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Photo Evidence might exist that Clemens was at the Party

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  • #16
    Where did that picture come from? That picture doesn't prove anything. If it was taken at a party, why are they wearing their uniforms? Players would where normal clothes to a party. And how do we know that that is Canseco's backyard? Looks like a softball field to me, with cars parked in the back.
    I want to see the photo of these guys with this little boy with other people from the party around. THAT would mean something.
    -Lou
    "He can get 10 hits in five at-bats." -Joe Torre, exasperated after seeing Ichiro hit a routine ground ball to shortstop and cross first with an infield single.
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    • #17
      Originally posted by Sweet Lou View Post
      Where did that picture come from? That picture doesn't prove anything. If it was taken at a party, why are they wearing their uniforms? Players would where normal clothes to a party. And how do we know that that is Canseco's backyard? Looks like a softball field to me, with cars parked in the back.
      I want to see the photo of these guys with this little boy with other people from the party around. THAT would mean something.
      -Lou
      I never even noticed that. Besides the fact that Canseco doesn't have a bat in his hand, but is clearly in a batting stance, that's some house he has if it has a nicely manicured lawn and the dirt you'd find at a LL or ST field. That looks like a ballpark to me.

      I've also never heard of players wearing their uniforms if they're not practicing. When Pettitte gave his recent press conference at Legends Field in Tampa, neither he, nor manager Joe Girardi, GM Brian Cashman, Rivera, Posada nor Jeter were in uniform. Unless you're playing the game, a uniform wouldn't be needed.

      If/when that pic of Clemens does surface, I'd have to hear what McNamee has to say re what they were all wearing. Looking at what you've just discovered, I'm surprised that Clemens' attorney hasn't already asked McNamee what they were all wearing. If the choice of clothing is inconsistent with the eventual photo, something would be very suspicious to me about this.
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      • #18
        Guys,

        I posted the picture as a joke. It's not from the party. I didn't think anyone would think it was an actual picture from the party.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Mattingly View Post
          So you're saying that Clemens and his attorneys are merely attacking a point brought up by McNamee, that he was at this Canseco-hosted party? So there's nothing which allegedly was said and/or done at this party which connects Clemens with PED usage? If so, now it finally begins to make sense.
          That is true. It is McNamee's contention that it was after that party coincidentally that Clemens approached him about getting and using steroids. There is more on the party but here's part of McNamee's deposition...

          Q Let me ask you to turn to page 168 and look at the
          bottom paragraph where it reads, on or about June 8th to
          10th, 1998, the Toronto Blue Jays played an away series with
          the Florida Marlins. McNamee attended a lunch party that
          Canseco hosted at his home in Miami. McNamee stated that
          during this luncheon he observed Clemens, Canseco and
          another person he did not know meeting inside Canseco's
          house, although McNamee did not personally attend that
          meeting.
          Do you recall this party at Mr. Canseco's house?
          A Yes.
          Q How many people approximately were at the party?
          A Mostly the whole team, the coaching staff.
          Q The Blue Jays team?
          A Canseco's, I believe -- yes, the Blue Jays.
          Canseco's wife, his daughter, and there were two olderly
          people. One might have been his mother and/or his father or
          somebody helping out with the party. They set up a spread
          outside near the pool. I mean it was a -- it wasn't a great
          26
          party. It was a great house, a great setting with the pool
          and stuff, but we had a game that night. So it was, you
          know -- everyone just had sandwiches and hung out for an
          hour and went to the ballpark, so it wasn't a great party.
          Q How many people approximately are we talking, 30,
          50, 100?
          A I would say about 30 because I'm sure one or two
          people didn't go, I'm sure. You know, but it wasn't --
          Roger was there with his nannie and I think two of his kids,
          two of his youngest kids. Because the nannie was there.
          The child, his youngest child Kody was, Kody had to be two
          maybe, so the nannie was chasing him around. And maybe Kacy
          would have been about four. The oldest ones I don't believe
          were there. And Roger's wife was there, Debbie. She was
          the only other female besides the olderly woman helping with
          the food, Jose's wife, daughter and the two children and
          Debbie.
          Q We've received evidence that there was a team party
          at Canseco's house, but that Mr. Clemens was golfing that
          day and wasn't at the party. It sound like you have a
          pretty clear recollection of seeing Mr. Clemens at this
          party along with some family members, is that right? Are
          you certain about that?
          A Roger showed up after golf, I believe. Maybe he was
          golfing. I don't know if he was golfing. He might have
          27
          showed up a little bit later, but no, he was there the whole
          time for the most part. He was in the house. I could tell
          you a specific story about him being there, which was
          involving Jose, Jose's wife and Roger's wife when they went
          inside, when the guys showed up. I mean, they talked -- no
          disrespect, but they talked about how great Jose's wife's
          augmentation job was to Debbie and showed her. And then
          Debbie showed her her augmentation job.
          Q And this was during this same party?
          A In the house. Then the guy -- they came back out --
          the nannie, you can get her. If you want to talk to her,
          her name was Lily. They left on bad terms. She worked for
          him for 14 years.
          Q Worked for Canseco?
          A No, for Roger.
          Q The nannie?
          A Yes.
          Q Do you know what her last name is?
          A She's a great girl. No.
          Q How many times have you been in Mr. Canseco's home
          in Miami?
          A That was it.
          Q That was the only time?
          A Yes.
          Q And you're fairly certain about the time frame being
          28
          during this June 8th to 10th, 1998 period?
          A I'm sure that it was against the Florida Marlins,
          which was a National League team. And we only interleagued
          certain teams, so that's it. I don't know. Yeah, if that's
          what they came up with, then yes.
          Q You've never been to Mr. Canseco's house another
          time, right? This is the only time you've ever been in that
          house?
          A The only time. But you have to understand. In '98
          was my first job as a strength coach and this house was
          unbelievable. I've never been to a Roger-type house, but
          they had a rock pool. I mean, the house -- I mean it's
          something you don't forget, you don't forget. And I could
          tell you the players that were there. I mean, as far as Pat
          Hentgen, Woody Williams, Chris Carpenter, Jose, and just --
          you know, me. But those guys would -- they visibly saw
          Roger there, they visibly saw him go in the house and they
          visibly saw his nannie chase his kids.
          Last edited by MyDogSparty; 02-23-2008, 11:47 AM.
          ?

