Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Stealing Signs?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Stealing Signs?

    I am watching MLB Station and they are discussing the Astros stealing and relaying signs.

    I have two scenarios and lets see what you all think.

    !st scenario, you are coaching against a qualify program that has exceptional pitching and the coaches call every pitch. As soon as you observe the coaching staff calling pitches, you notice a pattern and have their system broken within the first batter or two. Is it cheating if you relay to your hitter what pitch is coming?

    2nd scenario, you can see the catcher's signs while playing the same program. Do you relay to the hitter the pitch coming? Is this cheating?
    Granny said Sonny stick to your guns if you believe in something no matter what. Because it's better to be hated for who you are than to be loved for who you're not.

    I am an ex expert. I've done this long enough to know that those who think that they know it all, know nothing.

  • #2
    What you’re describing is the organic stealing of signals. It’s on the other team to protect their signals. When technology is involved to steal signals that’s cheating.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by JettSixty View Post
      What you’re describing is the organic stealing of signals. It’s on the other team to protect their signals. When technology is involved to steal signals that’s cheating.
      I understand that but want opinions about this type of sign stealing.
      Granny said Sonny stick to your guns if you believe in something no matter what. Because it's better to be hated for who you are than to be loved for who you're not.

      I am an ex expert. I've done this long enough to know that those who think that they know it all, know nothing.

      Comment


      • #4
        Scenario 1 - We did that all the time. I've told the story when we played a top team in our league (their coach just happened to be a friend who in the offseason we both coached at the same academy), and in the first game of the series my kids (bench players were assigned to decode other team's signal - both offensive and defensive) had their pitch signals by the end of the 1st inning. By the 3rd inning opposing coach caught on that we had them, and then tried to change them on the run...which caused more confusion with his own F2 than it did with my five kids on the bench.

        We talked/joked about it after the game, and he said, "just wait until next time"...with a big smile on his face (might have been different if we weren't friends). Next game they show up and he a F2 have football play wrist bands on that he's calling numbers into his catcher. Took a little longer, but my bench kids had them by the end of the 3rd (we were now at home), and they came to me between innings with their completed paper, and I questioned if they were sure about it. They said "yes", so the next inning I had their notes, and sure as heck they had them again. LOL!!

        So now I was in kind of a dilemma...I didn't really want to "steal" them again, but then I didn't want to disappoint my kids by not putting their hard work (and contribution to the team) to use. So I justified it to myself that I was taking advantage of the other team's kids, but rather their coach who wasn't doing a good enough job if a group of freshman can kids could learn his signs. To take myself out of it (sort of), I then let the bench kids who put in the work to learn 'em, figure out with the hitters how they'd communicate the signs to them. They all worked it out quickly, and it worked out great...the opposing coach thought we might have been signaling them, but since it wasn't coming from myself or my AC, I don't think he knew for sure.

        After the game he chuckled that he had outsmarted us. I wish you all could have seen the look on his face when I handed him the note paper the kids had handed me, told him they gave it to me at the end of the third...and he knew the kids got him.

        Scenario 2 - No, and have even quietly told F2s who were doing it that they were showing them to us as I walked to the 3rd base coaching box between innings (or had my AC do it when heading to the 1st base box if we were in the home dugout). Since we were coaching Freshman and JV teams on alternating years, I thought we were still more on the coaching/instruction level, rather than exploiting an underclassman who may not have even been coached about it (especially if his HC can't see him or isn't even aware he's doing it).

        Scenario 1 - take them from the adult coach, "yes".....Scenario 2 - take them from the poorly coached player, "no".
        In memory of "Catchingcoach" - Dave Weaver: February 28, 1955 - June 17, 2011

        Comment


        • #5
          Mud, you and I are a lot alike. Sorry! I agree and somehow I just had a knack for breaking signs being sent in by coaches. For example, in the state championship game one year, I broke that coach in one batter. He then went to an alternative system that was really the assistant coach using the same signals. LOL It never bothered me doing this. In fact, I kept a book on coaches in our area and it was pretty in depth.

          I also made it a habit to tell opposing catchers when they were showing me the signs and especially if they were conference catchers. I loved the look of them sometimes when I would say something. I apologize for repeating a story but we played an area team where they knew that we had their signs. I had actually had their signs for years and they never made changes. So, they were going to teach me a lesson thinking that we were stealing the signs from the catcher. The first base coach would actually step on the field to try to steal the signs as my catcher signaled. I had gone to the trouble of asking my first base coach to step back in the coaching box toward the fence so that that coaching staff could clearly see that he was not stealing signs. So,I got a little hot and yelled for that coach to go ahead and do that all game BUT we coach and so I gave my catcher a signal. We had finger signs, glove signs, I called pitches from the sideline to the catcher and pitcher, ... in a progression that we actually practiced. He gave up almost immediately. They never figured out that I got the signs from the coaching staff. This program was so poorly coached that we never really had to do much with stealing signs. We seemed to pound them regularly and they were a school of over 2,000 students.
          Granny said Sonny stick to your guns if you believe in something no matter what. Because it's better to be hated for who you are than to be loved for who you're not.

          I am an ex expert. I've done this long enough to know that those who think that they know it all, know nothing.

          Comment


          • #6
            I think stealing signs is part of the game as long as it is team members in the areas where they are supposed to be. People outside the fence, be it over the outfield fence, or parents behind home plate or someone with a TV feed is off limits in my view.

            I, like mud, have the kids on the bench work on stealing signs all the time. They take pride in it, and they take pride in relaying them to batters and defense in ways that the other team does not know that they have picked them up. This keeps the bench players who are keeping charts and stealing signs engaged in the game and between that and bullpen/tee work keeps them ready to enter when they are needed.

            Comment


            • #7
              I'm on the same page as mud. in youth (up to 12 or 13u or so), if I see a catcher who isn't protecting his signs, I used to talk to the coaches about it.

              Comment


              • #8
                bman52
                What % of your batters don't want to know what's coming?
                Skip

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by skipper5 View Post
                  bman52
                  What % of your batters don't want to know what's coming?
                  Just about all of them don't want to know. That's dumb but it's the way it is. Then, the same guys get on second and start trying to relay signals to the batter.
                  Teenagers are dumb.
                  Major Figure

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Skipper, almost all want to know. Especially if the opposing pitcher has good breaking stuff. I have 2 that don’t want to know if they have 2 strikes on them. There are some others that are battlers that really want to know when they have two strikes on them. i let them tell each other what they want.

                    Comment

                    Ad Widget

                    Collapse
                    Working...
                    X