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  • Playing 4 games one or two Sundays a year results in a need for surgery? Clarify. Is that in approximately 10% 25% 50% or 75% of kids?

    Sometimes this site makes me feel like I'm the only guy who's got a kid who actually wants to play this game.
    There are two kinds of losers.....Those that don't do what they are told, and those that do only what they are told.

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    • Originally posted by shake-n-bake View Post
      Playing 4 games one or two Sundays a year results in a need for surgery? Clarify. Is that in approximately 10% 25% 50% or 75% of kids?

      Sometimes this site makes me feel like I'm the only guy who's got a kid who actually wants to play this game.
      My sons wanted to play. I feel the difference may be in parents (subconsciously) "forcing" their children to play by committing to travel schedules that are laborious and injurious.
      "He who dares to teach, must never cease to learn."
      - John Cotton Dana (1856–1929) - Offered to many by L. Olson - Iowa (Teacher)
      Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by shake-n-bake View Post
        Playing 4 games one or two Sundays a year results in a need for surgery? Clarify. Is that in approximately 10% 25% 50% or 75% of kids?

        Sometimes this site makes me feel like I'm the only guy who's got a kid who actually wants to play this game.
        If a team is good they will be playing three or four games every tournament into the semifinals or finals. The effects are cummulative over the years.

        The percentage of preteen baseball players who need surgery as a result of playing too much should be ZERO. It shouldn't happen. I know four from our immediate area. I know of at least ten total from the wider area of our tournaments.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Jake Patterson View Post
          My sons wanted to play. I feel the difference may be in parents (subconsciously) "forcing" their children to play by committing to travel schedules that are laborious and injurious.
          The parents are ignoring the stress on growth plates. When kids play by themselves they know when to shut it down for the day. With parents involved they buck up and fight on.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by TG Coach View Post
            The parents are ignoring the stress on growth plates. When kids play by themselves they know when to shut it down for the day. With parents involved they buck up and fight on.
            I guess your kids are just different than mine. What the parents think is a very low priority to my son and his buddies. There's winning, followed by their personal performance and how it makes them feel, how their performance positions them amongst their friends and teammates, then finally what dad thinks. This coming from a kid who has an "overinvested" dad.

            Playing (not pitching) 4 games a day stresses growth plates? Please direct me to the research on that. I'd be interested in seeing it.

            It's pure bs that kids monitor their own and each others' feelings. They quit when either everyone comes to a mutual conclusion or the kids with the most influence (usually the oldest that will threaten to kick some butt if someone wants to bail) say it's time. It's 1000X more likely that adult influence will result in an unwanted suspension of play or their freinds will red ass them about wanting to shut it down than a parent exerts pressure on the kid to play on with an injury that should require them to sit.

            Has it ever happened? Sure. But the sky isn't falling. Once again, show me the research that backs up kid's play too much (not "pitch" - "play") and the injury correlation. If you're simply saying that they (the kids) shouldn't because they don't want to, that they're only doing so because adults schedule that many games, I've never seen that.
            There are two kinds of losers.....Those that don't do what they are told, and those that do only what they are told.

            Comment


            • Now you're making insinuations against my kids who are now college and high school athletes. I don't think they got where they are by being passive. I'm not going to continue to spare with a know-it-all of a pre teen kid. I've never suceeded in dealing with your type on a board.

              I've tried to educate people like you in the past. You'll have to learn for yourself. Hopefully your son won't share the results of some of the parents I failed to educate.

              One of my friend's daughter lost her major college D1 lacrosse ride due to a serious knee injury her senior year of high school. The dad came to me and told me I was right. I had told him to watch out for the cummulative effects of playing organized sports too often. The doctor told him it's why his daughter's knee blew up.

              Where did I get my information? 1) From a leading orthopedic surgeon in our region who rather than retiring decided to specialize in sports medicine. 2) From ASMI, a sports medicine organization founded by Dr. James Andrews. Have you heard of him?

              Comment


              • [QUOTE=TG Coach;1383729]Now you're making insinuations against my kids who are now college and high school athletes. I don't think they got where they are by being passive. I'm not going to continue to spare with a know-it-all of a pre teen kid. I've never suceeded in dealing with your type on a board.

                TG, Please. Why do you turn into such a crybaby every time someone dissagrees with you. You actually have a valid point, but my guess is that your preaching style doesn't suit everyone. You actually make some very good points (you belabor them) but you do make them. Then when the poor guy says that your kids must be different from his and explains why he said it, you take it personally and make the assinine comment above. RELAX. Did he use the word passive? Did he question their ability? NO. He said his kids seem to be different. Give him a break.

