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  • i hate math
    International League Fourm and Pacific Coast League Fourm Triple A Baseball

    "The dumber a pitcher is, the better. When he gets smart and begins to experiment with a lot of different pitches, he's in trouble. All I ever had was a fastball, a curve and a changeup and I did pretty good."
    Dizzy Dean.


    9 WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!

    19261931193419421944 1946196419671982

    Comment


    • team salary link

      Originally posted by Mattingly
      Biggerin, I see you guys have gone bargain hunting. It's productivity like that which we could use. However, some of the positions we already have filled. While the original question (which you'd quoted) was about any possible inaccuracies in which ESPN had quoted in Boston's payroll (such as full salaries of players you're only partially responsible for financially), I'll go with the flow.

      Now, Lyon used to be your effective "closer" even when the "committee" thing was in use. I've never compared, but why would he be less useful than Sauerbeck?

      Millar plays 1B, but does have an almost .300 BA, and is almost .900 OPS. We obviously couldn't use him, but then again, had Thome signed on with you, then you'd be rooting (and paying dearly) otherwise.

      OK, now Mueller (names too similar) seems better offensively. I'm curious why you're saying Millar at 1B is the reason the BoSox offense is stronger, while Mueller at 3B has a higher BA and OPS. Does Mueller get more clutch hits? His order in the lineup? Anyway, if you'd consider taking Ventura, we'll throw in Todd Zeile and pay his salary, plus shipping costs. I'll even pack his bags personally.

      For Weaver, it's a risk, since last time, he didn't bring his good stuff. The man's got no curve, as it's a flat and slow meatball without movement. If he can stick to the fastball, he may be more effective. He's paid $4m this season, which jumps to $6m in 2004, and $9m in 2005, so he'd better come up big and stop overthinking.
      Mattingly, here's the link from espn about how much more the yanks spend then everyone else:

      http://espn.go.com/mlb/news/2003/0721/1583818.html

      Comment


      • Re: team salary link

        Originally posted by RedSoxFanAtic
        Mattingly, here's the link from espn about how much more the yanks spend then everyone else:

        http://espn.go.com/mlb/news/2003/0721/1583818.html
        [Sarcasm]Oooh, The new luxury tax will be effective...$10.8 million thats going to cripple the Yanks![/Sarcasm]
        RIP - HGF [1937-2009]

        Comment


        • Re: Re: Before Domination through Money

          Originally posted by Mattingly
          I'm curious, by money in 1920, were you referring exclusively to the Ruth purchase, or were you referring to overall payroll of both teams?

          I'm also wondering where you'd gotten the 13 wins by Boston from 1871-1920. I don't have that far back, but from 1884-1920, I have 7 wins by Boston and 3 by the NY Giants.

          As to the greater overall payroll of the Yanks, I'm still not sure which source to believe, but on this one, I'm not overly trusting of ESPN, which doesn't seem overly pro-Yankee. Either case, I think that George was just stocking up for next season's big change, when the following aren't expected to be here, followed by their approximate 2003 salary in parenthesis:

          Roger Clemens ($10m)
          Sterling Hitchcock ($6m)
          Raul Mondesi ($7m)
          Robin Ventura ($5m)
          Todd Zeile ($1.5m)

          Others uncertain to return but still possible are:

          Andy Pettitte ($11.5m)
          David Wells ($3m)
          Jeff Weaver ($4m)

          I don't know which trades will be made before August and this winter, but I don't expect the Yankee payroll to be as high next season.
          as of 1919, I meant the Yanks started using money as their primary method of building a competing team. Buying Ruth and other sox stars is the most obvious example, but it became their 'formula', and they had success, and had more than other teams so they kept it up. before that, an occaional deal for more the norm.

          city of bosotn vs city of ny baseball championships from 1871 thru 1920:

          1872-nat'l assc.-Boston(1)
          1873-nat'l assc.-Boston(2)
          1874-nat'l assc.-Boston(3)
          1875-nat'l assc.-Boston(4)
          1877-nat'l league-Boston(5)
          1878-nat'l league-Boston(6)
          1883-nat'l league-Boston(7)
          1888-nat'l league-NY(1)-finally!
          1889-nat'l league-NY(2)
          1890-player's league-Boston(8)
          1891-nat'l league-Boston(9)
          1891-american assc.-Boston(10)
          1892-nat'l league-Boston(11)
          1893-nat'l league-Boston(12)
          1894-nat'l league-NY(2)
          1898-nat'l league-Boston(13)

          So there you have it. There were 5 professional leagues from those early times, all of which the players stats are counted on career totals:
          National Association
          National League
          American Association
          Union Association
          Players League
          All titles won are legit and count.
          To discount them is to ignore reality.

