Draft fixing?

[siritchy]

I am curious if draft fixing is common practice in all youth rec league ball parks. I learned that teams are not actually formed by the practice sessions and draft selections based on evaluation of skill.

Instead it happens in the back rooms where coaches have players either throw the evaluation/no show or collude to rank players down a lineup of draft selections in their favor. Then freeze kids based on assistant coaches that aren't actually at the games. Rate kids that are known to be frozen as high as possible. I guess it is naive to think that it is fair, but I didn't realize that rec ball is that cut throat. Random number selection would be more fair IMO. The coaches that have a poor draft selection are the odd men out that don't understand the good ol' boy system.

I am considering changing parks next year, but I didn't know if that would make any difference or just be a change of atmosphere.

[Jake Patterson]

I am curious if draft fixing is common practice in all youth rec league ball parks. I learned that teams are not actually formed by the practice sessions and draft selections based on evaluation of skill.

Instead it happens in the back rooms where coaches have players either throw the evaluation/no show or collude to rank players down a lineup of draft selections in their favor. Then freeze kids based on assistant coaches that aren't actually at the games. Rate kids that are known to be frozen as high as possible. I guess it is naive to think that it is fair, but I didn't realize that rec ball is that cut throat. Random number selection would be more fair IMO. The coaches that have a poor draft selection are the odd men out that don't understand the good ol' boy system.

I am considering changing parks next year, but I didn't know if that would make any difference or just be a change of atmosphere.

We have an open draft.

[TL_Dad]

We had our draft a couple weeks ago. We can only protect our own kids till the 5th round. If you don't pick your son in the 5th round he is unprotected and anyone can pick them. If you want an assistant coach you have to draft his son or trade for them. All trades must be done the night of the draft after all players have been chosen. We also do a snake draft (1-2-3-4-4-3-2-1).

[Macker]

Years ago, my league had coaches doing all kinds of tricks. There was a rule that a coach has his own son as well as the sons of any assistants. Next thing you know, some coaches would have a staff of six of seven coaches. Some of the fathers didn't even coach; they just had the better kids.

So we made a rule limiting each coach to 2 assistants. Then people conspired by having their kids miss the evaluation day and become late signups. New coaches wouldn't know the late signup was a first or second round caliber player, so a coach in on it would graciously accept the late addtion. Finally, we had to say no late signups were allowed, which is good and bad due to some legitimate late kids.

It always amused me how a team would load up, win the championship, and the coach would think he was Joe Coach. They never seemed to realize that by having the three best pitchers on his team, he was actually hurting the development of his own son, who never faced them.

A few years ago, we went to a setup where the coaches sit down and round out the teams. Not sure if this is called blind draft or what, but coaches have no incentive to load up one team. After the teams are formed, the coaches draw numbers to see which team is theirs. Then a few trades have to take place to get the coaches' sons on the team of their father.

[LAball]

Our Pony league has the Manager's and 1 coach's son that is protected. The rest in an open draft from try outs. Those that missed try outs are put in random selection. Managers can trade players that did their tryouts. But is you missed tryouts, you cannot switch games

[APPpitch]

A few years ago, we went to a setup where the coaches sit down and round out the teams. Not sure if this is called blind draft or what, but coaches have no incentive to load up one team. After the teams are formed, the coaches draw numbers to see which team is theirs. Then a few trades have to take place to get the coaches' sons on the team of their father.

A large town nearby does this. This is a wonderful idea. Make the best teams possible and then a coach picks his team out of a hat!

Our little town is a good 'ol boy network with lots of back room shananigans. Which is why I got my son out of there after 12's. Best thing we ever did.

-scott

[TG Coach]

We have an open draft.

It doesn't stop kids from tanking the tryout.

[bbjunkie]

They've been stacking teams in our LL since I've been around and a long time before. This year a mgr from one of last years teams (the one that historically does the most stacking) drafted his son knowing that he would not be able to manage this year. Immediately after the draft he resigned. The shenanigans never stop.

[siritchy]

A few years ago, we went to a setup where the coaches sit down and round out the teams. Not sure if this is called blind draft or what, but coaches have no incentive to load up one team. After the teams are formed, the coaches draw numbers to see which team is theirs. Then a few trades have to take place to get the coaches' sons on the team of their father.

