Base running question

[tiwebber]

Hi forum! My first post. I help coach a Mosquito (u 10 little league team) The situation is

1) two out
2) runner on second and third
3) batter hits a slow roller between home plate, third base and pitchers mound.

I am third base coach. Given the slow roller and my base runner, I tell the runner on third to go home immediately. He runs, then hesitates 2/3 the way to home then runs again and it thrown out at home plate. The boy on third base is the head coaches son and the head coach is upset at the boy for running. I tell the head coach that I instructed him to run and if it was a bad choice, then it was my bad choice. She (head coach) tells me he (her son) should know better -> probably this is why he hesitated because this boy knows that his mom (head coach) would not run in this situation.

Couple of questions. First, given that there is two out and we dont have a strong hitter coming up and children at this level are not too fast nor accurate with their throws, is running home a "bad idea"? If they didn't throw home they could have thrown the runner out on first base!!! Second, even if it is a bad idea, shouldn't the players listen to the third base coach?

Thanks all!

[Standballdad]

Hi forum! My first post. I help coach a Mosquito (u 10 little league team) The situation is

1) two out
2) runner on second and third
3) batter hits a slow roller between home plate, third base and pitchers mound.

I am third base coach. Given the slow roller and my base runner, I tell the runner on third to go home immediately. He runs, then hesitates 2/3 the way to home then runs again and it thrown out at home plate. The boy on third base is the head coaches son and the head coach is upset at the boy for running. I tell the head coach that I instructed him to run and if it was a bad choice, then it was my bad choice. She (head coach) tells me he (her son) should know better -> probably this is why he hesitated because this boy knows that his mom (head coach) would not run in this situation.

Couple of questions. First, given that there is two out and we dont have a strong hitter coming up and children at this level are not too fast nor accurate with their throws, is running home a "bad idea"? If they didn't throw home they could have thrown the runner out on first base!!! Second, even if it is a bad idea, shouldn't the players listen to the third base coach?

Thanks all!

If there is leading off the runner should get a good secondary and go on contact. If no lead off then runner should go home once the fielder commits to first. On the flip side I would have my defense get the out at first if there is play. This is a read play for the runner since its all in front of him.

[tiwebber]

Thanks. No lead off's until the ball crosses the front of the plate. So we can get a one shuffle forward towards home plate. Because kids at this age are not super quick on the ball I think a play at first would've have been tough as would a play at home if the runner was committed. The hit was like a bunt between Third and Pitchers mound. Your suggestion sounds great.

[clayadams]

No lead off in our rec league. The easy answer at this level is that all runners run on any ball hit with 2 outs. Some of the kids with higher level skills will go half way hard and watch the fielder and what he does with the ball. We've got a few advanced kids that will try to get a throw to 3rd or home, then initiate a run down knowing that 9 times out of 10 the ball will be fumbled. That's not something they are instructed to do, but I've never seen anyone have a problem with it.

[skipper5]

First, given that there is two out and we dont have a strong hitter coming up and children at this level are not too fast nor accurate with their throws, is running home a "bad idea"? If they didn't throw home they could have thrown the runner out on first base!!! Second, even if it is a bad idea, shouldn't the players listen to the third base coach?

Agree with both points.

[tg643]

With two outs he's gone on contact unless he's going to run directly into an easy out. It appears by your description had he not hesitated he would have been safe. Not hesitating would have forced a difficu;t throw to first maybe resulting in the hitter being safe and scoring a run. You made the right call at any level of ball.

[tg643]

For anyone not familar with Canadian youth baseball, Mosquito is a Canadian classification.

[DerekD]

I think R3 should be going on anything other than something landing between the pitcher and the plate. R2 would be running on anything other than the grounder towards third and obviously making sure that R3 went.

[skipper5]

For anyone not familar with Canadian youth baseball, Mosquito is a Canadian classification.

The Canadian national bird, right?

[soceric]

You are correct. The runner is really his own base coach on this play. He's got to go.

[tiwebber]

The Canadian national bird, right?

Lol, in some parts of this country that would fit well with reality but not sit well with the locals . Fortunately we have next to no mosquitoes on the left coast other than small baseball players.

[pthawaii]

Hi forum! My first post. I help coach a Mosquito (u 10 little league team) The situation is

1) two out
2) runner on second and third
3) batter hits a slow roller between home plate, third base and pitchers mound.

I am third base coach. Given the slow roller and my base runner, I tell the runner on third to go home immediately. He runs, then hesitates 2/3 the way to home then runs again and it thrown out at home plate. The boy on third base is the head coaches son and the head coach is upset at the boy for running. I tell the head coach that I instructed him to run and if it was a bad choice, then it was my bad choice. She (head coach) tells me he (her son) should know better -> probably this is why he hesitated because this boy knows that his mom (head coach) would not run in this situation.

Couple of questions. First, given that there is two out and we dont have a strong hitter coming up and children at this level are not too fast nor accurate with their throws, is running home a "bad idea"? If they didn't throw home they could have thrown the runner out on first base!!! Second, even if it is a bad idea, shouldn't the players listen to the third base coach?

Thanks all!

I'm a 3rd base coach for a U8 team and here is what I do in that situation. I tell the player to get off the base on any hit, run home on anything unless it's on the ground and doesn't get past the pitcher. In that case, shuffle out and take off when they throw to first. The idea being, just don't run home into a tag or easy out. Not sure that's technically correct, but just thought I'd toss in my newbie 2 cents

[pthawaii]

Delete duplicate post

[CoolHandLuke]

Sorry but that was coaching error and your HC was right. You put the kid on 3rd in a tough spot because he obviously knew he was making a baserunning error given his hesitation.

Why run into an out? What are you gaining by sending the runner on contact? If the pitcher fields the ball and goes to 1 in time, your guy is out anyway. If the pitcher goes to 1 and the batter beats it out, your runner will score either way, given that he takes a proper secondary and breaks for home after the pitcher commits to 1. There is no advantage to sending the runner on contact here. A ball hit like that is a tough play at 1. The easier play for the fielder is the runner on 3rd in this scenario considering there is no lead.

[Jake Patterson]

Hi forum! My first post. I help coach a Mosquito (u 10 little league team) The situation is

1) two out
2) runner on second and third
3) batter hits a slow roller between home plate, third base and pitchers mound.

I am third base coach. Given the slow roller and my base runner, I tell the runner on third to go home immediately. He runs, then hesitates 2/3 the way to home then runs again and it thrown out at home plate. The boy on third base is the head coaches son and the head coach is upset at the boy for running. I tell the head coach that I instructed him to run and if it was a bad choice, then it was my bad choice. She (head coach) tells me he (her son) should know better -> probably this is why he hesitated because this boy knows that his mom (head coach) would not run in this situation.

Couple thoughts... We had a saying in base running "Once you decide.... live with it!" Once that decision is made the runner has no choice. The choice was made.
Second.... If you told the coach you sent him then the discussion is over. If she had a problem with the decision to send then she should take you aside after the game and talk about it..
Third... Sometimes a hero sometimes a goat.... It's part of the game.
Fourth... The player should only listen to you if you are coaching third. For her to say what she did AFTER you told her you sent him tells me a great deal about her.

Couple of questions. First, given that there is two out and we dont have a strong hitter coming up and children at this level are not too fast nor accurate with their throws, is running home a "bad idea"?

See #3 above

If they didn't throw home they could have thrown the runner out on first base!!! Second, even if it is a bad idea, shouldn't the players listen to the third base coach?

Thanks all!

Absolutely!