                At least you did get to mention they are college and high school athletes again ( for about the 2 millionth time).

                Comment


                • [QUOTE=ShawmLee;1383771]
                  Originally posted by TG Coach View Post
                  Now you're making insinuations against my kids who are now college and high school athletes. I don't think they got where they are by being passive. I'm not going to continue to spare with a know-it-all of a pre teen kid. I've never suceeded in dealing with your type on a board.

                  TG, Please. Why do you turn into such a crybaby every time someone dissagrees with you. You actually have a valid point, but my guess is that your preaching style doesn't suit everyone. You actually make some very good points (you belabor them) but you do make them. Then when the poor guy says that your kids must be different from his and explains why he said it, you take it personally and make the assinine comment above. RELAX. Did he use the word passive? Did he question their ability? NO. He said his kids seem to be different. Give him a break.

                  At least you did get to mention they are college and high school athletes again ( for about the 2 millionth time).
                  You're taking one post out of context. For the past few days the other poster has refused to accept anything I've told him based on experience and keeps coming back with a combative response. When he runs out of ammunition and starts comparing the veracity of an eleven year old versus a collegiate and high school athlete, it's time for me to bow out of the conversation. I've been in these kinds of conversations before. They go nowhere. I hope for nothing but the best for his son.
                  Last edited by TG Coach; 12-23-2008, 01:12 PM.

                  Comment


                  • QUOTE=TG Coach;1383793]
                    Originally posted by ShawmLee View Post

                    You're taking one post out of context. For the past few days the other poster has refused to accept anything I've told him based on experience and keeps coming back with a combative response. When he runs out of ammunition and starts comparing the veracity of an eleven year old versus a collegiate and high school athlete, it's time for me to bow out of the conversation. I've been in these kinds of conversations before. They go nowhere. I hope for nothing but the best for his son.
                    Your experiences are valuable contributions, but not accepting anectdotal experience as gospel is hardly combative. I could name drop, if that'd gain my experiences more validity. However, the perspective of a kid currently immersed in what we're discussing and a parent oft misconstrued as "overinvested" seems relevant.

                    I had no intention of insulting you, your kids, or even pulling a hit and run on this discussion, and I apoligize if it came off that way. Better put, my son and his friends' attitudes toward the game and parental pressure issues are extremely far removed from what you're describing. Once again, I know that you've seen it. I know it exists. I don't see it in epidemic proportions. I'd have probably been more accurate to say that your kids' perspective is/was a lot like my sons or not made the comparison at all.

                    One of two things is correct here. Either I am right and I'm not stereotyping the attitudes I know to be true among my son and his friends, or I really am the naive hayseed you think I am. Leave it at that and I'll follow your lead and bow out as well before this thing really goes south.
                    There are two kinds of losers.....Those that don't do what they are told, and those that do only what they are told.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by TG Coach View Post
                      Now you're making insinuations against my kids who are now college and high school athletes. I don't think they got where they are by being passive. I'm not going to continue to spare with a know-it-all of a pre teen kid. I've never suceeded in dealing with your type on a board.

                      I've tried to educate people like you in the past. You'll have to learn for yourself. Hopefully your son won't share the results of some of the parents I failed to educate.

                      One of my friend's daughter lost her major college D1 lacrosse ride due to a serious knee injury her senior year of high school. The dad came to me and told me I was right. I had told him to watch out for the cummulative effects of playing organized sports too often. The doctor told him it's why his daughter's knee blew up.

                      Where did I get my information? 1) From a leading orthopedic surgeon in our region who rather than retiring decided to specialize in sports medicine. 2) From ASMI, a sports medicine organization founded by Dr. James Andrews. Have you heard of him?
                      TG,

                      I'm not sure what was "out of context" I've read the posts. He doesn't swear undying obedience to you and all your ideas but he's not exactly a philistine (as far as I can tell). Show me where he made any insinuation regarding your kids. I know, one is playing college ball and one is playing HS ball!!!!! You should be proud. But please show me where he said anything negative about them. You can't, cause he didn't.

                      You really do have a lot to share but so much gets lost in the delivery. You can't save everyone from themselves. No matter how hard you try.

                      Peace.
                      Last edited by ShawmLee; 12-23-2008, 09:47 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Little League is recreational and gives the kids a chance to play against their peers. Its good for the community, and good to keep your kids playing if possible. I am a board member and we are losing our best 9, 12 year olds to pony/aau. This sucks but I understand the need for more competitive ball if daddy thinks its the best thing. Those same kids never dominate anybody in April but I understand they don't want the politics and problems that come with LL. Its easy to form your own team and roll. LL will suffer until they do something about the program. Sign of the times....

