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Need Help - Fixing Stiff Front Arm Swing

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  • Need Help - Fixing Stiff Front Arm Swing

    I don't know how I could have missed this. It seems my son has been swinging for the past year with a fully extended stiff front arm. It's even in these videos I posted some time ago:

    3 Swings - Normal Playback Speed

    3 Overhead Swings in Slo-Mo

    Notice how he's pushing the bat into the ball at contact (both arms extending into the ball [linear hitting anyone?!]). Worked with him hard yesterday to fix it but on live pitch practice nothing changed. And at batting practice he could not pull a single ball even though he's hitting it well in front of him. This looks like it's going to be a difficult muscle memory fix.

    What do you guys suggest I do? I was thinking a lot of front one-arm drills to get him to flex it again. Also what to do about the pushing the bat into the ball? Thanks again all!

  • #2
    IMO and if I was in the cage with him I would first try a different bat. He seems to have some guy eye/hand coordination, but in several clips it appears as if the bat actually stops if forward movement at contact indicating that the bat may be way too light for him. If this is the case fixing other items may be premature. Make sense?
    "He who dares to teach, must never cease to learn."
    - John Cotton Dana (1856–1929) - Offered to many by L. Olson - Iowa (Teacher)
    Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by NewbieBBDad View Post
      Notice how he's pushing the bat into the ball at contact (both arms extending into the ball [linear hitting anyone?!]). Worked with him hard yesterday to fix it but on live pitch practice nothing changed. And at batting practice he could not pull a single ball even though he's hitting it well in front of him. This looks like it's going to be a difficult muscle memory fix.

      What do you guys suggest I do? I was thinking a lot of front one-arm drills to get him to flex it again. Also what to do about the pushing the bat into the ball? Thanks again all!
      I don't see a stiff front arm but I do see lots of disconnection. He hits the ball way out in front. He needs to wait for the ball to come to him rather than going to get it.

      I also see what Jake sees in terms of the bat stopping at the POC.
      Hitting Coordinator for Harris-Stowe State University in St. Louis.

      I also work with the pitchers who are dealing with injury problems.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Chris O'Leary View Post
        I don't see a stiff front arm but I do see lots of disconnection. .
        Yes, this causes the bat speed problem that causes the bat stopping.


        Originally posted by Chris O'Leary View Post
        He hits the ball way out in front. He needs to wait for the ball to come to him rather than going to get it..
        He can't...without fundamentally altering his swing. Using the arms to accelerate the bat he intuitively knows he needs time to accelerate the bat. Hitting the ball out in front gives him this time. In his world, with his understanding of how to accelerate the bat, letting the ball come deep is irrational. You might as well tell him ice cream tastes bad. He's going to think you are crazy on both counts...till you teach him a whole 'nuther way to swing the bat. Time for dad to send himself to school. I suggest starting with reading everything on the public side at Englishbey's site. If the money's not a problem, spring for the basic dvd. A whole new world will start opening up to you.

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        • #5
          What is the bat size? It looks like its to heavy for him. Or somehow he can slow his swing down and still go through it in slo-mo.

          What does his tee work look like?


          drill


          PS lol jake says bat may be lite, note i say the bat is to heavy,,,, Go with jake>>>> grin
          Last edited by Drill; 02-28-2008, 12:40 PM.
          Yogi Berra was asked by a reporter "How do you catch a knuckle ball?" He came right back and said "When it stops rolling"

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Drill View Post
            jake says bat may be lite, note i say the bat is to heavy,,,, Go with jake>>>> grin
            In looking at the bat hit the ball you see several things going on. Typically with young -good- hitters parents tend to undersize the bats from a weight standpoint in an effort to create bat speed. The problem with this is the force of the ball nears the opposing force of the bat and the impact hesitation we see may be an indication of a very light bat, a weak swing or both.
            Jake
            "He who dares to teach, must never cease to learn."
            - John Cotton Dana (1856–1929) - Offered to many by L. Olson - Iowa (Teacher)
            Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting.

