teaching a catcher how to receive pitches

[Megunticook]

So we have a 12 y.o. catcher on the LL team, this is his last year due to his age. He's a good kid and does a decent job, but there are some weaknesses (lots of passed balls, weak throws, and he tends to present his glove target on the high side). Anyway, since I never caught, I took it upon myself to read some books and look at some video, so I understand how the position is properly played.

One basic thing I've realized is that our catcher (like most catchers in our league) stays on the balls of his feet when receiving pitches, when he actually should be on his insteps when no runners are on base. I found a nice amateur video of Yadier Molina that illustrates the difference nicely (note how he begins on the balls of his feet and then switches when ready to receive the pitch):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XMDrhxniYo

I would like to show our catcher the proper way to receive (I would also teach him the stance for receiving with runners on base ).

But I hesitate because our catcher's dad is a former catcher himself (so I'm told), coaches the local Babe Ruth team, and presumably taught his son how to catch. The dad believes himself to be a baseball expert (his first words upon meeting me weren't "nice to meet you" but instead was some advice on how my son could correct his pitching mechanics). Did I mention that this fella is also a doctor and, as is not unusual in that profession, is pretty much a self-proclaimed expert on all things? His son is very nice, so dad must be doing something right, and I'm guessing he's a decent guy once you get to know him, just comes across as a little arrogant. No big deal.

Should I just leave our catcher be at this point? I don't want to teach him the "right" way to receive pitches, only to insinuate that his dad doesn't know what he's talking about. On the other hand, I would think he'd want to know and it would help his playing in future years. The season is almost over so it won't make much difference for us at this point.

What would you do?

By the way, I would say very few catchers in our local LL are receiving pitches correctly (and I didn't know the difference myself until recently). How about in your league?

When I am head coach of the team next year I am going to make sure everyone knows the fundamentals of their position--it's amazing how little good instruction they're given, especially when it comes to catching and pitching.

[CircleChange11]

So we have a 12 y.o. catcher on the LL team, this is his last year due to his age. He's a good kid and does a decent job, but there are some weaknesses (lots of passed balls, weak throws, and he tends to present his glove target on the high side).

Those are kind of important weaknesses. He doesn't block well, has a weak arm, and doesn't receive well. May I ask what he does do well? Wear the armor? Good throws back to the pitcher? Heh Heh.

Would anyone play a kid at short that doesn't field ground balls, have a good arm, and doesn't have range? *grin*

One basic thing I've realized is that our catcher (like most catchers in our league) stays on the balls of his feet when receiving pitches, when he actually should be on his insteps when no runners are on base.

IMO, this is a big deal.

My son catches and is one of the few guys I see that actually "squats" (sits in between his legs rather than sits on his calves). He also has a different body structure than most guys. He has muscular legs, and can (and has always been able to) squat naturally. It's a huge advantage. He's able to "sway" and "block" without losing balance. In other words, it's nothing I can "take credit for".

Many catchers seem to "fall" into blocks or tip into outside corner pitches. We encountered a youth catcher the other day that "fell to his knees" on EVERY pitch. It did allow him to block some pitches, but it was ridiculous that this was coached/tolerated. I guess at 10U it doesn;t matter because no one throws anyone out on the bases anyway, so might as well just block all balls in the dirt.

I would like to show our catcher the proper way to receive (I would also teach him the stance for receiving with runners on base )

.

Coach Weaver's catching video. Period.

I'm a former college pitcher that reveres catchers and catching. I think I know a good deal about it, as well as, how to teach it. This video, IMO, is the simplest way to teach, practice, and develop catchers. The only thing I disagreed with was how Coach taught catchers to catch outside corner pitches. I'd rather catcher caught the pitch with a bent arm and then slightly straightened their arm to "bring it in a few inches", rather than the "fold the glove down" method.

But I hesitate because our catcher's dad is a former catcher himself (so I'm told), coaches the local Babe Ruth team, and presumably taught his son how to catch. The dad believes himself to be a baseball expert (his first words upon meeting me weren't "nice to meet you" but instead was some advice on how my son could correct his pitching mechanics). Did I mention that this fella is also a doctor and, as is not unusual in that profession, is pretty much a self-proclaimed expert on all things? His son is very nice, so dad must be doing something right, and I'm guessing he's a decent guy once you get to know him, just comes across as a little arrogant. No big deal.

LOT's of people are former catchers. If you're my age and were the "fat kid" in your youth, then you were a catcher. I don't mean that as an insult, but they don't always put the best catcher at catcher. They put the kid that you can spare at catcher. The travel-ball leadoff style of play where catching is one of the most important positions tends to be a fairly recent phenomenon in many areas.

What he does for a living is not important in regards to his baseball knowledge. He's probably a rational guy, and as such should understand the advantages of being balanced and not on the balls of your feet. Not all kids have the leg/hip/flexor strength to maintain this position.

Should I just leave our catcher be at this point? I don't want to teach him the "right" way to receive pitches, only to insinuate that his dad doesn't know what he's talking about. On the other hand, I would think he'd want to know and it would help his playing in future years. The season is almost over so it won't make much difference for us at this point.

