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  • #16
    This is the reason why this forum should be apart of baseball discussion because it is as much to baseball as the fans, Hall of Fame, statistics and records



    The idea for this article came to me a few weeks ago when I was watching the Giants-Dodgers series with my kids. My four-year old daughter asked, “Why do we hate the Dodgers so much?” My son informed her, “Because they are the bad guys.” (Okay, so I am training them well…but that will be another article). My son’s answer was good enough for her but it made me stop to think. Here I am, a life-long Giants fan and I don’t really know why we hate the Dodgers or what started the rivalry to begin with. Then I began to wonder, how many other fans out there have one team in particular that they love to hate but don’t know what is behind the rivalry? So, I posed the question to a group of die-hard fans and guess what I discovered? I am not alone; almost everyone has a team that they love to hate but very few people know all of the reasons why. This article will attempt to examine and explain one of baseball’s fiercest rivalries.

    The Dodgers and the Giants rivalry can be traced back to their New York days when the Giants played in Manhattan and the Dodgers played in Brooklyn, which at the time were separate cities. Brooklyn was the fifth largest city in the USA but was in the shadow of Manhattan and Broadway. Even though the Polo Grounds were not in an upscale section of town, the Manhattan socialites that followed the Giants were said to have looked down upon the Dodgers and their fans. The Giants’ fans rode to the games at the Polo Grounds in their expensive clothes and carriages, while the players paraded through town wearing their uniforms. Dodger fans felt as if they were taunting them. In truth, there was no visitor clubhouse so the Giants were forced to arrive in uniform.

    The Dodgers’ fans from Brooklyn consisted mostly of hard-working immigrants who seemed to feel that the Giants’ fans were flaunting their wealth and position. As a matter of fact the Dodgers name is actually a derogatory term given to Brooklynites who were called Trolley Dodgers by Manhattanites.

    And then there is baseball. In the early years the Giants were very successful having five World Series victories out of fourteen attempts, while the Dodgers were merely one and eight in series play. In the very first meeting between the two teams (1889 Championship), the Giants defeated the Bridegrooms (as they were called in those days) six games to three. In game four there was a dispute over a bad call and as they say, the rest is history.

    For players and fans alike, the Giant-Dodger rivalry was war. There were fewer teams in the early days of baseball so the Giants and the Dodgers, who played against each other twenty-two times per season had quite a few meaningful games – that is, games that meant the NL championship for one or the other of them. Then when Leo Durocher, who managed the Dodgers from 1938-1945, made his move to the Giants’ organization in 1948 it certainly only added fuel to the fire.

    These two teams have definitely had their share of controversies. One of the most renowned being the dramatic ending of the 1951 pennant race and the playoff finale with Bobby Thomson’s ninth inning home run now referred to as “the shot heard ‘round the world”. Allegations arose that Thomson had stolen signs and to this day most Dodger fans cringe when they hear re-plays of Russ Hodge’s famous home run call.

    Emotions between the Giants and the Dodgers ran so high that Jackie Robinson, when traded from Brooklyn to New York after the 1956 season, chose to retire instead of reporting to the Giants.

    Then in 1957 Dodger owner Walter O’Malley convinced the Giants to join them in the move west in order to continue the rivalry. In the 1958 season opener, the Giants beat the Dodgers, 8-0 but perhaps even more significantly, they beat the Dodgers 16 out of 22 times that year, keeping the rivalry alive.

    So, what perpetuates the rivalry now? Part of it is still due to being in rival cities; there is a natural rivalry between San Francisco and Los Angeles (Northern and Southern California). San Francisco is filled with business people, and entrepreneurial types that perceive themselves to be above the blue-collar, surfer types in Los Angeles. Los Angeles, in the past, has wanted to secede from the state of California to become its own state. Northern Californians are bitter because their water is piped south. It is a battle of geography, economics, culture, as well as politics.

    And then there is baseball. Since moving west in 1958 the Giants have had limited post-season success, they have not won a World Series while the Dodgers have won five.