                        Comment


                        • Update:1/30/09

                          We've had about two weeks of practice in my boy's first year of school ball.

                          There is some pretty bad news to start out with. We are told that they will not have a 7th and 8th grade team... there is only going to be one team this year (not two separate teams). We had counted on the school having two teams.

                          There are 24 players on the team. I guess you can see the problem right away. 24 players for one team is crazy when there are only 9 positions. Basically it amounts to the 7th graders may not get to play at all (so I am told). I think there are 14 8th grade players on the team so it's going to be very hard for the 7th graders to get a chance.

                          Another problem my boy has (like I've said many times on this thread) is his size. He is the smallest of the 24 players. He's actually grown some since I posted last but he's still a good 3 inches shorter than most of the other kids.

                          Anyway, he has tried out for catcher, pitcher and SS (his normal positions). I'm told the catcher on the team (an 8th grader) is very very good. I have no idea how the pitching is. I hear the SS is pretty good as well.

                          So we will see how things go. It's really going to be an adjustment for my boy. He's never set on the bench before so I hope he can handle the downside and continues to work hard.

                          Sparks

                          Comment


                          • Hi Sparks!

                            Thanks for the update. Agreed -- 24 kids on a team is waaay too many. I don't know how things are in your area, but with that many kids, some of the 8th graders may drift off to other leagues or other activities if they're not playing much. (The 7th graders are sort of stuck, because they don't want to hurt their chances for next year by blowing off the team this year.) Has the coach given any indication of his belief in trying to develop the 7th graders for next year?

                            Any chance of the coach trying to set up "B" squad games or scrimmages against other schools that do have 7th grade teams or a smaller student body (e.g., private schools) and thus weaker teams?

                            Anyway, being the #2 catcher is a lot better than being the #2 third baseman -- coaches will want to rest catchers more. And, if the kid's good, your boy stands to learn a bit. I wouldn't get too caught up on the three inches of height -- with your boy's hitting power, he'll make 'em forget that pretty quick.

                            Did football season get any better?
                            sigpicIt's not whether you fall -- everyone does -- but how you come out of the fall that counts.

                            Comment


                            • Ursa

                              Football was terrible. My boy played two plays the first game...missed a tackle and didn't play again until the last series of the last game. Our team was getting beat worse than any team I have ever seen get beat....half time it was 48 to nothing. My boy still didn't play the first half. About midway through the 4rh quarter they finally let my boy play again and he made a great tackle that saved another touchdown.
                              So he played in about 4 plays the entire football season.

                              As far as the "B" team in baseball or anything else....well we just don't know. They've only had 2 full practices so far because a few of the 8th graders were playing basketball and school rules said they can't play two sports at the same time.

                              We just don't know what is going to happen at this point. I don't think he will make second string catcher either. One thing is his size and the two boys ahead of him are about 4 inches taller and I hear they are pretty good. I don't know one boy but the other boy was my boy's catcher on the All star team. He doesn't have quite the arm my boy has but he is fearless behind the plate. Great kid, works hard and I think he's a fine catcher.

                              They were having the first day of infield yesterday and they put my boy at SS. The coach told him that he was doing great and if he kept doing good the starting SS position was his. I'm pretty sure he meant for the 7th graders though. The SS for the 8th graders is pretty good and has 40 pounds and a good 5 inches on my boy. Never the less they both did SS at the same time and I thought my boy did just as good as the other boy...I wouldn't say better but he held his own. He made all the throws and didn't make any errors. Remember, they are going to 90ft bases this year so the throws are much further than my boy is used to. Still, as far as I could tell he made every throw and didn't make a bad throw the entire practice. I think one ball got buy him but the other boy had three or four get buy him. You never know how a ball bounced though....

                              For the first time my boy has a fight on his hands to get playing time (in baseball). I'm anxious to see if he has the character to fight for it. That might be the most important lesson he can learn.

                              Sparks

                              Comment


                              • Sparks, sounds as though you’re gonna have a roller coaster ride during the school’s baseball season. But to tell the truth, I wouldn’t despair a great deal. After all, there are one heck of a lot of schools that don’t have any middle school baseball, let alone 2 teams, and their players still seem to do just fine. How many teams does the HS have?

                                If all fails though, just remember that he’s got at least 2 full seasons before HS ball, and a heck of a lot can happen in those 2 years.
                                The pitcher who’s afraid to throw strikes, will soon be standing in the shower with the hitter who's afraid to swing.

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