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          • #20
            This would be interesting if I still cared. Good grief. If I wanted to see a circus, I would spend my money on Barnum & Bailey and not this crap. Who was where, who has what, who said that, who cares?

            Clemans is like the kid trying to deny he ate the Cheetos when he's got orange all over his face. Mitchell, Macnamee, Pettite, Knoblauch, and even his wife have made some kind of remark that hurts his case. Instead of apologizing, he's fighting a losing battle and making himself look like an idiot in doing so. This it what it comes down to for a HoF pitcher? A used syringe and a photo of him at a party?
            Religion: Yankeeist

            "Hanging out with him sucks because all the women flock to him. Let's see, he's been on the cover of GQ, is rich and famous, hits for average and power and is a helluva nice guy." - Tim Raines on Derek Jeter

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Mattingly View Post
              How exactly does a photo prove that Clemens was at a specific party on a specific date? I think I'll likely hear the word "Photoshop" mentioned sometime soon.

              I'm missing something. Clemens said he'd never attended the party, which Canseco's affidavit supports. However, McNamee said that Clemens was there. What supposedly happened at that party which is so significant? Did Clemens allegedly make a comment regarding PED usage while at the party?
              The nanny also said Clemens was there and that his kids slept at Canseco's house.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by ipitch View Post
                Here's the photo. Looks like they decided to put on their uniforms and mess around in Canseco's backyard. Apparently they couldn't find a bat. :cap:
                Clemens looks drunk, look at his eyes.

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                • #23
                  Found another photo from the "party"


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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by ipitch View Post
                    Here's the photo. Looks like they decided to put on their uniforms and mess around in Canseco's backyard. Apparently they couldn't find a bat. :cap:
                    That's not Jose.....that's Ozzie
                    "Batting slumps? I never had one. When a guy hits .358, he doesn't have slumps."

                    Rogers Hornsby, 1961

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by NJMetfan4life View Post
                      Clemens looks drunk, look at his eyes.
                      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun

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                      • #26
                        Clemens is actually acknowledging the possibility that he may have been there.


                        Roger Clemens may be backpedaling on his long-time stance that he never attended a 1998 party at Jose Canseco's house.

                        In the wake of the Daily News' report Friday that a photograph exists of Clemens posing with a young man at Canseco's Florida home - a photo said to have been taken on June 9, 1998 - the Rocket's attorney issued a statement that seems to suggest Clemens may have attended the party after all.

                        Brian McNamee, Clemens' former trainer, has told federal investigators and Congress that Clemens was at the party and talked about steroid use with Canseco, while the seven-time Cy Young Award winner has vehemently disputed such claims. Clemens reiterated those denials before the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform last week. Canseco likewise submitted an affidavit to the committee that corroborates the Rocket's version of events.

                        In his testimony before Congress, Clemens told ranking member Tom Davis (R-Va.), "So could I have gone by (Canseco's) house later that afternoon and dropped my wife or her brother-in-law, the people that golfed with me? Sure, I could have. But at the time of the day that I would have expressed it to be, I was on my way to the ballpark. I know one thing. I wasn't there having huddled up with somebody trying to do a drug deal. I know that for sure."

