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  • #16
    Originally posted by mr. potato head View Post
    You finally started talking about the importance of coiling as you stride
    I see you are new here. I have been saying this for a long time (I could provide a link, but mud will accuse me of 'pimping' :o- inside joke). But, I'm no genius, I just point out what MLB hitters actually do (in videos).
    Last edited by songtitle; 07-26-2012, 09:50 AM.
    efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

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    • #17
      Originally posted by omg View Post
      So how exactly would you go about teaching this?
      You can do this at home with your son/daughter. Spend 5 minutes in front of a mirror using a slo-motion swing, broken down into 2 or 3 phases. Stance-to-toe-touch phase - coil as you go, where do I end up? Then practice toe touch-to-elbow-at-hip phase - drive down, clear the hips, keep your hands back. Then try it all together. Then faster. Repeat.
      Last edited by songtitle; 07-26-2012, 10:01 AM.
      efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

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      • #18
        Originally posted by songtitle View Post
        I see you are new here. I have been saying this for a long time (I could provide a link, but mud will accuse me of 'pimping' :o- inside joke). But, I'm no genius, I just point out what MLB hitters actually do (in videos).
        I have lurked for a long time and read many of your posts and I don't necessarily agree that post count is indicative of what you know or don't know. I remember someone pointing out the coil as you stride idea to you so it isn't so long ago you jumped onboard. Can you explain why you feel the focus on the front hip is a good idea? Can you point out in "videos" MLB hitters intentionally turning their FRONT hip? I am no genius either, just a dad trying to make sense of it all and I see it differently than you do. The focus for me is IN the rear hip. Coil as you move out with control in the REAR HIP and the front hip will take care of itself. IMO of course.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by songtitle View Post
          Here he is at toe touch.

          He has not coiled properly. His shoulders have over-rotated, and his hips havent coiled.

          His hands are too far from his armpit/shoulders(causing the front armbar). He should be able to touch his shoulder with his top thumb.

          A few frames later...

          Instead of rotating his hips beginning at toe touch, he lunges forward.

          At toe touch, he should simultaneously:
          - drive his back elbow down
          - drive his back shoulder down
          - clear his front hip and start intentionally turning his front hip
          His hands being to far from his armpit isn't causing the straight arm, it's the other way around, but I noticed the same thing. The problems that have been mentioned are the same that I noticed. It's nice to get second opinions thought and know we're on the right track. We're going to work on the load (front arm bent and load the scap rather than rotate.) What drives me nuts is that he used to load properly, but he keeps screwing around with his swing. And we're going to work on the hip slide. That's an old habit that's come back in last couple months.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by azmatsfan View Post
            His hands being to far from his armpit isn't causing the straight arm, it's the other way around
            hmmm... The hands can be in the wrong place with a straight arm, or a bent arm. The hands are only in the right place when they are near the armpit - which puts the knob of the bat at it's optimum point of leverage.

            I used to spend a lot of time trying to teach 'bend your arm', but found it's much, much simpler to have a kid put their hands in the right spot.
            efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

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            • #21
              Originally posted by songtitle View Post
              hmmm... The hands can be in the wrong place with a straight arm, or a bent arm. The hands are only in the right place when they are near the armpit - which puts the knob of the bat at it's optimum point of leverage.

              I used to spend a lot of time trying to teach 'bend your arm', but found it's much, much simpler to have a kid put their hands in the right spot.
              I see. It depends on the student I suppose. I've been talking with my son about hand path, and the fact that his arm starts out pretty straight, but is bent at contact. This is because his hands are sliding in a linear path in relation to his body as he rotates. It's almost like he's imitating that video that pops up on here now and then demonstrating a linear swing.

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              • #22
                Azmats one thing that will give you a big bang for the buck is to work a little bit on the front leg.

                It took me a long time to see this for some reason, heck I can remember over 5 almost 6 years ago when my oldest was 12, Lclifton pointing something out to me. And back then it didn't really make a lot of sense to me, but it was something we worked very hard on this winter. Now my kid isn't a superstar, probably a JUCO or if he's lucky a low-level D1 type kid we'll see, but the improvement in fixing this really helped. I love to coin an occasional term and since I am big on "rear leg winning" meaning I want the back leg to be the first thing that turns, the setup your son is which is exactly what my kid did was what I called RLWI or "Rear Leg Winning Inhibitor". The good news is that you don't have to believe in what I teach, however to see some benefit.

                So let me explain. Your kid's front leg is jagged, that is there is a pinching inward in the knee whereas the foot stays out creating a sort of look where his upper thigh down to the knee is not that far apart (and for good reason since it's attached at both ends) and then from the knee to the foot that lower leg is sticking out away almost unnaturually. Compare to Jeff Kent or almost any pro-hitter. You will see the front foot is much closer to the knee spatially speaking. There isn't any kind of reaching out with a lot of hitters. Look at bonds or Manny and see how the front foot is not angled so far out away from the knee.