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            • #7
              The bat is heavy, it's a 30 inch -7. The reason for the recoil is I set the batting cage at 70 mph. (When I originally took the video the purpose was to see how many frames his swing is in a fastball situation, hence the 70 mph speed setting, I don't expect him to face 70 mph pitching at age 10. P.S. He has 5-6 frame swing, could probably be a frame less if he didn't stiff arm/push the bat.)

              So please ignore the recoil effect. You have look closely to notice the stiff arming but that's why his rear arm looks so odd in coming around.

              Mark is right that this will take a major workaround. Any thoughts on one-arm drilling to get his front arm to coil?

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              • #8
                How about the first major work over is dad's hitting education? Are you on Englishbey's site?

                Comment


                • #9
                  NewbieBBDad,

                  While you're at it, I recommend checking out HittingIllustrated.com, Batspeed.com, dryeagersbaseball.com and mikeepsteinhitting.com. If you're going to self-educate, and I highly recommend it, it pays to get multiple viewpoints. Picking Ted William's book, "The Science of Hitting" is a must do, as well.

                  Just make sure your world reflects what is happening in clips of MLB hitters - even this takes time to begin seeing what is going on. Opinions on this are highly variable, but if you keep an open mind on learning and are one to make up your own mind about things, you'll make big advances in not only your own knowledge but in the hitting progress of your son.

                  This is a fun and rewarding time for you and your son.

                  Mike

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by NewbieBBDad View Post
                    The bat is heavy, it's a 30 inch -7. The reason for the recoil is I set the batting cage at 70 mph. (When I originally took the video the purpose was to see how many frames his swing is in a fastball situation, hence the 70 mph speed setting, I don't expect him to face 70 mph pitching at age 10. P.S. He has 5-6 frame swing, could probably be a frame less if he didn't stiff arm/push the bat.)

                    So please ignore the recoil effect. You have look closely to notice the stiff arming but that's why his rear arm looks so odd in coming around.

                    Mark is right that this will take a major workaround. Any thoughts on one-arm drilling to get his front arm to coil?
                    I think we see it from very different perspectives. The force of the ball hitting the bat is actually setting him back on his rear foot. I would have a hard time correcting anything else before this was addressed.
                    "He who dares to teach, must never cease to learn."
                    - John Cotton Dana (1856–1929) - Offered to many by L. Olson - Iowa (Teacher)
                    Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Classic textbook Epstein swing..............

                      Originally posted by Jake Patterson View Post
                      I think we see it from very different perspectives. The force of the ball hitting the bat is actually setting him back on his rear foot. I would have a hard time correcting anything else before this was addressed.

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                      • #12
                        He is up on his toe at contact, so I wouldn't worry about what is happening just after contact.

                        Swings 1 and 3 (especially 3) show much less recoil because the ball is much deeper at contact and the rear shoulder is still powering the swing.

                        In swing 2 the disconnection is so severe and his arms don't have the strength to overcome the collision.

                        Get him to stay connected or start juicing his arms with some "roids"....

                        This is a classic "hips and hands" swing. He rotates his hips and "goes out to the ball" with his hands.....

                        When I get kids who disconnect this severely I work on the thought of hitting the ball with the rear shoulder rather then the hands..........

                        "Hips and Shoulders"...........The hands will do what they must do based on rotational momentum and location........






                        Originally posted by BoardMember View Post
                        Classic textbook Epstein swing..............

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                        • #13
                          can you provide a clip by clip?
                          "He who dares to teach, must never cease to learn."
                          - John Cotton Dana (1856–1929) - Offered to many by L. Olson - Iowa (Teacher)
                          Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            If you mean me Jake, I can't convert YouTube to a video file.

                            Here he is at contact:



                            Originally posted by Jake Patterson View Post
                            can you provide a clip by clip?
                            Last edited by Jake Patterson; 02-29-2008, 08:38 AM.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by BoardMember View Post
                              Classic textbook Epstein swing..............
                              I love how you bring the gasoline and matches with you to a little get together. This should be good for at least 6 pages.


                              love always,

                              drill
                              Yogi Berra was asked by a reporter "How do you catch a knuckle ball?" He came right back and said "When it stops rolling"

                              Comment

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