Help With Young Pitcher

[HeinekenMan]

My son is relatively big for his age. He's about to turn 9. He's a 5-footer and weighs about 85 pounds. He's a righty. He's a strong kid, too.

We haven't worked a ton on pitching. But he really wants to pitch, and his team certainly could use a big kid who can throw hard.

He has a live arm. The problem is that he simply cannot throw strikes.

We worked on a lot of different mechanics things to improve his accuracy, but he's still struggling. He started working with a coach at a local facility a month ago, and he's making progress. But he still has some issues. Here's a rundown.

1. When he brings the ball back, his arm is nearly parallel to the ground with the ball far back. The ball often doesn't reach ear level. I have tried to get him to flex his arm more and hold his hand higher before rotation. When he does it correctly, he comes over the top and has good accuracy. When he doesn't do it correctly, he ends up with a sidearm delivery and sometimes turns his wrist and sweeps across his body. This generally causes the ball to be outside on a right-handed batter. His coach has him doing a drill where he starts at separation, gets his arm up and then finishes his motion. It helps. But he still sometimes drops his arm while pitching. One of his teammates brings the ball nearly up to his right ear before rotation, and my son's arm is about 10-12 inches further back at the same point in his motion. I showed him what his teammate does, and his teammate is an 8-year-old who throws 50 mph. I'm hoping he starts to understand what's going on. But he's still pretty young and has trouble making the adjustments.

2. When he comes at three-quarters, he has a nice velocity. But he keeps releasing too early. Instead of releasing out front, he's releasing as his hand passes the shoulder. It happens most often when he tries to throw hard. These throws, of course, tend to be high and often inside. It seems like he's just trying to get rid of the ball quickly instead of throwing it hard. It helps when I talk to him about leading with the elbow and releasing out front. But he's still prone to not finishing his motion. The problem lessens if he comes directly over the top. But I feel that puts too much strain on the shoulder and could cause problems down the line.

3. Despite all of my instruction, he simply does not bend at follow-through. Sometimes, it's because he releases too early. Other times, he releases out front but stays upright and throws really high. The kid can rip off a nice fastball, but you'd need a ladder to hit.

I'm sure these are familiar mechanical problems for most pitching coaches. He's working out some of the things and has improved his accuracy. But it has been much harder for him than for some of the other kids. The smaller guys seem to catch on quickly to this motion. And I think my son is starting to get a little impatient. He works with his coach twice a week, but the coach spends most of his time with the kids who are ready to pitch in games. My son needs to prove what he can do in order to gain more attention from the coach. I know it shouldn't be that way, but that's how it has been. So I'm hoping to work with him on mechanics on his off days. Obviously, I'm not going to tax his arm too much.

I'll take any advice, encouragement, etc. I'm really excited about his potential as a pitcher. Given his size advantage, he may be able to dominate a lot of hitters once he fixes his motion.

[HeinekenMan]

Oops. Mom measured him. He's only 4-foot-10. Of course, she's not very good at math.

[jdfromfla]

But he still sometimes drops his arm while pitching.

Understand that because he's new to pitching, he will fatigue, when a mech fails most times it is related to fatigue. Strength has much to do with repeatability, at 9 this is going to be on-going and will improve over time.
You mention being in Fla. well Mike Martin at FSU has great camps which build fundementals, UNF also has had outstanding summer time day camps, what these do is improve fundemental skills as well as show hi level motions of the athletes who assist in the camps and they do it in a fun format which allows the kid to develop..as a kid and not as a 9 yr old under a microscope. My advice is to back-off on the intensity and allow for the trial and error he needs in order to learn the art and love it.

[CircleChange11]

Here's what I would do with a big kid with a strong arm that may have accuracy issues.

1. Put him at 3B.
2. Have him throw to 1B.

If he can throw accurately across the diamond, he can pitch. By accurately I mean if you don't catch the ball it will, literally, hit you in the chest ... almost EVERY time.

If he throws inaccurately to 1B, then whatever adjustments he needs to make to his throwing will lead to effective pitching.

When I have dads that ask me questions about pitching accuracy and how they're going crazy because their kid doesn't throw strikes, I'm usually familiar with their kid and they very often have accuracy issues everywhere ... from 3B, from SS, etc.

I say put them at 3B and have them throw to 1B, because it takes the pressure off of "pitching". They're just simply making a throw across the diamond. They don't realize you're actually assessing their throwing mechanics without them knowing it. Once they toe the rubber, they know you're watching everything ... and well, it's difficult for dads/coaches to not say something after every pitch.

I would use video to look at what's really happening. I say this as one that did that very thing with hitting and what my son and I discovered is what I thought he was doing wrong was not it. It was eye opening.

Pitching is NOT complicated. It's slight extensions to throwing.

I strongly request some video.

[songtitle]

When he brings the ball back, his arm is nearly parallel to the ground with the ball far back. The ball often doesn't reach ear level.

Make him throw his hand straight down to the ground hard, then it will automatically flip down and up in a circular pattern.

