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  • Originally posted by SDL View Post
    Evidently other managers are dumb not see how how dangerous Big Papi is
    Sometimes I'd like to count the ever-present "Clueless Joe" (as the scribes deemed him) amongst them. I don't remember the game, but it was around Game 5 or 6 in 2004. Flash was up, Papi leading off. Good record vs Ortiz, so he pitched to him. BOOM! Tied game. A walk and a single later, it was a tied game, corner runners, no out. Fine time to bring in Mo in the 8th inning. :o

    Anyway, if I were the TB manager, I had a 1-run lead, especially since Manny's out of the lineup, why in the world would you pitch to Ortiz? Yes, he's had sore shoulder & back problems earlier in the year. Did he change his name to "Mr Pencil-Necked Geek" and have a calculator in his shirt pocket? Thick-rimmed glasses also.

    Anyway, perhaps I'm over dramatizing it, but why not just put him on 1B? This forces him out of the game, since Tito uses a pinch runner, and allows a game-ending DP, since there's 1 out. If Pedroa scores, no more Ortiz. Seems like a win-win thing to me.

    Nobody listens to that stuff. They all want their closer to go one-on-one with Ortiz. It's like drag racing your luxury sedan (Town Car, etc) against a Vette or a Mustang. Guess who wins, tells you what the towns a few miles ahead are before you even get up to speed?

    Let's see if my boys can break out the brooms vs Toronto, a team that somehow manages to be their undoing.
    Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
    Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
    THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
    Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

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    • Originally posted by SDL View Post
      The magic number is now 12

      I salute Jose Tartabull who wore #12 in '67 and made THE throw of the year to get Ken Berry out at the plate in a game against the other Sox.

      (and as you know, somebody else in Boston/NEW ENGLAND wears #12 )

      Hmm...I could possibly see a clincher in person at The Trop
      That was also Mark Bellhorn's number...he of the 3 run opposite field shot off Lieber in the bloody sock game, and the ringing blast off the foul pole to restore order after Pedro showed us that the Yanks were still his Daddy.
      Mark could have ruined things by actually playing for the Yanks the next year, but that ended up being a brief and almost unnoticed episode.

      If I'm Maddon, why walk Ortiz in a game that is totally meaningless to the Rays...see if the young man can get the big stick out in the tight situation. Find out if the kids can get it done when things are tight. If it doesn't happen, so they win 69 instead of 70 games this year. I mean, don't lose the game on purpose, but just play the game straight and see if your closer can really get the big out.
      Last edited by hellborn; 09-13-2007, 05:14 AM.
      "I throw him four wide ones, then try to pick him off first base." - Preacher Roe on pitching to Musial

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      • Mattingly - Why they pitched to Ortiz

        If you walk Ortiz, you end up with a runner in scoring position where a single will tie it. In this case the next batter would have been Youkilis, who this year has a .457 slugging pct., a .391 OBP, and hits well with men on base. So it is not unreasonable to pitch carefully to Ortiz in that situation - prior to the at bat he had no walk offs this year, a bum knee, and so forth. That's what Tampa Bay did. Ortiz hit a pitch that was out of the strike zone, high, and but for the RF's miscue, the game would have been over. Walking him to get to Youkilis would have been perfectly reasonable too. A tough call, a nice piece of hitting, and a breeze from the Almighty...

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Mattingly
          What do you mean by this year's Italy? Joltin' Joe DiMaggio? Scooter (or his famous cannolis)? Yogi (and his Yogi-isms)?
          I am referring to the European Olympic Qualfiers which are going on in Barcelona. Italy was supposed to be one of the two teams that had a better than 85% chance to win and get an automatic berth in Beijing..or at least qualify for the Final Eight Tourney, where they they'd have a great chance to win a slot there. They finished 4th in the firrt round (only top three from each group advance to next round; they will finish 5th overall). In other words, they were supposed to fight The Netherlands for a trip to Beijing, but they'll be watching from home.

          Kind of like what I'm hoping for King George and his not-so-merry crew.

          (sorry for going OT, but I cover International baseball as part of my day job)

          I know Jeter lives down here...hope he contacted that miniature golf course on US 19 in Clearwater about his October 1 tee-off date...
          sigpicMan, do I *HATE* the Yankees!!!!!!

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          • Originally posted by SDL View Post
            I am referring to the European Olympic Qualfiers which are going on in Barcelona. Italy was supposed to be one of the two teams that had a better than 85% chance to win and get an automatic berth in Beijing..or at least qualify for the Final Eight Tourney, where they they'd have a great chance to win a slot there. They finished 4th in the firrt round (only top three from each group advance to next round; they will finish 5th overall). In other words, they were supposed to fight The Netherlands for a trip to Beijing, but they'll be watching from home.

            Kind of like what I'm hoping for King George and his not-so-merry crew.