That is a good idea. I was thinking it would be nice if all they got were numbers that they generated on average with no names as a surprise. That way even if the numbers were fudged they couldn't know who they were getting. I think they should just disallow assistant coaches from freezing kids.

[bluezebra]

Welcome to youth sports. In our local Little League some years ago, the manager of a Minor B team had a catcher on his Farm team who was a very good player. At the tryoutsd for the Minors, he took the boy aside, and told him to do poorly, so this manager could pick him up further down the line. Fortunately, the youngster had more integrity than this so-called 'adult', and told his Dad. The Dad had to be restrained from punching-out this putz for trying to get his son to cheat. This manager threw tirades on the field, both at his players when they lost a game, and at umpires, and even accused the Player agent of cheating during one of his tirades on the fireld during a game.
His punishment was to allowing him to continue managing (with no verball or written reprimand), and to be elected to the BOD for many seasons.

So much for teaching players good sportsmanship and honesty.

Bob

[epic]

In our small town, such happenings were common when our boys were growing up. Our first year here my husband was asked to coach the team of our youngest, then 7. He knew nothing about any of the other kids, and didn't care about the ability of the little boys-he cared about attitude. His team of kids who weren't good enough for the stud teams wound up finishing second in the league that year. In following years, parents clamored to have their kids on his team.

His philosophy was to work with, and have all the boys help, the least capable kid and the rest of it took care of itself.

[bluefan89]

A few years ago, we went to a setup where the coaches sit down and round out the teams. Not sure if this is called blind draft or what, but coaches have no incentive to load up one team. After the teams are formed, the coaches draw numbers to see which team is theirs. Then a few trades have to take place to get the coaches' sons on the team of their father.

Man...I love the sound of this draft...I am sure there might be some discussion or disputes about who the coaches kid is traded for??

But it would blow the minds of our little red neck townfolk.

The local ball board mafia directors...do a blind draft for the tee-ball, this year they didn't have a limit on the number of automatics on their teams..so some coaches came in with 2 kids (his and assistants) then some came in with 4-5..had the stories that "little johnny has to ride with little mary" scenario...
I think that is bull. Nest year I think they are going to allow only a coach and assistant (so 2 kids on the team...then blind draft)

The coach pitch division has the head coach and assistants kid. But we had one that had to have a cousin (which is good) along with his son....no good. All the names of each age kids are written on board (7-11) then you draw a number out of a bag to see the draft order....seems like the teams are sort of balanced at this point.

Little league goes thru a tryout type draft, but then you have those brothers that might have to go together or lost lost cousin that has to be on your team.

Girls Soft ball is coming up the girls try out then the pick starts in the order how you finished last season (worst picks first...unless a new team starts up then they get the 1st pick. They try to make it fair but some screw with it a little.



What gets me in our drafts is when a kid that is not in the household has to be on the same team as another kid...so they can ride together or if it is cousins or relatives. I think unless they live in the same household they shouldn't team up.

Sorry for the long post

[Olliemets]

Rec Leagues

- As I "age" out of all of this stuff after over a decade of involvement with Youth Basketball, Little League and Travel Baseball I've come to the following conclusion: Men simply can not be trusted to fairly assemble teams in rec Leagues that their sons play in. We just can't help ourselves.

I've found that its better if adults without kids run it, or ...... the women. My wife was the president of the LL for 6 years. She threw out all of the "assistant coaches" and allowed only the head coaches to come to draft night. Had the Player Agent actually have the final say on all picks. Every team got a catcher, and 2 got much more competative, and the kids benefited.

Baseball the worst with the over the top Dads, although Youth Basketball is catching up.

[TonyK]

Our LL grew sick of complaints from the weakest teams year after year and developed it's own type of draft. Say there are 8 teams in LL Majors. The top 16 pitchers among ages 11 and 12 are selected with the first two picks in the draft for everybody. The goal is every team should have two decent pitchers.

Round 3 has the best 8 catchers among ages 11 and 12. Every team drafts one good catcher. Rounds 4 through 10 include the remaining 11 and 12 year olds. The last two rounds are for the 16 best 10-year olds that will be moving up. Every team gets two 10's.

So on paper each team has two decent pitchers, one decent catcher, three or four above average players and three or four below-average players, plus two young 10-year olds. Our draft worked because most team's records were within a few games of each other and the worst team could beat the best team on any given day. The intensity level decreased until it was playoff time.