    The media also may have done a lot to keep the rivalry going because in the 1960’s the only baseball games that were televised in the Los Angeles area were as expected, Dodgers-Giants games. So, nine times a year the Dodgers’ fans watched these teams battle it out on the field. And I do mean battle.

    In 1962 The Giants narrowly defeated the Dodgers in a three game playoff to win the NL pennant and reach the World Series for the first time since they moved west. Of course, there is also more controversy; the Dodgers accused the Giants of wetting down the field at Candlestick Park in order to prevent Maury Wills from stealing bases.

    Again in the midst of a pennant race in 1965, Giants’ pitcher, Juan Marichal knocked down Maury Wills and Ron Fairly with brush back pitches. When Marichal came to the plate in the third inning the Dodgers pitcher, Sandy Koufax didn’t try to retaliate, but catcher, John Roseboro, did. When returning the ball to the pitcher’s mound Roseboro threw it extremely close to Marichal’s face. After the second of Roseboro's throws came too close to Marichal he struck Roseboro on the head with his bat, opening up a wound that required 14 stitches and in the process started a brawl that lasted 14 minutes.

    In 1993, at the end of September with only four games left in the season, the Giants were tied with Atlanta for the division title. Who else would the Giants have to face in those last four games but the Dodgers, who had nothing to lose? (The Braves had it easier as they were playing the Rockies) Naturally, both the Giants and the Braves won the first three games. And on the last day of the season the Dodgers beat the Giants, knocking them out of the playoffs and finally extracting revenge for 1982 when the Giants knocked them out of the playoffs.

    In 2001 when Barry Bonds hit home run number 500 against the Dodgers they were displeased that the game was halted for a lengthy on field celebration. Later the same year when the Dodgers visited Pacific Bell Park the Giants wanted to celebrate the 50-year anniversary of “the shot heard ‘round the world.” Of course, the Dodgers wanted no part in it (and who could blame them?) but it was more fodder for the media thus fueling the rivalry even more.

    Over one hundred years later, fans still take this rivalry seriously. Chants of “Beat LA” can be heard around San Francisco – even when the Giants are playing another team. Some fans travel from as far as New York to watch these teams battle it out on the field. There is an inexplicable spirit and intensity at these games that you can actually feel; everyone finds themselves becoming a part of it. To the fans it doesn’t even seem to matter if their team is having a bad season, as long as they beat the other – at all costs. That is what this rivalry is all about.
    Sorry National league the DODGERS have return

    Comment


    • #17
      OK, I'll jump in....

      As I've written before on this board, my Grandfather grew up a fan of Mathewson, so being a Giants fan was in my blood. And when I started coming of age in the 60's, the rivalry was white hot, which meant the distaste for the Bums came easily. Part of this was due, and I'll admit this, the Dodgers had a lot more success than the Giants, and I wanted that success for my team. But over the years things kept happening to keep the rivalry going in my heart. Reggie Smith going into the stands at the "Stick, Joe Morgan beating the Bums in '82, the last game of '93 and many more examples.

      And while it's not IMO the greatest rivalry in sports, much less baseball, it is one of the longest lasting, and still has relevance today. But the Giants success over the last decade has given us Giants fans a modicum of bragging rights, it wont be finished till the teams wins a WS. And if both Sox teams can win one, it's gotta be the Giants turn now.

      And yes, it's personal!

      KH14<--who's betting a pack of Topps cards the Giants win the division.:gt
      “Well, I like to say I’m completely focused, right? I mean, the game’s on the line. It’s not like I’m thinking about what does barbecue Pop Chips and Cholula taste like. Because I already know that answer — it tastes friggin’ awesome!"--Brian Wilson

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by KHenry14

        And while it's not IMO the greatest rivalry in sports, much less baseball, it is one of the longest lasting, and still has relevance today. But the Giants success over the last decade has given us Giants fans a modicum of bragging rights, it wont be finished till the teams wins a WS. And if both Sox teams can win one, it's gotta be the Giants turn now.

        And yes, it's personal!