          NY had 7 major cities win world titles before they got their first.
          and we all know in 1904, NY chickened out of playing Boston in the World Series and refused to play!!

          Like I said, now that Sox ownership has finally been returned to caring intelligent people, after all these years, you should prepare for a serious change in your world fellas. and if their is ever a salary cap installed, your all through.

          Comment


          • this weekend

            so...
            anyone else think we're apt to see some more hit batsmen this weekend?

            I'm sure fat boy roger is pissed he won't get to throw at anybody. but I wouldn't be surprised to see one of his teammates retaliate for jeter and soriano. I'm pretty sure it will happen and could get ugly.

            course, we got pedro going, so it should be very interesting.

            Comment


            • Re: Re: team salary link

              Originally posted by brewcrew82
              [Sarcasm]Oooh, The new luxury tax will be effective...$10.8 million that's going to cripple the Yanks![/Sarcasm]
              Code:
              [B][I][SIZE=3][COLOR=red]One of the mid-level secretaries will handle it by writing an expense check out of the petty-cash account...
              
              [IMG]http://www.techwarelabs.com/community/images/smiles/yawn.gif[/IMG] . . Business as usual . . . [/COLOR][/SIZE][/I][/B]
              Ken Fougère

              Comment


              • Re: Re: Re: team salary link

                Originally posted by KenFougere
                One of the mid-level secretaries will handle it by writing an expense check out of the petty-cash account...

                . . Business as usual . . .
                Probably George Costanza, the assistant travelling secretary from about a decade ago.
                Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                Comment


                • Re: Re: Re: Before Domination through Money

                  Originally posted by RedSoxFanAtic
                  as of 1919, I meant the Yanks started using money as their primary method of building a competing team. Buying Ruth and other sox stars is the most obvious example, but it became their 'formula', and they had success, and had more than other teams so they kept it up. before that, an occaional deal for more the norm.

                  city of bosotn vs city of ny baseball championships from 1871 thru 1920:

                  1872-nat'l assc.-Boston(1)
                  1873-nat'l assc.-Boston(2)
                  1874-nat'l assc.-Boston(3)
                  1875-nat'l assc.-Boston(4)
                  1877-nat'l league-Boston(5)
                  1878-nat'l league-Boston(6)
                  1883-nat'l league-Boston(7)
                  1888-nat'l league-NY(1)-finally!
                  1889-nat'l league-NY(2)
                  1890-player's league-Boston(8)
                  1891-nat'l league-Boston(9)
                  1891-american assc.-Boston(10)
                  1892-nat'l league-Boston(11)
                  1893-nat'l league-Boston(12)
                  1894-nat'l league-NY(2)
                  1898-nat'l league-Boston(13)

                  So there you have it. There were 5 professional leagues from those early times, all of which the players stats are counted on career totals:
                  National Association
                  National League
                  American Association
                  Union Association
                  Players League
                  All titles won are legit and count.
                  To discount them is to ignore reality.

                  NY had 7 major cities win world titles before they got their first.
                  and we all know in 1904, NY chickened out of playing Boston in the World Series and refused to play!!

                  Like I said, now that Sox ownership has finally been returned to caring intelligent people, after all these years, you should prepare for a serious change in your world fellas. and if their is ever a salary cap installed, your all through.

                  Other than Ruth, who were the players who were "bought"? I mean, Gehrig came from Columbia U, was brought into the farm, then came up in 1925. Who are the players the Yanks "bought" before winning their first WS in 1923, why it became a "formula", as you say?

                  As to the World Championships you list, do you have a link? Not that I'm doubting you, but I don't know of anything showing who won those games in the 19th century, though I'm familiar with the National Association, American Association, and a few others mentioned.