            (sorry for going OT, but I cover International baseball as part of my day job)

            I know Jeter lives down here...hope he contacted that miniature golf course on US 19 in Clearwater about his October 1 tee-off date...
            To tell you the truth, the playoffs are extremely funny. When the 83-win Cards won the last WS, I couldn't help but wonder how that could be. The Yanks won about 85 in 2000, had the most September losses (around 20) of any WS winner in MLB history. Weird, huh?

            The Yanks have on paper a great team, but they need to play well down the stretch. Between Anaheim and a few other teams, we haven't gotten that done the last few years.

            I figure that "Top 3" thing can be sorta like how the HR Derby Contest is: you'll need just enough jacks to get you past the 1st round, then just enough to get you past the 2nd, etc. Same with the playoffs. You'll need just enough runs to win the LDS, then the LCS. You'll need just enough runs to win 4 games. Get too many runs in one game, you may not have enough for the 2nd. Perhaps Italy may have not gotten enough runs to get to the next level.

            Hopefully, the Yanks can win 2 of 3 this weekend. I wouldn't expect a sweep in either direction.

            Oh well, so long as the WC is available, I can deal with it if we happen to not win the division. Of course, if we do win this, that'll be extra gravy on the meat & mashed taters , and a little extra dressing on the salad!

            Gotta run, see ya around this weekend.
            Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
            Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
            THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
            Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

            Comment


            • Who knows, come next season we might have [email protected] & [email protected]!

              Originally posted by Mattingly View Post
              I'm curious, when are you going to answer things other than those parts of a question which favor you? Such as the ones I'd asked?

              I'm not the least bit concerned here about any Pats, Bruins or Celtics players. This is a baseball forum, not some NE fan section.

              You'd mentioned Mike Lowell going 4-for-4. That's fine. I'd mentioned Alex Rodriguez. Did you read that part? Do you wish to compare Lowell to Rodriguez? Yes or no? Who's looking like the runaway AL MVP candidate? Can you even admit who this is w/o changing the topic? Let me start it off.

              Lowell has 18 jacks and 103 RBI. Compare that to Alex' 52 and 140 RBI, then an OPS that's almost 1.100. That's about .220 higher. One is a very good hitting third bagger most teams would enjoy having. Another is an elite athlete.


              BTW, Don Zimmer was your manager. Who was the GM in 1978? Did Zim have a role in Reggie Cleveland's trade? If so, please specify.

              So a RS fan is calling the Yanks cursed? This despite nothing from 1919 through 2003? That's quite a few years. So a 32-yr-old player is cursed? You sure you haven't been believing too much of the anti-A-Rod stuff the Yankee-hating media pours out? How would you describe Ted Williams, Carl **Yasztremski and Barry Bonds then? I really can't stand bringing up their names, but none of them have any rings either. Nothing can ever change that.

              I really think you need to put this anti-Yankee thing in perspective, since it's just a game.
              Let me put it this way.
              Mike Lowell, in my opinion, is ,without question, the MVP of the Red Sox.
              Alex Rodriguez, in my opinion, is ,without question, the MVP of BOTH Leagues.

              With that said, guess which one I'd rather have . . .



              ** (Spelled): Yastrzemski
              Ken Fougère

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              • Comment


                • Originally posted by Williamsburg2599 View Post
                  Let's pray his shoulder and knee can hold up long enough to power the Sox to win the final game in this years' playoffs . . .
                  Ken Fougère

                  Comment


                  • Isn't a win against Toronto sort-of important at this point in the season?
                    Big Hurt's walk-off single drops Yankees 5 1/2 games behind BoSox.



                    Question: Why didn't Torre use Mariano in the 9th? :disbelief:
                    Ken Fougère

                    Comment


                    • The Magic Number is now 11

                      I salute such #11s as Frank Malzone..who the Sox signed under the Yankees noses, Bill Mueller of the 2004 team, HOFer Luis Aparicio, Dave Stapleton, who had McNamara had a working brain cell the night of Game 6 in '86 would have been at 1B instead of SOMEBODY ELSE and the IMMORTAL Dick "Ducky" Schofield Sr!
                      Attached Files
                      sigpicMan, do I *HATE* the Yankees!!!!!!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by KenFougere View Post
                        Let me put it this way.
                        Mike Lowell, in my opinion, is ,without question, the MVP of the Red Sox.
                        Alex Rodriguez, in my opinion, is ,without question, the MVP of BOTH Leagues.

                        With that said, guess which one I'd rather have . . .



                        ** (Spelled): Yastrzemski
                        I haven't followed Lowell in quite awhile. I'll admit that when he was coming up, I was hoping for him, but Scott Brosius, who'd been expected to just keep Lowell's spot warm until he was ready, was considered the Yankee 3Bman. Unlike pitchers, you can only have one guy at each position.

                        To me, Boston lucked out that Florida made both himself and Beckett available.

                        I'll agree that Lowell's numbers are very good, as I've pointed out earlier, but hadn't realized that he was the team's MVP. Please describe why you feel he's the BoSox 2007 MVP. SDL, W2599 and others can do the same.

                        Sounds like a good thread idea for CE about each team's MVP.