The answer is obvious. In case it isn't ... you teach him the right way. You do your job and fulfill your responsibilities. Whether the dad and player accept the instruction is not within your control (influence yes, control no). You control what you can, which is what you do.

I see very few, if any, coaches work with catchers at practice. Most catching instruction seems to be "verbal barking". How many catchers are taught to "Work the T" or "Work the L" or are taught that throwing is a function of footwork? How many actually have receiving drills and blocking drills implemented into practice? I'm going to guess less than 5%.

I will say this, our catchers (3 of them), absolutely LOVE catching practice. We make it competitive at times with being able to throw to 2B and have it knock over a bucket (if they don;t use the proper footwork, it's not a valid throw), and who can block a ball in the dirt and have it go closest to the middle of the plate, and things of that nature. They are sponges that soak up everything. For many kids it's their first time with real catching instruction other than being yelled at for "not doing it right".

[Megunticook]

Those are kind of important weaknesses. He doesn't block well, has a weak arm, and doesn't receive well. May I ask what he does do well? Wear the armor? Good throws back to the pitcher? Heh Heh.

Actually, some of his throws back to the pitcher land at the pitcher's feet...

What he does well is pays attention to the game, listens to his coaches (usually), has a great attitude, and tries hard. He makes excellent plays sometimes. Just needs to work on some fundamentals.

Funny you should mention Coach Weaver, I watched all the stuff his outfit put online and it was a video of his son teaching the proper receiving method that first made me realize that most catchers in our league (including ours) are doing it wrong.

The head coach on our team puts zero time into working with the catchers. I asked if I could take them aside during one practice and work with them on blocking balls, he let me do this once for like 10 minutes on one occasion but clearly doesn't understand the importance of it. But that's another thread.

I guess I can approach it as, "Your dad may have taught you this way, but there's actually an even better way that you'll see big-leaguers like Yadier Molina doing, and here are the advantages of doing it that way." Then I show him and explain and have him try it out.

What I don't want is to put the kid in the middle of a "pissing match" between his coach and his dad over what's the right technique. That puts him in an awkward spot. I almost wonder if I shouldn't sort of casually discuss this with the Dad first, see if I can get him to buy in, but I'm guessing he would not be too open to it and would probably just tell his kid to ignore me.

The thing that has me scratching my head is, if the dad was a former catcher, and got even as far as just high school, wouldn't someone have taught him the proper receiving stance at some point? It doesn't make sense...then again sometimes the dads who proclaim their expertise the loudest are usually the ones with the least knowledge. The other assistant coach on this team, a former h.s. pitcher, scoffed at me for teaching our first-time pitchers to throw a 4-seam fastball ("what pitcher throws a 4-seamer?"). To his credit, though, he listened and changed his tune when I assured him it was a common pitch among the pros, and a great way to get a youngster started out throwing strikes.

I can promise you next year we will have plenty of catching practice and I will make it fun.

[AdamInNY]

Coach Weaver's videos are great. Also, I wouldn't let him catch until he could get the ball back to the pitcher. Throws the entire team off if the kids start throwing the ball around the yard on every ball returned to the pitcher. Nevermind what it does to his/her momentum.

[tg643]

Go to www.catchingcoach.com. Whenever I spoke with Dave Weaver what he said was consistant with what two MLB'er taught my son.

[Jake Patterson]

So we have a 12 y.o. catcher on the LL team, this is his last year due to his age. He's a good kid and does a decent job, but there are some weaknesses (lots of passed balls, weak throws, and he tends to present his glove target on the high side). Anyway, since I never caught, I took it upon myself to read some books and look at some video, so I understand how the position is properly played.

One basic thing I've realized is that our catcher (like most catchers in our league) stays on the balls of his feet when receiving pitches, when he actually should be on his insteps when no runners are on base. I found a nice amateur video of Yadier Molina that illustrates the difference nicely (note how he begins on the balls of his feet and then switches when ready to receive the pitch):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XMDrhxniYo

I would like to show our catcher the proper way to receive (I would also teach him the stance for receiving with runners on base ).

But I hesitate because our catcher's dad is a former catcher himself (so I'm told), coaches the local Babe Ruth team, and presumably taught his son how to catch. The dad believes himself to be a baseball expert (his first words upon meeting me weren't "nice to meet you" but instead was some advice on how my son could correct his pitching mechanics). Did I mention that this fella is also a doctor and, as is not unusual in that profession, is pretty much a self-proclaimed expert on all things? His son is very nice, so dad must be doing something right, and I'm guessing he's a decent guy once you get to know him, just comes across as a little arrogant. No big deal.

Should I just leave our catcher be at this point? I don't want to teach him the "right" way to receive pitches, only to insinuate that his dad doesn't know what he's talking about. On the other hand, I would think he'd want to know and it would help his playing in future years. The season is almost over so it won't make much difference for us at this point.

What would you do?

By the way, I would say very few catchers in our local LL are receiving pitches correctly (and I didn't know the difference myself until recently). How about in your league?