                        Clemens attorney Rusty Hardin issued a statement Friday that in part reverses course. "We know that baseball announcers broadcasting the games at the time said Roger was not at the party. Jose Canseco has said Roger was not at the party, as has Canseco's former wife. Roger was playing golf at the time of the party, and has stated that he may have stopped by the Canseco house after playing golf before heading to the ballpark for the game," read Hardin's statement.

                        The proof Clemens attended may also lie in photographs from the party. As The News first reported, McNamee attorney Richard Emery was informed of the existence of the photograph that allegedly shows Clemens and the young man at Canseco's home. Emery also told The News a second photograph exists, showing Canseco posing with the same boy on the same day.

                        "I don't know anything about it. No one's talked to me or Jose. No one's said anything about it. We don't know the validity of (the photos)," Robert Saunooke, the attorney for Canseco, told The News on Friday. "There's no doubt that Roger Clemens has been to Jose's house. But the question was (about) this particular date for a barbecue and that didn't happen. You can take a picture of me every day of the week and I can say, 'This is one day and that's another.' How are you going to tell which day you took the photo of me?"

                        According to Emery, the photos in question have been turned over to federal investigators and Congress. Emery told The News that McNamee's lawyers, including Earl Ward, were called by the father of the boy in the photo following the Feb. 13 hearing in which Clemens faced off against McNamee. The boy was about 11 at the time the photo was taken.

                        The father of the boy informed McNamee's lawyers that he was frustrated by the attacks on McNamee, particularly those of committee member Dan Burton (R-Ind.), who repeatedly called McNamee a liar. The man told the lawyers about the photo of his son, and also that he had contacted Hardin before the hearing.

                        "I find it interesting that it was offered to Hardin on Feb. 12 - and he walked away from it, probably because he didn't want any contradictory evidence that showed Clemens was at the party," Emery said.

                        Emery has not seen the photos himself, but gave the information he learned about them to Congress and to IRS Special Agent Jeff Novitzky, the lead investigator in the BALCO steroids case. The Justice Department could investigate Clemens for perjury and any such photographic evidence could prove damning if it's valid.

                        According to Emery, the boy’s father told McNamee’s lawyers that he wants to keep his son, who is now a college baseball player and is draft-eligible, out of the controversy.
                        http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...cket_was_.html

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                        • #27
                          30 eye witnesses were at the party. Why do they need a picture? I think they would recognize Clemens.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Old Sweater View Post
                            30 eye witnesses were at the party. Why do they need a picture? I think they would recognize Clemens.
                            Yes and two of those witnesses claim that Clemens WAS at the party, the man who had the photograph that is now in the hands of federal investigators and his son shown in the two photographs. Also a third witness that was proven to be at the party who has testified that Clemens was also there was the former nanny for Clemens children. Unless the photos can be proven to be obvious fakes, very doubtful, it is just more trouble for Clemens and more blows to his already shaky credibility.

                            I guess we are just supposed to believe that there is this "vast conspiracy" that was formed to "get Clemens" made up of McNamee, Pettitte, Pettitte's wife, Knoblauch, the former Nanny who Clemens' people allegedly tried to intimidate, and now some guy who just decides to lie and maybe make up a couple of fake photos putting him and his baseball player son into possible serious jeopardy if they are in any way less then truthful.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by BoweryBoys View Post
                              Yes and two of those witnesses claim that Clemens WAS at the party, the man who had the photograph that is now in the hands of federal investigators and his son shown in the two photographs. Also a third witness that was proven to be at the party who has testified that Clemens was also there was the former nanny for Clemens children. Unless the photos can be proven to be obvious fakes, very doubtful, it is just more trouble for Clemens and more blows to his already shaky credibility.

                              I guess we are just supposed to believe that there is this "vast conspiracy" that was formed to "get Clemens" made up of McNamee, Pettitte, Pettitte's wife, Knoblauch, the former Nanny who Clemens' people allegedly tried to intimidate, and now some guy who just decides to lie and maybe make up a couple of fake photos putting him and his baseball player son into possible serious jeopardy if they are in any way less then truthful.
                              spot on man, spot on:applaud:

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                              • #30
                                If anyone actually took the time to read Clemens deposition, you would have read that Clemens acknowledged the possibility that he was at the party for a brief time.

                                Q ...Let me just go back here. So you have or you haven't been to Mr. Canseco's house?

                                A I sure could have been. I wasn't here at this -- at a party that he had. I could have gone by there after a golf outing. So -- but I was not at this party.
                                He could simply point out that these "pictures" were taken during the the brief time he was there after Golfing.

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