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  • Operation 85+

    This is my training log for my batspeed workout. I have a swing speed radar (don't know how accurate it is) and last year I improved from about 65 to 80 doing a self designed batspeed workout.

    It mainly consists of overload and underload swinging as well as my famous tire drill. I do also the noontime drill as well as some epstein drills and of course lifting (my goals for spring are at least 350 in the deadlift, 300 in the squat and 220 in the bench press).

    this year my goal is to hit 85 on that radar thing.

    today I re tested and I hit about 73. I did not do my programm since spring but at least I'm still higher than before I started batspeed training. I hope to be back at 80 in about 2-3 weeks. you have to be carefull with that kind of training though since you can burn out and regress or at least stagnate quickly if you overdo it. last year I did it daily and improved quickly but after about 5-6 weeks I peaked and never got further (even slightly regressed). thus I started my program later this season and I also plan to do it only 3 times a week.

    this thread is to log my success and keep me motivated. feel free to comment or not.

    BTW: I know that batspeed is not everything and thus I also do some drills for quickness and contact ability. I certainly need to since I now play in a higher level league were I will face 80 mph regularly. will be tough to even get a starting spot this season.
    I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

  • #2
    Originally posted by dominik View Post
    This is my training log for my batspeed workout. I have a swing speed radar (don't know how accurate it is) and last year I improved from about 65 to 80 doing a self designed batspeed workout.

    It mainly consists of overload and underload swinging as well as my famous tire drill. I do also the noontime drill as well as some epstein drills and of course lifting (my goals for spring are at least 350 in the deadlift, 300 in the squat and 220 in the bench press).

    this year my goal is to hit 85 on that radar thing.

    today I re tested and I hit about 73. I did not do my programm since spring but at least I'm still higher than before I started batspeed training. I hope to be back at 80 in about 2-3 weeks. you have to be carefull with that kind of training though since you can burn out and regress or at least stagnate quickly if you overdo it. last year I did it daily and improved quickly but after about 5-6 weeks I peaked and never got further (even slightly regressed). thus I started my program later this season and I also plan to do it only 3 times a week.

    this thread is to log my success and keep me motivated. feel free to comment or not.

    BTW: I know that batspeed is not everything and thus I also do some drills for quickness and contact ability. I certainly need to since I now play in a higher level league were I will face 80 mph regularly. will be tough to even get a starting spot this season.
    Thats great!

    You should video tape yourself with the radar so we can all see the progress and hopefully see any visual differences(if any) of your quest. It would also be a great if you could describe anything that you would be doing different in order to hit you goal in any of the videos.

    This is a first. Good luck and thanks for letting us watch your progress(hopefully).

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by dominik View Post
      this year my goal is to hit 85 on that radar thing.
      85 mph would be MLB level bat speed. Pujols was measured at 86.9. (Ignore the myth/idiocy - started by GQ Magazine - about Pujols having slow bat speed)

      80 would be awesome for normal folks.

      At a certain size/strength level, increased bat speed is mostly driven by technique. Have you tried setting a baseline on a given day, then trying different techniques for increased swing speed?
      efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

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      • #4
        Originally posted by songtitle View Post
        85 mph would be MLB level bat speed. Pujols was measured at 86.9. (Ignore the myth/idiocy - started by GQ Magazine - about Pujols having slow bat speed)

        80 would be awesome for normal folks.

        At a certain size/strength level, increased bat speed is mostly driven by technique. Have you tried setting a baseline on a given day, then trying different techniques for increased swing speed?
        well albert was plugged with cables and probably not really warmed up. I'm sure he could hit 100 if he is really fired up.

        still of course I'm not sure how accurate that thing is. jack mankin also uses it (this device http://www.batspeed.com/products06.html) I just hope it reads kinda consistently to track my progress. I certainly don't claim to have MLB batspeed although I'm a pretty strong guy (former discus thrower 6" and 220 pounds).

        I do work a lot on technique, especially my coiling and stretching pattern. with the device I certainly can spot any leak in the kinematic chain. when I "cheat" and activate the upper body too early my batspeed immediately drops at least by 5 mph.
        I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by dominik View Post
          well albert was plugged with cables and probably not really warmed up. I'm sure he could hit 100 if he is really fired up.

          still of course I'm not sure how accurate that thing is. jack mankin also uses it (this device http://www.batspeed.com/products06.html) I just hope it reads kinda consistently to track my progress. I certainly don't claim to have MLB batspeed although I'm a pretty strong guy (former discus thrower 6" and 220 pounds).