                  As to 1904, I don't even know the full story as to what happened. I think that the NY Giants didn't find Boston worthy of playing, so they decided not to play them. I don't remember the full story, so what happened?

                  BTW, I welcome the challenge, but none of us really knows what'll happen at the end of September. We can all root for our respective teams, but nobody really can guarantee anything.
                  Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                  Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                  THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                  Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                  Comment


                  • Where's George?

                    Originally posted by Mattingly
                    Probably George Costanza, the assistant travelling secretary from about a decade ago.
                    Code:
                    [COLOR=darkblue][I][SIZE=2] [IMG]http://www.techwarelabs.com/community/images/smiles/shhh.gif[/IMG] _{Shh! He's asleep under his desk}_ [IMG]http://www.techwarelabs.com/community/images/smiles/zzz.gif[/IMG][/SIZE][/I][SIZE=2][/SIZE][/COLOR]
                    KenFougere
                    Sr Member BB-Almanac 1998
                    Last edited by KenFougere; 07-24-2003, 06:06 PM.
                    Ken Fougère

                    Comment


                    • I know that this is going to be difficult to believe, but once upon a time, a New York team actually was hesitant to play a team from Boston.

                      Besides the financial and territorial factors involved, New York of the National League was not upset to NOT play the Red Sox, a team that they felt had a better than even chance to beat them.

                      My, how the years have changed that attitude.
                      Baseball articles you might not like but should read.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Where's George?

                        Originally posted by KenFougere
                        _{Shh! He's asleep under his desk}_
                        Well, since Seinfeld had that show, it's been an inside joke amongst Yankee fans, and I'm not sure how the NYC humor went over with you guys, so I decided to explain the punch line.

                        Anyay, it's a part of Yankee folklore, just like the Pine Tar game, of which this is the 20th anniversary.
                        Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                        Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                        THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                        Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by LouGehrig
                          I know that this is going to be difficult to believe, but once upon a time, a New York team actually was hesitant to play a team from Boston.

                          Besides the financial and territorial factors involved, New York of the National League was not upset to NOT play the Red Sox, a team that they felt had a better than even chance to beat them.

                          My, how the years have changed that attitude.
                          I've heard something about the NY Giants not thinking Boston was worthy, so they refused to play them. Was this the case, or were they just scared? I never got the full story.
                          Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                          Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                          THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                          Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                          Comment


                          • After the dual humiliations, everyone's too pooped to pop? Or saving all their energy for the LOOOOOONG weekend?
                            Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                            Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                            THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                            Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                            Comment


                            • It's a lot more fun to talk trash when the devil rays aren't setting franchise records on ya (unless it's for runs allowed, which we already handed to em 1 year and 2 days ago)

                              Well, if everyone in the bullpen needed to have a bad outing, i'm sure glad they got it out of the way in the same game...

                              Anyway, It's a blessing in disguise for the Red Sox. We haven't had any prolonged winning streaks this year, and to sweep the yanks, we would have needed at least 8, so now we can pick up a new 3-5 game winning streak starting tomorrow

                              btw, I got 5 to 1 on burkett winning saturday. Any takers? (no, i'm not betting my sig on that)
                              "Endlessly deferred redemption provides, paradoxically enough, its own kind of reward... It tests our faith and marks us as spiritually stronger than other fans for whom entrance into heaven is a far cheaper thing."
                              -Scott Stossel

                              Comment


                              • Nope, no bets. That rainout killed us. Andy is out, and Moose is facing Burkett, not Pedro, so I'm not so sure.

                                To me, the game to watch is Sunday's, since Boomer may keep it close, unless he has one of the better game's he's had recently, I doubt he'd beat Pedro. Andy I'd give a better chance to, since his game on Wednesday was excellent.

                                Seriously, I don't think Burkett is expected to beat Moose (unless lightning strikes), and if Weaver is on his "A" game on Sunday, Lowe isn't, we may manage to pull this off.

                                Ideally, it would be:

                                Fri: Moose/Pedro
                                Sat: Boomer/Burkett
                                Sun: Pettitte/Lowe

                                Then I'd bet an av for a week, but you'd have to talk me into the sig.
                                Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                                Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                                THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                                Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                                Comment

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