1. Despite all of my instruction, he simply does not bend at follow-through.
2. Sometimes, it's because he releases too early.

1. It sounds like his stride is way too short.

2. The ball comes out on it's own. He doesn't actually 'release it'. (It's a result, not a conscious act)

I agree with circle, video is best.

[skipper5]

Consider buying a pitchback for your backyard.

If he's self-motivated, he'll eventually teach himself to throw accurately--and trust him arm--by throwing a few hundred pitches a day on his own while you're at work.
He'll make up various games, and get experience throwing under world series pressure.

"Jimmy, come inside, it's getting dark."
"Mom, it's the bottom of the ninth and the bases are loaded."

[CircleChange11]

Consider buying a pitchback for your backyard.

If he's self-motivated, he'll eventually teach himself to throw accurately--and trust him arm--by throwing a few hundred pitches a day on his own while you're at work.
He'll make up various games, and get experience throwing under world series pressure.

"Jimmy, come inside, it's getting dark."
"Mom, it's the bottom of the ninth and the bases are loaded."

I would NOT get a pitchback.

1. Bucket of baseballs.
2. Heavy, hanging tarp/mat. Paint strike zone on mat/tarp.

IMO, with the pitchback, the focus can easily become "fielding the ball afterwards".

[mudvnine]

IMO, with the pitchback, the focus can easily become "fielding the ball afterwards".

And that's a bad thing for a 9 y/o?

[HeinekenMan]

We don't really have a yard that is conducive to pitching. Our back yard slopes at about 30 degrees. A tarp or pitchback could work in the front yard. We have two large live oaks close together. But a tarp might look awfully tacky. Plus, the neighbor's house would be in the crosshairs should a pitch get out of control. I am not a fan of kids pitching by themselves. Here's why. I have a kid whose dad created a target in the back yard, and the kid was out there throwing every day. But he was throwing with horrible mechanics, and I think all of that throwing reinforced the poor mechanics. Sure, if a kid is fundamentally sound, it's a way for him to get in some extra throwing and defense. But it really hurt one of my players this spring. Instead of "showing the ball" to third, short or second, he yanked it back while "showing" straight to home plate, and he bent his wrist in a hook shape and just couldn't get out of that habit. And that is a kid who is a natural athlete. He threw gas but it was all over the place and had him really frustrated.

Fortunately, I'm home a lot of the time. I haven't taken my son outside to play catch that much. And that's probably not helping his development. But that's mostly because of our busy schedule. He gets home at 3, and we're off running errands until dinner time. Then we're usually at the field for practice or a game. The summer is a nice time to get in some work. So we did that for 30 minutes today.

I worked with him on bringing his hand down to his hip with force to help him get his arm on top as he completes the circle. It seemed to help. I also stood him in front of a mirror and showed him what happens when he has the ball extended too far from his shoulder. I convinced him to flex his elbow at the 90-degree point to improve his arm angle. We also measured and marked the ground for a stride length that is about 80 percent of his height. But that's off flat ground. I didn't want to push it more than that on flat ground until he gets his motion down. It is still a longer stride than he's been using. I can tell because he brought his down pitches quite a bit and flexed more at the midsection on his follow through. I also noticed that he shortens his stride and releases too early (on his side) when he tries to hum it. By concentrating on his stride length, he was able to eliminate that problem and throw relatively hard today.

I'd say he threw pretty well. He stays closed much better than he did a few months ago. That is really helping both his accuracy and his velocity. He threw a lot of pitches around the plate with about 50-60 percent strikes. He's learning to concentrate on the target. I would guess that he's throwing it about 40 mph. I think he's on his way. I'm sure there will be some challenges ahead. Facing live batters will be a challenge, I'm sure. He pitched about five innings this spring. I let all of my kids throw at least an inning. My son was pretty wild. But he reeled off a heater that had the opposing coach in shock. he had been throwing off his back foot and was arching the ball with about 20 mph velocity. Then he popped one in the glove at about his max speed. Naturally, old dad said, "Just throw it like that every time." As if it's that easy...

I have wondered whether his size has been a challenge. He seems to grow a few inches and get a little clumsy. He has a good glove. But he's fallen down a few times. I recall him falling down on his way to first base at least twice this past year. LOL.

I'll tell ya what. It's tough to balance my enthusiasm, his enthusiasm and the need to let him be a kid. But I think we're both enjoying it quite a bit. These are some incredible memories. I couldn't be more proud. He started travel ball last month. His uniform shirt is still not in. A few days ago, he said, "I think I'm going to feel really special when I get my jersey." He slept with his new big barrel bat when he first got it. He also just got his first bat pack. Since he's the coach's son, he's never had his own bag. His stuff has always gone into my equipment bag. I got him a red bag to match his team's colors. He looks really sharp. For his birthday, he's getting an airbrushed helmet with a snake on it to match his team's name. He's going to freak.

I forgot to mention the knuckleball he threw today. LOL. I could tell he was up to something. Then he threw this thing that looked like it slipped out of his hand. That's what I get for letting him watch R.A. Dickey a few nights ago.

