop it. This is not a drill so much as a test to see if you have stopped doing this. You have to change the idea in your mind to stop pushing.

                  Also, your rear leg is not really striding forward all the way. You are trying to stride forward with the front leg. This could be causing some of the above.

                  Try to keep the back heel down as long as you can hold it, and try to stride another couple inches with the back leg, not the front.

                  Notice that he does seem to coil inward (good), and he keeps his rear forearm flat at toe touch (good). So, be very very careful at how you try to fix this. Don't break the upstream parts.


                  TEST/FIX 'TOO EARLY'
                  Either way, see if he really is starting too soon. Take some video where you can see him and the pitcher. He should generally begin the stride when the pitcher takes the ball out. If he does, then maybe try a one count or a two count.

                  THIS WOULD BE A TIMING ISSUE ONLY AND NOT A TECHNIQUE ISSUE. You can practice this in the cage by breaking your hands and making sure he starts moving (dont throw the ball).
                  Last edited by songtitle; 04-17-2019, 06:57 AM.
                  efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    it is definitely a timing issue. he starts at the right time. I think he just starts the launch too early (move forward) and then adjusts mid swing. look how forward his top half drifts.. which slows down the turn and gets pushy

                    here is the cage snip
                    Last edited by hitwithwood; 04-17-2019, 07:47 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by hitwithwood View Post
                      it is definitely a timing issue. he starts at the right time. I think he just starts the launch too early (move forward) and then adjusts mid swing. look how forward his top half drifts.. which slows down the turn and gets pushy

                      here is the cage snip
                      Maybe it is the shirt? See if your coach can get the other team to be on board with shirts and skins..
                      In all seriousness, the game fix may be as easy as him thinking only oppo for a while...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Doesn't look super early to me. Do you have a clip game or live bp where he is not doing It?

                        also can you use YouTube, much better for analysis than gif due to ability to stop and change speed
                        I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by hitwithwood View Post
                          Thank you "hww", and all-in-all not too bad of a swing for a 13U...a lot of pretty good stuff going on there. However, I do agree with you that he has some "drift" forward if you will...I see it as more of a top half lean forward, but that's just minor semantics if terms for what I think we're both seeing as the same thing (I use "drift" to mean a more total body movement forward, but your son's to me is more of just a upper half move/"lean" forward...just for clarification).

                          I think you captured it pretty well in your comparison still where he seems to shift his weight forward before actually launching the swing, and thus the reason he's out front, and swing at the ball too early.

                          RD is giving you good information wrt getting his barrel path to come more from "behind and through" the ball, which would/should prevent his hands from pushing forward ahead of his rear hip as Song is showing you in his clip, and this can only be accomplished by getting the rear hip out ahead of his hands, and shoulder turn as Dom is demoing in his video. IOWs, I'm not going to muddy up the waters too much with just different ways of saying what's already been presented as good advice by others.

                          I'm more of a fix the underlying causes, and not simply address the "effect" or symptoms seen by the faulty upstream mechanics or timing, and would stay away from restricting his arm and/or hand movements, and focus more on the "stride (or hit the ball) with the rear hip" kinds of advice that teaching him to move out correctly sequentially, and that will lead to him learning to move forward towards the ball, while also "staying back" on it as well in order to get into a good "launch position" (or "position of power" as is also used around these parts)...

                          ....where the hitter's body moves forward, but their upper half stays back.

                          In memory of "Catchingcoach" - Dave Weaver: February 28, 1955 - June 17, 2011

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            great info. thank you.

                            we have talked about going oppo over and over. he actually used to hit that way with lots of power.

                            it doesnt transfer to the game because he says..

                            I just think about the situation. then I just see ball hit ball. but unfortunately he may need to have some discipline to actually do it in the game. because he absolutely rakes in the cages

                            I will see if I can get some other swings on youtube.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              [QUOTE=songtitle;n3521660]2019-417-2.gif

                              This is where most of it goes wrong. The front bicep should not be pushing away from the torso here. It seems as if someone has been telling him to push his hands at the ball.


                              I think the late push has too do with the top half starting to early. landing on a soft front side, then his front knee is starting to lock out.. but he's already basically turned, and the ball isnt in the zone yet, so then his hands push forward.

                              Honestly, I think a alot of this would be better f he just waited a bit longer to launch.. Striding with the back hip instead of the front leg and keeping his top half over his back leg during the turn. Now summarizing that and getting that to translate to the game? Problem is, he isnt hitting at his potential so he is now trying harder at the plate.

                              Comment

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