When I am head coach of the team next year I am going to make sure everyone knows the fundamentals of their position--it's amazing how little good instruction they're given, especially when it comes to catching and pitching.

Meg,
If you coach long enough this problem presents itself a hundred times...
One thing I always did was to tell my players not to believe anything I tell them and try to prove me wrong by watching what the best in the game do. Let them find the videos... It usually worked out.
With dad I would simply say "What you teach seems to be inconsistant with what the best actually do... I have some videos I can show you." I always had my laptop in the car and hundreds of clips loaded.

[mudvnine]

Go to www.catchingcoach.com. Whenever I spoke with Dave Weaver what he said was consistant with what two MLB'er taught my son.

Yes, and now speak with his son Jay, who has stepped in, and is doing a great job of working on filling Dave's shoes in meeting the training needs of developing catchers of all ages, of either sex.

[CircleChange11]

Actually, some of his throws back to the pitcher land at the pitcher's feet...

What he does well is pays attention to the game, listens to his coaches (usually), has a great attitude, and tries hard. He makes excellent plays sometimes. Just needs to work on some fundamentals.

Funny you should mention Coach Weaver, I watched all the stuff his outfit put online and it was a video of his son teaching the proper receiving method that first made me realize that most catchers in our league (including ours) are doing it wrong.

The head coach on our team puts zero time into working with the catchers. I asked if I could take them aside during one practice and work with them on blocking balls, he let me do this once for like 10 minutes on one occasion but clearly doesn't understand the importance of it. But that's another thread.

I guess I can approach it as, "Your dad may have taught you this way, but there's actually an even better way that you'll see big-leaguers like Yadier Molina doing, and here are the advantages of doing it that way." Then I show him and explain and have him try it out.

What I don't want is to put the kid in the middle of a "pissing match" between his coach and his dad over what's the right technique. That puts him in an awkward spot. I almost wonder if I shouldn't sort of casually discuss this with the Dad first, see if I can get him to buy in, but I'm guessing he would not be too open to it and would probably just tell his kid to ignore me.

The thing that has me scratching my head is, if the dad was a former catcher, and got even as far as just high school, wouldn't someone have taught him the proper receiving stance at some point? It doesn't make sense...then again sometimes the dads who proclaim their expertise the loudest are usually the ones with the least knowledge. The other assistant coach on this team, a former h.s. pitcher, scoffed at me for teaching our first-time pitchers to throw a 4-seam fastball ("what pitcher throws a 4-seamer?"). To his credit, though, he listened and changed his tune when I assured him it was a common pitch among the pros, and a great way to get a youngster started out throwing strikes.

I can promise you next year we will have plenty of catching practice and I will make it fun.

I was a junior in college before I learned really good pitching mechanics.

Matter of fact, as a sophomore I was praised in front of the entire team for "leaning into the pitch" and for actually "having both feet off the ground at the same time" (Max effort, propulsion) during my stride. Not only was I not being taught good mechanics, but was having my bad(or lesser) mechanics praised.

Id did rather well because everything I threw moved. But I'm quite confident I never got through a game on less than 120+ pitches.

[Jake Patterson]

PS: I had Dave Weaver teach at several of my clinics. After running clinics for ten years and attending dozens more, I believe him to have been the best in the business... I saw his son Jay in action and I believe him to be every bit as good as his dad.

Edit:.... not as good looking though!

[JCincy]

What would you do?

I would probably do nothing. If there was a risk of injury (i.e., setting up too close to the batter) I would take a minute to instruct the kid.

My experience has been that a few minutes to attempt to change the mechanics of a kid, will not help change the mechanics of the kid... especially if he is getting counter instructions from someone else.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
As a rec league coach...

When you are the head coach, you will be in a better position to provide the instruction you want. Try to use good quality videos / books, etc... to bring your other assistants into the same line of thinking. You will still be countering some other sources of instruction. You can't change that. Having your players watch SHORT, meaningful clips can also be handy.

Keep your expectations in check. I know the thrill of wanting to get information and great drills to my team. A few may really get engaged in what you are doing. Some already 'know everything'. Some want microwave results. Some were dropped off by a parent so they can have you babysit.

[real green]

Meg,
Don't forget they are 12. You said yourself, you are guessing the dad has taught him how to catch. Some kids don't listen to their dad and some dads don't take LL so serious. Keep up his love of the game. Introduce the basics of the positions. You will find next year time is a big issue. As head coach of a LL team, you can introduce them to the fundamentals of the position. If they thrive they will seek out further instruction on how to advance. With your time constraints you can only expect to help them make baby steps and give them reps.

Also, remember you can't learn everything from books and video's and there is more than one way to skin a cat.

[johnlanza]

Go to www.catchingcoach.com. Whenever I spoke with Dave Weaver what he said was consistant with what two MLB'er taught my son.

We recently ordered Coach Weaver's DVD and I've watched it thru about five times already. My eight-year old son (almost nine) has watched some of it with me. He's excited about trying out the catchers position in the Fall, which will be our first kid-pitch season. And I'm excited to try to teach what I'm learning from the DVD to the guys who want to play catcher.