                Now what I saw in this late last winter and into spring was that there was a point in time where knee and foot established a more balanced look (like Kent). That is the knee was now starting to move out a little as the body is. Finally at the point that the knee was more balanced over the foot, the rear leg started to fire. And compared to an elite hitter this getting to the more nuetral was happening very late in the process. However once he was more nuetral the back leg started to win. So the solution was of course, do not do anything that caused the pelvis to stay closed off. As a matter of fact, I told the kid to slightly turn out the lead leg to make sure it's not blocking. That setup keeps the pelvis completely closed off. You want to see the pelvis starting to open a little during the shift.

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                • #23




                  @noontimegifs

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by NoonTime View Post




                    Nice... It does look like the kid is really trying to lift the ball compared to the pros... In comparison, now that you look at it, it almost looks like a golf-swing finish...? No?
                    I don't like my balls to smell like pickles.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Encinitas View Post
                      Azmats one thing that will give you a big bang for the buck is to work a little bit on the front leg.

                      It took me a long time to see this for some reason, heck I can remember over 5 almost 6 years ago when my oldest was 12, Lclifton pointing something out to me. And back then it didn't really make a lot of sense to me, but it was something we worked very hard on this winter. Now my kid isn't a superstar, probably a JUCO or if he's lucky a low-level D1 type kid we'll see, but the improvement in fixing this really helped. I love to coin an occasional term and since I am big on "rear leg winning" meaning I want the back leg to be the first thing that turns, the setup your son is which is exactly what my kid did was what I called RLWI or "Rear Leg Winning Inhibitor". The good news is that you don't have to believe in what I teach, however to see some benefit.

                      So let me explain. Your kid's front leg is jagged, that is there is a pinching inward in the knee whereas the foot stays out creating a sort of look where his upper thigh down to the knee is not that far apart (and for good reason since it's attached at both ends) and then from the knee to the foot that lower leg is sticking out away almost unnaturually. Compare to Jeff Kent or almost any pro-hitter. You will see the front foot is much closer to the knee spatially speaking. There isn't any kind of reaching out with a lot of hitters. Look at bonds or Manny and see how the front foot is not angled so far out away from the knee.

                      Now what I saw in this late last winter and into spring was that there was a point in time where knee and foot established a more balanced look (like Kent). That is the knee was now starting to move out a little as the body is. Finally at the point that the knee was more balanced over the foot, the rear leg started to fire. And compared to an elite hitter this getting to the more nuetral was happening very late in the process. However once he was more nuetral the back leg started to win. So the solution was of course, do not do anything that caused the pelvis to stay closed off. As a matter of fact, I told the kid to slightly turn out the lead leg to make sure it's not blocking. That setup keeps the pelvis completely closed off. You want to see the pelvis starting to open a little during the shift.
                      We're planning to spend a lot of time on the front leg as you suggested, but this post helps a lot in describing how we should attack it. Thanks.

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                      • #26
                        Here's a swing from December when we were working on some things. I think it looks better than what he's doing now. He still had issues with the lead arm/hand path, but his front side looked better and he wasn't rotating at his trunk when he loaded.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by azmatsfan View Post
                          Here's a swing from December when we were working on some things. I think it looks better than what he's doing now. He still had issues with the lead arm/hand path, but his front side looked better and he wasn't rotating at his trunk when he loaded.

                          Still had the "shift then swing" issue.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Bolts-Baseball View Post
                            Nice... It does look like the kid is really trying to lift the ball compared to the pros... In comparison, now that you look at it, it almost looks like a golf-swing finish...? No?
                            That's what I see and I attribute it to over doing the back leg drive.
                            Major Figure

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by azmatsfan View Post
                              Here's a swing from December when we were working on some things. I think it looks better than what he's doing now. He still had issues with the lead arm/hand path, but his front side looked better and he wasn't rotating at his trunk when he loaded.

                              Again, needs to be more relaxed and smooth with that initial hand cocking. Contrived. Just like the back leg. Over coached?
                              Major Figure

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by omg View Post
                                Again, needs to be more relaxed and smooth with that initial hand cocking. Contrived. Just like the back leg. Over coached?
                                Nope. Nothing contrived about the hand cocking. In fact we've talked about a smooth slow load. We haven't worked on his swing in a while because he's been playing and hitting really well. I'm of the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" philosophy during the season. Now that it's off season we can work on some things. As you can see from the differences in his swing from December to now that he plays around with his own swing a lot. He'll go 5 for 5 then say, "I think I'm going to change my stance and stride." I think he does it just to drive me nuts.

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