[clayadams]

With my kid, basically the same exact age as yours, I just broke it down piece by piece. For quite a while we only did drills, not the full throw. We started with posture, leg lift, stride. That has to become muscle memory. Then add in the upper half with dropping the glove and bringing the hands to their positions of equal opposite. Then combine them stopping at equal opposite and stride finished. The foot should land in the same place every time, hands at equal opposite every time, posture correct. You can see where I'm going with this. We did this for months before we ever got to any real pitching. Accuracy was horrible, velocity stunk. We started this at 7. This year my kid played in the 9-10yo kid pitch league (at 8). My young 'un was one of 4 "major" pitchers for the team. I'd personally say the 2nd best pitcher with the first best being a 10yo travel ball player. It all came down to hard work and a love for pitching that my kid has. Practicing pitching is NEVER an issue. I'll also add that it was about half a year before we had a "working" throw.

[CircleChange11]

And that's a bad thing for a 9 y/o?

Not necessarily.

If you're working on one specific thing, then it could be distracting.

I liken it to teaching a young player batting mechanics ... and then throwing them changeups and/or curveballs. It's not "bad" to work them on changeups and curveballs, but not necessarily when you're trying to teach basics and specifics.

I also recall from good pitchback machines that if you throw hard and throw strikes, it's more of a practice of "comebackers". I admit I haven't used a pitchback in the last 30 years, so maybe they're different now. The one I used wasn't one of the flimsy ones with weak springs and structure, but a solid one with good net and good springs, and a hard, centered throw resulted in a sharp liner back to you.

Again, not a bad thing if you're working on fielding. If you're working on pitching, then I'd prefer to just work on that. Even using a lawn chair as a catcher would be a better alternative, IMHO.

[bbrages]

Our pitchback is adjustable, so you can set it up so that strikes result in ground balls, fly balls or line drives.

The thing about pitchbacks (IMO) is that they are a lot of fun, so kids put in a lot of time with them. My oldest has thrown into one for a couple of years and it helped his accuracy and fielding a lot... even his velocity improved, too. I think he's going to have to get off of the pitchback and just start throwing to a target, but it's not going to be nearly as fun. At some point, it makes sense to push kids into practice that isn't fun... I guess.

My 6-y/o has just started throwing into the pitchback too... he says he wants to be a pitcher.

[CircleChange11]

At some point, it makes sense to push kids into practice that isn't fun... I guess.

If I gave the impression that I think "not fun" should ever be a goal or even a result, then I have made a great error. If something is not fun for a young player, they will eventually go to something that is.

Earlier, I recommended a bucket of baseball and throwing to a tarp/mat with a strike zone on it. You know what's fun for kids? Being able to hit the strikezone, and be praised for it. You know what's NOT fun for kids? Not being able to hit the target.

IMHO, the fun baseball can bring is limited when you have low skills. Pitching isn't fun when you walk a lot of batters. Hitting isn't fun when you don't hit the ball well.

Teaching a young player and having fun should not be mutually exclusive. IMHO, one of my greatest achievements as a coach was convincing 3 10yo catchers that blocking balls drills were fun. As long as they did them together and received positive feedback they would do the drills for quite a while, even enjoying it. I think we can all agree (or at least those that have caught before) that blocking balls drills are about the least fun thing on the planet.

"Hey guys, it's 92 degrees and humid ... let's go ask coach to throw one hoppers at our chest!" "Yeah, great idea! I'm going to see if I can take a few off my forearms and biceps, those feel awesome!" That's not something 10yo kids are just lining up to do. But they will do it, even with enthusiasm, if you "set the climate". I usually start off by describing that the task is difficult, but they have my respect for being brave enough to try it. Then we set realistic goals for their level, and praise them for when they get better. What we DON'T do, is point out every flaw of every pitch/swing/etc. A coach, doing that, can suck the life out of even the most enthusiastic player.

My opposition to the pitchback was simply because it adds another element, which COULD be a distraction. If it's not a distraction, don't worry about it. Use it. If it works, it works.

[shake-n-bake]

Understand that because he's new to pitching, he will fatigue, when a mech fails most times it is related to fatigue. Strength has much to do with repeatability, at 9 this is going to be on-going and will improve over time.
You mention being in Fla. well Mike Martin at FSU has great camps which build fundementals, UNF also has had outstanding summer time day camps, what these do is improve fundemental skills as well as show hi level motions of the athletes who assist in the camps and they do it in a fun format which allows the kid to develop..as a kid and not as a 9 yr old under a microscope. My advice is to back-off on the intensity and allow for the trial and error he needs in order to learn the art and love it.

Could not agree more!

[HeinekenMan]

One thing I don't understand is how often he should be throwing. Currently, he throws indoors Mondays and Thursdays with his travel ball team. He has been doing drills for much of the time with maybe 15-20 actual pitches. I am willing to catch 50 balls a night if that's okay. I certainly don't want to go overboard.