        KH14<--who's betting a pack of Topps cards the Giants win the division.:gt


        Your few NL West Titles and NL pennets do not compare to our let me see 1....2.....3.....4.....Let me see......5 World Championshp since the move out West

        Comment


        • #19
          After years of rooting for the Giants this is how your life will end up



          Being a Gnat fan is a psychological disorder
          Sorry National league the DODGERS have return

          Comment


          • #20
            Come on, man. It's ok to bash on the team, but no need for that.
            Last edited by UnderPressure; 12-24-2005, 10:06 PM.
            Using a stolen chant from Boston Celtics fans whenever an L.A. team is playing up there just reeks of inferiority complex.

            If hitting a baseball is the toughest thing to do in sports, then pitching must be the easiest thing to do in sports.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Pure Dodger
              Come on, man. It's ok to bash on the team, but no need for that.
              It's borderline to have a fan in a straight jacket, but if it's taken in humor (like zinging someone), I guess that'll go.

              See the very long bitter rivalry thread and see all the cheesy potshots we've all taken at one another. Not as direct as the straight jacket, but zings nonetheless.

              An off-key sense of humor helps, is all I'll say.
              Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
              Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
              THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
              Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

              Comment


              • #22
                I object to the title of this thread. It should be Dodger/Giant rivalry, not the other way 'round. Shame on you Jake.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Giants

                  The giants have not won anything since 1954 when they were still in new york. they should have never left new york. i hope i never see them win anything on the west coast. the curse of the POLO GROUNDS.
                  LONG LIVE THE POLO GROUNDS 1891-1964
                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/POLOGROUNDS1962

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Elvis9045
                    I object to the title of this thread. It should be Dodger/Giant rivalry, not the other way 'round. Shame on you Jake.

                    Like the saying ladies first

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Mattingly
                      It's borderline to have a fan in a straight jacket, but if it's taken in humor (like zinging someone), I guess that'll go.

                      See the very long bitter rivalry thread and see all the cheesy potshots we've all taken at one another. Not as direct as the straight jacket, but zings nonetheless.

                      An off-key sense of humor helps, is all I'll say.
                      It obviously couldn't have been meant to be hurtful, because Southern Californians have no feelings in the first place.
                      "Hall of Famer Whitey Ford now on the field... pleading with the crowd for, for some kind of sanity!"

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by iPod
                        It obviously couldn't have been meant to be hurtful, because Southern Californians have no feelings in the first place.

                        We sure have a better baseball team

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by iPod
                          It obviously couldn't have been meant to be hurtful, because Southern Californians have no feelings in the first place.
                          It must be the smog and plastic in LA

                          Great thread

                          Very refresing
                          The countdown to 755 begins

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            The Dogger/Giant rivarly is a pissing match that no one cares about anyone

                            It is about the Angels now
                            Angels 2002 World Champions 1979 1982 1986 2004 2005 AL West Champs

                            Southern California is covered in Red now

                            5 Straight Series Win:gt :gt



                            The saviors
                            Jered Weaver 3-0 with a 1.86 ERA and a Sub 1 WHIP with 17K to 3Walk ratio
                            Kendry Morales 279 AVG 3 HR'S 11 RBI
                            Mike Napoli 323 AVG 4HR'S 11 RBI

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Where is Chone Figgins
                              The Dogger/Giant rivarly is a pissing match that no one cares about anyone

                              It is about the Angels now
                              Uh-ohhhhh. Now how'd the Halos (who can't even figure out where they play) get involved?

                              In 10,000 words or less (preferably 500 or less), why is it now about Anaheim? Or would that be Les Angels de Los Angeles?
                              Please read Baseball Fever Policy and Forum FAQ before posting. 2007-11 CBA
                              Rest very peacefully, John “Buck” O'Neil (1911-2006) & Philip Francis “Scooter” Rizzuto (1917-2007)
                              THE BROOKLYN DODGERS - 1890 thru 1957
                              Montreal Expos 1969 - 2004

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by BayBaseballFan
                                It must be the smog and plastic in LA

                                Great thread

                                Very refresing

                                No it is the 5 championships in LA

                                Comment

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