                        BTW, it's spelled "Yaz" (aka, "Carl Michael Yastrzemski"), so please get it right!

                        http://www.yaz8.com/

                        Anyway, my point to SDL was that those are 3 legendary ballplayers, none of whom have a ring. Teddy sadly passed before 2004, so how's that for injustice?
                        Last edited by Mattingly; 09-13-2007, 10:45 PM.
                        Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                        Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                        THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                        Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by KenFougere View Post
                          Big Hurt's walk-off single drops Yankees 5 1/2 games behind BoSox.



                          Question: Why didn't Torre use Mariano in the 9th? :disbelief:
                          Thomas killed us twice, getting a 2-out RBI double in the 1st inning. It was a tied game.

                          Debatable, but here's my thoughts:

                          With a 1B runner, 2 outs, Sept callup Ian Kennedy was allowed to pitch to Frank Thomas, who had fewer HRs (21, I think) than 2006 with Oakland. Torre could've IBB'd Thomas, but he seems to be against pitching around players. That IBB which never occurred may have affected Kennedy's confidence the rest of the game if it had been done, but 7.0 IP, 1 ER doesn't seem like a bad line against a 3rd place team. I'll deal with 1 loss if he can do more for us the rest of the way.

                          Had Torre IBB'd Thomas, and presuming all things else being the same, it would've been 1-0 for the 9th. Then we would've used Mo. In a tied game, and with the Boston series upcoming, I guess that Mo wasn't to be used. The little-used Britton was used instead, and the rest is now known.

                          The silver lining is that Kennedy did well in a loss, and hopefully, Britton doesn't go back on Torre's "Charmin List", as I like to call it.

                          Oh, and will yourself and SDL be talking lots of football on Monday? And cursing them Damned Yankees?
                          Last edited by Mattingly; 09-13-2007, 10:47 PM.
                          Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                          Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                          THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                          Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Mattingly View Post
                            Thomas killed us twice, getting a 2-out RBI double in the 1st inning. It was a tied game.

                            Debatable, but here's my thoughts:

                            With a 1B runner, 2 outs, Sept callup Ian Kennedy was allowed to pitch to Frank Thomas, who had fewer HRs (21, I think) than 2006 with Oakland. Torre could've IBB'd Thomas, but he seems to be against pitching around players. That IBB which never occurred may have affected Kennedy's confidence the rest of the game if it had been done, but 7.0 IP, 1 ER doesn't seem like a bad line against a 3rd place team. I'll deal with 1 loss if he can do more for us the rest of the way.

                            Had Torre IBB'd Thomas, and presuming all things else being the same, it would've been 1-0 for the 9th. Then we would've used Mo. In a tied game, and with the Boston series upcoming, I guess that Mo wasn't to be used. The little-used Britton was used instead, and the rest is now known.

                            The silver lining is that Kennedy did well in a loss, and hopefully, Britton doesn't go back on Torre's "Charmin List", as I like to call it.

                            Oh, and will yourself and SDL be talking lots of football on Monday? And cursing them Damned Yankees?
                            Yeah, we'll be talking about the Sox taking the series from you guys and about the THREE TIME SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS shutting the yaps of Tomlinson and Merriman..and about the new contract The Genius got that just happens to have a $500,000 raise in it

                            To me, Damn Yankees is also the name of a band I like despite the fact it had Turd Nugent in it..

                            I hope I can see the AL East clinched at The Trop...
                            sigpicMan, do I *HATE* the Yankees!!!!!!

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Mattingly View Post
                              I haven't followed Lowell in quite awhile. I'll admit that when he was coming up, I was hoping for him, but Scott Brosius, who'd been expected to just keep Lowell's spot warm until he was ready, was considered the Yankee 3Bman. Unlike pitchers, you can only have one guy at each position.

                              To me, Boston lucked out that Florida made both himself and Beckett available.

                              I'll agree that Lowell's numbers are very good, as I've pointed out earlier, but hadn't realized that he was the team's MVP. Please describe why you feel he's the BoSox 2007 MVP. SDL, W2599 and others can do the same.
                              Lowell's statistics speak for themselves . . .
                              With both Manny & Ortiz having off years, I don't want to think where we'd be in the standings without Lowell having the year he's had so far.
                              Ken Fougère

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by SDL View Post
                                Yeah, we'll be talking about the Sox taking the series from you guys and about the THREE TIME SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS shutting the yaps of Tomlinson and Merriman..and about the new contract The Genius got that just happens to have a $500,000 raise in it

                                To me, Damn Yankees is also the name of a band I like despite the fact it had Turd Nugent in it..

                                I hope I can see the AL East clinched at The Trop...
                                You sure it won't be cussin' the Yanks for taking 2 of 3 this weekend? Then off to the "I hate the Damned Yankees" Pats game?

                                Seriously, crazy weekend coming up. Any predictions of the outcome? Anyone saying that Boston will lose is fine by me. :hyper:
                                Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                                Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                                THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                                Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

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