          I do work a lot on technique, especially my coiling and stretching pattern. with the device I certainly can spot any leak in the kinematic chain. when I "cheat" and activate the upper body too early my batspeed immediately drops at least by 5 mph.
          I used to have a bat speed meter and it was pretty accurate. 85 would be a top level hs/college player, roughly speaking. A d1 college guy/1st round pick got in to the low nineties. I think it is a great device. Plus you actually have to be accurate when you swing, can't just swing wily-nily. Of course, it can be mis-used. If you take that big, long, wrappy swing then the mph will be higher. Make sure you don't cheat-take your swing.
          Major Figure

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          • #6
            Originally posted by omg View Post
            I used to have a bat speed meter and it was pretty accurate. 85 would be a top level hs/college player, roughly speaking. A d1 college guy/1st round pick got in to the low nineties. I think it is a great device. Plus you actually have to be accurate when you swing, can't just swing wily-nily. Of course, it can be mis-used. If you take that big, long, wrappy swing then the mph will be higher. Make sure you don't cheat-take your swing.
            That's why it's good to film yourself and count frames in the usual way. If you're between 4 and 5 frames, you weren't too long or loopy. The goal is to have a quick and powerful swing, not just powerful.
            The outcome of our children is infinitely more important than the outcome of any game they will ever play

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by JJA View Post
              That's why it's good to film yourself and count frames in the usual way. If you're between 4 and 5 frames, you weren't too long or loopy. The goal is to have a quick and powerful swing, not just powerful.
              yeah if I do it like this
              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qAE2PrCVhY it probably would be cheating (although he uses centrifugal force pretty well). I'll try to shoot a video.
              I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by omg View Post
                If you take that big, long, wrappy swing then the mph will be higher.
                If that's true, then you should be using that swing in a game. But... it's not true.
                efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

                Comment


                • #9
                  OK, just trying to clarify here....

                  Originally posted by omg View Post
                  85 would be a top level hs/college player, roughly speaking. A d1 college guy/1st round pick got in to the low nineties.
                  Maybe there is some confusion here over exit speed and bat speed. 90 mph bat speed would be faster than any MLB player using wood in 2012. Maybe the low 90s reading was using a lightweight metal bat?

                  The formula is exit speed=q*(pitch speed) + (1+q)*(bat speed) where q is roughly 0.2 for a wood bat. Average MLB fastball speed is 91 mph out of the hand, and 83 mph at the plate.
                  The top 2009 exit speed was Wladimir Balentin's, 122.3 mph. (Calculates to roughly 88 mph bat speed.)
                  The top 2012 exit speed was Stanton, Giancarlo, 122.4 mph. Again, 88 mph.

                  ---------------

                  So, I'm thinking 80 is really good with a wood bat. 85 would be MLB high-level.
                  Last edited by songtitle; 12-28-2012, 07:23 AM.
                  efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by songtitle View Post
                    If that's true, then you should be using that swing in a game. But... it's not true.
                    Come on song. You're been around way too long to say that. It's well known that swing speeds in slow pitch softball are a lot faster than in baseball, with guys over 95 mph quite common. This is of course because they have a lot more reaction time to load up and take a longer but more powerful swing. Needless to say, not many of these slow pitch guys are stars in MLB because of the need to have a much quicker swing in baseball than slow pitch softball.

                    A swing needs to be quick and powerful, not just powerful.
                    The outcome of our children is infinitely more important than the outcome of any game they will ever play

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by JJA View Post
                      A swing needs to be quick and powerful, not just powerful.
                      This one probably wouldn't work in the MLB.


                      'Quick' is simply a function of timing. Start sooner.
                      efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by songtitle View Post
                        This one probably wouldn't work in the MLB.


                        'Quick' is simply a function of timing. Start sooner.
                        What??????????
                        Last edited by cps; 12-28-2012, 07:34 AM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by JJA View Post
                          It's well known that swing speeds in slow pitch softball are a lot faster than in baseball, with guys over 95 mph quite common.
                          I was not aware that they used wood bats in slow pitch

                          From the Nathan study
                          The average swing speed (at 6 inches from the end of the bat) of the A and D level players was found to be 89 and 81 mph, respectively.

                          The bat speed was shown to have an observable dependence on bat MOI [the difference between baseball and slow-pitch]


                          Originally posted by JJA View Post
                          This is of course because they have a lot more reaction time to load up and take a longer but more powerful swing.
                          So, you are saying that a 'longer' swing generates more bat speed? (What do you mean by longer? Longer coil/stride? Or, outstretched arms?) Isn't this backwards? Does this defy the law of conservation of angular momentum?
                          Last edited by songtitle; 12-28-2012, 08:10 AM.
                          efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by songtitle View Post
                            This one probably wouldn't work in the MLB.
                            [ATTACH=CONFIG]117885[/ATTACH]

                            'Quick' is simply a function of timing. Start sooner.
                            well I think that quick is also a function of shortness. a more direct path takes less time than a wide arc. the wider arc on the other hand can yield to a longer acceleration path and thus higher batspeed. also quickness is a function of getting early batspeed and hitting the ball deep in the zone. if you achieve the same batspeed two feet farther out front you wil rob yourself some time.

                            However personally I don't feel like I'm getting more batspeed if my swing gets longer. but I could certainly see how a player gets some extra mph by using a longer swing.
                            Last edited by dominik; 12-28-2012, 07:56 AM.
                            I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I'm puzzled when baseball folks are ever concerned about what happens prior to toe touch.

                              If you get your toe down in time, what difference does it make what happened before?
                              efastball.com - hitting and pitching fact checker

                              Comment

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